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    Coronavirus: The Government Is Failing Us

    More people are feeling they're being cast aside as collateral damage
    by Adam Taggart

    Friday, May 8, 2020, 8:58 AM

Well, some good news to share today: pepcid, selenium and anticoagulants/blood thinners all appear to make a positive difference in covid-19 recovery rates.

Such good news is very welcome, as there’s not much to go around.

New infections in the US remain stubbornly high, and increasingly, the American people are feeling betrayed by their leaders (something our survey from last week validated).

Not only do citizens feel the government did too little too late to prevent the covid-19 pandemic, but they are feeling like they are being cast aside as collateral damage.

Many aren’t getting the stimulus payments they were promised. Many others aren’t receiving unemployment checks due to unacceptable shortcomings in the payment processing system. And the military has just informed recruits that if you’ve had covid-19, that will permanently disqualify you for future military service.

All while the stock market parties on. As easily predicted, all that Congress’ and the Federal Reserve’s stimulus efforts have achieved is an acceleration of the deeply unfair wealth divide in this country.

Until we have real leaders (not bureaucratic managers) running things, we are on our own folks.

So don’t forget to get your free download of Peak Prosperity’s book Prosper!. Given its relevance to preparing for any kind of crisis, pandemic or otherwise, Chris and I are now making it available to the world for free during the covid-19 lockdown.

To download your free copy, click here.

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88 Comments

  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 9:14am

    #1
    Tonya McKinney

    Tonya McKinney

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 06 2020

    Posts: 4

    12+

    Re: Good News!

    Because of this forum, our family has been eating a few Brazil nuts every day (great source for selenium) since February in addition to all the supplements recommended and other places.  I found out I had direct exposure for two solid days in early March with a friend who came down with Covid on the next day.  I am wondering if all these measures prevented the infection.  I just tested negative for antibodies at Quest Direct last week which involves a vein blood draw so I was not asymptomatic either. Is there any research showing these methods are preventing Covid?

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 9:39am

    #2
    vshelford

    vshelford

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jul 13 2014

    Posts: 133

    10+

    kittens and mascara worked!

    For some time now, although I remained subscribed to Peak Prosperity at YouTube, they had ceased to notify me of a new video.  Then early this week they disappeared the video when I just went to YouTube.  Day before yesterday it didn't even come up with a search, and I had to go through the PP website.  Then bingo - I get a push notification for kittens!  Algorithms.  How totally bl**dy stupid.

     

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 9:56am

    #3
    BASH

    BASH

    Status: Member

    Joined: May 08 2020

    Posts: 1

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    Comments.

    Thanks Chris and Adam for helping us reduce our ignorance.

    I wanted to say that you should have two ways of commenting on your information, one by registering and second by just commenting without registering.

    Unlimited ontime feedback is one of the greatest tools of data collecting and you are losing  big time on the comments of people who wish not to register to comment.

    Unrestricted traffic in marketing is one if the greatest sources of income and adjustment in the loop of poster/audience.

    Just imagine how much it would be your income if you did not have to pay to put your information on 8 billion people.

    Videos that go viral, as well as this virus is precisely because unlimited access and although your intuition is much based on viruses your missing out on easy access, like smelling inexpensive alcoholic beverages like cognac or any other form of alcohol is yet an untested highly effective way of keeping our lungs disinfected once with the symptoms of a respiratory infection...... besides all of us who has been at our children's swimming practices have smelled the by comparison poisonous chlorine in the water of the swimming pool in which they practice and children nor parents and public have not died from swimming pool chlorine vapor smelling..... for 20 years I have smelled alcohol from a napkin and I have not died on the contrary I have learned so much of when to smell and its effects once my respiratory system has cleared up and the overwhelming amount of Oxygen intake and Co2 release has always been invigorating...... it has been proven that alcohol is even more effective killing viruses than chlorine is..... but its problem may be that it is inexpensive to prescribe so they rather prescribe drinking fruit/plant alcoholic beverages which is also proven to kill liver/brain cells and also indirectly braves and innocents too....... when I have the symptoms I smell fruit/plant alcohol at home but when in my car I carry Isopropyl alcohol otherwise I risk a very expensive ticket.... doctors prescribe all forms of expensive inhalers and drugs including experimental but no one prescribes using the vapors of alcohol where it counts, they do however prescribe smoking marijuana and more and more states become legal prescribers of smoking marijuana which smoke is not free from producing lung cancer I have read.

    I have wonder lately what would happen to this virus if all that were wearing a mask instead smelled fruit/plant distilled alcohol all at an exact hour? Would this kill the virus in a locality and at the same time multiply antibodies in all who did?

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 10:21am

    #4
    JWhite

    JWhite

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    Joined: Jul 12 2016

    Posts: 33

    U.S. Government not the only one failing the citizens

    Regarding the  stories of individuals having an impossible time getting through to U.I. offices, having their identities validated, and actually receiving money, I had heard similar stories from Canadians a few weeks ago.  Some people have been rejected for receiving U.I., apparently without reason, and after paying into the system for many years.  I'm not sure if the reason was that they want people to apply first for another aid initiative being offered during the pandemic.

    Initially there was no aid for small business owners and the self employed - I'm not sure whether that has changed (although the intention to help their employees was announced).  The latest I've heard is that the Canadian government is providing 75% of salaries for businesses hurt by the pandemic. But the kicker is that they intend to publish the names of everyone who applies.  Public shaming.

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 10:27am

    #5
    louisdoran

    louisdoran

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    Joined: Oct 02 2010

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    Governments not only failing us but working against us

    Interview with Dr Mikovits. Must see.

    https://www.sott.net/article/434062-Plandemic-Documentary-Part-1-Interview-With-Judy-Mikovits

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 10:41am

    kunga

    kunga

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    Posts: 302

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    Kitten video

    More proof cats own everything!  🐱🐱🐱

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 10:46am

    kunga

    kunga

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    Tonya Mc. /Good news

    All the supplements have been helping me.  Just do them early and often.  May become a way of life.

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 10:53am

    #8

    westcoastjan

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jun 04 2012

    Posts: 385

    5+

    Puppies and Kittens for posting comments

    Well, it seems we might be on to something.... With tongue firmly planted in cheek, I suggest we who have experienced a few too many posts being sucked in to the black abyss of (perceived) cen$sorship adapt a puppies and kittens approach to making comments. How might this work? Let's give it a whirl!

    I read this big dog talking and saying some interesting stuff about a certain country becoming the next big wig of the globe. It was kinda interesting to read. Then I noticed THE BIG DOG saying some interesting things that meant maybe the first dog was on the right track and that big dog will not allow that to happen. Hmmm.... The big dog has already demonstrated that he feels threatened by the next big wig doing stuff he did not like in his favourite off-leash area which he and his buds think is their exclusive domain. The big dog responded by fatally biting another big dog  who lives in the off-leash area. Now just this week the big dog thought since he got away with that he might do it again to another big dog across the pond that he does not like but who has an off-leash area that big dog really wants to play in also!

    Well, all you puppies out there who are dedicated truth seekers following world events this post gives you a good bone to chew on for awhile. I hope you enjoyed this first edition of puppies and kittens comments!  I further hope this does not go 'poof' as I just spent half an hour doing this.... we shall see in a moment!!

    Time to go out to the garden!!

    Signed 'you know who' (in case the bad guys know my name lol)

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 10:58am

    #9

    westcoastjan

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jun 04 2012

    Posts: 385

    2+

    Cool! It worked hahahahaha!!!!

    Too funny! And also too pathetic that puppies and kittens are necessary....

    Jan

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 11:06am

    #10

    sand_puppy

    Status: Platinum Member

    Joined: Apr 13 2011

    Posts: 2285

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    Athletes in Wuhan Sick in October

    Did European athletes catch coronavirus while competing at World Military Games in Wuhan in OCTOBER? French delegation returned with fevers, after fishmonger is found to have been contaminated in December

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8291755/Did-European-athletes-catch-coronavirus-competing-World-Military-Games-Wuhan-OCTOBER.html

    The 31-year-old went on: 'We were in Wuhan for the World Military Games at the end of October. And afterwards, we all fell ill. Valentin missed three days of training. Me, I was sick too. [...] I had things I had never had before. We weren't particularly worried because no one was talking about it yet.'

    She added: 'A lot of athletes at the World Military Games were very ill. We were recently in touch with a military doctor who told us: "I think you had it because a lot of people from this delegation were ill."' 

    The French delegation were competing in the 7th World Military Games in Wuhan - just 20 days before the first Chinese person officially became ill with coronavirus - with 402 athletes present, along with 10,000 other athletes from all over the world.

    According to French news channel BFMTV, a number of athletes returned to France with unusual symptoms, including fevers and body aches.

    According to the news channel, none of the returning athletes was tested and the French Army who were responsible for organising their athletes at the military games reportedly confirmed that they had not wanted to test any athletes either.

    Doctors have speculated that the virus might have been making its way around before even December, in November or even in October, and the latest revelations seem to underscore that.

    BFMTV quotes one athlete, who preferred to remain anonymous, as saying that he originally thought he had simply caught a cold.

    However, when news began to emerge of an epidemic in Wuhan, many athletes on a WhatsApp group reportedly began to openly wonder if it was possible that they had contracted the disease too.

    Now that it has been revealed that Amirouche Hammar in France had the coronavirus back in December, closer attention is being paid to what these athletes have said.

    --

    So, if someone actually wanted to know what happened here, they could test the athletes for antibodies.  But, do "we" WANT to know?

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 11:09am

    #11

    davefairtex

    Status: Member

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    Posts: 2025

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    log everything - actionable intelligence

    Another win for your "log everything" approach  to finding things that might work.

    Isn't it interesting how supplements might actually - if not cure this thing, make it much less fatal?  I'm really liking the list of supplements that appear to be moving the needle.  Now thats actionable intelligence.

    selenium
    vitamin D
    pepcid

    I will make one claim, however.  Once a million people are infected, "contact tracing" and widespread testing of everyone is not a viable strategy.  The trace and test policy only works when the number of infected people is small relative to the population as a whole.

    Where we are now, the better strategy might be to focus our resources on protecting the vulnerable as best we can - perhaps supplying them with PPE and/or supplements that are known to help ameliorate the severity among that population.  This might well do more to reduce deaths than a test & trace policy which - given the numbers of infected we now have - would be bailing out the lifeboat with a thimble.

    "Everyone at nursing homes gets masks, selenium, vitamin D, and - all the staff gets fever-checked at minimum each day, and - perhaps - tested once a week."

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 11:17am

    #12

    LesPhelps

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Apr 30 2009

    Posts: 606

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    Supplements or Plants?

    You guys do know that all the needed vitamins, minerals, nutrients and antioxidants originate in plants, right?

    So far, every time someone has come up with another supplement, I’ve looked up the plant sources for the vitamins, nutrient, or antioxidants involved and compared it to my diet.  I’ve yet to run across one where I’m not getting at least 100% of the RDA.

    I may be wrong, but it seems like going way over RDA may as easily have a downside as an upside.  At the very least, the overdose may block too many of my bodies receptors resulting in my body absorbing too little of another nutrient it needs.

    More than one study of a supplement has been terminated early, due to increased mortality rate.

    Many processed foods are “fortified” with something or other.  My take on that is the manufacturing process has removed most of the nutritional value of the food, so the manufacturer adds something back in an attempt to make shoppers assume that the item has nutritional value.

    My take on supplements is that they are, to some extent, an attempt by people to add back missing nutrition because they know their diet is otherwise less than optimal.

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 11:29am

    #13
    Linda T

    Linda T

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    Dr. Mikovits

    Well, apparently she's getting too close to home for some of the government folks, especially Fauci. I just saw this and thought I would share. They seem very intent on discrediting her.

    "Who is Judy Mikovits, and what does she have to do with Anthony Fauci and the coronavirus?"

    https://www.oregonlive.com/coronavirus/2020/05/who-is-judy-mikovits-and-what-does-she-have-to-do-with-anthony-fauci-and-the-coronavirus.html

    Linda

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 11:38am

    #14
    Jarven77

    Jarven77

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    HCQ and Zinc study for Chris

    https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.05.02.20080036v1

    hopefully worth sharing here

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 1:30pm

    #15
    vshelford

    vshelford

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    Re U.S. Government not the only one failing the citizens

    Hi JWhite - could you point me to a source for that?  I've heard nothing but praise for how quickly people have been getting the money from the government up here.  I suppose it may vary, province to province, but there certainly hasn't been any mention I've seen of publishing names or public shaming - and that would certainly make the news.  Initially payouts were very quick.  It's possible as the numbers ramped up it slowed things down, and there may well be at least some criteria.  But everyone I know who applied, got it and quickly.  On the other hand, if this is going on, I'd like to know about it and start some questioning.

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 1:34pm

    French connexion

    French connexion

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    SandPuppy

    I confirm your post. I post a video here

    https://www.lci.fr/autres-sports/coronavirus-covid-19-pandemie-des-athletes-militaires-francais-contamines-a-wuhan-en-chine-des-octobre-jeux-militaires-ministere-des-armees-2153093.html

    Americans will not like the conclusion - that the virus was imported by the American military - a name was mentionned at the end of the post. The second part of the clip concerns a French junior champion tennis player who was in China 1000 kms away and came back very sick - infected his parents. For the military athletes no testing planned to see if they were indeed infected.

    So in two days this week we went from the first case in France and first death in January - to a case in December who had tested negative then his test was redone - positive. Next day I saw another clip (not the above) showing an athlete in hospital needing oxygen.

    I do not have opinions on this. Other than these are top notch athletes - probably not getting sick very often. The French lady is champion du monde for pentathlon.

    Sorry for the spelling mistakes - computer set up for French - it is late here.

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 1:47pm

    Mohammed Mast

    Mohammed Mast

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    Nutrition/Supplementation

    If everyone were eating a varied diet of plant food grown in rich bioactive soils your point would be spot on. Unfortunately that has not been the case for over a 100 years. Weston A price did a study in 1930 traveling around the world studying the effect of diet and nutrition on health and dental health. The results are pretty clear. He at that time described Midwestern soil as devoid of nutritional quality. You cannot have nutritious food if those nutrients are not present in the soil.

    The corn belt has also been called a corn desert and for good reason. Constant cultivation and the use of chemical fertilizers, herbicides and pesticides has left the soil totally barren. The only way to grow anything in that kind of soil is with chemical inputs.

    Approximately 80% of Amerikaans live in cities. It is not possible for the huge number of people to grow their own food. They have to rely on grocery stores which for the most part do not sell organic produce and pasture raised animal products. There are a small percentage of small organic farmers but not nearly enough to go around. Add to this the nutrition intelligence of the average Amerikaan is far less than the average IQ.

    Cooking is another issue which is detrimental to nutrition. There are many nutrients that are destroyed in the process of cooking, perhaps chief among them are enzymes. Enzymes are destroyed at temperatures around 118 f.

    Getting back to the soil. Clearly anyone who has been paying attention knows zinc plays a major role in fighting SC2. A good food source of zinc is pecans. Well if the soil that pecan tree grows in is deficient in zinc you will not be getting zinc from those pecans. New Zealand soils are very deficient in zinc so the New Zealanders import food from Oz like wheat because it has a high zinc content due to the soils in Oz. Vit B12 is mostly available from animal products. I have been a vegetarian for 50 years so I supplement Vit B12.

    To top it all off are bodies are under a continuous assault fro environmental pollution. There are untold numbers of chemical compounds floating around. The EPA lists over 85,000 on its list of toxic chemicals. Many of these are hormone disruptors. Hormones rule the universe. Just ask any woman having a hot flash. Many of these chemicals are xenohormones which means they mimic the hormones your own body produces. Breast cancer is primarily a disease caused by hormonal imbalances.

    So to cut to the chase. Our bodies are complex systems which have to deal with numerous existential threats. There are times when it is necessary to give our bodies a boost. Reducing all of this to simply diet does not go quite far enough.

    I have been organic gardening for most of my life. I add Azomite to all my plants. It is a product that comes from Utah. It has virtually every mineral in it.

    To truly know what nutrients are available in your body you need to have a blood test. I do not favor just taking supplements (including herbs) willy nilly. I have posted this before but I will do so again. I use a blood test called Spectracell. It is an amazing test and most insurance companies will pay for at least part of it. The best way to use it is to get the test and find out where you are. Use this as your baseline. See what you are deficient in and either add more foods rich in that micronutrient or supplement to get you levels up. Retest in 6mos. - a year. Do periodic testing. Pretty simple and very accurate. We all love data here so this is a no brainer.

    https://www.spectracell.com/micronutrient-test-panel

     

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 1:51pm

    #18

    sofistek

    Status: Platinum Member

    Joined: Oct 02 2008

    Posts: 667

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    Selenium Toxicity

    A person needs only minute amounts of selenium to support the body, anything more than minute can be toxic. So folks should be careful about equating selenium with a cure. Selenium is present naturally in many soils (sadly, in New Zealand, most soils are deficient in selenium) but a couple of brazil nuts each day should ensure you have the right amount.

    At least, this is my understanding. If I've got this wrong, someone please update me.

    Correlation isn't causation, of course. Without a proper trial it's impossible to know if those with elevated selenium had some other common factor (or factors) which helped them overcome this disease.

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 2:11pm

    #19

    Jim H

    Status: Bronze Member

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    Posts: 1105

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    New NY hospital study finds positive benefit for Zinc addition to HCQ + Zithromycin!

    Can it be?  A positive study result?  Will miracles never cease?   

     https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.05.02.20080036v1.full.pdf

    Hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin plus zinc vs hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin alone: outcomes in hospitalized COVID-19 patients

    Philip M. Carlucci1 , Tania Ahuja2 , Christopher Petrilli1,3, Harish Rajagopalan3 , Simon Jones4.5, Joseph Rahimian1 1 New York University Grossman School of Medicine, Department of Medicine, New York, NY 2 New York University Langone Health, Department of Pharmacy, New York, NY 3 NYU Langone Health, New York, NY 4 Division of Healthcare Delivery Science, Department of Population Health, NYU Grossman School of Medicine, New York, NY 5 Center for Healthcare Innovation and Delivery Science, NYU Langone Health, New York, NY 6 Division of Infectious Diseases and Immunology, Department of Medicine, NYU Grossman School of Medicine, New York, NY  

    The main finding of this study is that after adjusting for the timing of zinc therapy, we found that the addition of zinc sulfate to hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin was found to associate with a decrease in mortality or transition to hospice among patients who did not require ICU level of care, but this association was not significant in patients who were treated in the ICU. This result may be reflective of the proposed mechanism of action of zinc sulfate in COVID-19. Zinc has been shown to reduce SARS-CoV RNA dependent RNA polymerase activity in vitro [13]. As such, zinc may have a role in preventing the virus from progressing to severe disease, but once the aberrant production of systemic immune mediators is initiated, known as the cytokine storm, the addition of zinc may no longer be effective [17]. Our findings suggest a potential therapeutic synergistic mechanism of zinc sulfate with hydroxychloroquine, if used early on in presentation with COVID-19. 

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 2:20pm

    #20
    Oxfordeye

    Oxfordeye

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    Oxfordeye said:

    Children in New York City are manifesting symptoms similar to Kawasaki Disease but may be caused by COVID-19:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ja-jhcXMGj0

     

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 2:25pm

    dtrammel

    Status: Bronze Member

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    Posts: 762

    6+

    Now That One Has Got To Be A Bot, LOL

    Just saying...

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 2:40pm

    MarkM

    MarkM

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    Posts: 392

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    MM took the

    words right out of my mouth.

    A blood test is the only way to know your nutrient levels. No matter what foods you are eating.

    Any food that is supposedly high in a particular mineral will certainly not be if grown in a soil deficient in that nutrient.

    Mineral balance is a complex, interwoven story. Very important,  not easily solved.

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 2:57pm

    #23

    thc0655

    Status: Platinum Member

    Joined: Apr 27 2010

    Posts: 1938

    9+

    I’ve been wondering

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 3:09pm

    #24

    thc0655

    Status: Platinum Member

    Joined: Apr 27 2010

    Posts: 1938

    4+

    Police officer challenges peers re: enforcing lockdown

    https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=3261382657205825

    I don’t know what’s going to happen to him but I do know he’d be fired in Philadelphia.

    YouTube version:

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 3:50pm

    Mots

    Mots

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    Selenium Toxicity

    Sofistek
    thank you for your cautionary note about selenium
    1. 50 micrograms per day is generally recommended for adults
    2. 500 micrograms per day is generally considered toxic for long term supplementation.
    3.  some people say that 200 micrograms per day is tolerated by adults, everyone is different, I don't have my own opinion.

    selenite (inorganic form) is cheap, organic selenium is not) I have heard that organic selenium is less toxic but dont remember details.
    I found that feeding selenite in excess caused urinary excretion of trimethylselenonium (unlike most things, selenium is reduced rather than oxidized by the body before excretion)
    Too much selenium causes accident substitution of selenium in place of sulfur in the amino acid methionine (analogous to the problem of arsenic replacing phosphorus in reactions (look at the periodic table, to get an idea of what is going on)
    I asked my favorite selenium scientist (Dr. Chris Hawkes, who discovered the selenocysteine transfer RNA) to give his opinion.
    Here is his reply:
    "Yes, I know the senior author of the study that chart came from (https://academic.oup.com/ajcn/advance-article/doi/10.1093/ajcn/nqaa095/5826147). This is solid research, but just a correlation. There is a plausible mechanism by which selenium might protect against coronavirus, because it protects mice from coxsackievirus (https://www.cell.com/trends/microbiology/fulltext/S0966-842X(04)00164-7?_returnURL=https%3A%2F%2Flinkinghub.elsevier.com%2Fretrieve%2Fpii%2FS0966842X04001647%3Fshowall%3Dtrue)."

    Sofistek: I note that Coxsackie virus is a single stranded RNA virus.  From my review of this paper, I conclude that selenium deficiency facilitates coxsackie virus infection (this was a side finding of studies of Kushan (selenium deficiency) disease in China).  So far I don't see a reason to take high selenium, yet those graph results show less covid at higher selenium levels..  Keep in mind that hair levels are a long term measure of selenium status.  Maybe daily levels never go below a minimum if the overall selenium consumption is high.  anyway, that is my take, Mots

     

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 4:14pm

    #26
    Sparky1

    Sparky1

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    Chris' newest video, live now: "Greatest Wealth Transfer Ever" (5/8/20)

    "Coronavirus: The "Rescue" Is Stealing Your Wealth" (5/8/20)

     

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 4:37pm

    #27
    Prep101

    Prep101

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    second video on Bill Gates just came out

    Last week the first video could be seen on Bill Gates on the Corbett Report:

    How Bill Gates Monopolized Global Health:

    https://www.corbettreport.com/gateshealth/

    This week, just now, the second video came out.

    Bill Gates' plan to vaccinate the world:

    https://www.corbettreport.com/gatesvaccine/

    Next week, the third video in the series will come out.

    You can also read the Transcript to the video's including hyperlinks to the sources.

     

     

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 5:36pm

    #28

    berensma

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 10 2011

    Posts: 17

    Melatonin

    Hi Chris:
    Per your request--I saw this article back in March. It's not your typical scientific article, but then those are not necessarily where the best information is coming from now.

    COVID-19, Pneumonia & Inflammasomes – The Melatonin Connection

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 6:17pm

    Janie-em

    Janie-em

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    Joined: Mar 05 2020

    Posts: 33

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    Prep101 - Gates video

    Thanks for this. I find it informative, reasonable and helpful.

    Corbett states something I've been asking for a few years now. Why is the world listening to an unelected, uncredited, college dropout, software engineer, businessman who has no medical background? I find it astounding that all of the media outlets around the world refuse to do any background research on the Gates Foundation vaccine program in the third wold and the scandals associated with it. They are all so blinded by the wealth and success of the Gateses, that they just take them at face value for anything thing they propose.

    Want to vaccinate with a live Polo virus, even though it leads to thousands of cases of paralysis? Want the entire world to sit at home while you hope to develop a vaccine for a type of virus that we've never had a successful vaccine for? Sure, come right in! It's such a incredibly unprofessional reaction by media and government leaders. And now the G.F. is doing this for the entire world. Why must we all be subjected to the whims of a billionaire couple with a God complex? At least on sites like the one you linked to, and this one, we are free to question the pseudoscience and pseudo governance being forced on us.

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 6:36pm

    #30
    Angi

    Angi

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    Vaccine Study In Seattle -

    It looks to me like this was started mid March - doesn't that timing raise some questions ???

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/victoriaforster/2020/03/17/first-person-injected-with-trial-coronavirus-vaccine-in-seattle/#6a6aff1b2583

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 7:14pm

    #31

    sofistek

    Status: Platinum Member

    Joined: Oct 02 2008

    Posts: 667

    How to win

    Just to clarify what Chris put up about those countries winning. The coronavirus.org web site shows countries that have the classic winning curve, those that are almost there and those that are nowhere near. However, its characterisation of what is needed to get that winning curve is not accurate. Countries don't necessarily need to take all of the actions mentioned. In particular, my country, New Zealand, and our neighbour, Australia, have the winning curve but don't mandate or recommend the use of masks in public. In contrast, the USA does recommend the use of face coverings but is definitely not winning.

    So, to get the right curve (at least in the first wave), then actions are needed to break the chain of transmission but not all actions that could do that are needed simultaneously.

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 7:49pm

    JWhite

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    Re U.S. Government not the only one failing the citizens

    vshelford - my source for difficulties in applying for Unemployment Insurance was relatives and friends who live in Ontario and who personally had these experiences; they did not speak to a newspaper reporter about it. I heard from a lawyer who is a sole practitioner who has employees, also in Ontario, about the possible publication of names of small businesses who apply for help. On the Government of Canada website relating to the Small Business Emergency Wage Subsidy program I found the following statement buried within a link to the Privacy Statement, which may have been the one referred to:
    Please note that to process your application we will need to access information in your tax file. Information regarding your participation in the program may be disclosed to the public in accordance with the Income Tax Act.”
    Here’s the link to that page within the overall document; you need to click on ‘Read the Privacy Statement’:

    https://www.canada.ca/en/revenue-agency/services/subsidy/emergency-wage-subsidy/cews-how-apply.html

    Note this policy refers to the small business employer, who is applying for wage subsidies for the employees.

    Another observation about Canada’s emergency aid package is that applicants are required to prove that they have lost at least a given percentage of their salary (15% or 30% depending on month being applied for), compared to either the same month last year or the first two months in 2020, in order to receive aid. In the case of some self-employed people, such as Real Estate agents or seasonal workers such as landscapers, they do not necessarily have income in every month of the year. For example, the Real Estate market is flat right now but an agent who did not happen to have income in March / April of last year, or Jan / Feb of this year, does not appear to qualify for aid.

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 7:50pm

    Island girl

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    Island girl said:

    Epidemiologists agree with your assessment that contact tracing useful when outbreak is small (or we have new hot spots pop up),

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 9:37pm

    Mots

    Mots

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    Chris's newest video comments about THIS GROUP

    I appreciate Chris's comments about this group and our possible dispositive role in creating better alternatives after the crash.
    I also note that "history rhymes."  and we are rhyming with Germany of the 1930s, wherein (in this case) truth seekers are the new devil and labeled as domestic terrorists etc.
    With all of that in mind, anyone in the group who is a radio amateur or interested in peer to peer communications out of control of FB, google etc. please message me.  There are interesting alternative communication paths we can use as things get worse.................

     

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 9:53pm

    #35
    westernsmile

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    Selenium/Flu Numbers/Grammar

    Around two months ago I read about a study that showed that people with a sufficient level of selenium in their bodies did not catch Ebola.  Since then my husband and I have been eating 3 or 4 Brazil nuts a day to get a sufficient amount of selenium.    Regarding the actual number of flu deaths in the US each year, please google this article published by Scientific American,  "Comparing Covid-19 Deaths to Flu Deaths is Like Comparing Apples to Oranges," by Jeremy S. Faust.  His article repeats something I read a number of years ago, that the CDC basically makes up the flu death figures, greatly exaggerating them, in order to scare us into getting the flu vaccine.    Finally, regarding grammar, when you say "send your comments to Adam and I, it's really correct to say "to Adam and me."  You can verify this by leaving off the Adam part.  It doesn't sound correct if you say "send your comments to I."  It's therefore also incorrect to say "send your comments to Adam and I."  Sorry to be a pain about grammar.... Aside from that, I greatly value all of your videos regarding Covid19.  I have done extensive reading since mid-January.  I'm so glad I found you!  You are the almost singular voice of valid information and  reason on the web!  Thank you!!!

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 11:03pm

    sofistek

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    Grammar

    Westernsmile,

    It's very brave to correct grammar but well done (I cringe at bad grammar often). However, I'm afraid it's a losing battle; someone can easily say,"but you know what I meant." I guess that's what language is for; communication.

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 11:15pm

    splittiebus66

    splittiebus66

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    Possible junk science in EVMS Critical Care Covid Protocols?

    Had an interesting talk with a critical care doctor treating Sars/cov2 patients regarding the EVMS protocol page Chris mentioned, including the anti coagulation drug aspect and other issues. He had some criticisms for Dr. Paul Marik that may merit some more research. The protocols put forth may very well have been extrapolated from a Wuhan prophylaxis study and then scaled by the author to a full scale treatment option for potentially critical patients. I'm not a Dr. but there is that extrapolation thing again.  The other conflicting bit he stated lies in the idea of reduced viral loads as the disease progresses and into an immuno response, which is something he does not see across the board, but rather the virus moving in waves of various effects on his patients. He stated the only thing he's noticed in his patients that is 100% is one will react one way and another a completely different outcome. The antiviral/immunosuppresant/anticoagulant treatment line is not clearly defined at all with large viral loads in tests in late course people as well. He also had some insight on the venting idea, that there isn't a clear time to do that either. Some folks crash so fast, that if you have an anatomically difficult intubation to do it can get ugly quick. Worth looking into where the EVMS treatment ideas come from, the doc I spoke with said he has been overwhelmed with terrible junk science papers and awfully conducted studies from typically reliable and well established sources. Seems many folks want to be "the guy" to crack the nut so to speak.  Honeybadger indeed.......

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 11:34pm

    #38
    Truth9834

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    Hydroxychloroquine Study

    In univariate analyses, zinc sulfate increased the frequency of patients being discharged home, and decreased the need for ventilation, admission to the ICU, and mortality or transfer to hospice for patients who were never admitted to the ICU. After adjusting for the time at which zinc sulfate was added to our protocol, an increased frequency of being discharged home (OR 1.53, 95% CI 1.12-2.09) reduction in mortality or transfer to hospice remained significant (OR 0.449, 95% CI 0.271-0.744).

    Conclusion: This study provides the first in vivo evidence that zinc sulfate in combination with hydroxychloroquine may play a role in therapeutic management for COVID-19.

    https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.05.02.20080036v1.full.pdf

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  • Fri, May 08, 2020 - 11:36pm

    Tweetybird

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    Tweetybird said:

    Is there a list of supplements on this site? I have been looking but can't find it anywhere? Would appreciate a pointer to the list. I want to order some selenium.

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  • Sat, May 09, 2020 - 2:51am

    sofistek

    Status: Platinum Member

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    Diet

    Quite right LesPhelps. It seems odd to me that supplements are recommended instead of making sure you get the right nutrients from real food. In some cases it may be desireable to temporarily add some nutrients until you get the mix right but supplements, generally, are unsustainable.

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  • Sat, May 09, 2020 - 8:16am

    #41
    Mohammed Mast

    Mohammed Mast

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    Well good to know the race tracks are open.

    The most amazing horse race of all time.

     

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HIS7F_tkvuM

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  • Sat, May 09, 2020 - 8:28am

    Mohammed Mast

    Mohammed Mast

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    For my kiwi friends

    New Zealand has rather poor volcanic soil. Supplements might not be a bad idea. Or just import food from somewhere else that has good soil. Of course that isn't too sustainable.

    https://wondermins.co.nz/minerals-lacking-nz/

    https://www.abouthealth.co.nz/blog/post/new-zealand-soil-deficiencies.html

    This one is particularly good.

    https://www.healthyfood.com/advice/how-to-avoid-nzs-top-dietary-deficiencies/

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  • Sat, May 09, 2020 - 9:01am

    #43
    Mohammed Mast

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    The Government is Failing Us??????

    Certainly a catchy title. I think it needs some further definition though.

    What is government?

    Who are us?

    What is failing?

    Government is nothing more than a Cosa Nostra. The US government was created by rich white guys for rich white guys to be run by rich white guys. The US constitution did not include women, African slaves, nor the first nation people. It centralized power in a single entity rather than a loose confederation of individual states, as created under the Articles of Confederation.

    Who are us? LOL This government of rich white guys is as George Carlin has shown is a big club and you aint in it.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HIS7F_tkvuM

    The government is not failing the bankers and Wall Street ( Wall Street was a slave market at one time), large corporations, hedge funds and a slew of "connected"  white collar criminals. The illusion of an "us" only exists for a few reasons, war,  and taxes. Voting is the biggest illusion of all.

    So what is failing? Nothing absolutely nothing. Are people dying? Sure. Are people losing jobs and businesses? Sure. Does the government care? LOL. This government sent millions of jobs overseas. Thanks to supposed free trade and trade agreements the US can not make and supply its citizens with PPE. It cannot produce Hydrogen Peroxide. It cannot produce hand sanitizer. We have breweries being repurposed to make hand sanitizer. We have a cottage industry making masks. This is only an embarrassment if you think the government is your friend. This is an embarrassment if you think you believe this is a government of the people, by the people for the people. It AINT.

    As has been stated in these videos "you are on your own. " The good news is people are now waking up thanks to this pandemic. As stated in the Crash Course the next 20 years will be very different from the previous 20 years. The rich white guys are stealing everything they can get their hands on and putting in place technology to control the expected fallout.

    Here is Oxiris Barbot telling New Yorkers to party on. This is a government official in charge of protecting the health of 10 million people. How this woman still has a job paying $228,141 a year is a question that demands an answer from the victims of her incompetence

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x4lmPMG4wtg

    Think of it this way the people in government sat next to you in high school.

    YOU ARE ON YOUR OWN

     

     

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  • Sat, May 09, 2020 - 10:13am

    drbrucedale

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    Correction: Zelenko was the first to treat with HCQ and zinc

    It is good that the effectiveness of HCQ and zinc in treating Covid-19 is being more widely recognized. But this somewhat self-congratulatory paper is wrong--they are not the first.

    As far as I can tell Dr. Zelenko was the first to start treating lots of US patients with HCQ and zinc. For his troubles, he got labeled as a "star of the right wing" by the New York Times and other left-leaning media. Here is one example:

    https://www.chicagotribune.com/coronavirus/ct-nw-nyt-coronavirus-vladimir-zelenko-hydroxychloroquine-cure-20200402-s4rwdsfi5ncx7oyxoiwgmoml7y-story.html

    You can Google "Zelenko" or "Zelenko protocol" to get more details, especially of his early work using HCQ and zinc (back in February)...but he was the first and should be acknowledged as such. To get you started, here is what I think is his most recent interview.

    https://techstartups.com/2020/04/21/dr-vladimir-zelenko-now-treated-1450-coronavirus-patients-2-deaths-using-hydroxychloroquine-99-99-success-rate-latest-video-interview/

    Bruce

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  • Sat, May 09, 2020 - 1:57pm

    vshelford

    vshelford

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    Re U.S. Government not the only one failing the citizens

    Thanks JWhite!

    Ontario and Quebec have been the hardest hit provinces, so I can well imagine that, after the initial burst of applications, response from the bureaucracy would have slowed down. Also, as the implications of the rescue became obvious, someone was obviously doing some sums in the background and trying to place some rational limits. Whether they were actually rational is always open to question, of course - as Chris says, these people are mostly managers.

    "Information regarding... participation in the program", since the program has to do with the aid going to wage subsidies for employees, might actually amount to positive PR.  Public shaming would be really really unusual - no one is likely to consider participation in this program as a shameful act anyway, so that sounds to me more like a miscellaneous standard cya by some lawyer.

    Proving that you've lost a portion of your normal income for a given month sounds like one of the ways of limiting the damage to the overall budget.  Real Estate agents and others with sporadic income streams are usually prepared for dry periods.  I checked with some local agents here in BC and it's not worrying them.  If the following month was good, they can apply for help on that basis.  Surprisingly, though, people are still out there buying houses.

    Around here, landscapers and other self-employed are often still working, as they can do so safely, but that may not be the case back east.

    Although I'm grateful that the govt is doing as much as they are to help, I'm also glad there are some criteria or the final debt will be even worse.  BC is about to start "opening up" a bit, as our curve has really flattened, and I think the way they are proposing to do it is really intelligent.  They are suggesting guidelines for safe operation, that the business must post for potential customers to assess for themselves whether what is being done makes them feel safe enough to patronize that business. That way, it's between the business and their customers, not a bunch of top-down rules with official enforcement.  I'll be really interested to see how it works.  They'll close things down again if the curve goes up past what the health system can manage.

    I'm sorry your friends/relatives have had a hard time with it.  As I said before, I've just heard good things, so it may depend on the bureaucrat they hit.  These are chaotic times, and nobody's doing a perfect job.

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  • Sat, May 09, 2020 - 6:52pm

    JWhite

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    Re U.S. Government not the only one failing the citizens

    Hi vshelford – thanks for sharing your thoughts and opinions.

    Re: the Small Business Wage Subsidy program, I don’t quite see how the reference to a public list of applicants could act as a ‘cya’ statement, and I can’t think of a good reason why the names should be publicly displayed, but the possibility of this happening may of course prevent some employers, and especially professionals, from applying for it.  It seems shameful that such a statement has been included, especially when the small business aid program(s) did not provide for assistance for the small business owners themselves (I’m not sure if this has changed at this point).

    In any case, I’m happy that things have gone smoothly for your friends out in B.C, and that your curve has flattened – that’s certainly what we want to hear!

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  • Sat, May 09, 2020 - 7:02pm

    #47
    Mohammed Mast

    Mohammed Mast

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    The MOFOS You will not believe this

    The US gubmint turned down an off to buy 1.7 million masks a week from a Texas based company on January 22. This is a crime against humanity. This is a crime against every Amerikaan. How many people died because of this including Health Care workers.

    Somebody needs to fry for this shit

    https://theintercept.com/2020/05/07/coronavirus-whistleblower-hhs-n95-ppe/

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  • Sun, May 10, 2020 - 8:59am

    Prep101

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    Prep101 said:

    Great idea to make a list of actionable intelligence! Don't forget Elderberry syrup and vitamin C and perhaps zinc on that list (for the listeners of Chris who haven't put it on there already).

     

    I also agree that - like you said - "once a million people are infected, 'contact tracing' and widespread testing of everyone is not a viable strategy.  The trace and test policy only works when the number of infected people is small relative to the population as a whole."

     

    If more than a million people are infected, then "contact tracing" I think there is a real danger that it will become an excuse which an increasingly authoritarian government can use to suppress dissident voices in it's population. (Mind you, authoritarian overreach isn't limited to either Democratic or Republican governments. I would argue that it's more like a class warfare which the 0,001% CRONY-capitalist revolving-door billionaire or multi-multi-millionaire class is waging against everyone else.)

     

    Pro tip: when the number of infected in the population exceeds a million, every time you hear "contact tracing" you can substitute "Big Brother omnipresent surveillance" in its place:

    https://www.corbettreport.com/stop-calling-it-contact-tracing-propagandawatch/

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  • Sun, May 10, 2020 - 11:18am

    #49

    westcoastjan

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    An interesting geopol*tical read

    This is an interesting geopolitical view from a Canadian

    black-swans-fly-in

     

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  • Sun, May 10, 2020 - 12:03pm

    #50
    Angi

    Angi

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    Great Interview for Understanding Food Supply and Shortages.

    Spiro Skouras is a very good interviewer and cutting edge for what's going in big picture.

    If you have time also check out some of his other work. He's super credible IMO.

     

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  • Sun, May 10, 2020 - 12:07pm

    davefairtex

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    contract tracing

    The concept of having to answer a ton of questions about where you went, and who you saw, and - perhaps - being required to run a particular phone app in order to run around "outside" - does seem a trifle overdone.

    Here's the thing.  Iceland lets everyone who tests positive just quarantine at home.  Nobody is subjected to cross-examination.  They are trusted to do the right thing.  As a result, nobody fears getting tested.

    Alternatively, if you require everyone to confess to everything they ever did, and everyone they saw, and everywhere they went - do you imagine people will want to be tested?  Knowing what that will expose all of their contacts to?

    People will hide from testing.

    The whole approach is counter-productive.  It is is exactly what the CCP does.  "We will impose this regime upon everyone because we know best."  Natural human response: everyone tries to avoid being tested.  Who wants to subject their contacts to that sort of scrutiny?

    Compare with the Iceland model - we trust the people to do the right thing.  Once infected, most people will inform their contacts on their own.  Nobody fears getting tested.

    In a high tech "enforced contact tracing" regime, I will leave my phone at home.  A phone is a liability in such an environment.  It is a witness for the prosecution - for whatever they want to prosecute you for.

    [Note: in Xinjiang, you cannot do this - you must have the CCP app on your phone, and you must have it with you at all times.  It is your "leash" they use to monitor you.  Once "they" start to require you to carry a phone or face "consequences" - you will be in a de-facto Xinjiang-like environment.]

    Lastly - if we have 10 people infected, then it makes sense.  Once we have millions of infected people, it just makes no sense at all.  It seems like a structure put in place for something else entirely.  Especially if the tech companies put it into place.

    Perhaps, having worked in tech for many years, I am a skeptic.  🙂

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  • Sun, May 10, 2020 - 12:36pm

    Linda T

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    Re: contract tracing

    Dave,

    I am also very skeptical, having worked for in a call center contracted to Sprint for over 3 years. I think there would be a huge amount of people shifting back to flip-phones, me included. Not only the intrusiveness, 1984 style, but with all of that data, it would be a surefire target for hackers and nefarious third-party vendors, ie Facebook’s fiasco with Cambridge Analytica.  I for instance work somewhere where it would be impossible, due to the large number of customers, to account for everyone I came into contact with. If fact, anyone who worked there…

    Linda

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  • Sun, May 10, 2020 - 4:16pm

    sofistek

    Status: Platinum Member

    Joined: Oct 02 2008

    Posts: 667

    Contact tracing

    I don't think that the total number of infections is the critical thing, rather the number of daily infections relative to the contact tracing capability. We have a very good contact tracing ability in New Zealand. Yes, we only have a few new infections per day but have the ability to trace thousands of contacts each day and we're a very small country.

    Contact tracing is a vital part of trying to ensure that any infections don't spread too far. Relying on individuals to trace and tell their own contacts is just too weak of a strategy and likely to fail.

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  • Sun, May 10, 2020 - 5:12pm

    Susan7

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    Susan7 said:

    That might be fine for NZ. Here it will spell the introduction of the police state they all long for.

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  • Mon, May 11, 2020 - 1:31am

    sofistek

    Status: Platinum Member

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    Posts: 667

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    Contact tracing

    So you don't agree, Susan and Dave, that Chris's step 3 (rigorous contact tracing) should be part of the gold standard pandemic approach?

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  • Mon, May 11, 2020 - 6:37am

    davefairtex

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    Posts: 2025

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    contact tracing

    sofistek-

    It is pretty obvious that - at some point - contact tracing becomes pointless.  The question for debate is, what is that point?

    If the US has 320 million people, and 160 million are infected, is contact tracing useful?

    No.  It would just be wasted effort.  Would you agree?

    If, in a 320 million population, only 3 people have it, is contact tracing useful?  Of course it is.  It is extremely useful.

    It is the middle ground that is up for debate.  How many "likely infected" does it take for contact tracing to be more time and trouble and economic expense than it is worth?

    You tell me.

    I expect that in some areas, with few cases, it will be a great idea.  In other areas - say NYC - it will be mostly useless.  Certainly NYC doesn't seem to care about it at this point.

    I can definitely see providing advice to people who test positive on what they should tell people in their household (since that's how - mostly - people get infected) but beyond that, once the numbers get too large, I mean - what are  you gonna do?  With 5000 new cases a day, will you put out a bulletin that says "30 new positives were using the (A-C-E) subway line yesterday"?  Every day you'll be saying this.  Useful?  Not so much.  Information overload.  Why would you waste the man-hours to do this?

    Take a look at the advice given by NYC Health department.  They do not even recommend getting tested unless you are really super sick.  (So much for "treat early").  Maybe this is why they have so many people dying.

    https://www1.nyc.gov/site/doh/covid/covid-19-symptoms-chronic-health-risks.page

    If you are sick, assume you have COVID-19. You do not need to seek testing at this time. Not getting tested protects health care workers and saves essential medical supplies that are in short supply, such as testing materials, masks and gloves.

    NYC does not seem to be doing contact tracing right now.  That's because - they have too many cases for it to be useful.  My guess.

    "Don't bother getting tested.  We don't care about you unless you are really super sick."

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  • Mon, May 11, 2020 - 7:04am

    #57

    sand_puppy

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    Limits of contact tracing when aerosol is a transmission route

    I would add to DaveF's excellent comment above, that when aerosols (which can float in an airspace for hours) is a transmission route that exposure is too hard to define.

    One infected visits Starbucks one time, say, 7:00 am Tuesday morning, means that everyone who visited Starbucks between 7:00 am and Noon that Tuesday has been "exposed."

    Should these 50-100 people be called and asked to stay home for 14 days?

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  • Mon, May 11, 2020 - 7:58am

    Mohammed Mast

    Mohammed Mast

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    NYC Standard of no care

    Dave Barbot is an idiot way over her head.  If the NYC health dept is recommending not to get tested unless "super" sick then she should be taken out and shot. Even most idiots know (at least by now) you have to treat a virus early.

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  • Mon, May 11, 2020 - 8:27am

    Quercus bicolor

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    NYC Standard of no HCQ

    NYC DOH: "Don't get tested unless you're super sick."

    NY Pharmacy Board: "No HCQ without a positive test."

    And of course, once you get a test after you become super sick, you have to wait 3-4 days for results.  Your window of significant HCQ usefulness is closed or nearly closed by then.

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  • Mon, May 11, 2020 - 8:53am

    #60

    davefairtex

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    Joined: Sep 03 2008

    Posts: 2025

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    NYC Health: "you should wait for 3-4 days" vs treating rapidly

    Was my characterization of "don't bother us until you are super sick" accurate?  Here is the full description from the NYC Health Dept.

    Most people with COVID-19 have mild to moderate symptoms and recover on their own. Less commonly, COVID-19 may lead to pneumonia, other severe complications, hospitalization or death.

    If you are sick, assume you have COVID-19. You do not need to seek testing at this time. Not getting tested protects health care workers and saves essential medical supplies that are in short supply, such as testing materials, masks and gloves.

    If you have mild or moderate symptoms of COVID-19, stay home, except when you need essential medical care or basic needs, such as groceries, if you have no other way to get them.

    So basically don't bother us unless you have severe symptoms!

    That said - they do make exceptions if you are > 50 or you have a co-morbidity, but they still want you to wait around for 3-4 days, rather than treating immediately.

    If it were me, and I had symptoms, I'd want to start an anti-viral instantly, rather than "waiting around for 3-4 days."  You know, like they say to do with Tamiflu.  One would think they'd be on board with this too, being medical professionals and all.  But - apparently not.

    You should call your health care provider if you have symptoms and one of the following applies to you:

    You are 50 years of age or older, pregnant, or have other health conditions, such as:

    Lung disease
    Moderate to severe asthma
    Heart disease
    A weakened immune system
    Obesity
    Diabetes
    Kidney disease
    Liver disease
    Cancer

    You do not feel better in three to four days.

    Again, that link:

    https://www1.nyc.gov/site/doh/covid/covid-19-symptoms-chronic-health-risks.page

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  • Mon, May 11, 2020 - 9:15am

    #61
    dryam2000

    dryam2000

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    Predictable

    Going back to January I knew there was going to be bureaucratic bungling at every level of healthcare in regard to CV-19.  I’ve been practicing (evidence-based to this best of my ability) medicine for nearly 20 years.  I’m completely bewildered over this love affair with Remdesivir by the MSM, medical boards, the WHO, etc.  It literally makes zero sense.  No study has shown any decrease in mortality with Remdesivir.....none, nada, no hint, nothing.  Same thing goes for other severe complications such as renal failure, blood clots, number of patients requiring mechanical ventilation, etc.  There is evidence it may help decrease the symptomatology for 1-2 days, but that’s it.  I am befuddled why the medical establishment, the press, citizens, etc., etc. aren’t asking more questions about this.  If someone out there has new information on a Remdesivir study I would like to know about it.
    It is extremely difficult even when trying to practice the best evidence-based medicine on some of the most basic things in medicine.  Medicine is anything but black & white; it’s literally all shades of gray.  Yes, first do no harm, but sometimes doing nothing is doing harm in itself.  When there’s evidence showing a medicine such as HCQ is effective early on, its safety profile has been followed for 70+ years, and there’s a new disease which can have known devastating effects I’m not seeing the downside if given to non-cardiac patients & those not already taking QTc prolonging medications (QTc prolongation is the serious cardiac arrhythmia concern with  HCQ).  ALL medications have side effects....people have died from taking low dose aspirin.  Frankly, most of the folks on medical committees are blowtards playing political games for secondary personal gain.  They tend not to be folks directly caring for patient.  How’s the saying go?...”Go along to get along.” Yes, I said it.  Blasphemy!!  If someone can show me hard data that says something to the contrary I am I most willing to change my mind.  People are dying.  This is no time to let political correctness, money, politics, power, etc. to get in the way of helping out humanity.  On one hand completely unbelievable, on the other predictable.  I hate to sound so pessimistic.  I try not to to be either pessimistic or optimism, but realistic.

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  • Mon, May 11, 2020 - 9:54am

    #62

    Jim H

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    How many studies will it take to convince people HCQ works? Here's another from today

    New study from France that shows 90% reduced death rate for those getting HCQ + Zithromycin.  

    Here is the link:  https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.05.05.20088757v1

    Here is the money chart - the story is the same as told before... clear benefit, 90% less death even for hospitalized patients in this case... and those getting HCQ were sicker to begin with!

       

    Edit: The authors didn't miss the fact that Azithro alone seemed to be equally beneficial vs HCQ + Azithro in these hospitalized patients;
    Interestingly, patients who received azithromycin alone had a trend to a better
    241 outcome than standard of care (multivariate analysis, p=0.05), in the limit of the
    242 sample size (n<30). Azithromycin’s potential antiviral activity is concordant with
    243 previous in vitro studies regarding SARS-CoV-2 [12] or H1N1-pdm09 [13] and one
    244 clinical randomized trial in in the prevention of children respiratory infections [14]. As
    245 azithromycin is commonly prescribed and authorized in ambulatory care, a study
    246 conducted among general practitioners could be relevant to evaluate this single
    247 therapy for the control of COVID-19 in outpatients.

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  • Mon, May 11, 2020 - 10:13am

    #63

    sand_puppy

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    Blowback against Faucci and Remdesivir

    A member of my facebook group, EM Docs, (not me) posted this giving evidence to the deterioration of trust in "authorities."

    Fauci has been caught red-handed, unequivocally, lying about the effectiveness and role of Remdesivir.  And, most importantly, the ER doctor's group knows that he is lying.

    I also believe that he (and his group) is actively deceiving us about HCQ/azith/zinc effectiveness in the early viral replication stage of illness, and actively doing harm with the avoidance of steroids during the COVID phase of illness characterized by uncontrolled cytokine storm. (here, here, and here)

    ---------------------

    From another EM doctor, authors name withheld

    Anthony Fauci’s credibility:  Why it Matters.

    Sometime in the next 12 to 18 months you will be asked by your employer to receive a newly minted vaccine for the coronavirus. In many cases it may be a Requirement for employment rather than a request.

    Since I’m going to be talking about vaccine I guess I need to give a little of my background. I’m a board certified residency trained practicing emergency physician for the last 30 years. I am a strong proponent of vaccines. I receive the flu vaccine annually, and would do so even if it were optional for my employment. My wife and children are also fully vaccinated. When I travel to Haiti I received optional travel vaccines for typhoid and hepatitis A.

    I recently posted “Lies, Damn Lies and Statistics” On this site to generate a discussion about how the recent research into the effectiveness of Remdesivir has been portrayed.

    I was particularly appalled by characterizing Remdesivir as “the standard of care.”   In my reading of the research the most optimistic description I could give would be “might be helpful deserves additional study“

    I would particularly like anyone who is currently involved in clinical research to comment on the decision to terminate the study early due to the early finding of shorter hospitalizations. Especially in light of a concurrent study published that found no benefit.

    A brief summary.

    A study was well designed with physiologic endpoints selected to determine if R altered the course of the disease COVID-19.

    Endpoints were 1)death, 2)  requiring mechanical ventilation, and, 3) requiring supplemental oxygen.

    After most of the data were collected these physiologic parameters were moved to secondary endpoints. The new primary endpoint of the study became “number of days hospitalized.“

    The above physiologic endpoints were relegated to secondary endpoints still studied but not the primary goal of the study.  No statistically significant difference was found in any of these physiologic endpoints with treatment

    We are to believe that the statisticians who designed the study and selected the valid physiologic endpoints somehow had a change of heart without examining the preliminary data.  They changed the entire goal of the study midway through.

    Length of hospitalization was appropriately left out of the endpoints in the original study design because there are dozens of non-physiologic factors that interfere with discharge from the hospital.

    My original post accused no one of dishonesty. Subsequently there have been televised interviews where Dr. Fauci claimed that the Statisticians who proposed the change to the study had not reviewed the preliminary data.  I look forward to the publication and peer review where they explain what reasoning they had to make that change.  The claim that they were blinded to the preliminary data is laughable on its face.

    The other glaring failure that has caused me to lose confidence in Dr. Fauci is the fact that he failed to comment at all on the well-designed study [done in China] published in the Lancet just a few days earlier that found no benefit from Remdesivir.  Still Fauci declared that “Remdesivir will become the standard of care”.  Would anyone who reads the study in the Lancet, and looks at Dr. Fauci’s preliminary data accuse me of practicing below the standard of care if I fail to use Remdesivir on a hospitalized COVID patient?

    The reason this all troubles me so is that these are the same scientists who are going to put forward a vaccine in the next 12 to 18 months that I will be expected to take.

    Vaccine manufacturing and testing for a new disease should be considered on par with the moon shot:  A decade long process.  If all hands are brought on deck and we shorten the testing as much as possible we still should be looking at 3 to 5 years before it goes in the widespread use. I am alarmed to hear discussion of a vaccine becoming available in the next 12 to 18 months.

    My fear is that our zeal to quickly bring a vaccine to market and distribute it widely will result in a flawed vaccine coming to market. This will result in the anti-vaccine movement leaping forward and will set back well proven well tested vaccines by 50 years.

    The stakes are high and while I am anxious to have effective treatments and vaccines I think we need to remain vigilant and make sure that what we do this correctly.  We must not fall into the trap of “hurry up and do “something“ even if it’s wrong.

    ------

    And when the head of the White House Coronavirus Task Force WHO and CDC are  bending the data for power and profit and cannot be trusted to speak clear truth, how will we trust the safety of the new vaccine that they recommend?

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  • Mon, May 11, 2020 - 10:27am

    #64

    Jim H

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    Super post Sandpuppy

    The ER doc you quoted said this.. and I think it needs more light on it;

     I would particularly like anyone who is currently involved in clinical research to comment on the decision to terminate the study early due to the early finding of shorter hospitalizations. Especially in light of a concurrent study published that found no benefit.

     

    For those who don't know, the Remdesivir study was actually stopped early by the board reviewing it.  These reviews are in place to make sure that when studies start showing fantanstic results early on, they can be stopped on an ethical basis in order to give all the participants this super beneficial treatment.  Makes sense right?  In the case of this study, it seems like an overdramatic cherry they put on top to help boost the headlines... 

    Comments?  Thanks, Jim    

     

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  • Mon, May 11, 2020 - 10:59am

    Kathy

    Kathy

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    Too many people taking SSRIs

    It is just a theory, but since some ommon SSRIs also cause QT issues my guess is TPTB don’t want the transparency.  How many people taking Lexapro would stop if they were lumped in with the cardiac patients being blocked from a treatment for Coivd 19?

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  • Mon, May 11, 2020 - 1:14pm

    MQ

    MQ

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    contact tracing--then what?

    There is a fear among more than a few (and it is irrelevant whether it is rational or not, it is a fear) that jack-booted thugs will break down your door, shoot your dog(s), put you and your spouse in FEMA camps and take your children to God only knows where and do God only knows what with them.

     

    When this kind of panic and fear infect people, other people get shot. Just sayin', this might work in many countries, but I don't think the whole contact tracing thing would go over well here. Too many are already sitting on a powderkeg, getting ready to light things up. A short stroll through YouTube and Facebook will tell you that without having to even search.

    There are more videos in the YouTube cesspool all the time talking about gonna boogaloo. The atmosphere is getting stormy in many parts of the country. Remember, it would only take a few unfortunate incidents to  go viral...

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  • Mon, May 11, 2020 - 1:17pm

    #67

    thc0655

    Status: Platinum Member

    Joined: Apr 27 2010

    Posts: 1938

    11+

    The coming line in the sand

    So it looks to me like we’re barreling toward a confrontation between demands by the Cloud People that everyone take the new vaccine (or the govt-approved standard of care which benefits the corporations more than any other) and the individual’s right to choose what is done to or in his/her body. It looks inevitable to me that people will be required to accept the vaccine as a condition of employment, before flying on a commercial flight, before entering certain kinds of buildings (govt buildings, restaurants, hospitals, etc.), before enlisting in the military, police or fire departments, etc. I, for one, won’t be taking any insufficiently tested vaccine or post-infection treatment that I am not convinced will work for me. I also won’t be submitting to required govt testing in which my results and DNA are reported to the .gov. Those are my lines in the sand.

    On the other hand, to this date there are no effective vaccines for HIV or any of the SARS family of illnesses. So maybe we never will get a Woohoo Flu vaccine at all so the issue may never arise.

    I’m also noticing that those who are most enthusiastic about forcing a future vaccine on people or mandating a specific course of treatment to the legal exclusion of others have never heard of the principle of “privacy” read into the US Constitution and the inviolable “My body, my choice” value that protects a woman’s right to abortion under all circumstances. If US society has really enshrined “my body, my choice” for abortion shouldn’t that also apply to vaccines and the treatments we can choose for Woohoo Flu? That promises to be an interesting dilemma for the Gates and Faucis of the world to harmonize for us. 😉

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  • Mon, May 11, 2020 - 2:09pm

    Susan7

    Susan7

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    Contact tracing

    Way back in January, well before discovering PP, I became glued to the images I was seeing coming out of China. People being dragged and pulled from their apartments and loaded onto trucks. The mass resistance to being led away to “hospitals”. At the time I couldn’t really understand why they fought so hard. Didn’t they want to be helped? Wasn’t it the reasonable thing to do? I consoled myself that this sort of thing would never happen here in the US. But then the Virus came, and we were told not to worry. Why, there was no evidence of person to person transmission and of course masks only worked for medical workers and could even make matters worse. No reason to stop planeloads of infected people coming to our shores. The WHO said so. That was when I began to undergo a massive shift in my understanding of TPTB. They were no longer the benign, well-intentioned entities I had trusted and defended for years. I realize now that THEY DON’T CARE ABOUT US. The HCQ debacle proves this. So, I’m no longer convinced that contact tracing can be effective at this stage and that it won’t be tool in the hands of evil men.

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  • Mon, May 11, 2020 - 5:06pm

    #69
    Angi

    Angi

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    Joined: Apr 10 2020

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    Contact Tracing Implementation!

    Remember that this whole Covid episode started as a "Live Exercise"  they said as much publicly (Trump's response was something like "Thanks for telling me" ) and the craziness, has been ongoing ever since. Of course they will continue on until they get enough resistance or evil people start being exposed publicly. With every passing day WE are losing ground - don't kid yourselves. The more confusion and theater they can create the better for them. Why are we contact tracing now - it's past the point of being an effective tool. There is a completely different agenda being rolled out. What might that be? Good question!

    https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2020/04/22/842119284/washington-state-builds-coronavirus-contact-tracing-fire-brigade

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  • Mon, May 11, 2020 - 6:48pm

    #70
    Mohammed Mast

    Mohammed Mast

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    Once again

    I have been saying this for over 50 years. I will continue to say it until my dying day .

    Repeat after me " THE GOVERNMENT IS NOT YOUR FRIEND"

    Rinse and repeat as many times as necessary.

    The Fourth Amendment originally enforced the notion that “each man’s home is his castle”, secure from unreasonable searches and seizures of property by the government.  It protects against arbitrary arrests, and is the basis of the law regarding search warrantsstop-and-frisk, safety inspections, wiretaps, and other forms of surveillance, as well as being central to many other criminal law topics and to privacy law.

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  • Mon, May 11, 2020 - 7:48pm

    jerryr

    jerryr

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    Joined: Oct 31 2008

    Posts: 75

    Anti-vaccine movement

    My question might be off-topic for this thread. But, I noticed this from the anonymous ER doctor:

    This will result in the anti-vaccine movement leaping forward and will set back well proven well tested vaccines by 50 years.

    Jim H, Sand Puppy: I've been reading at RFK Jr's website and I'm not sure which vaccines are well proven, well tested and safe, if any. Could you briefly comment on this, or perhaps point me to an older thread here at the site where this has been discussed? Does Mikovits' theory about viruses and toxic chemicals in vaccines have any merit?

     

    EDIT: Found it! Here's an old thread: https://www.peakprosperity.com/forum-topic/vaccines/

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  • Mon, May 11, 2020 - 8:19pm

    #72
    Mohammed Mast

    Mohammed Mast

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    Vaccines

    Here is what they hit your kid up with

    https://vaccineinformation.org/infants-children/schedules.asp

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  • Tue, May 12, 2020 - 5:04am

    MarkM

    MarkM

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    Posts: 392

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    Where we are

    I post this as an indication of where we are as a Republic, not as political commentary. The scope of an unlimited surveillance state coupled with rogue governmental agencies.

    http://Searching the highly classified NSA database is essentially a function of filling out search boxes to identify the user-initiated search parameter and get a return on the search result. ♦ FISA-702(16) is a search of the system returning a U.S. person (“702”); and the “16” is a check box to initiate a search based on “To and From“. Example, if you put in a date and a phone number and check “16” as the search parameter the user will get the returns on everything “To and From” that identified phone number for the specific date. Calls, texts, contacts etc. Including results for the inbound and outbound contacts. ♦ FISA-702(17) is a search of the system returning a U.S. person (702); and the “17” is a check box to initiate a search based on everything “About” the search qualifier. Example, if you put a date and a phone number and check “17” as the search parameter the user will get the returns of everything about that phone. Calls, texts, contacts, geolocation (or gps results), account information, user, service provider etc. As a result, 702(17) can actually be used to locate where the phone (and user) was located on a specific date or sequentially over a specific period of time which is simply a matter of changing the date parameters.

    https://www.zerohedge.com/political/obamagate-trump-tweets-tucker-carlsons-crushing-breakdown-why-former-president-should-be

    William Binnie is out there still trying to educate us. Brave.

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  • Tue, May 12, 2020 - 7:50am

    #74
    britmi

    britmi

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    Social Distancing by a Robot

    I don't know this group but we have now moved to the second (third, fourth) step.

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  • Tue, May 12, 2020 - 8:47am

    #75

    Jim H

    Status: Bronze Member

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    Posts: 1105

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    More evidence that, "masks for all" would be a good way to get back to a new normal

    Posted today - presymptomatic spreading is worse than earlier estimates;

    https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.05.07.20094789v1

    Quantitative COVID-19 infectiousness estimate correlating with viral shedding and culturability suggests 68% pre-symptomatic transmissions

    In this work, we attempt to provide a better quantitative estimate for the temporal infectiousness profile using serial interval data from a combined 1251 individuals reported in the literature. We show that the infectiousness profile which we calculate correlates well with the viral shedding kinetics from nasopharyngeal swabs (r=0.97, p=0.00) and culturability (r=0.83, p=0.01). The profile suggests that a 68.4% (95% CI: 67.0-69.7%) of the infections are caused by infections before the symptoms appear, which is a much stronger pre-symptomatic influence than what was predicted in the literature 44% (95% CI: 25-69%) using serial data from 77 individuals.

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  • Tue, May 12, 2020 - 11:05am

    James

    James

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    James said:

    I completely agree with Dr. Martenson that wearing masks decreases viral transmission and thereby flattens the curve. What I am unclear about is the end game strategy, as the area under the curve remains the same and the ultimate threat the virus poses will not ever really go away until (or if) herd immunity is reached.

     

    Are we going to wait for a vaccine before mingling with others without a mask? Do we really know if a safe, effective vaccine will ever be created? Will Big Pharma develop a 100% effective miracle cure? How long can we self-isolate, social distance, wear masks, etc. before the economic fallout of these measures results in secondary problems (including social unrest, hunger, crime, depression, etc.) that render the “cure” worse than the “disease.”

     

    I do not propose to have all the answers or know all about the pathogenicity of this virus and how it will affect humanity in the short, intermediate and long term. I do not think anyone does. Think back about how wrong “the experts” have been at every turn from understanding the origin of the virus, to models of infectivity and lethality, to ventilators, etc. Every week brings a new twist, such as the Kawasaki-like vascular inflammation now being seen in children.

     

    I will continue to self-isolate with my wife and children and we will wear masks when out in the general public performing essential tasks like shopping for food. We also have a garden. But, really, are these measures going to inoculate us from risk going forward?

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  • Tue, May 12, 2020 - 12:30pm

    stevedaly

    stevedaly

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    Is it Killing Us?

    The following discussion is a logical follow up on the characteristics of Coronavirus (COVID-19) as presented in the discussions on the Peak Performance site:

    Coronavirus attacks the lungs as well as the heart, liver and kidneys and other organs of the body.  It is very efficient at binding to the ACE2 sites of lung tissue cells.

    Coronavirus has been inserted with a PRRA furin cleavage site that increases the ability to penetrate the host cell membrane by orders of magnitude.  So far there is no suitable explanation of how this insertion could occur through natural means.

    Coronavirus also has a function that binds with CD147 receptors on Tcells and macrophages of the immune system, breaks them open, and results in very dangerous cytochrome storms

    Coronavirus causes blood clotting and microclotting.

    Looking at all the functions it has, and the rapidity with which it has invaded the world, and the gain of function research that was conducted in Wuhan, the simplest and therefor most likely explanation for its origin is that it was designed and created by humans. Could you even design a more effective killer?  And now as a result we have what could be considered an ultimate biological weapon unleashed on the world.

    There are probably effective antidotes.  Hydroxychloroquine (HQC) in combination with zinc has been credited with saving hundreds of lives in various countries around the world.  Unfortunately it has frequently been used as a late stage treatment when it may not be effective in preventing cytochrome storms.  HQC is primarily effective in the early stages of the disease because it works as an antiviral that suppresses the viral count from the beginning and gives the immune system time to react.

    In the United States the policy of federal and state government agencies and medical associations is to prohibit administration of HCQ until the disease is in later stages.  They certainly must be aware of how antivirals work.  They are acting as if to intentionally handicap its performance.

    So we have to ask ourselves.  Is this a new stage in human history?  Is a government for some reason now willing to promote the death of its own people indiscriminately?

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  • Tue, May 12, 2020 - 3:44pm

    sofistek

    Status: Platinum Member

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    Posts: 667

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    The future of masks

    Good question, James. Until we know more about the virus, it's impossible to say that the "everyone wears a mask" strategy (and other NPIs) can be sustained in a society we want to live in. In the short term, there is no doubt it's the best approach. But what if the vaccine doesn't arrive or is not completely effective?

    Of course the simple actions of sharing a meal or a few drinks, means masks can't always be worn in situations where other people are around. And the constant decontamination of surfaces that might be touched by multiple people is impractical.

    The only ways to avoid the question is to actually have a (almost) completely effective vaccine, elimination of the virus or hope for a less severe mutation that is more infectious. Most people seem to think this will eventually (but not too long) go away with no long term impacts beyond viruses like the flu.

    But no-one knows what the future holds.

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  • Tue, May 12, 2020 - 4:36pm

    Janie-em

    Janie-em

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    Your question is valid.

    I used to think "Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity.".

    However, after watching in real time the criminal incompetence occurring in New York with the Governor's order (recently reversed) to force nursing homes to take in sick patients and bar them from testing them for Covid-19, I am willing to believe anything is possible with sociopathic c.y.a. politicians.

    Coumo's administration refused to listen to the nursing home administrators who told them they had no provision for such patients, and refused to look at the data that was already available from Kirkland Washington and other places. I consider them criminally negligent, if not reckless. I don't know the law but I would like to see a class action lawsuit and a big investigation of those deaths.

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  • Tue, May 12, 2020 - 5:37pm

    Mohammed Mast

    Mohammed Mast

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    Joined: May 17 2017

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    Good question James

    James the short answer to your question is the "normal" you knew 4 months ago will never return.

    There has never been an effective vaccine for a corona virus. There are people who believe this time is different and there are people who WANT you to believe this time is different.

    I have no problem wearing a mask in public. I have worn them for decades in airports, on planes and when out in public in SE Asia. Culturally Asia is well adapted to wearing masks. US not so much.

    At the present time we know that this is an extremely infectious virus. WE are not exactly clear on how lethal it is but we do know it is not the flu. With its gain of function capabilities it looks like herd immunity is the only way this is going away and that is no guarantee since we don't know how long immunity will last.

    I am prepared for the long haul and advise anyone I speak with to do likewise

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  • Tue, May 12, 2020 - 6:02pm

    Janie-em

    Janie-em

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    Joined: Mar 05 2020

    Posts: 33

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    Anthony Fauci's Credibility and Why it Matters.

    Thank you for this. I really appreciate information coming from medical personnel and researchers regarding Fauci et al.

    The short answer is: we can't.

    Fauci has been proven wrong, since the first models he promoted and statements he's made on this virus and the pandemic. I.e. It's not a threat to the U.S., go about your daily life, don't wear a mask it doesn't help very much. These are all statements he's on video making, plus several others that have proven false and dangerous.

    These doctors are right to question Fauci's credibility. It's a pity the administration and more media aren't doing so.

     

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  • Tue, May 12, 2020 - 8:30pm

    #82
    Janie-em

    Janie-em

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    Joined: Mar 05 2020

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    Fauci's response to Rand Paul highlights his credibility problem. Fauci must go.

    Today when challenged by the Senator about his models and how his advice on mitigations and keeping the country locked down affected Americans, Fauci dodged the question. His answer was something approaching: "I'm just a scientist/doctor/public health official who gives advice on public health, I have no knowledge of economics."

    This answer strains credulity, and was quite shocking.

    This man has been a leader in public health for over thirty years. He specializes in the public health management of infectious diseases and pandemics. Yet he has no knowledge of the effects of the models and mitigations he is inflicting on a population of 330 million people?!? He has no idea of the consequences to public health of a lockdown, a deep dive into a great depression, unemployment rates of 25% or more, break of supply chains, food shortages, school closures, hospital closures, loss of tax revenue, ensuing loss of public services like police and fire personnel, riots, rising mental health problems, suicides, domestic abuse, and addictions? Really?! No research papers, consulting colleagues, statistics of past pandemics? No MODELS Dr. Fauci?

    I find that very hard to believe.

    Anthony Fauci is either lying or completely incompetent.

    Either way his advice is not to be trusted, and he needs to be replaced.

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  • Wed, May 13, 2020 - 5:23am

    thc0655

    Status: Platinum Member

    Joined: Apr 27 2010

    Posts: 1938

    6+

    Yup, he’s getting fired

    https://www.zerohedge.com/political/seattle-cop-placed-leave-after-refusing-remove-viral-video-reminding-officers-not-obey

    A Port of Seattle Police Officer has been placed on administrative leave after refusing to delete a viral video reminding police officers that they don't have unlimited powers.

    "I have seen officers around the country enforcing tyrannical orders; I was hoping it was a minority of officers, anymore, I am not so sure," said Officer Greg Anderson, a Special Forces veteran.

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  • Wed, May 13, 2020 - 6:26am

    Mohammed Mast

    Mohammed Mast

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: May 17 2017

    Posts: 296

    1+

    Fauci

    He seemed to know about economics when he got those patents.

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  • Wed, May 13, 2020 - 7:41am

    Ision

    Ision

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 07 2020

    Posts: 103

    5+

    The goal is population reduction and control...

    Manipulated pathogens are the primary means by which a population may be reduced, while preserving the political structure which created and administers it.

    There shall never be a vaccine, other than for morale, power brokering, and monetary manipulations.  There shall probably be several "vaccines" trotted out, even mandatory vaccinations, which will have no effect against this virus...but, may be used to inject additional virus enhancements, instead.    After all, if population control is a goal, why not "vaccinate" to achieve antibody dependent enhancement of the pathogen?  Hardly anyone will know...and one can always say, "Opps!"

    We are also in the midst of the financial reset and the deliberate chaos it must bring.

    I expect there shall be treatments for the pathogen, while any effective serum for it remains classified.   It would help if the treatments are expensive, proprietary, and dictated...while any cheap and effective treatment is suppressed and made illegal.

    Better to have on-going treatments...than one simple dose of a vaccine...

    There shall never be "herd immunity" for a shifting virus.  In fact, you can have immunity for several different versions of a pathogen...but, there shall always deliberately be...another version floating about for which just about everyone has no immunity against.

    This is not accidental...none of it.

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  • Wed, May 13, 2020 - 7:44am

    #86

    westcoastjan

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jun 04 2012

    Posts: 385

    1+

    As always, money is more important than people

    COVID-19: Trump Labor Department Urges Employers to Report Workers Who Stay Home Due to Virus Fears

     

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  • Wed, May 13, 2020 - 10:20am

    Oliveoilguy

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Jun 29 2012

    Posts: 671

    3+

    Unemployment benefits and return to work fears.

    Nothing is risk free. Driving to work has a similar risk level for an auto accident (14,846 per day) than contracting Covid. We try to make the roads safe with traffic lights and speed limit signs but there is always the chance that a drunk will swerve into your lane, and kill you on your way to work. The only way to eliminate the possibility of a traffic accident or fatality is to stay at home. Similarly with Covid....we need safety guidelines that workers will follow and be safer than if they didn’t  follow them. If the employer breaches the guidelines and asks for unsafe practices, the worker should have recourse against the employer but not against the government.

    Also unemployment benefits should never exceed what the worker makes under normal circumstances.

    Clearly people are gaming the system.

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  • Wed, May 13, 2020 - 8:54pm

    Tonya McKinney

    Tonya McKinney

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 06 2020

    Posts: 4

    We can’t trust our gov’t

    I cannot believe there has been no mention by Fauci or anyone else on prevention via supplements and early intervention once you have symptoms.  It does feel like the gov’t and big Pharma want a big body count.  I keep wondering if all the nursing home deaths weren’t seeded by some dark force who purposely infected them.  Breaks my heart. 

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