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    We’re In Uncharted Territory

    Financial crisis expert Bethany McLean warns of today's precarious level of risk
    by Adam Taggart

    Friday, April 9, 2021, 9:57 AM

Investigative journalist Bethany McLean is an expert on crisis.

She has written New York Times best-selling books on the collapse of Enron (The Smartest Guys In The Room) as well as the mortgage industry and Wall Street abuses that led to the 2008 Great Financial Crisis (All The Devils Are Here and Shaky Ground).

So when she says she’s deeply worried about today’s macro environment, we’d better take notice.

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Looking at the accelerating expansion of debt issuance, the red-hot run-up in the financial markets, and the economic uncertainty caused by the ongoing pandemic — Bethany concludes we’re at a precarious never-been-here-before moment in history, aka “uncharted territory”. And she sees good probability another major crisis may be around the corner.

She also sees a familiar dangerous lack of imagination in those both running and cheerleading the current system. Similar to the ‘rock stars’ at Enron, no one seems able to entertain the idea that things could get out of hand much faster than folks are prepared for.

Once glance at the current level of investor euphoria confirms this:

Panic/Euphoria Model

We’re farther from the historical average than we have ever been on this measure — as well as on so many other metrics we don’t have room to list them all here. We are truly in uncharted territory.

Which is why Bethany agrees that now, more than ever, is the time to partner with a financial advisor who understands the nature of the market risks in play as well as the opportunities, can craft an appropriate portfolio strategy for you given your needs, and apply sound risk management protection where appropriate:

Anyone interested in scheduling a free consultation and portfolio review with Mike Preston and John Llodra and their team at New Harbor Financial can do so by clicking here.

And if you’re one of the many readers brand new to Peak Prosperity over the past few months, we strongly urge you get your financial situation in order in parallel with your ongoing physical resilience preparations.

We recommend you do so in partnership with a professional financial advisor who understands the macro risks to the market that we discuss on this website. If you’ve already got one, great.

But if not, consider talking to the team at New Harbor. We’ve set up this ‘free consultation’ relationship with them to help folks exactly like you.

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76 Comments

  • Fri, Apr 09, 2021 - 10:25am

    #1

    Wendy S. Delmater

    Status: Diamond Member

    Joined: Dec 13 2009

    Posts: 1458

    2

    Good Video

    My husband heard from them and they were thrilled that he was mostly in cash. We'll probably go with New Harbor - they GET it.

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  • Fri, Apr 09, 2021 - 11:17am

    #2
    davidrussell22

    davidrussell22

    Status: Member

    Joined: May 31 2020

    Posts: 15

    1

    What is the action plan here?

    All this low interest debt and the prospect for inflation means only fools hold cash....or worse: long duration bonds.

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  • Fri, Apr 09, 2021 - 11:36am

    brushhog

    brushhog

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    Cash?

    I completely disagree. In times of unprecedented risk, when markets have all peaked, cash is exactly where you want to be [ at least partially ]. Inflation is a red herring. The cure for inflation is inflation.

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  • Fri, Apr 09, 2021 - 5:01pm

    #4
    Nate

    Nate

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    7

    diversify

    When times don't make any sense, I check out what smart and experienced money individuals are doing.  Grantham is a guy managing real money, lived through many market cycles, and has a decent track record.  (he's always early but eventually right)  He's in the bubble camp and would probably tell us small guys to go to cash.  Ray Dalio is a hedge fund manager running lots of money, has a good track record, and a real keen sense of history.  I appreciate that.  He tells us cash is trash.  He actually sounds a lot like Armstrong - Asia is rising and we (US) are on the decline.  Move money east.

    So - is money getting shredded and is this the start of a hyperinflation?  Or is this a classic bubble and cash will win in the end?  Don't know.

    We are all small fish.  We won't know the outcome until it is too late.  Rather than betting the farm on one outcome, a better path forward is to create several buckets that will excel in different environments, knowing full well some will get hammered and others will thrive.  Buckets for me include ag land, PM's, equities (low PE dividend stocks), and cash.  %'s?  Trust yourself.

     

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  • Fri, Apr 09, 2021 - 5:08pm

    EddieLarry

    EddieLarry

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    1

    EddieLarry said:

    That’s because they will tell your husband what to do with that cash, and charge him for it.

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  • Sat, Apr 10, 2021 - 8:51am

    #6
    cherylboca

    cherylboca

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    cherylboca said:

    What is the definition of "Composite" on the left-side Y-axis in the euphoria-panic chart?

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  • Sat, Apr 10, 2021 - 9:39am

    dreinmund

    dreinmund

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    Re: cash ? - (hyper)/inflation vs deflation

    In one of Charles Hugh Smith recent musings (#21 2021), he presented one of the more convincing arguments for deflation.

    The general answer takes one of two paths: inflation leading to hyper-inflation or a deflationary collapse of defaults and popping asset bubbles.

    [...]

    Consider two variables that are rarely visible in pundits' arguments:

    1)  What will benefit the banks?

    2)  What will benefit the nation's place in the geopolitical order / global economy?

    [...]

    Hyper-inflation will destroy not just the currency but the entire banking sector,which is politically powerful. Will the banks just sit by passively watching their wealth and income being destroyed by accelerating inflation?  I think not.

    [...]

    The politically powerful elites have their ace in the hole in a deflationary collapse:they can demand politicians (who need their contributions to fund their re-election campaigns) bail out the banks, transferring the losses from defaults from private banks to the public sector, exactly what happened in 2008-09.

    I thought it very interesting to think about it from a “who benefits” perspective. The assumption that hyperinflation is beneficial to governments is naive.

     

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  • Sat, Apr 10, 2021 - 9:47am

    Adam Taggart

    Status: Platinum Member

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    6

    Expect the US to Defend the Dollar

    I speak with Charles often and he has been driving this point home frequently in our recent conversations.

    Those running/funding America will not stand idly by to watch the dollar lose its reserve currency status or become valueless confetti.

    Wolf Richter made a similar point in my interview with him last week. He sees the Fed being forced to tighten once the CPI hits 4% (which he predicts will happen within the coming year)

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  • Sat, Apr 10, 2021 - 10:38am

    #9

    sand_puppy

    Status: Member

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    6

    Defending the currency as the top goal of the elite

    Charles thesis certainly does change one's relationship to cash.

    Inflation is a glacier, deflation a tsunami.

    The elite do not carry personal debt.  They are hurt by deflation when asset prices drop, but not completely ruined.

    I read a history of the ascent of Bank of America to a major financial power.  It was due to repossessing farmland from distressed farmers who could not make their mortgage payments in California during the great depression.  Some banks do fantastically during a deflationary collapse.

    A deflationary collapse can lead to a sell-everything dynamic.  Even assets chosen as safe haven's can drop in price proving not much of a safe haven in the end.  Gold is an example.

    Another of Charles' big points is that trends will drift out of control and move in unforeseen ways.  We do our best to find certainty, but, the forces and trends are many and certainty is just not possible.

    Everyone has a plan until they get punched in the face.

    And, it is good to think through our responses in advance to a range of possible events.

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  • Sat, Apr 10, 2021 - 1:54pm

    #10
    CrLaan

    CrLaan

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    1

    sinclair 2010

    Explained Time and Time Again: Currency Induced Cost Push Hyperinflation

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  • Sat, Apr 10, 2021 - 2:19pm

    drbrucedale

    drbrucedale

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    I'm not so sure: there is not just one group "running America"

    I read Charles Hugh Smith regularly and value his insights. But I am not so sure about this prediction. While higher interest rates would defend the dollar's role as the reserve currency, they would also make financing the Federal government and all of its fixed obligations really difficult (translation: politically near impossible).

    So those people who prize the dollar's role as a reserve currency and the bankers will be up against other very powerful interests. Which will prevail?

    We have a supposed national debt around $30 trillion and it is growing rapidly. Even a 5% interest rate would make the annual Federal payment about $1.5 trillion. That's more than twice current expenditures for defense and more than either Social Security or Medicare in 2020. It is about equal to all tax revenues from individuals including FICA.

    Are we really going to double tax rates? I don't think so. So where is that "new" money going to come from if interest rates rise significantly?

    I don't think the new money can be found...particularly not with the MMT delusion and other delusions gaining more and more traction.  We are already badly fractured as a nation...the current trajectory toward deflation or inflation is not going to make a reasonable political solution (if there is one) any easier to find.

    If someone can tell me how we can pull off higher interest rates with a Federal government and a whole society up to its eyeballs in debt, I really want to know. I just don't see it as a politically-realistic option.

     

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  • Sat, Apr 10, 2021 - 3:18pm

    #12
    LBL

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    LBL said:

    Part of the financial scams which the US gov runs, involves the marketing of those scams.

    As labels for parts of Scams go, I think "Modern Monetary Theory" is pretty good.

    They are simultaneously diluting the money supply and re-distributing wealth, e.g. as $$ flows to the stock market and Bitcoin.

    Stanford comes in real handy in situations like this.  Just as Scott Atlas from the Hoover institution helped legitimize the Trump Pandemic-ism Du Jour, Stanford has also provided economist Michael Boskin to add cachet and flair to i.e. think Reagan's economic machinations.

    Fancy labelling and pedigree endorsements.

    Used to sell some less nice stuff.

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  • Sat, Apr 10, 2021 - 4:24pm

    #13
    PreCambrian

    PreCambrian

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    11

    Inflation vs Deflation or Charles Hugh Smith vs Luke Gromen

    First there WON'T be any HYPER-inflation, just inflation.  Hyperinflation did not occur in the Weimar Republic until France re-occupied Germany in order to try to collect on war reparations.  This occupation destroyed the Weimar Republic's means of production.  Venezuela has hyperinflation because they have destroyed their means of production of oil.  Argentina has high inflation, about 4% per month but somehow the eke by, banks still function and rich people still own assets like farmland where they can export soybeans and obtain foreign currencies.

     

    Having a reserve currency is a double edged sword for the United States.  It allows our country to consume more than it produces for an extended period.  The benefit is low inflation since we get the lowest prices for any good or service in the entire world but the cost is having good (or at least better) jobs for the average wage earner.

     

    I think that the best course of action is to hedge your bets instead of trying to pick a single winner.  I would have my 25-35% of liquid assets in equities that will do well during inflation trying to pick those with the least amount of leverage.  There are REITs with only 20% leverage and commodity producers (miners) that pay high dividends.  Both of these should do well with inflation and will survive deflation.  I wouldn't own bonds because they will do poorly if interest rates rise and there isn't much room for interest rates to drop.  Cash will do better than bonds (or at least not more than 2% worse).  I would have NO debt to prepare for deflation and substantial cash, 65 - 75%.  Once you see which way the winds have shifted you can deploy your cash.  My hard assets I would invest in housing or farmland. If people spend 30% of their income on housing then the debt free house will provide that income whether there is inflation or deflation.  Relatively it is the same, it is just the value in dollars that have changed due to inflation or deflation.

    I will be happy if I come out even, I don't need to predict the exact path, just prepare for both.

     

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  • Sat, Apr 10, 2021 - 4:56pm

    #14
    brushhog

    brushhog

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    The limits to inflation

    We have a nation mired in debt. Its not just the national debt thats out of control, its corporate and personal debt too. At this point, QE and interest rate manipulation amounts to monetizing the debt. In order to pay the debt, they have to issue more debt. The more they borrow and print, the higher inflation gets. The higher inflation gets the higher interest rates become. The higher interest rates become the more difficult it is to pay the debts.

    The whole global debt structure is dependent on low, no, or below interest rates, I dont think the economy can withstand a 2.5% 10 year rate. They already tried it [ remember the fed was going to "unwind" its balance sheet? ] and they had to reverse course when the 10 year got around 2.5%. The debts have gotten higher since then and they are dependent on even lower interest.

    The problem is now the debts are much bigger and they have to borrow and print even more to make the payments...but the interest rates are rising as bond holders are demanding more in anticipation of inflation. The bigger the debt the more they need to borrow, and the more they borrow the higher the cost. Its coming to a head. They've painted themselves into a corner.

    The idea that they can "inflate the debt away" was always wrong. Higher inflation causes higher interest rates and higher rates pop the bubble and cause deflation. They were always just kicking the can down the road and we're about out of road.

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  • Sat, Apr 10, 2021 - 5:07pm

    #15

    sand_puppy

    Status: Member

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    Changing the rules, knocking over the board

    When the elite lose by both rising interest rates and low-to-negative interest rates, that creates a setting where a radical re-writing of the rules offers advantage.  A great reset.

    Maybe a pandemic, a world war.  Some emergency where all the rules can be rewritten or suspended.

    Just talking off the top of my head.

     

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  • Sat, Apr 10, 2021 - 7:10pm

    thc0655

    Status: Platinum Member

    Joined: Apr 27 2010

    Posts: 2667

    13

    When the going gets tough, the elites just change the rules (and win again)

    The World Economic Forum runs its Cyber Polygon simulation of a cyberpandemic on July 9, 2021. So maybe we’ll conveniently have a real cyberpandemic shortly after that (~August - October). Since no crisis goes to waste, I expect they’ll have a ready-made “solution” that gets them out of the jams they’re in now, and installs a new monetary system in which they’re on top again. Heads they win, tails we lose.

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  • Sat, Apr 10, 2021 - 7:10pm

    #17
    MarkM

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    Joined: Jul 22 2008

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    4

    I agree

    that interest rates "should" go up to fight inflation. However, I just don't see how higher interest rates can be tolerated as drbrucedale points out.

    Enter "Yield Curve Control".

    https://www.brookings.edu/blog/up-front/2020/06/05/what-is-yield-curve-control/

     

    That will work right up until is doesn't. Then, chaos ensues.

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  • Sun, Apr 11, 2021 - 4:34am

    brushhog

    brushhog

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    If they can pull it off...

    You're right Mark, if they can, somehow, hold back the tide through YCC or other methods then I guess we'll have inflation. Its hard to imagine...can the fed buy ALL the bonds and unilaterally fund the entire government?

    Nobody will buy bonds that pay 0% when inflation is sky rocketing, its a guaranteed loss. The fed owns a small percentage of the debt, theres an ocean of bonds out there owned by private investors, banks, pension funds, other countries etc..

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  • Sun, Apr 11, 2021 - 7:11am

    #19
    Nate

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    disinflation

    Lacy Hunt and Mish provide 6 reasons to expect disinflation:

    1. Inflation is a lagging indicator, as classified by the National Bureau of Economic Research. The low in inflation occurred after all of the past four recessions, with an average lag of almost fifteen quarters from the end of the recessions. (Table 1 Inflation Troughs Below)

    2. Productivity rebounds in recoveries and vigorously so in the aftermath of deep recessions. This pattern in productivity is quite apparent after the deep recessions ending in 1949, 1958 and 1982 (Table 2 Below). Productivity rebounded by an average of 4.8% in the year immediately after the end of these three recessions and unit labor costs were unchanged. The rise in productivity held down unit labor costs.

    3. Restoration of supply chains will be disinflationary. Supply chains were badly disrupted by the pandemic. Low-cost producers in Asia and elsewhere were unable to deliver as much product into the United States and other relatively higher cost countries. This allowed U.S. producers to gain market share. As immunizations increase, supply chains will be gradually restored. Thus, the pandemic cost the low-cost producers market share which was shifted to domestic producers. The pandemic did far more for domestic firm’s

    4. Accelerated technological advancement will lower costs. Another restraint on inflation is that the pandemic greatly accelerated the implementation of inventions that were in the pipeline. Necessity is the mother of invention, as has been demonstrated in earlier crisis situations like wars. Thus, the technology du jour is not the same as the technology of a year ago. This will also serve to act as a restraint on inflation. Much of the technology substitutes machines for people, communication without travel, and work without offices.

    5. Eye popping economic growth numbers, based on GDP in present circumstances, greatly overstate the presumed significance of their result. This is where the fallacy of the broken glass comes into play. Many businesses failed in the recession of 2020, much more so than normal. As survivors and new firms take over their markets, this will be reflected in GDP, but the costs of the failures will not be deducted.

    6. The two main structural impediments to traditional U.S. and global economic growth are massive debt overhang and deteriorating demographics both having worsened as a consequence of 2020.

    https://www.thestreet.com/mishtalk/economics/expect-inflation-to-accelerate-heres-8-reasons-to-expect-decelerating-inflation

     

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  • Sun, Apr 11, 2021 - 8:35am

    MarkM

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    BH

    I think they can pull it off for a while, but then what. Like has been said on here many times before, the farther we kick the can, the greater the ensuing impact is going to be. It will be some interesting times, for sure.

    Hey, I have to say thank you for a thought you posted some time back. I don't recall exactly what you said, but what I heard was, "The best use for your money is to get you closer to not needing money." While that has always been in the back of my mind, you saying it really made me realize the importance of that. No matter what the future holds, inflation, deflation, disinflation, resilience is one of the keys to a life well lived.

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  • Sun, Apr 11, 2021 - 8:45am

    Adam Taggart

    Status: Platinum Member

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    Posts: 7556

    14

    Thoreau Said It Well

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  • Sun, Apr 11, 2021 - 9:46am

    acesovereggs

    acesovereggs

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    acesovereggs said:

    Thanks for the heads up on the date.  Sad that I feel the need to actually put it on my calendar.

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  • Mon, Apr 12, 2021 - 5:59pm

    #23
    RocketDoc

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    You say Inflation, I say deflation--Let's call the whole thing off

    At this point, we are all clapping for Tinkerbell.   The end game is two choices:  Nothing or cents on the dollar.  We have been in perpetual check  for 12 years but someone is going to get tired of playing, do something foolish, and we'll move to Zugzwang.....

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  • Tue, Apr 13, 2021 - 4:03am

    VTGothic

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    I'm buying bonds I don't want. So are you.

    @brushhog wrote

    Nobody will buy bonds that pay 0% when inflation is sky rocketing, its a guaranteed loss.

    Not directly buy, but the Fed will bail out bondholders (they're mostly .01%ers after all) from the public treasury. That's you and me, via taxes. So, you and I will buy bonds at any scandalous price the Fed determines. Taxes go up.

    Max Keiser says - I increasingly think correctly - that we should stop thinking in terms of inflation and deflation. The point is (he says) we've moved into neo-feudalism. We'll own nothing, and we'll like it.

    Guest Rick Ackerman (market analyst, former market maker) argues that if you think about the SoCal housing market - where you can  buy an 1100 sq. ft. home for $800,000 that you know is overpriced, and that you'll only ever be making payments on and will never own outright, many Americans are already just leasing -- from the Davos crowd's local managers.

    Link

    The good news, such as it is, is that things never go according to plan. The bad news is that the FUBAR outcome might be worse rather than better than planned.

     

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  • Tue, Apr 13, 2021 - 4:34am

    #25

    sand_puppy

    Status: Member

    Joined: Apr 13 2011

    Posts: 1930

    1

    Bond buying by the Fed

    Brushhog and VTGothic discussed

    B:  Nobody will buy bonds that pay 0% when inflation is sky rocketing, its a guaranteed loss.

    VT:  Not directly buy, but the Fed will bail out bondholders (they're mostly .01%ers after all) from the public treasury. That's you and me, via taxes. So, you and I will buy bonds at any scandalous price the Fed determines. Taxes go up.

    Please correct me if my understanding is wrong.  But my understanding of the FED buying bonds is that the price the citizens pay is:

    1)  higher taxes, and

    2)  the destruction of our currency through money printing.

    Eventually the destruction of our shared money will make commerce impossible.  I go to the hardware store to buy a hammer and the number of fiat notes in my pocket are not enough to make the purchase and I leave the store without the hammer.

    This stage is where alternative currencies come in.  Junk silver, all PMs, cryptos and barter.

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  • Tue, Apr 13, 2021 - 4:44am

    brushhog

    brushhog

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    Thoreau was right

    ...about alot of things. As it applies to the inflation situation, as prices rise I find ways to spend less. I think everybody does [ or will eventually by necessity ].

    My goal has been to make my property tax bill my only expense. Realistically, I dont think I'll ever quite get there. It would imply almost total self reliance. I do believe I'll get close.

    What I have learned by trying is that the smaller I make the role of money in my life, the freer, more relaxed, and ultimately happier I become. Thoreau got that. He lived in a cabin in the woods, spent his time hoeing beans and taking strolls through the forest. He wondered why people struggled so much when the necessities are fairly easy to obtain and the joys of life are absolutely free.

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  • Tue, Apr 13, 2021 - 6:04am

    VTGothic

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    Spot on, brushhog

    @brushhog I am SO with you on these sentiments! This is why we need to get together this summer: we're pursuing the same objective (altho you're getting more done).

    But I'm done messing around with small business startups (thanks Covid!), and I'm back to building out the homestead this summer. No more sidetracks; time's too short.

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  • Tue, Apr 13, 2021 - 6:13am

    brushhog

    brushhog

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    brushhog said:

    Same here, I recently made a big change to simplify my life. Even without covid and the host of issues facing society, life is too short to waste on nonessentials.

    Looking forward to meeting up.

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  • Tue, Apr 13, 2021 - 7:53am

    #29
    brushhog

    brushhog

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    brushhog said:

    Please correct me if my understanding is wrong.  But my understanding of the FED buying bonds is that the price the citizens pay is:

    1)  higher taxes, and

    2)  the destruction of our currency through money printing.

    Thats absolutely the way I understand it. I think what VT was referring to by "bailing out" the bond holders is that they will continue to borrow/print and buy bonds to support the bond market. Ultimately, we pay the price through taxes/currency debasement.

    In fact it might be even worse than that. In Greece during their debt crisis, the Greek government bailed out the "institutional bond investors" and left the individuals to take a "hair cut". So if you were a greek citizen who bought bonds, you bought the same bonds as the banks/pension funds/hedge funds etc, you bought the same bond, at the same auction. But the government decided to make your bonds unredeemable at the full value, while they magically transformed the bank's bonds into "special bonds" that were 100% redeemable.

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  • Tue, Apr 13, 2021 - 2:20pm

    #30
    Hans

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    Hans said:

    It is a ponzi scheme with the Fed being the lender of last resort.

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  • Tue, Apr 13, 2021 - 4:14pm

    #31
    Steven Kelso

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    6

    Fascism is the Foreclosure Process

    I just recently revisited Damon Vrabel's Debunking Money and in it he said, "Fascism is the foreclosure process." He laid out how the Financial Empire has basically served as interim world government for the last hundred-odd years.  Capitalism is the system used for high-growth districts (nations). Communism, et al. are used to keep a district in a "holding pattern" or steady-state economy. Fascism is the system employed to take a formerly Capitalist system through its debt repayments process.

    The Financial Empire (former)...
    Kept the "West" up:
    + United States
    + Canada
    + Britain
    + Japan
    + Australia/NZ
    + Singapore/Hong Kong

    Kept the "East" down:
    - Russia
    - China
    - India
    - Africa
    - South/Central America

    He had concluded that most of the wealth would have been transferred out of the West financial centers to the rising East financial centers (or would be soon). He also concluded that the Davos class was likely not all on the same team. Ergo, some want to just move on to the new system of empire and some want to maintain the West's foothold of power. I shudder to think that Catherine Austin Fitts believes that "they" made the decision to switch to a new empire system in the mid 1990s. I mean, Pax Americana was only 12 years (11-9-1989 to 9-11-2001).

    My guess is that it's the other thing that he said.
    You can watch Schindler's List. When they confiscate all of their possessions they stick to a strict accounting of valuables. This is the foreclosure process in the most dehumanizing of terms.

    So now, the donor class has to foreclose on a maxed-out society that has more firearms than people. I expect cosmic levels of dystopian repression for this reason alone.

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  • Tue, Apr 13, 2021 - 4:52pm

    #32
    Steven Kelso

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    1

    QE Ain't MMT

    It seems like a lot of folks around here are confusing the stimulus as modern monetary theory.

    Modern Monetary Theory requires a sovereign, asset-based currency.
    USD is a debt-based currency that is an asset to the banks (actually an asset to the multigenerational capital pools that control the system).

    Just because they print/code more USD doesn't make it MMT.

    TL;DR
    As long as bond market exists, modern monetary theory isn't being practiced_

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  • Tue, Apr 13, 2021 - 5:15pm

    capesurvivor

    capesurvivor

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    Weimar

    Sand,

    The real danger is money velocity,  when the price of the hammer zooms higher from the time you enter the store and just get to the counter. Did the Weimar TPTB have control of the situation to plan what would be best for them and the elite? Nope, and they won't this time either.

     

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  • Tue, Apr 13, 2021 - 6:06pm

    #34
    2retired

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    2retired said:

    Before getting too fixed on Thoreau and his minimalist needs, read 'pond scum' by Catherine Schultz

    https://longform.org/posts/pond-scum

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  • Wed, Apr 14, 2021 - 6:17am

    brushhog

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    brushhog said:

    A juvenile hit piece printed in "The New Yorker", no less. Ive studied Thoreau and his life. He was the real deal and his thoughts echo through time because they have depth. Unfortunately, his philosophy of individualism, self reliance, and freedom runs in direct opposition to that espoused by the leftwing writers at "The New Yorker".

    I'll stick with Thoreau.

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  • Wed, Apr 14, 2021 - 4:14pm

    #36
    agitating prop

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    agitating prop said:

    Cost of labor has to be figured in, when it comes to measuring the ability to pay off debt. The build up of government debt will be offset by governments imposing a global minimum tax regime on corporations who benefit from reduced labor costs. And that is a feature of automation.

    I have a sense that Canada, for example, is looking at the future and seeing very clearly that we are going to have massive numbers of unemployed people. Stimulus spending, universal basic income and other measures to deal with the effects of automation are a base requirement for a civilized society.

     

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  • Wed, Apr 14, 2021 - 11:52pm

    #37
    enjblog

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    The more you know

    <spam>

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 2:10am

    #38
    Hans

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    Hans said:

    Gouvernment debt will not be payed off by taxation. Never. Which politician will propose that? Paying off debt will be done by borrowing money. As it has always been the case. Nobody will spend their hard-earned existing money on this ponzi scheme anymore, so the Fed will just create new. Easy as that. This will go on and on until the end if time. Where the end of time will be the moment that this money will actually circulate.

    There is no way out of this. This will go on, until people no longer have faith in the currency anymore and spend it as soon as the get it.

    Even when gouvernment introduces a new fiat currency, people will recognize this as just a replacement and they will continue to spend this new currency in the same hurry as the old one. It does not matter if that is crypto or paper money. People will see that this new currency also has no value at all and hyperinflate that away as well.

    What is needed at that moment is something that is NOT backed by gouvernment. That could be a foreign currency, a non-gouvernmental crypto, or silver and gold. When the gouvernment introduces a currency that is backed by gold, I guarantee you that people will exchange it to the real stuff as soon as they get the paper-currency. Only when faith is restored that the paper currency is really, really as good as gold, the crisis will be over and the new currency will be accepted.

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 6:07am

    brushhog

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    Faith in government is still extremely strong

    For proof, look at the number of people lining up to get vaccinated by an experimental, gene altering drug, just because the government tells them to. Look at the people walking around outside with masks on....driving in their cars.... alone... wearing a mask.

    The dollar is in no danger, and if the government made up a new currency to replace it...and told the people it has value, they will grab it up. They will absolutely invest their hard earned money on this ponzi scheme. In fact they'll spend their entire lives hording it.

     

    Even when government introduces a new fiat currency, people will recognize this as just a replacement and they will continue to spend this new currency in the same hurry as the old one. It does not matter if that is crypto or paper money. People will see that this new currency also has no value at all and hyperinflate that away as well.

    I see no sign of this type of critical thinking amongst the general public, so we have a long way to go.

     

     

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 6:56am

    MarkM

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    Critical thinking

    Probably the most demoralizing realization to me of the entire last 14 months is the magnitude of the public's inability to think critically. I thought it was widespread. I now know how badly I had underestimated the numbers.

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 7:03am

    #41
    Hans

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    Hans said:

    Question to all PP-members: Who of you has put (some of) his savings in US bonds since the last 5 years?

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 7:10am

    brushhog

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    brushhog said:

    I did, and made out OK. I bought 2 year bonds back in 2017-ish. They paid 2.5%. And matured last year.

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 7:17am

    Hans

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    Hans said:

    To be honest, I did not expect this 🙂

    Would you do it again now?

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 7:25am

    brushhog

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    brushhog said:

    Not at these rates [.16 for the 2 year? ]. But if they offered a real rate [ depending on what else is going on in the economy ] I probably would. Problem is, I doubt we'll ever see real interest rates again in our lifetimes.

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 7:34am

    #45
    Hans

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    Hans said:

    Exactly. Me neigther. Other countries are also not buying anymore. The Fed is the only one and they create it just out of thin air.

    They can raise interest rates, but that would only mean that the gouvernment is going to borrow more than when the interest rates would be lower. This results in a even steeper shape of the debt-curve that is already vertical.

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 7:44am

    brushhog

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    brushhog said:

    The question is, when does it all blow up? I think you hit on it in your previous post, when people lose faith.

    So when do the mask wearing, vax taking, MSM watching crowd finally wake up and realize they've been conned?

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 8:28am

    sebastian

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    When will it blow up?

    How long can it go on?
    Well my native home of Argentina has had a number of currency collapses/resets (for over 50-60 years) and still the people play along.
    Their yearly inflation rate at the moment is running at 25%. It changes how people do business and how they store wealth but it hasn’t gone into Mad Max territory, at least for too long :-/
    No one saves their cash everything is spent right away and large purchases are done somewhat in barter or quoted in US dollars. For a complete loss of faith it has to get bad, real bad Venezuela bad.... the sheeple will not wake up until their bank accounts are seized, their fridges are empty and home invasions are common. At this point TPTB run the risk of losing control so it’s not in their interest to go there. People can get used to a progressively worse situation in so long as the pace isn’t too fast and they are scared enough.
    We in the west aren’t there yet.

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 8:37am

    dgbd

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    dgbd said:

    Hello Brushog, your question when does it all blow up?  I believe it will be in the near future (one-two years) if   the "vaccines" are demonstrated to be dangerous enough that it effects cannot be hidden any longer. Where that threshold is I don't know. Decades of trust and hubris in previous good vaccine outcomes will have to be destroyed. Therefore damage control is of the first priority. It's probably happening already. Word of mouth will be the main medium of exchange of information as official data sources will be compromised. First hand experience will have to trump propaganda efforts.  I think people will begin to question everything at that point.

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 8:45am

    MarkM

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    How long?

    Sebastian, I agree that it could go on a LONG time. I would not have said that 10 years ago. I was wrong in my thinking.

    My question for you is, what are stores of wealth used in your home country and how are they used in economic exchanges? Other than the barter you mentioned.

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 9:20am

    Pipyman

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    Struggling with that question

    Currently in danger of loosing a very good friend over it. He has elderly parents and he has been understandably very concerned. However, even though I shared FLCCC and ivermectin data , he made no effort to acquire any. He didn’t even suggest to them that they take vit d. With all the evidence, he still didn’t do anything (now 5o papers for IVM 70-90% effective). He did however think I was going to sit in his garden at Christmas time in the UK 1 day before we were officially ok to visit... I impolitely declined! I’ve been friends with him for 30 years!

    I mean, is it me?

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 9:22am

    Pipyman

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    Yes

    Couldn’t agree more. I feel like I’m in the twilight zone...

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 9:33am

    brushhog

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    brushhog said:

    Well my native home of Argentina has had a number of currency collapses/resets (for over 50-60 years) and still the people play along.
    Their yearly inflation rate at the moment is running at 25%. It changes how people do business and how they store wealth

    3 Questions; 1. How do people in Argentina store wealth?

     

    2. What would you think happens in Argentina if the US dollar is no longer a stable/trustworthy currency?

    3. Do you think people in the USA can adjust to a currency collapse/reset as well as the Argentinians since we have no experience wiht it?

    Thanks

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 9:57am

    #53
    Hans

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    Hans said:

    I think it is interesting to learn from the examples in Argentinië.

     

     

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 11:31am

    westcoastjan

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    Nope, not you at all...

    Your friend is representative of the mindsets of everyone I encounter, friends and family alike. There is such tremendous belief and faith in the MSM narrative it is unreal. I have stopped trying to educate, save for forwarding the odd article as last gasp attempts to try to educate. Nothing is working. PP is the ONLY place where I can talk to intelligent people who want to know what the truth is and are not afraid to find out. People think I am a nut bar and conspiracy theorist. Lordy... I feel like the sanest person around!!!! Just focusing on my self now, doing all the right things as we discuss here.

    Ordered a lot more of the magic horsey stuff that comes in a tube yesterday. Was on sale to boot - yay me! The way BC is rolling, it might be worth its weight in gold soon. Not a motive. Just insurance.

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 12:11pm

    #55
    agitating prop

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    Japan

    Japan is another country to take a look at. No doubt they have similar bi-flationary effects occurring in their economy, but take a look at the general inflation chart. China's population is aging and old people don't buy much more than they need, so that provides a brake on what otherwise may be very high inflationary forces.

    https://www.statista.com/statistics/270095/inflation-rate-in-japan/

    Corporate taxes in a highly automated society have helped Japan keep up payments on debt. See chart below. The Biden administration is proposing a global minimum corporate tax, which will help offset deficit spending. It will likely not exceed 25%, up from 21%  and should go a long way to enable the country to continue to finance or loan money into existence - while remaining one of the strongest reserve currencies.

    https://tradingeconomics.com/japan/corporate-tax-rate

    Another on Japan's debt levels, some of the highest in the world.

    "Tokyo has run budget deficits throughout the past three decades, creating one of the world’s highest public debt to GDP ratios, without any adverse effect on inflation and interest rates."

    https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/new-atlanticist/do-deficits-matter-japan-shows-they-do/

    Measured against other currencies and debt levels, the U.S. doesn't look so bad. I watched the Richter interview two or three times and noted that he said the government would intervene and raise interest rates if inflation ran hot, like over 4%--and, it looked like the situation was going to remain that way.

    There will be inflation but there will be so many factors tempering it, in the long run, I'm not concerned with the dollar spiraling down in value.

     

     

     

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 2:20pm

    Pipyman

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    My take is that's the plan

    I think the dollar & all global fiat will be destroyed and state digital currency's will be offered as the escape mechanism. The trap is then sprung. Total control. And I’ll probably be buying some. God help us all...

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 2:29pm

    Pipyman

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    Thanks

    At least there’s PP. I just don’t get it. But as you say, I won’t try anymore. This seriously demoralised me to be honest. I now see the horrifying reality that most will literally believe whatever they’re told until they see the state kill a loved one by commission; omission doesn’t seem to be strong enough!

    I’m afraid COVID 19 has laid bare just how far down the rabbit hole we are. Anything is possible now. Even probable..

     

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 2:35pm

    brushhog

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    My fear

    Jan, my fear in all this is that mad Dr Fauci's mask zombies who are running out to get the death jab are going to get horribly sick this winter when they get exposed to the live virus. Alot of them will die. Then they'll claim the deaths are due to a "mutated virus" and the "unvaxxed" "science deniers" will be blamed.

    Very few people will question it because, lets face it, if they havent by now they never will. Hope Im wrong about it all.

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 3:09pm

    #59
    Blindfox

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    Wuhan Covid is extinct.

    The original Wuhan strain Clade 19a no longer exists ANYWHERE in the world ,or is out competed by variants as to make it immaterial.  Look up nextstrain.com . Every case of covid is now a variant. All current infection/case is/are  a variant evolved in the human population. End of story, unless you happen to be a Vax manufacturer (happy days, Keep them profits rolling).

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 3:42pm

    Mots

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    Bad covid news from Japan

    Good point about covid variants Blindfox

    These variants are more infectious, as the Japanese are finding out.  The Japanese always voluntarily wear a mask to protect others if they think they have the sniffles.  Also, non-govt-reporting confidential contact tracing is carried out by a public health service.  Between these two normal (pre-covid) customs, Japan has had 20 fold less infection rates over here.

    Until now.

    According to our friends at the Japanese equivalent of the NIH ("RIKEN") where my wife works, numerous new variants of covid have popped up, which spread much more quickly.  The infection rate in Japan is exploding to unprecedented levels.

    We know that when a deadly virus such as the Spanish flu is pandemic, the thing mutates to less virulent form.  But the engineered corona is not that kind of deadly virus with very low kill rate.  Why wouldnt we expect it to mutate to more virulent (or more transmissible) form?  I would if I were the damn thing.

    We have heard that prior infection with other corona cold viruses may engender some cross-over immunity.  Hopefully those who get infected with an earlier strain (or vaccine) will have some immunity for these later ones.  I would like to see a summary of this but reports on the "South African Strain" are not encouraging.

    This cross over immunity will become an important factor in the covid saga.  If these variants are all in the exposed spike protein and only affect initial binding, I would hope that ivermectin and (the drug that will not be named) would work just as well on them.

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 3:51pm

    #61
    DennisC

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    Go Long, Baby

    Well, no surprise here.  A lot for me to "unpack" in this piece but I think it points to "back up the truck" and buy more "stawks".

    source

    “We need to see what would be the sequence, and for how often we need to do that, that remains to be seen,” he told CNBC’s Bertha Coombs during an event with CVS Health. “A likely scenario is that there will be likely a need for a third dose, somewhere between six and 12 months and then from there, there will be an annual revaccination, but all of that needs to be confirmed. And again, the variants will play a key role.”

    “It is extremely important to suppress the pool of people that can be susceptible to the virus,” Bourla said.

    The comment comes after Johnson & Johnson CEO Alex Gorsky told CNBC in February that people may need to get vaccinated against Covid-19 annually, just like seasonal flu shots.

    Researchers still don’t know how long protection against the virus lasts once someone has been fully vaccinated.

    So... more, needs to be confirmed, not sure, don't know, suppress pool of people (that doesn't sound good to me), annually, variants (ooh, scary boys and girls) and forever?  Sounds like a plan, Stan.  No need to be coy, Roy.

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 5:04pm

    wotthecurtains

    wotthecurtains

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    wotthecurtains said:

    "

    Jan, my fear in all this is that mad Dr Fauci's mask zombies who are running out to get the death jab are going to get horribly sick this winter when they get exposed to the live virus. Alot of them will die. Then they'll claim the deaths are due to a "mutated virus" and the "unvaxxed" "science deniers" will be blamed.

    Very few people will question it because, lets face it, if they havent by now they never will. Hope Im wrong about it all."

     

    I wish I had something more hopeful to say but I've been running a similar scenario through my head.    DaveF has written about how people will react to finding out they are subject to ADE because of a vaccine they were encouraged to take even though they were not in a risk group to begin with.

    Maybe.   But we must remember back to when SCIENCE! proved that masks don't work and only lockdowns can save us.  I remember thinking people were gonna go apeshit when the same officials told them that now SCIENCE! says if everyone masks up then the lockdowns can end.

    Of course by now the story is to lockdown/mask/vaccinate and still there is an almost explicit promise that Covid won't end anyway.   People seem to accept this too so far.

    Not much to do but hope things "somehow" get better.   We are taught about standing up to tyranny, and there are moments when informal gatherings allow people to realize they aren't alone in their opposition to something.   But as a rule "protest" is futile because things move too slowly for most to notice until its too late.

    This depressing book is full of musings on how and why the Germans let it happen to them.

    https://press.uchicago.edu/Misc/Chicago/511928.html

     

     

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 5:37pm

    westcoastjan

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    link correction re post # 59

    The original Wuhan strain Clade 19a no longer exists ANYWHERE in the world ,or is out competed by variants as to make it immaterial. Look up nextstrain.com .

    I believe that should read nextstrain.org and not nextstrain.com as shown. No biggie... just want folks to find the right info! 😊

    Thanks for that new source of info!

     

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 5:51pm

    westcoastjan

    westcoastjan

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    Agreed...

    I wish I had something more hopeful to say but I've been running a similar scenario through my head. DaveF has written about how people will react to finding out they are subject to ADE because of a vaccine they were encouraged to take even though they were not in a risk group to begin with.

    People I know are actually doing the happy dance and are giddy with joy after they get the jab 🙄 They have no inkling of what they have just done.... I can only try to imagine what it will be like when they become aware somewhere down the road.

    My fear is that I could lose virtually all of my family if the ADE thing happens the way we anticipate. The vast majority have gotten or are getting the jab. It will be like being orphaned. Jeez. What a crummy thought 😥

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 6:46pm

    stealyourface

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    stealyourface said:

    nextstrain.org - a pretty cool site to dig around and have fun..

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 7:22pm

    stevedaly

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    Like being orphaned

    Jan, my father in law lost 85% of his relatives in Germany. If we are targeted by those who are lead by psychopaths, yeah, I guess it could happen.

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 7:39pm

    sebastian

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    sebastian said:

    Hi Brushhog,

    Most people in Argentina don’t generate much wealth to store, but if they do its in purchasing land and building a modest house. Often a young couple will live at one of their parents home and save to buy a small lot and slowly build a brick house one room at a time. My siblings buy US dollars sometimes Euros... but mostly people are barely getting by.

    If the US dollar becomes worthless the few that had them will spend them if they get a chance but for the most part it won’t matter unless you are owed payment in them, then it’s tough luck.

    I’ve often thought of how westerners would deal with a currency collapse, what I come back to is that it depends on how quick and aggressive the debasement is and what measures the government takes (debt forgiveness, UBI etc). Argentina’s case has always surprised me in its longevity, 90 years ago they where the 7th largest/debt free economy and considered developed. Things went sideways for about 40 years until the 1970 junta saddled the country with a large IMF foreign debt then neoliberalism, socialism and low taxes sealed the deal.
    As far as the west goes we haven’t seen hard times since the Great Depression so how will we adapt to a long emergency and de-growth situation? Very poorly to say the least.

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 7:40pm

    kunga

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    WestcoastJan + limerick

    As per your post, I was trying to recall times I have witnessed or felt the euphoria you described of the people who got the jab.  Combination of FOMO and release from fear.   I had similar feelings at the party the night before graduation of a grueling three year course.

    Champagne friends bragged of big party on the float,

    You envied all the luggage they did tote,

    You rushed in a panic

    Snagged the last ticket on the Titanic,

    Some days you should just miss the boat.

     

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 8:06pm

    #69

    Quercus bicolor

    Status: Gold Member

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    Posts: 906

    5

    The homesteading limerick

    The economy is kind of a joke.

    Soon it will go up in smoke.

    So build up your homestead.

    And grow the wheat for your bread.

    And laugh while the grifters go broke.

     

    I hope this one comes true!

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 8:17pm

    westcoastjan

    westcoastjan

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    Fab! + responses

    Nicely done, Kunga!

    Steve - sorry about your father-in-law's family - simply tragic!

    Sebastian: the Liberal Party of Canada just approved UBI at their policy convention this past weekend. It will be a slow decent to hell (until its not). And ya, we in the western developed nations have no idea what real hardship is.....for many hardship is having to put their cell phone down for 5 minutes and actually conduct a conversation without glancing at the phone... talk about mission impossible.

    I do not know real hardship either, having led a classic middle class life. Am preparing for the worst, but unlikely to be able to fully fathom the significant breakdowns we are likely to experience in the not too distant future, if things play out with the vaccines and Great Reset in the manner anticipated by many here. I am typing the words but increasingly at a loss as to what to say............ it is surreal, yet real...

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 8:42pm

    #71
    wotthecurtains

    wotthecurtains

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    wotthecurtains said:

    I guess on some level we just have to accept that we have no real control over things.

    My fears of ADE are not "well informed".  Just Chris mentioning it is a theoretical problem that was also  a real problem with the early attempts at mRNA vaccines created for the original SARS.   It sounded like those tests went really badly actually.

    So it worries me that the subject is not broached at all now in the "respectable press".  It guess there is an outside chance that the researchers cracked that nut and they have just decided the public is too stupid to understand the issue anyway.   Ive seen this many times where authority refuses to condescend to talk to mortals which leads to all kinds of speculation.

    But deep down, after everything Ive seen since Covid started, I think they are throwing these vaccines out and praying.  They didn't secure that immunity from lawsuits for no reason.

    All we can do is hope that serious ADE is limited to a small percentage of people I guess.   I'm barely old enough to remember the cold war but I remember a lot of people saying "Maybe the Nukes will fly and maybe they won't".  Not only was that good enough for people.  It had to be good enough.

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  • Thu, Apr 15, 2021 - 9:50pm

    timot78

    timot78

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Sep 18 2010

    Posts: 69

    0

    ADE a Non-Issue?

    FWIW:

    https://www.medpagetoday.com/special-reports/exclusives/91648

    Scientists say that ADE is pretty much a non-issue with COVID-19 vaccines, but what are they basing this on?

    From the early stages of COVID-19 vaccine development, scientists sought to target a SARS-CoV-2 protein that was least likely to cause ADE. For example, when they found out that targeting the nucleoprotein of SARS-CoV-2 might cause ADE, they quickly abandoned that approach. The safest route seemed to be targeting the S2 subunit of the spike protein, and they ran with that, wrote Derek Lowe, PhD, in his Science Translational Medicine blog "In the Pipeline."

    Scientists designed animal studies to look for ADE. They looked for it in human trials, and they've been looking for it in the real-world data for COVID-19 vaccines with emergency use authorization. So far, they haven't seen signs of it. In fact, the opposite is happening, Lowe noted.

    "[W]hat seems to be beyond doubt is that the vaccinated subjects, over and over, show up with no severe coronavirus cases and no hospitalizations. That is the opposite of what you would expect if ADE were happening," he wrote.

    Furthermore, ADE is an acute problem, and it can be very dramatic. If it was an issue with these vaccines, we would have spotted it by now, said Brian Lichty, PhD, an associate professor in pathology and molecular medicine at McMaster University in Toronto.

    "It'll kill you quickly. In all the places I'm aware of ADE happening, it is an acute, mostly cytokine-driven event," he told MedPage Today.

    The one exception may be an inactivated whole-cell, or "killed," vaccine developed by China. That vaccine uses alum, the same adjuvant that was used in the measles and RSV vaccines that caused ADE in the 1960s. The Chinese inactivated whole-cell vaccine could "conceivably" generate ADE like those older vaccines, according to Bloom.

    "I don't think that vaccine is ever going to see the light of day in the U.S., and it may not even be worth mentioning. There have been no actual cases of ADE with the Chinese whole-cell killed vaccine, or if so, it hasn't been reported," he said.

    What About Variants?

    Current COVID-19 vaccines were developed to protect against the original strain of SARS-CoV-2 that became dominant worldwide. As more variants arise, scientists have raised questions about whether one of these could become different enough to cause ADE. So far, that concern seems to be hypothetical, according to Lichty.

    "To date, there's really no evidence of ADE with the COVID-19 vaccines. It's all theoretical," he said. "I think all the evidence so far is that ADE is not turning out to be a problem with any existing vaccines or viral variants."

    One reason could be that SARS-CoV-2 just may not affect macrophages in a way that can produce ADE, although scientists are still working out the details. ADE has been reported after natural infection with other viruses, such as HIVEbola, and coxsackievirus, as well as other coronaviruses like SARS and MERS.

    Throughout the pandemic, scientists have been looking for ADE associated with SARS-CoV-2, but so far they haven't found any cases of it, noted Lichty.

    "This coronavirus may already be sufficiently adapted to humans, so that if it does get into macrophages via a non-neutralizing antibody interaction, it may not allow the macrophage to produce enough cytokine to cause an obvious pathology," he said.

    Newer Vaccines Are Safer

    Despite hesitancy about the relative newness of mRNA and adenoviral vector vaccines, these vaccines, in fact, have better safety profiles in terms of ADE than older types of vaccines, according to Bloom.

    "The bottom line is that not only is the new technology faster to respond to a new viral pandemic, but so much safer and much more clearly scientifically designed," he said. "The S protein vaccines are so much cleaner, so much more carefully defined, and so much lower risk. All you're seeing is one protein from that virus. So the chances for ADE are much slimmer than with any of the older ways for making virus vaccines."

     

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  • Fri, Apr 16, 2021 - 11:28am

    #73
    KugsCheese

    KugsCheese

    Status: Gold Member

    Joined: Jan 01 2010

    Posts: 934

    1

    Chapwood Index of Inflation Website No Longer?

    Adam just had an interview with Ed B. the creator of the Chapwood Index.  However, the website for the index is no more.   What's up?

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  • Fri, Apr 16, 2021 - 2:08pm

    #74
    M3

    M3

    Status: Member

    Joined: Jan 25 2021

    Posts: 32

    1

    Ade, covid or vaccine death

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.businessinsider.com/infected-after-covid-vaccination-cdc-numbers-breakthrough-infections-2021-4%3famp

    Where the 74 deaths previously part of the number of hospitalizations?  Are the hospitalizations and deaths from the vaccine, is it ADE, or is it covid? If the vaccine doesn't prevent covid, how do we know which one it is, the tests will be positive. I have a feeling they will keep saying the deaths are from covid, to not admit possible ADE or vaccine death. If the numbers keep increasing, I think it's something to watch. Other countries as well.

    Is there another way to look for ADE other than in breakthrough cases?

     

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  • Fri, Apr 16, 2021 - 3:49pm

    BSV

    BSV

    Status: Member

    Joined: Jan 26 2009

    Posts: 30

    1

    Chapwood Index

    You will not find it at www.chapwoodindex.com, but you will find it at www.chapwoodindex.org. The site seems to be up and running as usual.

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  • Thu, May 06, 2021 - 1:51pm

    #76
    SellAsIsJefferson

    SellAsIsJefferson

    Status: Member

    Joined: May 06 2021

    Posts: 2

    0

    SellAsIsJefferson said:

    Scary times!

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