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    VIDEO: The Coronavirus Is The Pin Popping The ‘Everything Bubble’

    This will be an extinction-level event for many players
    by Adam Taggart

    Monday, March 9, 2020, 5:44 PM

For years, Peak Prosperity has been raising a loud warning of the ‘Everything Bubble’ that the world’s central banks have blown in global asset prices.

Over that time, we’ve debated with hundreds of economic experts on what will be the trigger to “pop” this mania.

Well, now we’re finding out.

The economic damage being wrought worldwide by the coronavirus is the black swan the system never saw coming. Trade is being strangled, and the necessary productivity needed to support that massive increase in global debt that has been taken on over the past decade is just not there.

Bankruptcies are set to ripple across industries like wildfire. Mass layoffs will return with a vengeance. For certain industries — like travel, hospitality, and the shale oil drillers — this will be an extinction-level event for many players.

As ugly as the swift -19% drop in markets from from February’s highs has been, this is just the start of the reckoning, folks.

To give you a clear understanding what to expect during the bursting of the largest asset bubble in world history, Chris rushed to record this interview with John Rubino, author of The Money Bubble:

For those wondering what practical steps to take with their money as the Everything Bubble bursts: while Chris and John were recording, I was busy interviewing the lead partners from New Harbor Financial, Peak Prosperity’s endorsed financial advisor.

In the short video below, they offer their seasoned take on the current market action, what they see as most likely to happen from here, and what they recommend investors consider now:

Anyone interested in scheduling a free consultation and portfolio review with Mike and John can do so by clicking here.

And if you’re one of the many readers brand new to Peak Prosperity over the past few weeks, we strongly urge you get your financial situation in order in parallel with your physical coronavirus preparations.

We recommend you do so in partnership with a professional financial advisor who understands the macro risks to the market that we discuss on this website. If you’ve already got one, great.

But if not, consider talking to the team at New Harbor. We’ve set up this ‘free consultation’ relationship with them to help folks exactly like you.

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152 Comments

  • Mon, Mar 09, 2020 - 5:57pm

    #1
    Kat43

    Kat43

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 10 2020

    Posts: 48

    We're on daylight savings time now

    Chris, change your clock!  LOL

     

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  • Mon, Mar 09, 2020 - 6:13pm

    #2
    Christie Mariotto

    Christie Mariotto

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 14 2020

    Posts: 7

    Killing the Virus

    Definitely not a chemist or lab person and new here also.  I have been using Lysol Clean & Fresh Multi Surface Cleaner, 1.1856% alkyl dimethal benzyl  ammonium chlorides to disinfect cardboard packages received from UPS.  Is this product working or should I switch to bleach, hydrogen peroxide or bleach in the percentages Chris mentioned in his video today?  Thanks for any input.

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  • Mon, Mar 09, 2020 - 6:51pm

    yaz

    yaz

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 09 2020

    Posts: 5

    List of products

    I have been using gloves to open all packages, then "dumping" the contents into a plastic tub, followed by disinfecting each item with lysol wipes and setting aside to air dry prior to taking them into the house. I also purchased hydrogen peroxide and bleach as a back up. Just ordered some Microban 24-hr cleaner for things like keys, jackets, etc. Here is a link to an extensive list of recommended disinfectants.

    https://www.americanchemistry.com/Novel-Coronavirus-Fighting-Products-List.pdf

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  • Mon, Mar 09, 2020 - 7:01pm

    #4
    chewbacca

    chewbacca

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 10 2020

    Posts: 15

    chewbacca said:

    Chris, feed your cat!

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  • Mon, Mar 09, 2020 - 7:05pm

    #5
    dadzcats

    dadzcats

    Status: Member

    Joined: Dec 07 2011

    Posts: 19

    dadzcats said:

    Can anyone point me to an effective recipe for hand sanitizer using isopropyl alcohol and aloe vera gel?  After watching the video I am second guessing myself. Thanks!

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  • Mon, Mar 09, 2020 - 7:09pm

    #6
    JahFire

    JahFire

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 26 2020

    Posts: 13

    Welp...

    Well I had a consultation with a new harbor advisor today.. and to put it bluntly he didn't make me feel much better about my situation. I was told that there wouldn't be much benefit to establishing a partnership with them given the pending bubble burst.. didnt get much insight on other ways to prepare myself financially other than the obvious.. so I had to come to the forum for help.

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  • Mon, Mar 09, 2020 - 8:36pm

    #7

    LesPhelps

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Apr 30 2009

    Posts: 626

    DIY UV Sterilizer Box Project

    I've been expecting the bubble to burst for years, but it never occurred to me that the black swan would be a super virus.

    I stocked up fairly well before most people caught on (thanks Chris), but it didn’t occur to me to buy a UV sterilizer box, before they became insanely pricy and unavailable.

    So, I’m making one.  I thought I’d share my solution, in case anyone else wanted to do the same project.

    Things you will need in addition to the items listed below are, a drill, a solder gun, screw drivers, solder, solder flux and a short length of small gage electrical wire.  Modest soldering skills will be helpful.  A cheap low power soldering iron is ideal for this project.

    The items I am using are:

    Amazon:

    2 ea Phillips Lighting 363713 Germicidal Lamps $16.54

    1 ea AmerTac Everyday Basic Mini Fluorescent Light (Pack of 2) $8.48

    1 Powseed 45W Universal Power Adapter $16.87

    True Value Hardware:

    1 ea Rustoleum Silver Metalic Spray Paint $7.42

    Walmart

    1 ea Steriilte File Box internal dimensions 12 1/4 X 10 X 9 $9.70

    Basiclly, I have painted the inside of the file box metalilc silver. The result is a finish that resembles rough chrome.  Next, I'll install the two light fixtures on the inside of the lid facing down.  The light fixtures come with a 6 volt DC plug.  I will wire the two light fixtures together and plug the power adapter into one fixture.  The drill is to create a hole in the lid for the power supply wire.

    I’m also going to install a couple of hooks on the underside of the lid to hang things like masks from, while they are sterilizing.

    That’s it.

    The project without the power supply is $42.14 and with the power supply it’s $59.01.

    I have extra power supplies at home, but I am wintering 2,000 miles from home.  I need this sterilizer before I get home, so I’m buying a power supply.

    The finished box has a larger interior than similar retail items I've seen.

    I based my light system on the bulbs used by CoralUV.com.  Their unit looks excellent and reasonably priced, but they are on back order until mid May.  I need one before then.

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  • Mon, Mar 09, 2020 - 8:41pm

    #8
    Geedard

    Geedard

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    Joined: Oct 13 2014

    Posts: 63

    Really like the video format for Featured Voices

    Really like the Video format as much as the (until now) Podcast format.  I can stream either format and tend to listen (or now watch) whilst on the move (usually during the 1 hour train journey travelling to and from Zürich). iPad. Headphones. Tiptop.

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  • Mon, Mar 09, 2020 - 9:25pm

    #9
    pat the rat

    pat the rat

    Status: Member

    Joined: Nov 01 2011

    Posts: 148

    backwards

    There may be away to track  many deaths China had in Wu Han ?By knowing how many engineers and workers Apple needed to make ipod on the factory  floor and other company you can estimate how many are dead by how hard they work to replace this workers and engineers. If you can't work a problem forwards, then work it backwards.

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  • Mon, Mar 09, 2020 - 9:56pm

    #10
    Bren

    Bren

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 27 2020

    Posts: 19

    Jahfire - some thoughts came to mind

    Hello JahFire,

    I do do not know neither your tolerance for risk nor the state of your estate, but some thoughts came to mind if you wish to add some funds to long term investments via market vehicles.

    As you can see from the five year chart of the Dow Jones Industrial Average(DJIA), the index is only roughly 1400 points from flirting with the most notable resistance/support level (12/21/18) of the past two years. This low point in the mentioned index was reached 91 days after it had reached a closing high of slightly more than 26,740 points on Sept. 21st of the same year - at least according to the five year chart of the DJIA as furnished by Google.

    In addition, the DJIA saw an earlier downturn in 2018 after it nearly summitted the 26,620 mark in late January (1/26). It faltered to the slightly more than the 23,530 level some 56 days later (3/26).

    In my exceedingly humble opinion, the closing price set in late March will only act as a shallow support floor for the DJIA after it likely vacilates in a upwardish manner as it did after the dramatic precipice experienced during the last week in February. The index will probably collapse once more below today's low after 1) someone in Hollywood in shown to have come down with the virus, 2) the lockdown of primary European city beyond the borders of Italy manifest itself, 3) further testing reveals the entrenched state of the virus in the US, 4) turn to your chosen page in the Choose Your Own Adventure book - the Distopian Edition ... pick any or all of the above.

    At this point, the stronger back stop offered by the floor establiished in late December 2018 will be likely breached with only shallow resistance levels, which served as brief pauses during the index's overall rise in 2017, to arrest its descent.

    My point being that the current downturn of this index will not subside for weeks as the two prior weak periods cited above suggest. Moreover, this latest mkt. plunge brings to mind the market crash of 1987.

    The market lost nearly 35% of its value in roughly five weeks after managing a rebound intermediate high in early October of 1987. This Fall rebound in the index's spirit followed a shallow fall from its (then) all time high that was obtained earlier in the Summer.  However, from its initial fantastic bottom in early Nov. of 1887, the DJIA struggle to superceed the breathtaking low during the rest of said month as it experienced a secondary low point in late Nov/early Dec. of 1987.

    This latest example seems fitting in terms of a future timeline as the arrival of Spring will hopefully dampen considerably the virus' rate of the infection. Thus, market makers will collectively expel a deep sigh of relief and promptly forget the still existing threat of the novel corona virus while promptly extolling the bargains in value to be had.

    At this future instance, you could consider modestly dollar cost averaging back in as there could be another surprise in the Fall if the novel virus mimics the Spanish Flu of 1918... or not.

    But you should consult a trained professional to ascertain your risk profile coupled with your significant financial goal timeline to possibly set aside some monies in the market given its far lower valuation in the intermediate future and its likely future rise from fresh lows during the coming years of probable inflation to come.

     

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  • Mon, Mar 09, 2020 - 10:04pm

    #11
    Geedard

    Geedard

    Status: Member

    Joined: Oct 13 2014

    Posts: 63

    Et voila....fiscal stimulus is suddenly on the way !!

    Well that didn't take long did it.

    2'000 point drop on the DOW, oil in the $30-$40 range and...voila...POTUS stands forward and teases stocks back up with talk of fiscal stimulus and more debt.

    If this is how it turns out - then the globalists+virus employed a brilliant strategy to move the world over to global fiscal stimulus, from global monetary stimulus.

    Copperfields rabbit out the hat. Brilliant.  We've been done again 🙂

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  • Mon, Mar 09, 2020 - 10:13pm

    #12
    Bren

    Bren

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 27 2020

    Posts: 19

    My humble opinion (continued)

    Hi again JahFire,

    I did not listen to the two latest videos above prior to thinking about your circumstances. I wished to think for myself on the subject at hand before listening to a likely well informed opinion from a market expert.

    Good luck.

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  • Mon, Mar 09, 2020 - 10:56pm

    #13
    Thetallestmanonearth

    Thetallestmanonearth

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Feb 28 2013

    Posts: 330

    New Harbor updates

    Really really appreciate the updates. I’ve not wanted to bother those guys since they have important work to do right now, but I have been curious how their product is holding up to the headwinds. Their s great team and the results speak for themselves.

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  • Mon, Mar 09, 2020 - 11:00pm

    #14
    Bren

    Bren

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 27 2020

    Posts: 19

    On the notion of mask sterilization...

    If Chris advises us to severely curtail our interaction with society during the probable prevalence of the novel virus in our communities, should we not simply enclose a used mask in sealable glass jar and let the sun's rays disinfect it for us? We should not be moving about our communities during the thick of it anyways, right?

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 12:48am

    #15

    Dutch John

    Status: Member

    Joined: Oct 09 2008

    Posts: 36

    Black Sheep

    Blame game: how a black swan will convert into a black sheep......

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 5:13am

    #16
    ddelong

    ddelong

    Status: Member

    Joined: Jan 20 2015

    Posts: 35

    Payroll Tax Cut

    Hearing that the US TPTB are considering a payroll tax cut.  They just don't get it.  How is someone that doesn't have any sick days suppose to benefit from this.  A tax reduction on 0 income is still zero.  They really think that everyone can work from home and still get a paycheck.  I hope that some sensible ideas to help all of the american people are put forth and considered. (Pipedream).

    I guess we should all hope that this virus succumbs to the change in weather, come on heat wave.  However that will most likely only allow the US to try and get is s$%t together for round two come the fall, while putting an overwhelming burden in the short term on the southern hemisphere.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 5:40am

    #17
    Chris Martenson

    Chris Martenson

    Status: Platinum Member

    Joined: Jun 07 2007

    Posts: 5196

    A Letter to Trump

    In our flood of emails was one that claimed to have access to Trump.  So on the very small chance that's accurate, and even smaller chance that anything might happen even if it were true, I took 5 minutes to pen this letter:

    Dear President Trump,

    The coronavirus emergency is unlike any faced by a sitting president in over 100 years.  Your leadership on this, and this alone, will define how your presidency is remembered.

    You are in danger of being remembered as "that guy who was slow to the punch and crashed the economy, and failed to save lives."

    It's a very tricky balancing act you must now attempt.  The greatest negotiation ever because the entity across the table is a virus, and it doesn't respond to any pressure or requests.

    Here are the three things you must balance:

    1. Stopping the spread of the disease
    2. Preventing the economy from crashing
    3. Not allowing our hospital system to become overwhelmed.

    If you fail at (1) this thing just keeps burning through our society creating lasting damage

    If you fail at (2) as much - or more - pain and misery results for people

    If you fail at (3) many, many people die, from both the coronavirus as well as other treatable conditions like heart attacks and appendicitis.

    Here's where your incredible leadership is going to be needed.  You can't just 'solve for one' of the above without accidentally sacrificing it.

    For example, if you simply opt to 'save the economy'  (2) then the disease screams across the land, it destroys the hospital system, people refuse to travel or go to work, economic behaviors change,  and you lose the economy (2) nonetheless.  This is already happening.

    If you simply optimize (1) and stop the contagion, then your sacrifice the economy and eventually people are starving so they break quarantine and then the disease takes off again and you've failed at (1).

    Our advice?

    Immediate transparency and honesty.  This is a War.  It's time to pull the nation together.  Ask for sacrifices and call on people's honor and duty.   We'll get through this.  It won't be easy.  But it will be worth it and will reignite a sense of togetherness like this country hasn't had in 70 years.  You could lead this.  Or the opposite.

    Next, people have been getting bad, and often scientifically inaccurate information from the leadership of the CDC and WHO.  This needs to stop immediately.  And they know it too; people can smell BS a mile away.  This is eroding trust at a time when it is most needed.

    Finally, people need to know what the plan is.  Who is making more masks?  When will they be available?  What should they do in the meantime?  Who is paying for the covid-19 testing?  Who will pay for the uninsured hospital bills?  What happens to mortgages and student loans if people are out of work?

    You should simply state what the answers are to these (and many other) questions and then let Congress take the fall if they can't or won't deliver on them.

    Time is running out.  You have at most another week to get this right.

    Sincerely,
    Dr. Chris Martenson

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 5:51am

    Chris Martenson

    Chris Martenson

    Status: Platinum Member

    Joined: Jun 07 2007

    Posts: 5196

    Re: Payroll Tax Cut

    I agree - a payroll tax cut does nothing for the person who loses their wait-staffing job. It does nothing to help the hourly worker who has no hours to work because their services aren't needed because nobody is shopping or vacationing.

    It's a super indirect thing. It's something. But it's really not a game changer, no matter how much the PPT crams the stock futures up in the overnights to try and "stem the damage" (and probably try to salve Trump's ego by showing the ""markets"" applaud his amazing leadership, yada, yada, yada)

    Meanwhile in Italy:

    (Source)

    That's how you do it.

    But that kinda sticks it to the banks and that's pretty un-American so a weak-assed payroll tax cut it is!

    How the ""markets"" can interpret that as in any way being capable of moving the economic needle is beyond me.

    So SARs it is!  (Sell All Rallies)

     

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 6:23am

    BillL

    BillL

    Status: Member

    Joined: Jan 15 2020

    Posts: 115

    Caught a bit of sarcasm in the "stick it to banks" comment.

    If I'm not mistaken, every, single, bank has a charter with the Federal Reserve Bank.  Every, single, bank gets their orders/direction from the FED.  Money printed out of thin air (for their gains) and added to the backs of those of us that are productive, our kids and grandkids futures.

    Let's strike the match and let it burn.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 6:32am

    dtrammel

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: May 03 2011

    Posts: 799

    Mask Sterilization - Its Complicated

    If Chris advises us to severely curtail our interaction with society during the probable prevalence of the novel virus in our communities, should we not simply enclose a used mask in sealable glass jar and let the sun’s rays disinfect it for us? We should not be moving about our communities during the thick of it anyways, right?

    That is an excellent way to do it Bren. A glass jar or even a ziplock bag set in a window for 9 days (the length of time it takes to kill this thing without interventions) is one way to do it. That's assuming you have the number of masks needed to do a rotation like that. Not all people will.

    Many people are going to have to be out each day in some fashion. No matter what the authorities believe about the miracle we all can work from home, people have ill parents and family, or their job they have to work no matter what, or in my case, animals at a shelter who must get feed or they die.

    So we may need working masks quicker.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 6:50am

    #21
    Sparky1

    Sparky1

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jul 21 2016

    Posts: 736

    Vancouver, BC reports 1st Covid-2019 death, 5 new cases

    B.C. announces Canada’s first coronavirus death

    residents and workers at residential facility test positive for Covid-2019

    https://globalnews.ca/news/6650774/bc-covid-coronavirus-update-monday/

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 6:59am

    LesPhelps

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Apr 30 2009

    Posts: 626

    It’s not just masks I want to sterilize

    I’m retired, so I’m able to isolate more than most, but still need occasional fresh items from the grocery store among other occasional needs.

    I’d like to sterilize things like my cell phone, credit card, car keys and watch, as well as masks.  Also, we are treating mail and mail order packages we receive as suspect.  None of that can be rotated for nine days.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 7:17am

    #23
    DaveDD

    DaveDD

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Sep 08 2019

    Posts: 166

    question about crypto currency

    Hi all,

    These are great article’s discussions the financial precautions people can take and many of us have taken.

    Apart from precious metals (in a safe locations), purely out of curiosity, I started to invest (small amounts) in crypto. My question is this: if there will be a financial disaster/reset, what would/could the effect be on crypto currencies?

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 7:28am

    #24

    LesPhelps

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Apr 30 2009

    Posts: 626

    Something we found yesterday

    I wonder if either of these have merit?

    This just might work for us

    The new NCP coronavirus may not show signs of infection for many days, how can one know if he/she is infected. By the time they have a fever and/or cough and goes to the hospital, the lungs are usually 50 % Fibrosis and it's too late!

    Taiwan experts provide a simple self-check that we can do every morning:

    Take a deep breath and hold your breath for more than 10 seconds. If you complete it successfully without coughing, without discomfort, stuffiness or tightness, etc.,it proves there is no fibrosis in the lungs, basically indicating no infection.

    In critical times, please self-check every morning in an environment with clean air.

    SERIOUS EXCELLENT ADVICE by Japanese Doctors treating COVID-19 cases:
    Everyone should ensure your mouth & throat is moist, never DRY. Take a few sips of water every 15 mins at least. WHY?  Even if the virus gets into your mouth...drinking water or other liquids will WASH them down through your esophagus into the stomach. Once there in the tummy...your stomach ACID will kill all the virus. If you don't drink enough water more regularly...the virus can enter your windpipes and into the LUNGS. That's very dangerous.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 7:35am

    Christie Mariotto

    Christie Mariotto

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 14 2020

    Posts: 7

    EPA List

    Thank you!

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 7:40am

    #26

    LesPhelps

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Apr 30 2009

    Posts: 626

    Yet another question.

    Yesterday, I ran across a statement that the average age of those who have died from the virus is 80. I think the source was MSM. I wonder about the validity of that statement?

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 7:48am

    #27

    LesPhelps

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Apr 30 2009

    Posts: 626

    Transmission distance up to 4.5 meters (15 feet)

    Now I feel really safe.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 7:52am

    Nairobi

    Nairobi

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Feb 05 2020

    Posts: 289

    What reset?

    Well DaveDD, I suppose it depends on what you mean by a reset since that is a pretty loaded word. If you are talking about a situation of debt defaults though and widespread bank failures then we might have some historical perspective to work with. There are no "resets" in the real world though. Economies might bankrupt over time and that has happened. But the process isn't instantaneous as you may imagine and there would be plenty of signs along the way.

    So you need to think through the mechanics of what you expect and then ask yourself step by step what would happen in order and what outcomes might follow. But if your income was affected then it is pretty certain your governments revenues will be equally impacted and if it was a widespread problem such as the 06 housing bust where tens of thousands of people went bankrupt and lost homes then probably the reset will resemble welfare and debt relief for the masses. Maybe even MMT.

    But I am going to guess that you are probably a gold bug and you have bought into the gold ideology that some day soon money will become confetti and gold will soar in value and you will be solvent (and saved) while all your neighbors who don't have gold will slip into poverty.

    In that case expect the authorities to take it away from you.

    And if the crisis is really huge and people rush into alternative assets to escape the ravages of taxation or flee from every form of real and imagined control (like an autocratic government then you will doubtlessly find yourself attacked financially through legal means. For that matter Bitcoin and other alt coins will probably be outlawed altogether and indeed that is also what is already happening in some countres.

    The government will have its pound of flesh no matter where you live and so if your idea is to hide out under a rock with a little pile of gold or some electronic currency you will be sought out and found and taxed while the reset is happening. Because your government is broke too and might need some percentage of that money. That is also already happening. I don't suppose you are even aware that you cannot talk about this on the internet because every word you write can and will identify you later on down the road (and my words too of course). So much for the secrecy owning blockchains!

    So I can help. There is low odds gold even exceeds 2400 dollars in the next few years. Secondly, bitcoin is trash and will go to zero. Let me save you all the trouble of even worrying because there isn't going to be a reset. Just more of the same but with added drama but life will go on like always.

    Whew! You can relax now.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 8:01am

    #29
    MKI

    MKI

    Status: Member

    Joined: Jan 12 2009

    Posts: 189

    Bankruptcies...mass layoffs...really?

    Bankruptcies are set to ripple across industries like wildfire. Mass layoffs will return with a vengeance.

    I don't think this is the reality on the ground for normal people. Most big companies seem fine; I own blue-chip dividend paying stocks and they have hardly budged, esp in the fundamentals (PE, ROIC, Bk, PO). I'm still ahead from 12 month average.

    The only stocks I have that took it hard are oil stocks, and those are simply undervalued. I'm not crying, I'm buying even more oil stocks right now with dividend my dividend PO. I don't think we are even close to the Fed bumping the limits yet.

    I also think the virus fear is a bunch of silly panic for healthy folk. If people just ate right (no processed food, negligible grains/fruit, and instead ate lots of protein/veggies...let's call it the Taggart diet?), plus get good sleep, sun, and exercise they have nothing more to fear than the risk of driving. To me, CV is just another opportunity due to the madness of crowds.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 8:52am

    JahFire

    JahFire

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 26 2020

    Posts: 13

    Much appreciated, Bren

    Thank you for your well thought out reply. You look to be very informed on the subject and provided a lot of good insight. This was something along the lines of what I was looking for with New Harbor.. but I won't dwell on that. I've had consultations with advisors before and have a pretty good grasp on my risk tolerance profile. Right now I'm focused on hard assets more than anything. There's a bit of blind faith that goes into this I'm sure..especially at this moment. I'm just hoping my next move will be my best move..  .

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 9:07am

    #31

    Jim H

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jun 08 2009

    Posts: 1170

    Antiviral properties of mushrooms and mushroom products

    I sense that very few folks here have caught the particular contagion that I am offering, which is to get excited about the anti-viral properties of mushrooms.  I think having a well tweaked immune system is much more comforting than having the best protocol for mask reuse.  In any event, I continue to research mushrooms and mushroom products and I have stocked up recently on the Stamets Host Defense products, which the work behind this research paper from 2019 is based on;

    https://bmccomplementmedtherapies.biomedcentral.com/track/pdf/10.1186/s12906-019-2681-7

    For context,  Stamets has been working for many years to develop his own approach to organic mushroom farming.  He allows the mushroom to grow on fermented brown rice as a substrate, at which point the wispy threads of mushroom mycelium become intertwined with the rice.  Stamets' products include all of this, hence he has gone to extra lengths to show that his products may actually be even more effective than those made from fruiting bodies (what we think of as the mushroom) alone.

    My approach is to use both types of products,  traditional Chaga preparation harvested from birch trees, as well as the Stamets lab grown stuff.

      Results: Both aqueous and solid fractions of TvM triggered robust induction of CD69 on lymphocytes and monocytes, whereas FS only triggered minor induction of CD69, and IS had no activating effect. The aqueous extract of TvM had stronger activating effects than the solid fraction. In contrast, the solid fraction of IS triggered a
    reduction in CD69, below levels on untreated cells.
    Both aqueous and solid fractions of FS triggered large and dose-dependent increases in immune-activating proinflammatory cytokines (IL-2, IL-6), anti-inflammatory cytokines Interleukin-1 receptor antagonist (IL-1ra) and Interleukin-10 (IL-10), anti-viral cytokines interferon-gamma (IFN-γ) and Macrophage Inflammatory Protein-alpha (MIP-1α), as well as Granulocyte-Colony Stimulating Factor (G-CSF) and Interleukin-8 (IL-8). TvM triggered more modest cytokine increases. The aqueous extract of IS showed no effects, whereas the solid fraction showed modest
    effects on induction of cytokines and growth factors

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 9:10am

    ao

    ao

    Status: Platinum Member

    Joined: Feb 04 2009

    Posts: 1242

    MKI, you would seem to be a talented stock picker

    Can you give us the symbols of the 10 best blue chip dividend paying stocks that you own?  Thank you.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 9:32am

    DaveDD

    DaveDD

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Sep 08 2019

    Posts: 166

    Re: what reset

    Hi Nairobi,

    Thanks for your answer! 😂

    Indeed the term reset is too loaded I and should have phrased my question better. The actual question is: are there any other potential ways to protect (part) of ones savings outside of the standard systems.

    Although I do own some precious metals, I’m not a gold bug, neither a crypto bug, neither am I interested in Bitcoin. There are a few very nice projects with real world use cases.

    Anyway, it’ good to hear all kind of opinions as this makes me think in different ways and might open new viewpoints.

     

     

     

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 10:22am

    #34

    thc0655

    Status: Platinum Member

    Joined: Apr 27 2010

    Posts: 2024

    I heard it from a trusted source

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 10:30am

    BonnieB2A

    BonnieB2A

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 25 2020

    Posts: 34

    Stamets on immune defense properties of certain mushrooms

    I’ve been following Paul Stament’s mycelium work in regard to immunity and also soil health for more than 5 years since first hearing him speak at a Permaculture Voices event.  He is working with some solid scientists and I have been a user of his Host Defense products.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 10:35am

    BonnieB2A

    BonnieB2A

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 25 2020

    Posts: 34

    Homemade hand sanitizer

    The WHO has a recipe for hand sanitizer that does not include the addition of Aloe Vera. There are a few instructional videos on YT that use this recipe and many more from more questionable content creators that include the Aloe Vera as well as other ingredients not included by WHO.   Thus far I have been unable to locate the recipe on the WHO website, though it is reportedly there.

     

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 10:41am

    scotthw

    Status: Member

    Joined: Oct 16 2008

    Posts: 20

    Package quarantine

    I too have been opening all packages with gloves then dumping it somewhere and leaving it for several days, if I can afford to.  Otherwise using CLorox wipes on the contents.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 10:50am

    scotthw

    Status: Member

    Joined: Oct 16 2008

    Posts: 20

    Transmission distance up to 4.5 meters (15 feet)

    Well the maddening thing about all this is we have no idea who has been where we tread.  Someone with CV may have sat in his seat the day before... bingo.  As it can live for days on some surfaces, its enough to make you dig a hole and crawl in.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 10:54am

    scotthw

    Status: Member

    Joined: Oct 16 2008

    Posts: 20

    It’s not just masks I want to sterilize

    Similar here, but I have not taken to wearing masks just yet, only have a few so saving them.  Everything else you said I am doing same.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 11:02am

    chloecasey

    chloecasey

    Status: Member

    Joined: Dec 25 2008

    Posts: 26

    Homemade Hand Sanitizer

    My understanding is that you need to use the 99% isopropyl alcohol. The end product needs to have 60-70% alcohol content so you would mix 2/3 alcohol with 1/3 aloe vera to bring the alcohol down to 66%. You cannot use standard 70% isopropyl alcohol because mixing it with the aloe vera will bring the alcohol below the effective range.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 11:10am

    #41

    Oliveoilguy

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Jun 29 2012

    Posts: 749

    Message from LifeCare home in Kirkland

    From Scott who’s father roomed with the first fatality at LifeCare:

    I SURVIVED ACUTE COVID-19 and am doing fine.

    My 86 year old father, Chuck, just now tested positive for Covid-19. He is confined to Life Care Center of Kirkland, the epicenter of the US breakout.

    Those of you who really know me, understand how challenged I am asking for help.

    I am now asking all of you for your help.

    No matter what you call it ..... white light, healing, prayer, love, best wishes, a moment of silence or reflection, good positive thoughts ......... will you please send it our way?

    For Chuck Sedlacek that he survive this virus
    For all Life Care Center of Kirkland patients and staff
    For those now suffering or have already lost a loved one to Covid-19
    For our First Responders
    For our Medical Professionals
    For our government officials to get this right
    For all of us dealing with the reality of this novel coronavirus.

    Please send your support of Good Health & Long Life & the fortitude to deal with the fear and unknows of this virus.

    Thank You

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 12:01pm

    BonnieB2A

    BonnieB2A

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 25 2020

    Posts: 34

    Letter to POTUS

    👏 👏 👏

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 12:10pm

    Ision

    Ision

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 07 2020

    Posts: 121

    Use UV-C Light To Disinfect Your Unwashable Items

    I suggest using a very powerful UV-C Ultra-Violet light source to kill all pathogens, which may have contaminated your non-washable items.

    Learn about UV-C sterilization, so you will not use WEAK UV-C lights, which are less than 36 Watts.  If you do, you will NOT effectively kill the coronavirus, and many other pathogens.  Most commercial "home" UV disinfecting lights are simply not powerful enough.    Example:  Using a 5 Watt LED UV light will not achieve the desired results without long exposures...  The reason is a 5 Watt LED does NOT produce 5 Watts of UV-C.  In other words, the light power wattage is NOT equal to its OUTPUT of UV-C.

    This makes people's dose calculations wrong, making the time required to kill a pathogen far LESS...than it really is.   IN addition, the DISTANCE from the UV-C light source is very important, too.   A weak UV-C will not only take longer to kill a virus..the virus must be CLOSER to that source.

    A 36 Watt rated CFL fluorescent light, if it is any good....will only produce 12 Watts of UV-C.   But, 12 Watts of UV-C is enough to do a good job, in much quicker time, at a much greater distance.

    Build your own UV-C light box, but DO NOT SKIMP ON THE POWER OF THE UV-C LIGHT IT USES.

    The more powerful the UV-C light is in the box...the better.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 12:38pm

    #44

    Quercus bicolor

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Mar 19 2008

    Posts: 347

    email to members of a local nonprofit board on which I sit

    Hi all,
    I'll get right to the point.  With cases of coronavirus possibly (likely?) already hiding in our area perhaps it is not a good idea for a group of 20, mostly older folks to gather in a church basement for our meeting.  How many of us are over 60, the age at which the case fatality rate turns sharply upward?  Maybe an online meeting would be prudent?
    I know some of you might see the risk as minimal right now.  I urge you to consider that the US is about where Italy was about 2 and a half weeks ago.  The people dying over the past few days in Italy (over 168 so far just today) were most likely infected about 2.5 weeks ago.
    So far, I've got two supportive responses and nothing from naysayers.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 12:40pm

    #45

    Quercus bicolor

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Mar 19 2008

    Posts: 347

    email to organizer of a sports banquet at my daughter's high school

    Hi ...,

    I haven't responded because I'm wrestling with the coronavirus situation. My best assessment is that we as a nation are almost exactly where Italy was at 2 and a half weeks ago. If that is the case, continuing to hold non-essential gatherings, perhaps even keeping schools open could be construed as irresponsible behaviors that will be blamed for overwhelmed hospitals and too many deaths a few weeks out. Overwhelmed hostpitals and 168 deaths today (total deaths 631) is exactly what Italy is experiencing right now. I'm sure there are people dying of things like appendicitis, physical trauma, heart attacks, etc. who would not have if the hospitals were not overwhelmed.

    I understand normalcy bias (our tendency to carry on with our normal activities even if the data suggests we should do otherwise) and have found my own behavior subject to it even today, but perhaps we are being called on to get beyond that human tendency and take different actions for a while.

    There is already a localized lockdown in New Rochelle. I'm guessing many more locations will be experiencing that in a few weeks. Unfortunately, a few weeks from now, much more extensive disruptions to routine will likely be required to get this virus under control and even with these, there will be more hardship and death than there would have been if we started now. So why not start now when the required effort is still huge, but smaller that it would be and our actions could save many lives?

    Would you consider postponing the banquet until after this passes?

    So far no response.

    I'll post an email I sent to our school superintendent (with whom I had a very productive conversation on Friday) as soon as I have his permission.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 1:12pm

    #46
    kunga

    kunga

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Feb 26 2017

    Posts: 341

    Alex Jones arrested DUI in Texas

    Not a good time to be incarcerated, Alex.   Be smart out there, people!

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 1:31pm

    BonnieB2A

    BonnieB2A

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 25 2020

    Posts: 34

    Letter to your not-for profit board

    Perhaps also forward a story link regarding the CDC recommendations so that they do not see this as just your opinion?

    CDC urges older people to stay at home amid coronavirus spread

    https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/specific-groups/high-risk-complications.html#who-is-higher-risk

    Perhaps propose an action plan for your organization at this online meeting per CDC guidelines (at a minimum) https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/community/organizations/index.html

     

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 2:04pm

    #48
    westcoastjan

    westcoastjan

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Jun 04 2012

    Posts: 438

    Helpful print resources for spreading the word

    For those of you who want to be proactive with messaging in your circles the CDC has some excellent print resources here:

    https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/communication/factsheets.html

    I am taking a cue from Quercus bicolor by starting to write to non-profits and organizations I associate with to help foster awareness and cultivate allies. Perhaps this is the next logical prep step for those who are ready, willing and able. We all have a vested interest in filling information gaps and/or countering erroneous information spread, inadvertently or not, by authorities.

    Thanks Quercus bicolor for sharing what you are doing and igniting a new train of thought for me.

    Jan

     

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 2:18pm

    #49
    Desogames

    Desogames

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 03 2020

    Posts: 210

    Crypto is speculative

    It's always been in doubt until Monday 2 weeks ago; In a rout, Crypto falls along with all the other speculative assets. That was when we had the first perfect sell signal (gold/silver/VIX/USD up, everything else down) and crypto went down with everything else. I think wensday following the same thing happened again, though that doesn't really matter. Mostly it's when the unexpected happens that you get some truth out of the markets for once.

    The crash yesterday confirmed it. The oil price wars where another black swan, another thing everybody didn't see coming, and again.... Crypto went down with the rest. Further then the stock market, which puts it into speculative territory.

    Sure - everything falls. But i was watching crypto as well and bitcoin was down 10% while the rest of the crypto space was down 15%. Which is the last time i checked, because if Bitcoin falls more then the stock market percentage wise  in a crash, it is 100% a speculative asset.

    Generally speaking Crypto is it's own space. Over the past few months i've not seen any correlation between market moves (speculative or safe haven) and crypto. Sometimes it moves with gold, sometimes opposed. Sometimes it's a safe haven, sometimes it's speculative.

    But that's the wonderful thing about panic selling. Panic is pure. There's no lies in panic. Even when everything sells, what are the things people sell the least? The thing they really try to avoid selling. Gold for example is still very high up on the year, even if it sells off some days. Silver only went down something 1,5% in the end on monday, even at it's lowest it was only down 4%. Contrast that to Oil being down 33% at it's low point, or the Dow down 7,38% and closing over 2000 points down.

    Crypto folded. So we can now conclude 2 very simple things:
    1. Crypto is speculative and has no safe haven status when it counts.
    2. None of the other crypto coins matter. Everything still depends on Bitcoin. What bitcoin does, they do amplified, much like silver tends to track gold but amplified.

    Nope i'm with Nairobi on this one. Bitcoin is trash. Always has been. The whole idea of creating a coin that at some point, cannot inflate, is just moronic. I can't even begin to describe the problems that creates economically.

    But the idea of a crypto currency in itself is very promising. There *is* value in mathematically being able to trust a stranger. It's just that the coins attached to these methods are worthless by design. I honestly can't wait until bitcoin dies - thats when the crypto revolution can really begin. That market needs a paradigm shift though before i would consider getting in.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 2:27pm

    #50
    MQ

    MQ

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Oct 13 2011

    Posts: 115

    Buy real passports, ID Card,whatapp (+1(626)657-0237) (www.perfectdocumentservices.com) drivers license, visa, green car

    WTH?????

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 2:33pm

    #51
    Lisa Mooney

    Lisa Mooney

    Status: Member

    Joined: Jan 25 2020

    Posts: 17

    Italian Health Official .. speaks out.. worse than a bomb

    https://youtu.be/9mrPHO-nkVE

    I am on quick work break, cannot do math now, but Lombardy has 10.8 million residents ...Total of 850 ICU Beds, Currently close to 700 patients in them ...

    AHA data: According to the AHA 2015 annual survey, the United States had 4862 acute care registered hospitals; 2814 of these had at least 10 acute care beds and at least 1 ICU bed. These hospitals had a total of 540,668 staffed beds and 94,837 ICU beds (14.3% ICU beds/total beds) in 5229 ICUs.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 2:44pm

    #52
    Sparky1

    Sparky1

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jul 21 2016

    Posts: 736

    Adam, Is this an advertisement/spam from "maxbrown"??

    I could be wrong and I don't want to be disparaging, but it sure looks like an advertisement or spam to me. :-/

    https://www.peakprosperity.com/video-the-coronavirus-is-the-pin-popping-the-everything-bubble/#comment-413990

     

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 3:09pm

    pinecarr

    Status: Gold Member

    Joined: Apr 13 2008

    Posts: 1141

    Nice letter, Chris!

    Nice letter Chris; it is certainly worth a shot!

    I don't think the leadership qualities and humanity your letter reflects are innate to Trump's character.  But he has business smarts, so maybe he'll at least recognize a good opportunity (play-book) when/if he sees it.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 3:10pm

    #54
    westcoastjan

    westcoastjan

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Jun 04 2012

    Posts: 438

    BC SCAM ALERT RE VIRUS TESTING - IMPORTANT

    It was noted yesterday by BC's Provincial Heath Authority Dr. Bonnie Henry that scammers have started working in BC offering Covid-19 testing for a fee.

    DO NOT FALL FOR THIS!!!!  All testing in BC is free & is conducted by the BC Health Authority in various locations. Dr. Henry further indicated that testing is increasing in response to changing conditions, and the turnaround time is fast. More assessment centres are being planned to be able to set up on an as/where needed basis across the province moving forward.

    It is imperative that people only go to BC Health Authorities for testing to ensure accuracy as well as proper record keeping which informs crucial decision making.

    There are no guarantees of safety or accuracy of testing with these for fee scammers. It is a serious risk to use them, and puts the rest of us at risk if the results are fake. They are nothing more than slimy scum bags looking to profit from the crisis - and that is being polite!

    Jan

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 3:18pm

    #55
    Sparky1

    Sparky1

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jul 21 2016

    Posts: 736

    Chris' newest video, live now: "It's Too Late for the US and EU" (3/10/20)

    Our Authorities' Poor Response To The Coronavirus Is Just Making Things Worse (3/10/20)

    https://youtu.be/K0HYh6zjTUo

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 3:47pm

    SagerXX

    Status: Gold Member

    Joined: Feb 11 2009

    Posts: 451

    Hey Jim H: Just ordered Host Defense immune and their cordyceps product...

    A friend gave me some cordyceps supplements and I felt the difference.  Thanks for the reminder!  Looking forward to putting them into daily rotation, so to speak!

    Good to see you kickin' around the community here, old-timer.  <smile>

    VIVA -- Sager

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 3:54pm

    #57
    Susan7

    Susan7

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 15 2020

    Posts: 49

    Lysol Spray for My Hands

    i prepped about a month ago but didn’t feel I needed to buy hand sanitizer since I’m practicing social distancing. I don’t use the stuff anyway because I wash my hands at least 7 or 8 times a day. Today I realized I’d forgotten about my weekly Meals on Wheels duty, delivering a meal to about 8 semi-home bound people. So I bought a bottle of Lysol to spray on my hands before and after each delivery. I’m fine with doing this for several weeks until the program is suspended but would appreciate any comments or suggestions for a better option. The pharmacist recommended baby wipes but I don’t think this would be very effective.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 4:27pm

    #58
    Sparky1

    Sparky1

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jul 21 2016

    Posts: 736

    Central, South America: lack of water, soap, bathrooms, meds increase CV-2019 threat

    Buckets for toilets, recycled gloves: Venezuelan hospitals await coronavirus unprepared

    "The Pan American Health Organization said last week it would be prioritizing Haiti, Venezuela and a handful of other Central and South American countries who have “more challenges to their health systems.”

    Hania Salazar, president of Maracaibo’s nursing school in the western state of Zulia, said hospital workers have been without supplies for years.

    “Workers bring their own kits with soap and towels, and their own water to drink and wash,” said Salazar.

    “They also carry paint containers because here there is no hospital that has a bathroom in good condition.”

    As in other parts of Venezuela, Zulia’s health system has hemorrhaged workers. Salazar said only emergency units were operating and workers often clock upwards of 18 hours a day.

    Residents say a lack of access to water or affordable soap can make basic hygiene practices - needed to guard against the spread of the virus - out of reach for many.

    “I am very concerned that in Venezuela there are no supplies, medicines, or even water in hospitals or homes,” said Josefina Moreno, a 50-year-old university professor with a history of respiratory disease. “The prevention measures that everyone is talking about are hard to comply with here.”

    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-venezuela/buckets-for-toilets-recycled-gloves-venezuelan-hospitals-await-coronavirus-unprepared-idUSKBN20X2F1?il=0

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 4:30pm

    Wayne Swanson

    Wayne Swanson

    Status: Member

    Joined: Nov 29 2014

    Posts: 10

    Virus statistics website

    Here is what seems to be a reliable and reasonable website with a huge amount of information on all kinds of virus stats (I think it may be the one that Chris shows in his vids, but can't swear to that -click on "Corona" at the top):

    https://www.worldometers.info

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 5:10pm

    #60
    westcoastjan

    westcoastjan

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Jun 04 2012

    Posts: 438

    BC update late afternoon March 10th - 7 new cases

    Seven new cases 🙁

    Coronavirus: B.C. confirms 7 new COVID-19 cases, 2 of them health-care workers

     

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 5:11pm

    #61

    thc0655

    Status: Platinum Member

    Joined: Apr 27 2010

    Posts: 2024

    John Travolta hospitalized

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 5:15pm

    Jim H

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jun 08 2009

    Posts: 1170

    Hello Sager!

    Always good to have your positive spirit in the house!  I tried to follow you from the NY-area to Hawaii but only got as far as Washington State.. nice here except for being the #1 corona virus state, at least for now.

    How many years ago was it that we met during the New Paltz event with Chris that you organized?  I think the website was still ChrisMartenson.com back then : )

    I am continually amazed as I learn more about mushrooms.  In one of the video's of a talk he gave, Paul Stamets recounted mouse studies where amyloid plaques, as associated with Alzheimer's syndrome, were reversed.  The reversal was seen both through the mice regaining ability to negotiate a maze, and through brain autopsy as well (Thank you mice!).  Lion's mane mushroom, as prepared by Stamets, resulted in neuroregeneration in mice!  Needless to say I have several of his formulations, as well as some turkey tail powder that I mix with my Chaga tea.

    Best regards Sager,  Jim

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 5:20pm

    westcoastjan

    westcoastjan

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Jun 04 2012

    Posts: 438

    hahaha good one!

    Too funny! Needed that laugh! 🙂

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 5:28pm

    #64
    westcoastjan

    westcoastjan

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Jun 04 2012

    Posts: 438

    Alberta Update March 10th - case load doubled to 14

    The travellers had returned from France, the Netherlands, Egypt, Iran, Taiwan, Germany, Malaysia, Trinidad and Tobago, the Philippines and the United States.

    Several of the travellers visited more than one country on their trip. One was also on the same MS Braemar cruise ship in the Caribbean as a case announced on March 8.

    https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmonton/alberta-cases-of-covid-19-double-to-14-medical-officer-reports-1.5492562

     

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 5:52pm

    #65
    BonnieB2A

    BonnieB2A

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 25 2020

    Posts: 34

    American Hospital Association leaked webinar info. warns hospitals to prepare

    Originally on Business Insider (but hidden behind the paywall). https://www.zerohedge.com/health/leaked-covid-19-documents-hospitals-prep-96-million-infections-480k-deaths

    For those unfamiliar with the University of Nebraska Medical Center, there is a documentary on YT about the 10 years of preparation and practice they underwent for the containment of infectious diseases.  They are considered the premiere infectious control hospital in the USA and this is why the first Ebola patients were quarantined there as well as the first COVID-19 cases.

     

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 6:09pm

    #66
    westcoastjan

    westcoastjan

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Jun 04 2012

    Posts: 438

    Wow, just wow! Ben Hunt article

    Don’t Test, Don’t Tell (10 Days Later)

    It’s not that testing was not available. It’s that testing was not ALLOWED.

    This is “Don’t Test, Don’t Tell” and it is the single most incompetent, corrupt public health policy of my lifetime.

    But wait, there’s more. It’s not only this patient who was directly harmed by Don’t Test, Don’t Tell.

    This is beyond mind-boggling ...

    Chris is right - BOOM is baked in; and to further paraphrase him, it did not have to be this way. OMG

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 6:46pm

    Quercus bicolor

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Mar 19 2008

    Posts: 347

    my communications: results

    Sports banquet organizer: no response.

    Non-profit board: We're meeting online with zoom!  Yay!

    School superintendent: no response.  He's probably very busy.  I'll call tomorrow.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 7:22pm

    LA

    LA

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 07 2020

    Posts: 3

    Letter to Superintendent

    I’d love to see your letter. Was just about to draft one of my own to our school superintendent and was struggling. I thought your other two letters were great, so hopefully he will give permission to share.

    Speaking of letters. Chris, the letter to POTUS is probably the best I’ve seen!

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 7:25pm

    #69
    Mohammed Mast

    Mohammed Mast

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: May 17 2017

    Posts: 623

    The environment

    Something I have noticed here and elsewhere is that the entire environmental movement has been hijacked by the climate change narrative. There are lots of issues in the environment that get barely a mention anymore.

    What is particularly striking is the absence of discussion of the environment here where the entire premise is based on the three E's. Maybe it should be 2 E's and a C (climate)

    I get the fact that most here are gold bugs but the discussion with Rubino brought something home for me, and that is the destruction of the environment to extract gold. The advice to invest in miners goes against conscientious green investing. Clearly Rubino is unaware of the wholistic focus of the Crash Course. It appears of the three E's the environment is the redheaded step child. Once again money trumps the earth

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 7:36pm

    sunguy

    sunguy

    Status: Member

    Joined: May 22 2012

    Posts: 25

    Glass jars block UV

    Remember, you can't get a tan thru a glass window?

    Glass seriously absorbs UV. That's why UV lenses, instrument windows, etc. must be , I think , made of quartz.

    Putting a mask in a glass jar would exclude the UV in the sunlight. A plastic baggie, I think, would pass it OK.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 7:37pm

    Blueberry

    Blueberry

    Status: Member

    Joined: Aug 07 2013

    Posts: 9

    Re Susan's Lysol Spray

    I wouldn't want to use Lysol on my hands due to the chemical ingredients. I keep a spray bottle of 70% alcohol in my car and some hand wipes.  I spray the alcohol liberally,  rub it around with special attention to the fingers, maybe spray a little more and then let my hands fully air dry.  The hand wipes are because  the alcohol ironically leaves my hands feeling like they aren't clean.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 7:45pm

    #72

    AKGrannyWGrit

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Feb 06 2011

    Posts: 1019

    Re - Susan

    I would not use Lysol on my hands either.

    Perhaps 90% alcohol and mix with Corn Huskers lotion?

    AKGranny

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 7:52pm

    LesPhelps

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Apr 30 2009

    Posts: 626

    The environment

    IMHO, your charge is valid, but your aim is off.  It is not Peak Prosperity that is obsessed with climate change to the exclusion of the environment, it is all of Western Civilization.  I've been making that point for years.  Rarely are the other catastrophic problems being created by overpopulation paid more than lip service, due to the focus on climate.  What you see at Peak Prosperity is simply a reflection of the focus of the society of which Peak Prosperity is only a subset.

    BTW, I agree about mining, but I'm not sure it would make my top ten list, definitely not my top five, when it comes to the damage we are doing.  It's definitely behind animal agriculture, deforestation, land water and ocean pollution and the sixth mass extinction, to name a few.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 7:52pm

    #74

    Quercus bicolor

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Mar 19 2008

    Posts: 347

    Paper predicting ICU and ventilator requirements in a pandemic

    This paper is worth reading and thinking about.  The worst scenario it models (30% of population infected, case fatality rate of 0.25-0.5%) shows that peak ICU bed demand will equal the entire ~100K beds in the US, leaving no room for the current occupants that typically keep ICUs at > 50% capacity.  They report that ventilator demand will likely exceed supply at the pandemic peak, even without accounting for the availability of sufficient staff and supplies the ventilated patients will need as well as adequate allocation of ventilators by region.  Of course the worst case scenario appears to be quite conservative when considering the current situation with a CFR possibly in the several percent range and an infection rate of up to 60%.

    This underscores the importance to non-pharmaceutical interventions to slow the spread of the disease in order to reduce peak demands.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 7:59pm

    #75
    Nairobi

    Nairobi

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Feb 05 2020

    Posts: 289

    Don't throw away your old books

    I just read that Wikipedia is rewriting history and has seriously altered the numbers of victims of the Spanish Flu on its webpages. I had been aware of this happening in the past with regards to political people and historical events that were hotly debated (such as 911 for example and the tower 7 debate). But this new historical revisionism seems to be taking things to another level as the case fatality rate of that past pandemic has been dropped dramatically at that site using World Health Organization data. At this point we do need to question everything that is being stored online since it can be changed at a whim and may not ever be restored to its original form. So keep your old books, encyclopedias and reference manuals as those are the only reliable materials available that cannot be arbitrarily changed by corrupt organizations (like WHO) after the fact. And maybe think twice before posting links that come from sources we may now deem to be unreliable. Like Wikipedia. I only wish there was a good alternative. You can read the story here
    Wikipedia Slashes Spanish Flu Death Rate
    https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/wikipedia-slashes-spanish-flu-death-rate

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 8:15pm

    #76

    dtrammel

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: May 03 2011

    Posts: 799

    DIY Mask Idea

    Chris in a comment a while back, suggested making emergency masks from the type of sanitation pads used to put under bed ridden people to catch urine or body fluids (or puppy pads). I tried a few experiments today and the water proof layer on them, to prevent wetness from soiling the mattress is very, very hard to pull air thru.

    Tonight after watching today's video I happened to spot this DIY mask video from Canadian Prepper

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K-HRVrwxw9k

    His suggestion is furnace filters, in particular the higher end ones with a PR rating of at least 1900.

    The video has a few ideas but I think the one that would most work, would be the yoga pants under stocking (watch the video). You could then lay a layer of the filter material over it, and then put a second yoga stocking over that to keep the filter material in place.

    Be a bit hard to breath through but we knew any DIY option would be. Both furnace filters and yoga pants (or panty hose) are available now and might continue to be in the next few weeks.

    You could easily remove them at the door, then put all the material into a disinfecting bath (probably alcohol or hydrogen peroxide, since bleach is an inhalation risk) or in fact just wash the yoga stocking in the washer, and dry, while putting the filter material into a plastic bag and quarantine for 9 days.

    Something to consider.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 8:16pm

    Mohammed Mast

    Mohammed Mast

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: May 17 2017

    Posts: 623

    Well Les

    Perhaps I am missing something in the focus of the posts here on PP. I don't see much if anything posted by the owners except the climate. Maybe my eyes are bad resulting in bad aim. Maybe you could direct me to some of those environmental posts?

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 8:18pm

    #78

    Barbara

    Status: Member

    Joined: Dec 15 2009

    Posts: 159

    Recovery information from earlier US Cases

    UW reported on their first patient (now have 2) and others who are listed as fully recovered.

    https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/amid-growing-coronavirus-cases-another-number-increasing-recoveries-n1148126

     

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 8:30pm

    #79
    Tom Sammy

    Tom Sammy

    Status: Member

    Joined: Jan 30 2020

    Posts: 135

    Sports teams in US

    Overseas they are playing soccer matches with no fans, some US sports are taking notice but most are complacent.

    Take for example the arena used for the NBAs Cleveland Cavaliers and Monsters Hockey team.  Even though the state of OHIO has recommended that indoor sports be cancelled or played without fans they said “thanks for the advice but we’re proceeding as normal”. “We’ve got a state of the art air handler and cleaner”  Money over lives, pathetic.....

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 8:32pm

    westcoastjan

    westcoastjan

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Jun 04 2012

    Posts: 438

    Check the archives and be your own problem solver/site explorer

    There are A LOT of new people on this site the last two months. While the current focus is heavily on this virus, and rightly so given the seriousness, there are extensive archives on all manner of topics that have been seriously discussed and debated since the sites inception.

    It would be great if newer members could do some exploring on their own to first really see what this site is all about before voicing judgments. Please don't rely on the site administrators or long time members to keep pointing you in the right direction - be your own problem solver/explorer. Curiosity is an overlooked virtue! Navigation is not hard within the forums, so please take a look before voicing criticisms about lack of topic emphasis or, as others have suggested, a lack of astuteness in certain matters. There is a lot more here than meets the eye, and a whack of really smart people who are more than astute. Jumping to conclusions about site information breadth and depth is inappropriate if you have not taken adequate time to explore first.

    Jan

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 8:37pm

    #81
    Nairobi

    Nairobi

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Feb 05 2020

    Posts: 289

    Technically speaking, market worries may be overblown

    Insofar as the markets are concerned my own review is still pointing to the Dow recovering all its losses thus far and returning back to prior highs seen in February of 29550 and slightly exceeding them. So a full retrace in other words however the next period of caution will come at the beginning of May where another strong decline should get underway. There is going to be a period of tremendous volatility which should just be expected under our current circumstances but I have ruled out these current declines as being a permanent feature where markets just keep falling a'la 1929 or some other dangerous sounding wipe out of equity wealth that takes decades to recover from. That is not to say that the market decline from May onward won't be equally dramatic as what we have just seen. I am just saying that there are more innings in this game and we can assess again after that time and also that the market (and the economy for that matter) is much stronger than some people are giving it credit for despite the Corona virus interrupting business temporarily.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 8:41pm

    #82

    Quercus bicolor

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Mar 19 2008

    Posts: 347

    On the ground report from Northern Italy - The time for urgent action is now.

    From a doctor working in the epicenter:

    https://mobile.twitter.com/jasonvanschoor/status/1237142891077697538

    Hospitals are at 200% capacity.  Many patients who need ventilators only have access to an oxygen mask. Non-coronavirus emergencies are diverted or not treated.  Patients over 65 years old or younger if they have comorbidities are not even assessed, much less intubated.  They are basically left to die or by some miracle recover with oxygen and whatever care can be delivered.  Read the twitter thread.  It says it better than I did and there is a link to an Italian TV news report that probably has good information if you understand Italian (or maybe can find it on youtube with subtitles).

    This is what an overwhelmed hospital system looks like.  The very high death rate of 6% in Italy is almost certainly due to this.  Since so many infections there are recent and have not progressed to serious or critical yet, the death rate will likely increase.  Northern Italy is probably our best clue as to what really happened in Wuhan.

    Think about all of the people you know who would be left to die if/when this happens where you live - not because of lack of compassion, but because there will be no better choice if we get into such a predicament.  Everyone, please let's to everything we can to influence those around us to help slow the spread of this infection, lower the peak and save hundreds of thousands of lives.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 8:47pm

    SagerXX

    Status: Gold Member

    Joined: Feb 11 2009

    Posts: 451

    Jim H -- old timers unite!

    Even DIAP has been sighted here recently.  Hey Dogs!  Whutup?!?

    It was still CM.com, man -- I think it was the year after the crash, so '09 or '10, that you and I met at the conference in New Paltz.  It was so good to talk to reasonable people who believed as I did.

    I'm dating a woman right now who built a medicinal mushrooms biz on the mainland and sold it a couple years back.  She's the one who got me the fresh cordyceps, but now I'm taking the supply issue into my own hands.

    Good for you to get at least to WA.  New Rochelle just isn't that far from our old stomping grounds in Briarcliff Manor.

    Here's to our safety, and for our families, and the larger PP fam too!

    VIVA -- Sager

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 8:55pm

    LesPhelps

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Apr 30 2009

    Posts: 626

    Not my point

    What I was saying is that our whole society, including Peak Prosperity is climate change obsessed.  Obsession limits time for other things and narrows your focus.

    All I said was don’t blame PP for being any more climate change obsessed than the rest of society.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 8:58pm

    MKI

    MKI

    Status: Member

    Joined: Jan 12 2009

    Posts: 189

    Stock picking

    ao, I have zero skill at picking stocks. The pub IQ Trends has been playing the blue-chip game since 1966; holding ~20 undervalued, A-quality dividend-paying stocks an average of 3-5 years based upon the usual metrics. I recommend it. Very boring. It matches the market over time just without the wild swings up or down (makes sense as half of profits come from dividends) and it's all about "cash flow" versus "the market".

    But I can't just name my "top 10 stocks"; I currently have about 25 (I think EV, CMI, BP, SLB, XOM, BEN, IBM, TXN, UNH, PFE, SVS, KO, LOW, CWCO, WMT, TJX, TGT, AXP, TROW, BA, EMR, UNP) & many I bought recently because they got hammered, and many are overvalued now and I'm about to dump them & cash in. No skill, just dull work. They are just the cleanest shirts in a very dirty laundry pile. I much prefer local business or houses I can see, but I'm mostly too lazy/stupid to do much there.

    One of the strange things over the last 30 years has been how index funds drive up the "market" of garbage and nobody cares what is "in there" anymore. Many of these stock make no cash! There really is no "market", just a bunch of stocks, many making money (ROIC) and paying dividends, and many just raw speculation. But one can still buy individual stocks that make money and avoid the "market".

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 9:04pm

    LesPhelps

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Apr 30 2009

    Posts: 626

    How do you do that?

    Everyone, please let’s do everything we can to influence those around us to help slow the spread of this infection, lower the peak and save hundreds of thousands of lives.

    We have told friends about what is going on worldwide.  Without exception, so far, they have chosen not to alter their lives, even a little.  We try to make mostly rational decisions.  Those around us make emotional decisions.

    Mostly, our friends are worried about us.  They think we are overreacting.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 9:05pm

    #87

    dtrammel

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: May 03 2011

    Posts: 799

    Nice Chart

    Really hits home exponential growth. Note it is in logarithmic scale (10, 100, 1000)

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 9:30pm

    #88
    vshelford

    vshelford

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jul 13 2014

    Posts: 143

    How long does it last on soft (fabric) surfaces???

    I am wondering about keeping our car seats clean.  If I get it on my clothes, then use the car, is there any way of periodically cleaning the seats?  Spraying with bleach would do it, but also probably break down the cover pretty quickly.   I suppose we could cover the seats with old sheets and then launder them, so maybe I've answered that one, but is there any data on how long it lingers?  Everyone talks about hard surfaces, not soft ones.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 9:31pm

    #89

    dtrammel

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: May 03 2011

    Posts: 799

    Spam and What To Do

    Several people have noted the obvious spam in post 26 here. Instead of going WTF? a simple action that even a few people can do is go to your mail here, and PM Adam Taggart with the title of SPAM and the link to the post. You can copy that if you put your mouse over the post # (in this case #26) and then hit "Control + V". Paste that url (Control +C) into your PM to Adam.

    If 4-5 of us do this, he will notice in all of the PMs he is getting. Then he can delete the post in a timely manner.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 9:34pm

    dtrammel

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: May 03 2011

    Posts: 799

    Softer Material = Less Active Time

    As I understand it from my reading vshelford, the virus droplets live for less time on soft materials. The material probably wicks away the moisture and then cracks the coating to allow air to kill the virus.

    Sorry I don't have a link to that fact though. Too many posts and papers I have read.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 9:54pm

    BonnieB2A

    BonnieB2A

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 25 2020

    Posts: 34

    Historical revisionism via digital media....

    For this reason I’ve become a book buyer, especially antique books on American History.  It looks like I’ll need to get some into the 1930s to include the ‘Spanish Flu’ too.  Thank you for that heads-up.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 10:03pm

    Adam Taggart

    Status: Platinum Member

    Joined: May 25 2009

    Posts: 4938

    Spam deleted

    Thanks for flagging folks. Spam post deleted.

    cheers,

    A

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 10:10pm

    #93

    dtrammel

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: May 03 2011

    Posts: 799

    Self Diagnosing Covid19

    Of all places the Weather Channel has a nice article showing the different symptoms of the Flu, Alergies and Covid19. Might help you if you get sick and freak out thinking you have Covid and you just have the flu.

    https://weather.com/health/cold-flu/news/2020-03-10-difference-between-coronavirus-flu-allergies-symptoms

    BTW, buy a thermometer and an oximeter, which for $20 can give you your blood oxygen level. A big indicator of Covid19 is a decrease in blood oxygen levels as it attacks your lungs. Establish a baseline, then if you feel sick, begin to document your temp and O2 every 4-6 hours. If you get a fever over 101 or a O2 level of 92% or less, immediately go to the doctor.

    Oximeter Amazon listing

    https://www.amazon.com/s?k=oximeter+finger+with+pulse&crid=10NKYOFARR4T8&sprefix=oximeter%2Caps%2C179&ref=nb_sb_ss_i_3_8

     

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 10:21pm

    #94

    dtrammel

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: May 03 2011

    Posts: 799

    Spill Over Effects

    There's been alot of hair splitting here about the CFR of Covid19, is some cases to try and minimize the disruption this virus is going to cause.

    Personally I don't care if this virus causes 1, 2, or 3.4 people to die per hundred people. What I do worry about is the spillover effect that first the deaths, then the ill (10-15% of total infected) AND the effect of the worry that a family member will get this virus, is going to cause the economy. It doesn't take many people to stay home in fear to have a profound effect.

    "Ironically, the officials now urging citizens to keep calm understand far more acutely than the general public how much else can go wrong. A municipal police chief in the Boston area recently urged me to imagine that a school district closed for even three weeks. Take just one child, raised by a single parent who is a police officer. The child is home, so the parent must stay home. Other officers in the same patrol will be affected even if they don’t have kids in school. Shifts will change, nonessential functions will be put off, and the department will have less flexibility to respond to problems unrelated to the epidemic—even as, with more teens unsupervised, rates of car accidents and certain crimes could well increase.

    Emergency-response officials are hesitant to play out these dangers in public. This police chief asked me not to identify him because, like so many others in positions of responsibility, he worries that misgivings like his will become self-fulfilling prophecies—that citizens will panic if their local authorities give voice to their own doubts."

    https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2020/03/us-isnt-ready-whats-about-happen/607636/

    Imagine just 5% of your business' workforce not showing up. How would that effect you and your company. Imagine 10%, imagine 15%.

    People don't have to die to have a profound effect.

    Though the sick who don't are going to bury the hospital system.

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 10:40pm

    #95

    dtrammel

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: May 03 2011

    Posts: 799

    Someone Said Snorkel Masks?

    If you could figure a way to put a HEPA filter in the tubes this would be so cool to wear to my local grocery store, lol.

    mask

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 10:59pm

    #96

    dtrammel

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: May 03 2011

    Posts: 799

    Gotta Love The Ingenuity Of Children

    School administrators gave homework out to students using an app. Kids figured out if the app got enough 1 star ratings it would be removed from the App store, lol.

    https://www.theverge.com/2020/3/9/21171495/wuhan-students-dingtalk-hooky-nyc-columbia-princeton-app-store-reviews

    BTW, WTF is up with the image in the article? LOL, "He's dead Jim!"

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 11:09pm

    #97
    Geedard

    Geedard

    Status: Member

    Joined: Oct 13 2014

    Posts: 63

    Italian doctor calmly speaks out - watch video - tells it like it is in N Italy

    This is a great video and perhaps the closest and most believable truth we’re going to hear. Italian doctor calmly speaking out. He is the network controller for the ICU (Intensive Care Unit) beds in N Italy. Says coronavirus worse than a bomb (in terms of its impact to the healthcare system and cascading effects). Very worth to watch.

     

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 11:20pm

    gyrogearloose

    Status: Gold Member

    Joined: Sep 08 2008

    Posts: 415

    mask reuse

    From memory normal glass absorbs most UV.....

    and UV is what dose the sterilizing

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  • Tue, Mar 10, 2020 - 11:23pm

    gyrogearloose

    Status: Gold Member

    Joined: Sep 08 2008

    Posts: 415

    4.5 m transmission paper retracted

    Went to send the link on but the article noted at the top that the paper had been retracted with no reason given

     

    I was skeptical about the claim it stayed in the air for 30 min to infect a passenger that got on after spreader got off, and thought contact from surface more likely,  But time will tell

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 2:03am

    Desogames

    Desogames

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 03 2020

    Posts: 210

    Remember wehn i said prepare for loss

    I made that post a while ago. But it's worth mentioning again after watching Chris's latest video (as well as the disaster news coming out of Italy).

    The numbers are simply too large to not affect somebody *you* know. And yes, i do mean you as in every single person reading this. With how infectious this is and how little the west does to spread it, it is guaranteed a lot of people will be infected by this.

    80% might be mild but that means 20% is not and is going to have a very bad experience. This will affect them as a person, which in turn, affects your relationship with these people. I'm noticing that myself... i've got such extreme anger now to those who won't believe me, simply as a defense mechanism. Attack any threats.

    I was prepared for the virus... but i wasn't prepared to be left on the street to die because of disbelief. I wasn't prepared for how stubborn people i love so much would be, essentially barreling towards their own demise, and seemingly speeding up the more i protest.

    The time to prepare for the virus is over. It's here. The time to prepare what the virus will do is now.

    In case you where wondering. The preparing never stops. There's only one silver lining to all of this; preparing for loss is the worst stage. Once we arrive at it, we prepare for things to get back to normal again. After all being prepared means you suffer the bad before everybody else... but it also means you get to see the light at the end of the tunnel before everybody else. Which'll help those who can't pull through.

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 2:31am

    Janez

    Janez

    Status: Member

    Joined: Mar 11 2020

    Posts: 6

    Coronavirus in Elevators - anybody talking about it ?

    There was a presentation of  Chinese bus infection study on Dr. Campbell video
    Wouldn't then the whole bus got sick ?

    Why only two passengers (in case the bus wasn't empty) ?

    Does it mean that using elevators or even climbing stairs is extremely risky if there was an infected person there before ?

    I am sure there are plenty high rises with elevators in Wuhan.

    Clusters ?

    Would that make a rush hour in a busy office tower killing fields ?

    p.s.
    gyrogearloose - could you post the link pls anyway

     

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 4:02am

    planfortomorrow

    planfortomorrow

    Status: Member

    Joined: Dec 28 2017

    Posts: 116

    Why not...

    have all person's over 65 voluntarily remove themselves from all outside activities for a period of 30 days. Then allow the rest of the population go about their normal schedules. The ones that get really sick get treated, the rest deal with their runny noses, small fevers, aches and pains but work. Everyone wears a mask, home made is better than nothing. Wash hands a lot and have a anti bacterial bottle hand sanitizer on our person. Eyewear is worn also, especially at work. Productivity stays relatively high, supply chains are basically uninterrupted, and eventually virus hits those by chance and then the Virus just burns itself out. For those secondary reinfections we just take extreme cautions to Not get it the second time. My goodness, everyone usually goes to work when having the flu and for just a couple of days does the flu really hit us and we can't work. It sounds like this Coronavirus is a mild case of the flu (I know it is worse than the flu). The reason I even write this is because nothing has been done properly except for Singapore. We know it isn't a killer Virus where you catch it, are bleeding out of every oraface and are dead within 12 hours as was the case with the Spanish Flu. This Virus is a mild strain of the flu, it doesn't seem to kill extreme numbers of people and it seems when you get it, it isn't so bad that most could still just work. Instead, we don't test, haven't been ahead of the Virus at all and are reacting like if we don't adopt a strict daily exercise that the entire population will die. I say lets just stay at work, avoid close contact and monitor our safety precautions while at work. Why not?!!!! This Virus seems to be a game of chance, and we have no control over it except to try not and catch it by mask, eyewear and washing hands. Why are we ready to ruin everything when it isn't a true monster like the Spanish Flu. Why not!????

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 4:48am

    Chris Martenson

    Chris Martenson

    Status: Platinum Member

    Joined: Jun 07 2007

    Posts: 5196

    Re; Homemade Hand Sanitizer

    My understanding is that you need to use the 99% isopropyl alcohol. The end product needs to have 60-70% alcohol content so you would mix 2/3 alcohol with 1/3 aloe vera to bring the alcohol down to 66%. You cannot use standard 70% isopropyl alcohol because mixing it with the aloe vera will bring the alcohol below the effective range.

    This is absolutely correct.

    If all you've got is 70% isopropyl, then use it full strength.

    Anything below 61% and the protein denaturing activity drops off a cliff.

     

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 5:00am

    AssessX

    AssessX

    Status: Member

    Joined: Mar 04 2020

    Posts: 20

    1st Amendmnet then the 2nd Amendment - BEWARE!!

    First, thank you to Chris and his entire team for their heroic efforts to educate and inform all of us! Simply amazing work and an unbridled commitment to clarity and truth!

    Second, those of you paying attention will have noticed the change in tone and format that has ocurred in Chris and Adam's presentations in the last few days.

    I'm going to hypothesize that PP has been warned to reduce the truth being told here and to stick to their business of advising on wealth building. They are most likely also being held to a gag order about the control being imposed on them.

    No one from PP will be able to comment honestly on this post, but I believe we are seeing direct infringement of their 1st Amendment Rights. Every American is at risk of being denied our Constitutional rights. The erosion of our rights will be very difficult to reverse! Beware!!! Beyond the clinical and economic impact of this pandemic may lie a much more sinister and ultimately fatal blow to our fundamental Constitutional guarantees.

    We are all in danger.

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 5:30am

    Chris Martenson

    Chris Martenson

    Status: Platinum Member

    Joined: Jun 07 2007

    Posts: 5196

    Links in my Videos for March 9 and 10

    I've inadvertently caused too many cases of writers cramp as people scribbled down the URLs of the links I provided in my videos.

    I will start posting them with the videos.

    For now, here's the last two days worth (feel free to copy paste to other forum areas where they might be requested/needed so people can see them):

    March 10 Links:

    https://gov.texas.gov/news/post/governor-abbott-dshs-announce-statewide-testing-capabilities-for-coronavirus

    https://www.who.int/news-room/q-a-detail/q-a-coronaviruses

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-03-09/travel-companies-pull-forecasts-italy-extends-ban-virus-update

    March 9 Links:

    https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0060343

    People ‘shed’ high levels of coronavirus, study finds, but most are likely not infectious after recovery begins

    https://www.corriere.it/cronache/20_marzo_07/coronavirus-stiamo-creando-terapie-intensive-anche-corridoi-cb01190a-60be-11ea-8d61-438e0a276fc4.shtml

    https://www.kmov.com/news/st-louis-county-coronavirus-family-attends-villa-duchesne-dance/article_41ec34a4-6179-11ea-b3e3-6fbf809e7778.html

    https://www.redbubble.com/people/jakestollery/works/45647401-case-case-case?asc=u

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 5:49am

    Quercus bicolor

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Mar 19 2008

    Posts: 347

    What to do

    I'm creating a narrative based on Italy.  Italy is clearly in overwhelm.  Here is the data:

    Note that 75% of cases were diagnosed since March 3.

    Note that the death rate is 6.2% (631/10149). Also notice the surge in deaths starting March 8.

    Now to the twitter thread I linked to last night that clearly indicates hospital overwhelm and strongly points to the likelihood that that surge in deaths is due to triage of respirators: denying respirators to the old and already sick who are least likely to be helped so that all of those with the best chance of being helped receive one.

    Finally to a paper that explores the impact of ICU bed and respirator availability on pandemic deaths in the US.  Their worst case scenario is at least a bit conservative for coronavirus.

    Finally, a link to number of hospital beds per 1000 people in the US and Italy. 13% fewer beds per thousand in the US.

    I did convince a nonprofit board of mostly older folks to host our monthly meeting online tonight instead of in person.  There is actually discussion about go vs. no go for our summer programs (250 kids a week for 15 hours a week for 6 weeks all outside).  It was easy.  I just brought it up and mentioned the higher death rates for those over 60.

    I've also written my school superintendent (no response although we had a productive conversation on Friday - calling him in a few minutes) and an organizer of the indoor track sports banquet (no response).

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 5:58am

    Quercus bicolor

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Mar 19 2008

    Posts: 347

    estimate on appendicitis rates during hospital overwhelm

    Published rates for US: 100 per 100,000 people per year - a bit higher in Europe.  In Italy's Lombardy region with about 10 million people, that's 10,000 per year or 30/day.  How many of them are dying right now?  How many other people with medical emergencies are dying?

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 6:13am

    Mohammed Mast

    Mohammed Mast

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: May 17 2017

    Posts: 623

    Not my point Les

    You missed my point. So I will try to explain it. BTW clearly there are people here who jump to attack any criticism of this site. Unfortunately that is a rather immature reaction. Valid criticism is actually necessary to ensure that whatever is being criticized is being capable of not only maintaining a high standard but actually getting better.

    It is irrelevant to me whether the society at large is consumed with the climate narrative to the exclusion of other environmental issues. My point is that it would seem logical that one would apply the principles of the all three E's when discussing any one of them. After all they are supposed to be interrelated.

    It was clear to me that Rubino did not consider the interrelatedness of the three E's and I don't even know if he is aware of that premise or cares. Being focused solely on precious metals he suggested investing in mining companies. Now for you that might be on the top of your list of dirty industries to invest in, or even in your top ten worst. That is irrelevant. It is a very dirty industry nonetheless even if it is not as dirty as some others. I don't think it belongs in an ethical (green) portfolio. At some point it is necessary to examine closely our actions and their effects on the environment. Thus while owning pm's is prudent from an economic point of view (as well as owning stock in a mining company) it comes at a steep environmental cost. A more socially responsible investment might be investing in Fungi Perfect. The fact that in this entire thread I am the only one raising the issue only makes my point more apt.

    Here is a link you and others may or may not find of interest.

    https://earthworks.org/campaigns/no-dirty-gold/impacts/

    Fyi it would be a mistake to judge anyone's ability or right to criticize anything here based on how long it might appear from the date they joined the site. Many myself included have lurked here for many years and only joined to engage in the conversations. See you on the other side hopefully

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 6:19am

    Quercus bicolor

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Mar 19 2008

    Posts: 347

    Flights from Milan to JFK and Newark

    https://flightaware.com/live/findflight?origin=LIMC&destination=ZNY

    There are currently 3 flights that should have departed already, but are still listed as "scheduled".

    Yesterday, only the Emirates flight actually landed in New York.  Maybe it too will be cancelled today?  Two weeks too late is better than nothing, but not by much.

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 6:29am

    Desogames

    Desogames

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 03 2020

    Posts: 210

    For those not used to communication via PC

    I've done nothing but talk online to people via computers for 20 years now. So if anybody is looking to continue lessons or contact or whatever via the PC, i've got a few ideas on how to.

    Currently, the most popular app is Discord. It allows you to make a server (for free) and then share a link with people (for free). You can make channels, assign permissions/roles, chat with people over voice or via one of the text channels, you can *even* stream your desktop to people in the server these days, though that does require a good connection to yknow, stream your desktop. It's a good place to have a "live" community. It's taken over the desktop voice market quite rapidly and is now the most used app for communication for gamers (especially world of warcraft, haven't connected to a teamspeak for a while). Especially to keep schools going during long periods of lockdown i'd take a look at that one first.

    For a more dedicated talking program that focuses on speech online, both Teamspeak and Ventrillo are the old guard here. Mumble is a freeware alternative that i've used with a World of Warcraft raiding guild for a long time. Obviously, no extra frills here, just voice chat. But a very well done voice chat even with options to set up a cross channel talk/command structure (i used Teamspeak in a militarized gaming tournament a decade and a half ago called 21st century warfare).

    Ofcourse there's Skype for person to person video calling, that'd be the known one. Though programs like Line might be more popular these days amongst the mobile phone crowd. Which program is used varies *highly* per country in that area.

    Then there's streaming, via Twitch (amazon), Mixer (microsoft) or Youtube (google) streaming. This would be more useful for trying to reach larger audiences, as streaming via Discord puts a very heavy strain on your connection while doing it via the streaming services means you just upload to them, everybody else watches it from the site's connection. Even if 10 teachers are sick, as long as they all teach the same subject, one is enough to reach hundreds.

    While streaming might've started for just gamers, Twitch has many many catagories now that are seperate from gaming. Just Chatting (or IRL) is the most famous example (actually 3rd highest watched catagory on twitch right now), but also for example the Art catagory (6k+ viewers) or Podcasts(5k plus). Music got split up into multiple catagories not too long ago. Yes, you can earn money via the platform, many try, but that is not a requirement. You can stream for free just as well. If you're interested in streaming yourself as a past time a good place to start is Streamlabs and their streamlabs OBS client. It's the least amount of hassle to set up and get going (and you can always "upgrade" to normal OBS with plugins later).

    Don't expect any additional income. Building a community takes ages. However if you already have a community to carry over (virtually all the succesful streamers are that way cause they carry over a community from other social media) it's a good way to do like a weekly podcast or whatever and earn a bit of income on the side from that. Hell if Chris where to do a livestream AMA on youtube live streaming to just awnser questions live that might've been posed 15 videos ago and nobody got time to watch all of that (as well as situations that might've changed since then); one stream could probably fund this site for a month. Me, i tried for 11 months, never missed a day, got an average of 5 viewers. Not very economical. Not to mention don't expect donations considering everybody's going to tighten the ol' belt in a depression. But, it is still a past time to do when there's nothing left to do.

    As far as entertainment goes; While there's many online stores, Steam remains king of digital distribution. Obviously, many games, but there's software and movies on the platform as well (though the offering is still mediocre). Their service is the best, having many features such as the recently revised Remote Play, allowing you to play couch co-op games across the internet! Though if you wanna support good devs as well as play some nostalgic older games, GOG is a very good alternative. Their new galaxy 2.0 client certainly gives steam a run for it's money.

    Of course there are many streaming services now such as Netflix, Amazon prime video and Disney+, so watching stuff isn't going to be much of an issue.

    That's pretty much it for the digital illiterate 😀 There is *so much* digital entertainment on here you could be in lockdown for a decade and not even come close to running out of everything that's been produced so far.

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 7:10am

    Quercus bicolor

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Mar 19 2008

    Posts: 347

    re: gold mining and environment

    I went to exactly the same place in my mind as you did Mohammed when Rubino mentioned miners.  From a short term and personal perspective, investing in miners might be a responsible thing to do.  But it is absolutely unjustified from a whole systems perspective.  We are just a part of this hugely complex global biosphere.  There are millions of other species and not one of them cares about gold other than that it stays in the ground in order to preserve the intact, clean ecosystems they need to survive.  We humans and our games are not so important.

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 7:54am

    ddelong

    ddelong

    Status: Member

    Joined: Jan 20 2015

    Posts: 35

    Add another State to the list

    Two locally tested and yet to be CDC confirmed cases of COVID-19 have been reported in two of the counties that comprise the metropolitan Detroit, Michigan area.  Both are middle aged, one (Oakland County woman) had recent international travel and the other (Wayne County man) had recent domestic travel.  They are both currently hospitalized and their exact condition is not being shared.

    Well, locally my red line is really close to being triggered.  More so if they eventually release their city of residency.  I have upped my anti-oxidant game from my daily winter base to what I would normally take for a cold/flu.  And will up again if anything makes me think I have it or someone in close proximity has COVID-19.  Unfortunately, I doubt I will be able to work remotely.  Hardass old school management that doesn't think your working unless they see you working even though they see emails from all of the heavy hitters from 6 AM to 10PM everyday.

    Still taking my upcoming vacation.  Was going to Florida but cancelled due to my Father in Law's cancer situation, actually thankful for that, I hope his hospice care allows him to go peacefully and not need to deal with this virus in his final days.  We have already decided to not have a funeral gathering immediately and will do so when it is more appropriate for a gathering.  More like a delayed wake.

    I will use the vacation time to get my spring garden starts going (I love Spring), other projects, make a trip to farm to upgrade preps there as well (Not Base Preps but contingency preps to existing preps, I always try to make incremental improvements where I can).  Hopefully, in a couple weeks remote work may be a possibility from home or the farm.

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 8:04am

    Xango

    Xango

    Status: Member

    Joined: Aug 27 2013

    Posts: 7

    Xango said:

    I love your post Mohammed Mast.  Not only the importance of green investing and consideration of environmental impacts, but also for pointing out the tendency of some on this site to jump on people for not being frequent posters.  I too have commented and immediately been labeled a troll even though a long time paying member.  It's OK to lurk and only occasionally post.  For me, I recognize that I'm not a great writer but I still can gain a lot of insight from reading posts from the generally intelligent and eloquent posters.

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 8:06am

    Desogames

    Desogames

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 03 2020

    Posts: 210

    On the subject of money.

    Some people say only gold is "real money", or that silver isn't because now it's an "Industrial metal". Don't be fooled. The LONGEST running system of currency, and thus the most successful, is wood.

    Simple sticks. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tally_stick

    Turns out all you really need for something to be money, is verification. Nothing else seems to really matter that much. Really the paper you carry doesn't matter, it's just something material to grab hold onto and paper's reeeaalllly cheap. What matters is the Serial Number printed on that paper so that paper can be verified as being legitimate. Same thing for coins; ever wondered why they have the shape that they do?

    Can gold also be not-money? Why yes it can! When the government says it isn't. That's all it takes; ban all transactions in gold and ban private ownership of gold. Then it ceases to be currency immediately. Note that Money/Currency and Store of Value are not the same things.

    Now it's still a good store of value. But that only comes from people appreciating something shiny, equally, over a very long period of time (AKA, humans don't really change that much). Right now in Australia, toilet paper is actually functioning as a currency. If you really want a stable currency (only verification is needed for a currency, but for a >stable< currency, you need a few more rules), for something to be money it simply needs:

    1. To be verifiable by authority (yes, we could see counterfit/serialized toiletpaper, called the US dollar (OH SNAP)),
    2. To be plentiful to offer liquidity yet scarce enough to offer a store of value (while new batches are made and stocks are resupplied, toilet paper fits this bill).
    3. To be desired by the populace (check on that one)
    4. To have an external use aside from currency (to tie the currency to the real world economy, where production and use help determine value)(100% check on that one).

    Note the dollar fails that last test after it's seperation from gold and thus, hasn't been a stable currency since then. While sticks *do* pass that test funnily enough.

    Video games offer us a good insight in this. Maaaaany papers have been written about ingame economies and events that happened in various games that changed our understanding of economics in general, because each game is it's own microcosm. For any would be economist that's worth a good afternoon of looking into at the very least.

    I have personal experience in this when i was playing a game called Redmoon, an MMO released in South Korea in 1998 (played it for 3 years on US servers). It had a top level of 1000 and just 6 quests, everything else was a grind (ah the good ol' days) in a Diablo-esque game that had a tick-rate (so the positions of all monsters would update) of 1 per second. Needless to say, it was quite comical to see everything move. You also always made sure you could survive at least 1 hit of the strongest monster in an area of the map because of the lag 😀

    In any case, because the top level was so high, and of course monsters dropped gold, gold had become pretty useless pretty quick. You could always find some high level dropping millions around the starting area. Didn't help that the concept of gold sinks wasn't really invented yet. There was player to player trade, but it hardly ever involved gold. If it did, somebody would ask 2-4 billion for a crap legendary to supply his food costs for a while (pretty much the only thing that cost gold, was food/drinks which instantly restored health/mana).

    However, somewhere down the line they decided to add these items called -Dynes. These things had names such as AdrenelDyne or something silly, and they would give you a 10 minutes (i think) or 1 hour stat boost, significantly so. Due to the design of the game, that ended up not doing that much; however, there was 1 particular Dyne of interest: The QuickyDyne, or quickys as they where called by us.

    That one doubled all your actions. Double movement speed, double action speed. So moving twice as fast and attacking twice as fast, basically meant you could grind twice as fast and level up twice as fast. Which, for a game that consisted entirely of grinding out levels, was veeeeeery desirable.

    These things had a chance to drop. Pretty good chance, but they where used up at a similar rate to what they dropped. So some times you really had to either farm for them, or buy them off farmers with other drops you'd gotten while using quickies.

    As a result, Quickys became the default currency in the game. 90% of all trade was done in Fat quickies (the hour long version had a "fatter" version as it's graphic of the "thin" one which resembled a testing tube) while those never inflated. Really expensive stuff could run for a few thousand at most. The price was remarkably stable, because both supply and demand remained remarkably stable. Even as more people leveled up higher and got access to mobs with higher drop rates, they also needed more and more experience, so more and more time between levels, which scaled up their consumption of quickies as fast as their access to new resources unlocked.

    I can honestly say that was my first introduction to real world economics, the inability of central planners to control an economy. None of the above was planned because MMO's where such a new thing (that game was released 6 years before world of warcraft) that many systems where still developing or even being invented as they went along. Of course higher level monsters dropped more gold, that's what they did in Diablo. Nobody thought about what would happen if you scaled Diablo up to level 1000 until it was tried.

    Game economies are a bit more stable these days; but even the best of em still have the same problems. A really Epic mount used to cost 500 gold in World of Warcraft. Now they have vendor mounts that sell for 5+ million. Silver and Copper have been useless in that game since 2007, even though the level 1-2 quests still give you <1 silver for your troubles.

    So while i've got physical gold and silver stored in a safe and i would advocate some allocation in both as a backup plan to everybody, i always keep in the back of my mind: It's only money cause people say it's money. Once the situation changes and another good becomes far more desirable; i should change my analysis with it. We could very well end back up with sticks.

    I also have a stack of toilet paper in my bathroom at the moment 😀 Cause ya never know.

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 8:09am

    Tim Puffer

    Tim Puffer

    Status: Member

    Joined: Nov 24 2019

    Posts: 11

    Michigan

    I live in Kalamazoo. Continuing our preps. Wife is making a supplies run today. Will be making another one tonight.

    We also have a fence going in next week to keep animals out of the yard and out of the raised garden beds we will be building.

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 8:17am

    Hladini

    Hladini

    Status: Member

    Joined: Dec 28 2011

    Posts: 189

    Letters to the Swamp

    Dear Chris,  I wrote my own letter to President Trump and here it is:

    Dear President Trump:  Have not written in a while, but felt compelled to write this morning after seeing the Leader of the US Corona Virus Task Force walk off without answering the question:  Can the uninsured get testing?

     

    From where I'm sitting,  I would expect that some of that emergency funding for the corona virus would be set aside for free testing.  South Korea is testing for free.  Taiwan is testing for free.

     

    Don't you know that we live in a country where people don't want an ambulance called for fear of the bill?

     

    It appears the US government is making the same mistake Philadelphia made during the Spanish Flu outbreak.  Government officials did not balance the health of the public against the government's fiscal obligations (the need to sell war bonds via a parade) and the Flu ravaged the city - in short order.

     

    The narrative of "face masks are dangerous" presently  roiling through the airwaves is pathetically hilarious.   If the US did not know about this virus the first of January, then all of military/pysop budgets are for naught.  If the US did know about this virus by the beginning of January, then the facemask shortage is a royal clusterfuck of incompetence and heads should fucking roll.

     

    How bloody  hard is it to manufacture facemasks?  Billions and billions of dollars sunk into the CDC and they don't have enough fucking facemasks when the Pandemic rolls around?

     

    We want to hear those idiots are FIRED!

     

    One other comment about all that money being put aside for the Corona Virus Emergency.  Is there money set aside for the public to pay bills?  Hong Kong gave out $10,000 HK dollars to all legal residents.  Of course they are under quarantine, but what happens to the public under quarantine?  How will Main Street Joe and Jane pay bills if they don't go to work?  Half the country lives paycheck to paycheck - thanks to Piss Poor Public Policy.

     

    Is there gonna be money for Main Street during this crisis?  Price controls?  What's the plan?

    BTW,  I write pretty frequently and most of the time I'm complaining bitterly.

     

     

     

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 8:46am

    Desogames

    Desogames

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 03 2020

    Posts: 210

    South korea is having a 2nd outbreak

    https://www.zerohedge.com/geopolitical/us-coronavirus-cases-pass-1000-national-guard-arrives-new-york-washington-bans-large

    Along with the article about the national guard ZH notes that there's a 2nd outbreak happening in South Korea, in the middle of a transit hub in Seoul this time. That's caused an uptick in the overnight korean numbers.

    It looks like despite heroic efforts that South Korea might fail in containing this after all. Which doesn't bode well for us in the west.

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 8:51am

    Nairobi

    Nairobi

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Feb 05 2020

    Posts: 289

    Stacking is for fools

    I completely agree with you Mohammed Mast. I have made similar comments over the years (to howls of derision from the gold nuts) when I point out the idiocy of open pit mining when all those guys do after their big purchase is find ways to hide the stuff and then go online and brag about their ownership. They call themselves "stackers" but I have choicer words for them.

    But gold mining is a big activity and it employs tens of thousands of people around the world. And because there is always more demand for jewelry, bars, coins and a few industrial processes we just keep digging up more even though its well known that virtually all the gold ever mined in all history can still be accounted for in various vaults around the world. Because it never goes rotten and very little is wasted to industrial activities.

    But look what they do to the planet by digging it up. Here is a video of the worlds biggest open pit mine and I am not trying to single out Barrick or anyone else because they all do this the same way, but this is truly an idiotic activity beyond the pale.

    Kalgoorie open pit mine is the biggest of them all. It can be seen from space its so big. The hole is more than five square kilometers in size and 600 meters deep and you want to know what they pull out of that hole every year? They get a grand total of 700,000 thousand ounces of gold which measures about 1.2 cubic meters in size. That is what they get. And in exchange they process the hell out of the stuff with cyanide mostly plus mercury and really make a hell of an environmental mess just so the gold bugs can oooooh and ahhhhh about how its going to be the last damned thing standing after paper money is gone. lol

    They don't even stop to consider they wrecked the bloody environment on every continent except Antarctica and innumerable countries in between just to fix money that actually works just fine without gold to start with. But Zimbabwe they shout! And hey what about Weimar and the wheelbarrows of cash to buy bread?!!

    And then I shout back "Hey, what about my green grass and the birds and bugs and fish that if you didn't notice are going extinct faster than at any time in world history outside the last big meteor impact that wiped out the dinosaurs"!! And a lot of it has to do with the total disrespect of the environment caused by gold mining and widespread contamination of the environment due to all the heavy chemicals that get used for extraction. That's why we don't need any more of it.

    Nobody wants to hear it. It's the same thing every day with the bugs. No brains. They think gold is their salvation for Gods sake and none of them even consider the real costs. Surely we can come up with something better. The sooner the Central Banks can start minting digital currency the better for everyone. And we can leave gold exactly where we found it. In the ground.

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 9:06am

    Jim H

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jun 08 2009

    Posts: 1170

    Trusting Debt-based Fiat Currency is for Fools

    I certainly can't argue that Gold mining is environmentally friendly.. so I won't.  What I will say is that Debt-based Fiat, especially in the hands of our Western central bank cartel, will tend to drive those of a thinking bent toward forms of (savings) capital which have real scarcity integrity.  If our money system were not so flawed and corrupt, we might not need Gold as much.

     

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 9:09am

    dtrammel

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: May 03 2011

    Posts: 799

    Megathreads Now Back Online For View

    Ok, I went ahead and got a temporary WordPress site to host the Covid19 Megafiles online, so you can read them without downloading them.

    You can view them here: Peak Prosperity Covid19 Library of Files

    For now just the three megathreads are up, but over the next few days I'll get some of the other compilation put up there, and try and update the megathreads to current videos.

    You can search the files for keywords (like "mask" or "bleach") by using your browser's "Find" option under Tools.

    That should solve the false malware alerts some of you were getting.

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 9:22am

    Nairobi

    Nairobi

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Feb 05 2020

    Posts: 289

    The Wuhan Virus has Arrived

    Well, the Wuhan Virus has arrived in my neck of the woods. There is a case about one block from me so its pretty damned close. Can't say where that is exactly because I just pissed off a lot of gold bugs and some miners in my prior post, but it's arrived. What took it so long?

    Looks like I will have to avoid the 7-11 and shopping mall after all. Dang.

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 9:43am

    pawch

    pawch

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 06 2020

    Posts: 25

    MMT meets SARS 2

    Hi DavidDD,

    Happy to see that some people are beginning to look beyond the "COVID CRISIS" and to ask the right questions.

    There are many opinions out there, but few based on significant thought. It's all about emotion.

    You should read Plan B in the addendum of the free book FROM FREEDOM TO FASCISM. You can download it from B&N but Amazon expunged the entire addendum.

    https://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/from-freedom-to-fascism-skip-sparks/1130048697

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 9:54am

    pawch

    pawch

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 06 2020

    Posts: 25

    Why the Old, not the Young, Why Chinese?

    SARS2: Why the Old, not the Young, Why Chinese?

    Mortality from SARS 1 and 2 was/is highest in the elderly, especially in those with comorbidities (pregnancy is not a comorbidity 😊). This is not hard to accept given the general immune decline as we age. But why is mortality inchildren, who are relatively inexperienced immunologically, the exact opposite of that for the elderly for both SARS 1 and 2? This is not the case for influenza, in which younger children, pregnant women, the elderly, and people with compromised immune systems are at greatest risk.

    SARS 1 and 2 both enter the target cell via the ACE2 receptor site. Without getting too technical suffice it to say that the SARS virus saturates these ACE2 receptor sites and essentially remove them from play.  Absence of ACE2 increases a hormone (angiotensin II) that latches onto another receptor site (ATR1). This latter mediates inflammation by a well known signaling pathway. ATR1 receptor activity is a direct measure of biological age. Old people have no buffer (low ACE2), but the young have plenty of ACE2. Blockage of the ATR1 has been proposed as a longevity strategy. Alzheimers disease is associated with its overactivity.

    https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/10.1161/CIRCRESAHA.118.313477

    SUMMARY: Less ACE2 availability means more Angiotensin II and subsequent inflammation via ATR1 receptor activity. This leads to more inflammation and accelerated aging. The elevated ACE2 in children oppose this.

    The Chinese are more susceptible to SARS 1 and 2 because of the prevalence of certain HLA genotypes

    In their population not because they have more ACE2.

    TECHNICAL DISCUSSION

    If you want the more technical explanation supported by the medical literature, then read on. Otherwise skip to the conclusion.

    WHY THE OLD BUT NOT THE YOUNG

    Basically ACE (enzyme 1) produces the active Angiotensin II from the inactive Angiotensin I, while ACE2 (enzyme 2) inactivates Angiotensin II. The young have more ACE2 (the good kind) and less of the bad. ACE (enzyme 1) isn’t really bad, since our very existence depends on Angiotensin II, as it regulates fluid and electrolyte balance (fights dehydration and low BP (blood pressure)).

    https://academic.oup.com/eurheartj/article/26/4/322/439241

    https://www.nature.com/articles/nm0805-821

    But Angiotensin II does much more than that!

    Angiotensin II works thru two counter regulating receptor sites, ATR1 (“bad”) and ATR2 (“good”).

    However, within the last decade or two Angiotensin II has been shown to play an additional vital role in inflammation and aging-related tissue injury. ATR1 mediates the BP elevating/pro inflammatory arm and ATR2 counters both.

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3377325/

    ACE/ACE2 increases as we age. Angiotensin II and ATR1/ATR2 also increase as we age, especially upon pursuit of a sedentary lifestyle. This has been shown in mice and rats. Don’t hold your breath for clinical studies in human children.

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4855022/

    https://academic.oup.com/biomedgerontology/article/73/12/1594/4969203

    Additional evidence underscoring the benefits to the lungs of blocking Angiotensin II at its ATR1 receptor site but without the ACE2 receptor targeting by SARS:

    “Plasma levels of angiotensin II, a major regulatory peptide of the renin-angiotensin system, are markedly elevated in H7N9 influenza patients and are associated with disease progression. Moreover, the sustained high levels of angiotensin II in these patients are strongly correlated with mortality.”

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24800963

    “Avian influenza A H5N1-infected patients exhibit markedly increased serum levels of angiotensin II. High serum levels of angiotensin II appear to be linked to the severity and lethality of infection.”

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24800825

    “ACE2 and the angiotensin II type 2 receptor (AT2) protect mice from severe acute lung injury induced by acid aspiration or sepsis. However, other components of the renin-angiotensin system, including ACE, angiotensin II and the angiotensin II type 1a receptor (ATR1), promote disease pathogenesis, induce lung oedemas and impair lung function.”

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16001071

    “The levels of Angiotensin II were elevated following down-regulation of ACE2, causing severe lung injury via AT1R during the process of RSV infection.” (mice)

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4728398/#!po=9.25926

    So it appears that for influenza viruses Angiotensin II and its ATR1 receptor mediate an inflammatory process through a mechanism unrelated to the ACE2 receptor sites preferred by SARS 1 and 2. Higher ACE2 levels in the young are apparently not helpful in fighting influenza viruses (v SARS 1 and 2).

    WHY THE CHINESE

    In a January 2020 study of uninfected lung cells from 8 normal donors (2 males, 1 Asian) the 2 male donors had a higher ACE2-expressing cell ratio than all 6 female donors (1.66% vs. 0.41% of all cells => 4x more). Furthermore, the only Asian donor (male) had a much higher ACE2-expressing cell ratio than the white and African American donors (2.50% vs. 0.47% of all cells => 5x more). Consequently the authors concluded that “this study provides a biological background for the epidemic (sic) investigation of the 2019-nCov infection disease, and could be informative for future anti-ACE2 therapeutic strategy development.”

    https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.01.26.919985v1

    So ACE2 seems to be bad, according to this article. Seems logical since this ACE2 receptor is the target for SARS entry. But ACE2 appears to be highly beneficial in the young in fighting SARS and infusion of ACE2 is highly effective in fighting influenza H5N1, influenza H7N9, acute lung injury from sepsis and acid aspiration, and RSV (respiratory syncytial virus).                                                     https://www.nature.com/articles/ncomms4594

    https://www.nature.com/articles/srep07027

    https://www.nature.com/articles/nature03712   https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4728398/

    So which is it?

    ACE2 has a circulating component and a membrane bound component. Perhaps increasing the circulating component acts like an antibody and soaks up virus that would otherwise attach to the membrane bound component for cellular entry.

    The “ACE2 is bad” study is seriously flawed (extremely small sampling), stands alone unsupported, and contradicts much larger studies.

    Here are three February 2020 articles, two from China and one from India, touting ATR1 inhibitors (AKA angiotensin receptor blockers or ARBs) as a novel approach to SARS 2 therapy.

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/32061198

    https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007%2Fs11427-020-1643-8

    https://www.bmj.com/content/368/bmj.m406/rr-2

    and an Israeli article from 3/4/20

    https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1002/ddr.21656

    CONCLUSION

    The obvious questions are:

    “Why are ATR1 inhibitors/blockers (widely available, widely popular, and inexpensive) not even mentioned as viable therapy much less touted as a frontline approach.

    “Why is human recombinant ACE2 not available?” There was a successful phase II clinical study more than a decade ago.

    https://ccforum.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s13054-017-1823-x

    Phase II B trials have not yet been undertaken.

    https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT04287686

    IMHO the clear answer is currency (dollars are not money). Vaccines and antivirals are much preferred because they bring in the big bucks. The WHO and the CDC are both manipulated by Big Pharma.

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 9:56am

    Barbara

    Status: Member

    Joined: Dec 15 2009

    Posts: 159

    Flatten the curve - about time

    New trending item

    https://twitter.com/hashtag/FlattenTheCurve?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1237735898650943490&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fstream.syscoi.com%2F2020%2F03%2F11%2Fmodelling-flattening-the-curve-links-covid19-flattenthecurve-coronavirus%2F

     

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 10:19am

    Ision

    Ision

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 07 2020

    Posts: 121

    What A Wonderful Article! A Treasure!

    Now, THIS, is the type of information, and opinion, I like to see!

    You have written a very good article and illuminated the subject nicely!

     

    Thank you.

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 10:47am

    brushhog

    brushhog

    Status: Member

    Joined: Oct 06 2015

    Posts: 76

    "Panic buying and panic selling"

    Dont you love how the media is portraying people who are stocking up as "panic buyers"? Or people who are selling risky investment instruments are now "panic selling". Making strategic adjustments to your life in the face of pending crisis is depicted in a negative light. You are "panicking". I guess the implication is that you are a coward or something. lol.

    You are not supposed to react to global crisis in any way. You should stand in front of the coming freight train and never move a muscle, all for the collective good. You should risk your retirement savings, your families well being, risk illness, starvation and death, and never make any move to ameliorate your condition.

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 10:52am

    Jim H

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jun 08 2009

    Posts: 1170

    What to conclude?

    “Why is human recombinant ACE2 not available?” There was a successful phase II clinical study more than a decade ago.

    If you read the paper linked to after this statement, it concludes,

    However, GSK2586881 infusions did not result in improvement in physiological or clinical measures of ARDS in this small study

    I am not sure I would call this a, "successful" study.  I'll take the malaria drug Chloroquine with some extra Zinc, Thank you.

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 10:59am

    yagasjai

    yagasjai

    Status: Member

    Joined: Apr 18 2009

    Posts: 117

    Communications

    I lived in a small, rural, town in Western MA for 12 years that did not have cell service. I have subsequently moved closer to town where there is cell service. But I've never bothered to upgrade my cell phone from my tracfone flip phone, which is pre-paid. I can buy a block of minutes in advance and use it as needed. No monthly payment. The workaround I used while living rural for people being able to text me was a google voice number, which shows up on my computer, not cell. At this point I would like to upgrade the tracfone to a smart phone of some sort so that I can stop pushing buttons over and over to text and also get on the internet if I need to. And in researching this am finding that tracfone now offers "plans" where you can pay $20 or more a month to get unlimited talk and text (which seems potentially useful in an emergency) but does require the banking system to be functional in order for automatic payments to go through in order to keep the service running (not great in an emergency). So what I may do is simply get the upgraded phone with better texting and internet capabilities and not the plan, but continue buying the blocks of time so that it's already there if I need it. Or get the new phone with the plan, and keep my block of minutes on the old flip phone as backup. But then I'll have 2 cell numbers. Wondering what others are thinking about cell phones/payment plans and how to keep connected with loved ones. I also recently heard a friend of mine on the west coast talking about getting a CB radio as part of her emergency planning and remember using CBs as a kid with my family on long car trips to hear where the "speed traps" are. Also interested to hear if people thing that having a CB radio on hand is a good investment for this type of emergency. I've not seen much discussion of the implications for our cell service or phone/internet system.

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 11:30am

    Airie

    Airie

    Status: Member

    Joined: Mar 09 2014

    Posts: 4

    Deep state opinion

    Economist

    Might be more complicated than we can perceive. So many power players, so many unknowns, yet we all must act as if we know what we need.

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 12:09pm

    reflector

    reflector

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Aug 20 2011

    Posts: 263

    italian doctor finds sucess using tocilizumab to treat coronavirus

    this just out today:

    Rome, March 11 - A commonly used arthritis drug has shown "excellent results" in two coronavirus patients and a national protocol for its extensive use against the virus should be drawn up, oncologist Paolo Ascierto of Naples' Pascale Hospital said Wednesday. The drug, tocilizumab, "has shown it is effective against pneumonia caused by COVID-29," he said.

    http://www.ansa.it/english/news/science_tecnology/2020/03/11/coronavirusarthritis-drug-seems-to-work_8113f9d9-9bb8-4181-9c02-3e314c30e7e9.html

     

    from what i gather this drug can stop a cytokine storm:

    ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tocilizumab )

    Cytokine release syndrome

    On 30 August 2017, the FDA approved tocilizumab for cytokine release syndrome, a side effect of CAR-T cell therapies.[15]

    Severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2

    On 11 March 2020 Paolo Ascierto confirmed that tocilizumab has proven effective in a couple of cases of severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2 in Italy.[citation needed]

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 12:14pm

    Desogames

    Desogames

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 03 2020

    Posts: 210

    Dutch state news LYING

    I'm watching the state news right now on NPO 1.

    They stated that housedoctors have been testing since the very beginning everybody with symptoms and they only found one.

    That is a BOLD FACED LIE considering the effort you guys KNOW i've gone through to try and get tested.

    I called the doctor 6 times. the GGD 4 times. 112 twice. Been to the emergency room twice.

    And i COULD NOT get a test, because, according to policy, if i hadn't been abroad, and i could not show a sustained 38c RECTALLY MEASURED temperature, the policy was i had 0 chance of having it. that was the LITERAL policy (it was even posted on this site on whatever article was out that day). i could show a 37.8 rectally measured temperature, i have PHOTOGRAPHIC EVIDENCE but because of a 0.2C degree difference they DID NOT TEST ME.

    <supermario voice> I'M-A SOH MAD! </supermario>

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 12:17pm

    PhilH

    PhilH

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: May 24 2010

    Posts: 166

    Father in Law in Hospice

    Being in Hospice means they will not provide ANY additional medical care.  For his own best interest, when he can no longer feed himself, any intake of food and water must be cut off.  I cringe when i hear of people using feeding tubes on their parents.  Caregiver where my father in law was staying was fired, because she was giving him sponges filled with water, "because he's a sweetie".  Nobody could figure out where the water in his lungs was coming from.  It's a super hard decision, and worse watching him dying is the worst helpless feeling one can have.

    This is a time for the family to come together to provide comfort to the patient and to each other.  My wife had to deal with her father by herself (I was of course there supporting her), but younger brother ran out of the room, ran out of the room screaming and crying because he couldn't see dad in that condition.  Older brother is a POS who couldn't be bothered to come see dad.  He lived for 14 days with no food nor water (minus the little bit he was given against dr orders), and finally my wife asked him who he was waiting for, there was nobody left, only she and I.  He passed a couple of hours later.

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 12:46pm

    Susan7

    Susan7

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 15 2020

    Posts: 49

    Hospice?

    That is not hospice care. Feeding tubes are one thing, withholding water from someone able to take it with assistance is cruelty. Comfort care is an important part of demonstrating our compassion for the weak and dying.

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 1:17pm

    mntnhousepermi

    mntnhousepermi

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Feb 19 2016

    Posts: 308

    Hospice

    Not true, you can choose what care is provided while in hospice.  Hospice care just means that they are not expected to live past 6months/year, and sometimes they get better.  My mother passed last year while under hospice care and she had a feeding tube, oxygen ( comfort mask) IV drip and antibiotics.  She was not expected to live long, but she had relief and less symptoms with that care. Her thinking was much clearer on the antibiotics, for example, and why have her die of dehydration ?  She died of pneumonia, which is what she had when entering hospice.  What was stopped was shoving intubation tubes down her throat and there was a non-rescuscitation order, so no CPR.

    To clarify, she was already on a feeding tube when she got the pneumonia, it was not started then.  It was how she ate, she had developed an inability to swallow due to years of a particular medication, but at that time, you could see how hard she was trying !  I have never seen someone with such a will to live and someone working so hard, chewing and trying to swallow, but the swallow reflex just gone.  SO, just want to say,  do not judge about feeding tubes ! Why should someone be left to starve when they can get nutrition that way ?  I even know children who will be on feeding tubes their entire lives -- living like normal, except when it comes to meal times

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 1:21pm

    Desogames

    Desogames

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 03 2020

    Posts: 210

    Charts are in!

    https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/stocks-puke-pandemic-cycle-lows-us-financial-conditions-crash-most-lehman

    Another bad day for ye olde markets. Everything went down, except the dollar. Shows liquidity is getting veeeery tight.

    Still not sad/worried about gold though. The chart of the day would be this:

    It's not even spring yet. Still though... that's a gold ETF; which means it falls under the ETF bubble as well. Good luck actually redeeming that gold. But atleast they get it in spirit.

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 1:29pm

    mntnhousepermi

    mntnhousepermi

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Feb 19 2016

    Posts: 308

    water in lungs

    Having just gone thru this, well, saliva can run down into lungs, but even that isnt  the issue, pneumonia is what causes water in the lungs.  The body does this on its own, no need for swallowing the wrong way.  trust me, a person with no mouth input of fluids or food will still get water in the lungs when coming down with pnuemonia

     

    Sponges, the swabbing of the mouth with a wet sponge is a comfort measure that is always done !  It is not enough water to cause water in lungs or any other issue.  It is cruel enough to die of dehydration, but swabbing the mouth increases comfort, and it does not prolong death as it is just moistening the mouth.  It feels horrible to have a dry mouth and cracked lips.  They also use lip balms for this reason.

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 1:35pm

    FooBarr

    FooBarr

    Status: Member

    Joined: Oct 21 2010

    Posts: 57

    Communication for Emergencies: CB, FRS, GRMS, MURS, Ham Radio

    Out here in fly over country, seems lately a few folks been have been talking up some interest in radio communications for emergencies.  A few farmers still got a CB in their trucks, and maybe an old base station on a shelf somewhere gathering dust.  Most have given into using cellular phones nowadays.

    I got a little bit of everything, but have gotten rusty in using it.  Just last weekend I pulled some GMRS and Ham radios out of storage and started setting them back up on my shelf over my desk and I'm back to rereading their manuals.

    One of the best primers for a quick reading on EMCOMs is this older post (Jan 2012) over on SurvivalBlog.  I still reference it once in a while to pull freqs to scan.

    https://survivalblog.com/comprehensive-crisis-communica/

    Today one can fill out the paperwork for a (no-exam-required) GMRS license, send it in with the $90 fee, and after a few days them and their family can legally use the higher powered GMRS-only radios.

    https://nsea.com/apply-gmrs-license.html

    Then in between sessions of playing around with GMRS, they could be studying for their Technician-level Ham Licence with an on-line class.  http://www.arrl.org/getting-licensed

    The hard part will be able to find a ham-radio testing location with everything shutting down in next few months.

     

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 1:40pm

    Jim H

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jun 08 2009

    Posts: 1170

    Excellent info Reflector!

    Really glad to see even more of the old gang bringing their gray matter into the fray here... Thank you, Jim

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 2:03pm

    Sparky1

    Sparky1

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jul 21 2016

    Posts: 736

    WHO declares Covid-2019 an official "Pandemic"

    [Sparky1 comment: WHO's a bit late to the party. Before they didn't want to use the "P" word as it might convey a sense of hopelessness. So now they're ok is using it--why? I suspect they needed extra time to get their back-channel deals in place, especially since now governments in afflicted countries are putting big money on the table. What about those "pandemic bonds" or other financial instruments tied to the use of the "P" word? Seems like there's more to this than semantics. At the very least, it makes it look like they are "doing something". Lame.]

    WHO calls coronavirus a pandemic as Britain, Italy shore up defenses

    “We are deeply concerned both by the alarming levels of spread and severity and by the alarming levels of inaction,” Director General Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus told reporters in Geneva."

    “We have therefore made the assessment that COVID-19 can be characterized as a pandemic,” he said, using the formal name of the coronavirus.

    '"Use of the word pandemic does not change the WHO’s response, said Dr Mike Ryan, the head of the Geneva-based agency’s emergencies program."

    "WHO officials have signaled for weeks that they may use the word “pandemic” but said it does not carry legal significance. The WHO classified the outbreak as a “public health emergency of international concern” on Jan. 30, triggering an increase in global response coordination. "

    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus/who-calls-coronavirus-a-pandemic-as-britain-italy-shore-up-defenses-idUSKBN20Y1RF

     

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 2:16pm

    Sparky1

    Sparky1

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jul 21 2016

    Posts: 736

    Wall Street tumbles; Dow down 1,465 pts., confirms bear market

    Wall Street tumbles, Dow confirms bear market

    "Concerns over the fast-spreading virus have ravaged markets and hobbled supply chains as countries around the world grapple with how to contain both the virus and its economic impact."

    "As part of those efforts, the U.S. Federal Reserve is widely expected to cut interest rates for a second time this month at the conclusion of a two-day monetary policy meeting next week."

    "The Dow Jones Industrial Average .DJI fell 1,464.94 points, or 5.86%, to 23,553.22, the S&P 500 .SPX lost 140.85 points, or 4.89%, to 2,741.38 and the Nasdaq Composite .IXIC dropped 392.20 points, or 4.7%, to 7,952.05."

    "All 11 major sectors in the S&P 500 ended the session sharply lower."

    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-stocks/wall-street-tumbles-dow-confirms-bear-market-idUSKBN20Y1FR

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 2:25pm

    vshelford

    vshelford

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jul 13 2014

    Posts: 143

    thanks dtrammel!

    At least then I know it won't take longer than the 9 days (hiding away in those threads), and hopefully a sheet on the car seats will do.  Read various studies that talk about half-life and things like that, but numbers are still elusive.  I guess we just over-care and hope.

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 2:45pm

    westcoastjan

    westcoastjan

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Jun 04 2012

    Posts: 438

    New article from Gail Tverberg - Our Finite World

    Provides an interesting take on things, as usual.

    It is easy to overdo COVID-19 quarantines

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 3:08pm

    westcoastjan

    westcoastjan

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Jun 04 2012

    Posts: 438

    Move over gold! lol

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 4:49pm

    Sparky1

    Sparky1

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jul 21 2016

    Posts: 736

    23-yr. old shares young people's views on coronavirus

    I've had some pretty interesting Covid conversations with my 23-year-old daughter who is working fulltime in food service while finishing her last semester of undergraduate study at our state university. She's probably more informed about the virus spread than many her age, given my level of awareness and preparations.

    [For context, I'm at the tail-end of recuperating from a serious illness from last year and rebuilding my stamina and immunity. I'm taking precautions (e.g., wearing gloves and respirators, using sanitizers, avoiding crowds and anyone obviously ill) but I don't appear to be sickly. My daughter has been enormously supportive throughout.]

    Here are some of her observations (without my counter-arguments during these very teachable moments):

    * Most people think this whole "virus thing" in the US is overblown and people are over-reacting. Most people aren't going to get sick, and if so, it's just like a bad cold or the flu and nothing to really worry about. Just wash your hands, sneeze into your elbow, and avoid obviously sick people.

    * People are offended with those who wear "masks" because masks won't protect you from the virus; and it [read: "hoarding"] reduces the masks from being available for people who really do need them (e.g., health care workers).

    *  Younger people in particular think wearing a mask makes someone look "stupid" or "ignorant" and that the wearer is either sick (and should therefore be avoided) or that the "mask" wearers think others may be sick just because they are of a certain race or nationality (i.e., a "micro-aggressive" or xenophobic reaction), so the wearer should be avoided and those socially unacceptable (non-PC) behaviors/views shunned. My daughter emphasized that she doesn't hold these views about those who wear "masks", but was just letting me know how others might react to me wearing a surgical mask, respirator or gloves in public.

    * Her university sends out several emails a day re: coronavirus about not attending class if sick  (one of her professors apparently didn't get/follow the memo on that one), to call ahead to Student Health Services with symptoms for triage, prevention strategies (e.g., wash hands, use sanitizer). The university has a Covid-2019 FAQs page, which includes this statement, "In the U.S., flu is currently a far bigger threat to the general public than coronavirus," with lots of references to CDC and the CalState Chancellor's office, which also references to CDC and US State Dept. for travel information resources. Note: no university guidance/information on Covid-2019 testing.

    * Apparently students believe/are told the university has three different "plans" for different Covid-2019 scenarios:

    Plan A, no one gets virus (tests positive), so BAU with near-term events to be assessed on a case-by-case basis;

    Plan B, one or only a few students/university personnel get virus, close school for 2-4 days, clean, trace and track contacts, assess next steps, leave it to instructors' and immediate supervisors' requirements during the short 2-4 day closure (i.e., on-line alternative, extended due dates for assignments, rescheduling activities);

    Plan C, more/a cluster of students or personnel test positive, school closes down for to-be-determined time period, classes, meetings and other events cancelled and/or completed remotely (on-line, independent study).

    * She and other students are concerned about the disruptions, missing out on college experiences, socialization, unfinished school projects, and delayed or derailed academic/degree progress and graduation.

    * She and other students believe that they'll be released for spring break. But if there's Covid cases on campus, then the university may curtail/close in-person activities for the remainder of the semester. She knows students and school personnel will be traveling to places where Covid is prevalent and is concerned that infected travelers may expose others upon their return.

    * She's aware of and dismayed at the possibility that this may impact graduation ceremonies and celebrations, including her own.

    * She has friends with travel plans to US destinations and abroad during spring break.  Some of those trips/activities may be cancelled as parents are voicing concerns for their children's health, safety and potential for being stranded during quarantine and possible area lock-downs.

    * Students are tempted by "stupid cheap" "great" deals in air travel. She has a friend who booked a round trip to Florida. The air fare was $0.01 (yes, one cent!) and the total costs with fees was about $26.

    * She also has another friend whose mother is a nurse at a hospital in/near Tracy, CA. Her friend reported that hospital personnel encountered a (suspected/confirmed?) Covid patient, had to "shut down" the hospital (floor?) temporarily for cleaning, and transferred the patient to another hospital.

    My daughter is very bright and thoughtfully considers alternative evidence and views than those pushed by the government and health "authorities", MSM and social networks.  But, as a parent, it is really infuriating to have to refute the misinformation being spread by these incompetent, negligent entities.

    She and other young people her age are aware of and concerned about the coronavirus, but are in various stages of CDC-curated denial about the seriousness of the disease. There's also fear underlying this denial as these young people contemplate their world and futures being "highjacked" by something invisible, pervasive, and potentially debilitating and deadly.

    As Chris so aptly reminds us, "It didn't have to be this way."

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 5:04pm

    Grayman

    Grayman

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 11 2020

    Posts: 28

    New PP daily video update on You Tube titled "The WHO finally Declares a Pandemic"

    Watch it here:

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 5:18pm

    Grayman

    Grayman

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 11 2020

    Posts: 28

    How do you start a new 'Forum' topic?

    I wanted to put the link to the new PP video on You Tube as a Forum topic so the comments there would be in response to just the latest video but I don't know how to start a new Forum.

    Can anyone else oblige please? And let me know how it's done too.

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 5:37pm

    northoftheborder

    northoftheborder

    Status: Member

    Joined: Jan 02 2017

    Posts: 3

    Canada and testing, more is being done

    A friend who has been following all your videos, Chris, tells me that the Canadian testing and case numbers really are:

    Ontario 36 (2747 tested)
    British Colombia 39 (2803 tested)
    Quebec 7 (can't find testing data--not surprised)
    Alberta 14 (2018 tested)

    Then there is that 600+ on the national website---she is not sure if these are just confirmations. She couldn't find the testing on the other provincial websites, although she looked. We will keep an eye on these, and let you know where things stand.

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 5:54pm

    westcoastjan

    westcoastjan

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Jun 04 2012

    Posts: 438

    Add 7 more for BC - March 11 update

    First case on Vancouver Island 🙁 🙁  Not unexpected, but not wanted either, as is the case elsewhere...

    Coronavirus: B.C. confirms 7 new COVID-19 cases, first on Vancouver Island

    Jan

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 7:23pm

    Barbara

    Status: Member

    Joined: Dec 15 2009

    Posts: 159

    Young People's ideas

    The most common issue I'm hearing from the young is that all these restrictions (cancel trips, events, classes) are unnecessary [stats say they won't get sicker than a cold or flu].
    They are mad because this is interfering with their lives: Their fun trips, their education, their career plans.

    My daughter was particularly bummed out when the Houston Rodeo was cancelled, since she'd been planning on going to a concert by one of her favorite performers.  She's also resistant to wearing gloves in high risk locations because people will think she's weird.  The thing that does make an impression is the need to protect other people.  She'd wear a mask and quarantine if she thought she was sick, but keeping a normal life seems to outweigh the risk of a nasty virus.

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 8:10pm

    Sparky1

    Sparky1

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jul 21 2016

    Posts: 736

    San Joaquin Valley, CA: 5 confirmed Covid-2019 cases

    As of 3/11/20 there are 5 confirmed Covid-2019 cases within California's San Joaquin Valley (SJV) eight-county region.

    The San Joaquin Valley (SJV) is about 250 miles long and has a population of just over 4.08 million. The SJV, known as the "breadbasket of the world," is the world's fifth largest supplier of food and agricultural commodities. (Source).  Nevertheless, severe drought conditions during 2012-2016 devastated the SJV's agricultural-based economy, which has still not yet fully recovered.

    The SJV region is also known for its high poverty rates, seasonal/mobile workforce, and high rates of un/under-insured residents--factors that may contribute to pandemic spread. In addition to its potential health impacts, the coronavirus pandemic poses new, significant threats to the region's economy and the world's food and agricultural supply.

    Information concerning Covid-2019 testing and status of those tested in the SJV is woefully (intentionally??) incomplete and uneven across county health departments. These county public health departments, in consultation with the California Department of Health, have authority and discretion as to if, when, and what data and information they report publicly concerning Covid-2019.

    Today, there were two confirmed Covid-2019 cases in my county, Stanislaus; and 1 confirmed case in neighboring San Joaquin County.

    PP members who live and/or have connections within the SJV region may want to save these links below for future reference as the number of cases is sure to increase through community spread and more readily available testing.

    Stanislaus County, CA: 2 test positive for Covid; 17 pending test results; 8 negative; 37 monitored (cumulative)

    http://www.schsa.org/publichealth/pages/corona-virus/

    San Joaquin County, CA:  1 confirmed Covid case (a Grand Princess cruise ship passenger but NOT on the cruise that is currently disembarking in Oakland (i.e., an earlier cruise??))

    http://www.sjcphs.org/assets/20200310_PR%20PHS%20REPORTS%20FIRST%20CONFIRMED%20CASE%20OF%20CORONAVIRUS%20DISEASE%202019%20COVID-19.pdf

    Merced County, CA: no confirmed cases

    http://www.co.merced.ca.us/DocumentCenter/View/23698/COVID-19-Daily-Status-Update-31120?bidId=

    Fresno County, CA: 1 confirmed case (travel related)

    https://www.co.fresno.ca.us/departments/public-health/covid-19

    Madera County, CA: 1 confirmed case; 7 being monitored

    https://www.maderacounty.com/government/public-health/health-updates/corona-virus

    Kings County, CA: no confirmed cases

    https://www.countyofkings.com/home/showdocument?id=21652

    Tulare County, CA: no confirmed cases; 5 being monitored

    https://tchhsa.org/eng/index.cfm/public-health/covid-19-updates-novel-coronavirus/

    Kern County, CA: no confirmed cases

    https://kernpublichealth.com/2019-novel-coronavirus/

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  • Wed, Mar 11, 2020 - 8:48pm

    pawch

    pawch

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 06 2020

    Posts: 25

    ACE2 response

    Thank you Jim H for taking the time to read my post and to comment.

    That linked article was from 2017 not 2010 as I posted. Try this link (phase I study from 2010) https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Bernhard_Peball/publication/276411091_rhACE2_Cloning_to_Clinic/links/5559014b08ae980ca61058d3/rhACE2-Cloning-to-Clinic.pdf?origin=publication_detail

    The link I originally mistakenly posted does however underscore my contention, as it received heavy Big Pharma funding.

    The report was interim and not completed after 39 of the original 60 ICU patients dropped out.

    A larger study on individuals a bit earlier in their clinical course would be more reflective of true hr ACE2 efficacy.

    The study was designed to fail.

    I don’t think you plan to commence your chloroquine therapy when you are in the ICU.

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  • Fri, Mar 13, 2020 - 10:36am

    yagasjai

    yagasjai

    Status: Member

    Joined: Apr 18 2009

    Posts: 117

    Thanks FooBarr

    I appreciate that info!

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