I believe there's an entrepreneur in everybody.~ Robert Kiyosaki
Last weekend, Chris and I traveled to Phoenix, AZ, where we spent several days with Robert Kiyosaki, author of the popular personal finance book Rich Dad, Poor Dad, which has sold over 26 million copies to-date.
Robert had read The Crash Course, and it resonated so strongly with him that he purchased copies for his staff and made it the theme of his company's leadership conference this spring. Together with his wife, Kim, and his council of Rich Dad advisors, we spent many hours discussing the future implications of the Three E's with business leaders from across Robert's global organization.
Kiyosaki's great passion is financial education; specifically, teaching people how to take control of their destiny by becoming financially independent through business ownership and investment income:
The more money you print, the poorer we get. It has happened throughout history. Yet, people get up every morning and go to work. They work for money. If they get fired, they just get another job to work for more money. After a while, you have to wake up and ask why you are doing this. If they are printing money, why are you working for money?
That's what happened for me back in 1983. I just woke up and said I could not know what I know and allow this to go on. If you read my book Rich Dad, Poor Dad, people don't really get the message in the first chapter. The title of the first chapter is "The Rich Don’t Work for Money". That's why they are rich. Yet, you go to school to get a job to work for money. The more you are working for money, the poorer you are getting because of inflation and taxes.
The rich print our own money. We have assets.
There are different kinds of assets in the world. That was Rich Dad, Poor Dad. My poor dad worked for a paycheck. My rich dad worked to create assets. He was an entrepreneur. He built hotels. He built restaurants. He did not sell them; he just ran them as an entrepreneur. He built assets. If you read Rich Dad, Poor Dad, the definition of an asset is something that puts money in your pocket whether you work or not. A liability takes money from your pocket.
My Rich Dad used to teach me that playing Monopoly: four green houses for one red hotel. With one green house, you get $10.00. That is an asset. There are financial assets, real property assets like real estate and IP assets, intellectual property assets. Every time I write a book, it is an asset, and more and more money comes in.
The point here is that I am always converting cash into an asset. That is the difference. That was what Rich Dad, Poor Dad was about.
What caught Robert's attention most in The Crash Course is the magnitude of the coming wealth transfer; where tertiary wealth (paper-based claims) will be forgone in favor of second and primary forms of wealth (productive assets and raw materials). More than ever, he believes entrepreneurial skills will be the most important determinant for ensuring you are on the right side of that wealth transfer.
What you saw in the workshop is my team, my advisors, the team of nine. We are tight. We have my accountants, my attorneys, my guys who raise capital for me and my sales guys, all that stuff. We are a team. That is what makes you rich. I talked about this. You have to be a master of pieces. I put accountants, attorneys and bankers all together. That is how I get rich. In school, rather than being a master of the pieces you become one of the pieces. You come out of school as an accountant or attorney. The entrepreneur comes in and puts you together with the rest of their team. You are either the master of pieces as an entrepreneur or one of the pieces from the school system. What you guys are doing right now is becoming the master of the pieces, putting your own team together, or your community, or your tribe. That is what is going to cause us to survive.
Especially when it comes to the world of money, as you and I will probably agree, that's probably the most corrupt of all. The moment they could print money, it became more corrupt. For people to go to school and work to make a high salary, you are probably going down the wrong trail. The more money they print, the harder you have to work. Nietzsche says the more we print money, the poorer we get and the more impoverished people get.
You had better start thinking differently. How do you convert your money into an asset?
Click the play button below to listen to Chris' interview with Robert Kiyosaki (32m:09s):
Chris Martenson: Welcome to this Peak Prosperity podcast. I am your host Chris Martenson. Today I get to invite onto the show somebody I am very excited to invite on the show, Robert Kiyosaki, American investor, businessman, self-help author and motivational speaker. I just had the opportunity to spend three days with Robert, his lovely wife Kim, his team and some select people who were invited to a three-day seminar, where the topic happened to have been my book. I was invited as the author to come and provide some additional color on top of the book. Robert, thank you so much for joining me today.
Robert Kiyosaki: Chris, thank you. You and Adam were just fantastic additions to our three-day in Phoenix, Arizona. We have a lot of seminars throughout the world, but we have a very closed seminar twice a year in Phoenix. You were it, your book, everything. It was so nice to have been with you.
Chris Martenson: Thank you. Adam has had a great time as well. We have been talking about it ever since. There were a number of things that really struck me. One is that you are a student of history, even more so than I am. I love history. I love the way it is going to inform us about what is coming. One of the themes that came out was that there is really nothing new under the sun. Whatever is going to happen tomorrow already happened yesterday. I believe that is how you put it. What do you mean by that, for people listening?
Robert Kiyosaki: For those who came to the seminar, I showed pictures of a thing called the Weimar Republic. You can go to any website and pull them out. It is what happens when money is no longer money. In other words, we are all so busy. We go to school and get a job to work for money. They never tell you what money is. One day, money is no longer money. What you are talking about has happened through history. It has happened for thousands of years. Once somebody figures out what money is, they aberrate it. They change it.
It started in Roman times when they got your coins and they debased it. They put base metals like lead, nickel and tin instead of silver and gold. Any time that has happened, poverty goes across the land. Mises also said that. He said that when you aberrate and extend credit, poverty increases. My whole shtick for all these years with Rich Dad Poor Dad and my other book Rich Dad’s Prophecy is that Federal Reserve money, printed money, any fiat currency today whether it is the yen or the euro, is impoverishing people.
That is why we were talking about it. One day we kind of wake up as adults and ask "What are we going to do about this?" In 1984, when I realized poverty was going to increase across the world, I did not know what to do. I just had to do something. That is what I wanted to talk to my friends about, the vision I saw for the future. You and Adam share the same vision. What happens if money is no longer money? What happens to society then?
Chris Martenson: It is a very interesting point. Money is tangible. It is real for all of our lives. That is how it really feels to us. But that is just an illusion. Once you study how money is actually created and you discover it is made out of thin air, then you realize that may be good or bad, but we had better be paying attention to how much is being created out of thin air. You and I share a number of the same charts that we might put up. One is this absolute exponential increase in money and debt, which are claims on real things.
You and I look over into the real world and we see that production is not increasing exponentially at the rate. There is a huge gap between the claims and the real stuff. My point of view is that it is better to have your hands on the real stuff because there will be a moment when people suddenly wake up. It will be a sociological event. We will say, “About all that money you have been printing, Federal Reserve—I don't feel so good.”
Robert Kiyosaki: Right. I say the same thing. The more money you print, the poorer we get. It has happened throughout history. Yet, people get up every morning and go to work. They work for money. If they get fired, they just get another job to work for more money. After a while, you have to wake up and ask "Why am I doing this? If they are printing money, why am I working for money?" That is what happened for me back in 1983. I just woke up and said I could not know what I know and allow this to go on. If you read my book Rich Dad, Poor Dad, people do not really get the message in the first chapter. The title of the first chapter is "The Rich Don’t Work for Money." That is why they are rich. Yet, you go to school to get a job to work for money. The more you are working for money, the poorer you are getting because of inflation and taxes. "What do you mean? I am making more money." But you are getting poorer. That is what we are saying. Isn’t it true?
Chris Martenson: If rich do not work for money, what do they work for?
Robert Kiyosaki: We print our own money. We have assets. There are different kinds of assets in the world. That was Rich Dad, Poor Dad. My poor dad worked for a paycheck. My rich dad worked to create assets. He was an entrepreneur. He built hotels. He built restaurants. He did not sell them; he just ran them as an entrepreneur. He built assets. If you read Rich Dad, Poor Dad, the definition of an asset is something that puts money in your pocket whether you work or not. A liability takes money from your pocket. My rich dad used to teach me that playing Monopoly, four green houses or one red hotel. With one green house, you get $10.00. That is an asset. There are financial assets, real property assets like real estate and IP assets, intellectual property assets. Every time I write a book, it is an asset, and more and more money comes in. The point here is that I am always converting cash into an asset. That is the difference. That was what Rich Dad, Poor Dad was about.
Chris Martenson: One of my first moves—I came to this story much later than you did, by the time I finally arrived at my own conclusions about where we were headed. One of the things I decided to do was take my physical paper dollars off the table and slide them over into gold and silver for a period of time, as I waited for some sort of a transition to happen. That was back in 2002. I hate to say it, but it has been fairly lucrative and profitable for me, at least on paper when I transfer these things back into paper assets if I do. I was trying to put my money into a place where it was safer, safe from the forces that I could see happening, even back in 2002. Excessive money printing and really poor fiscal control at the government level, both of those fiscal and monetary policies were just trying to print our way to prosperity, something I did not believe in.
Robert Kiyosaki: Right. They are taxing and printing. That is why the middle class is shrinking. That is why poverty is increasing in America. As Mises said, you expand credit, you impoverish the people. This has happened throughout history. Every time I see Mr. Greenspan, Bernanke or Mrs. Yellen standing up there talking about printing money, I wonder how in the world we got so stupid as American people. How did we get so stupid we can listen to these guys talking about money printing and thinking it is making us richer? Because they must know better. Do you think they know better Chris?
Chris Martenson: They have to know better. They have to. How could they not?
Robert Kiyosaki: If they know better and they continue to do it, then they are criminal. They are impoverishing a great country. I would say the American dream has turned into the entitlement mentality. I am not blaming the poor for having the entitlement mentality. I would say the entitlement mentality starts at the top of the country, not the bottom. That is really the problem, as the American dream goes, that they can make a better life for themselves, they say, "Well, I am entitled to a better life." There is a very big difference.
Chris Martenson: That is true. The amounts of welfare that are handed out on both the bottom and the top of the scale are staggering amounts. They are just huge. They are just wealth transfers, of course, coming out of the middle class and flowing in both directions. You mentioned the impoverishment of intelligence in the country. Let’s talk about education for a minute. I am a big believer of this idea that our educational system was designed to create people to work in factories. I think it did that brilliantly. But people do not work in factories anymore. We do have people coming out of school without the appropriate context to know what is happening when a Yellen, Bernanke or Greenspan says they are printing money. What are your views on that? How do we move in a better direction?
Robert Kiyosaki: That is why my rich dad and poor dad are opposites. My poor dad always said go to school and get a job. My rich dad said I would never learn to be an entrepreneur in school, so why go to school? He said to learn to be an entrepreneur and create jobs. The problem with most people leaving school is that they do not have the skill set to be entrepreneurs. The skill set for entrepreneurs is different than the skill sets for employees. For example, I have a college degree, a Bachelor of Science in Naval Architecture. I have never used it. When somebody asks how much money I make from my college degree, I say nothing because I do not use it. When I came back from Vietnam in 1973 as a Marine pilot, my poor dad said go to school and get a job, but my rich dad said I had better learn how to sell. Those are two different points of view.
I went to school to learn how to sell, whereas my poor dad wanted me to go to school and learn I don't know what—to climb the corporate ladder. After I learned how to sell, my rich dad said I still had to learn how to use debt because money is debt. Most financial experts say to get out of debt, which is good if you do not have any financial education. If you want to be rich, you have to know how to handle debt. It is called financing. How do you finance something and get richer with it? The third thing I had to learn was taxes. As you know, every time they print a dollar, two things happen. Inflation goes up and taxes go up. That is killing the people who are working for money. As long as you have a paycheck or you are on the cash society, your money is decreasing and your taxes are going up. That is the problem.
Chris Martenson: Let’s back up on debt for a second. I am regularly counseling people to get out of debt if they can, high yielding debt, non-productive debt and consumptive debt. What kind of debt are you talking about?
Robert Kiyosaki: There is good debt and bad debt. Consumption debt is always bad. Let’s say I go to dinner and I break out my American Express card because the dinner was $400. That dinner lasted an hour but the bill lasts forever. When I use debt to finance a piece of property or a business, even to bring a book out, that debt provides income each time. There is good debt and bad debt. Bad debt goes to buy liabilities like a house, a car, clothing and food. Good debt goes to buy assets, such as we are discussing. I am buying a hotel. Why am I buying the hotel? It has water rights and it has food. That is what I am buying it for, so I can produce from it. The idea is not consumption, but production. Good debt goes to production. Bad debt goes to consumption. Most people should get out of bad debt as consumption.
Chris Martenson: It is interesting. In your book Prophecy, you had put some timelines up. When you and I were comparing notes, they were eerily similar to some timelines I have had. In that timeline, you see some sort of a major market correction by 2016. When you peer over into that world of assets, which is one we are supposed to keep our eye on, right? It is just the equities, right? It is the stock market, our major signaling mechanism. Everybody is looking at the stock market. It is in the news every day. Is it up? Is it down? It is up and we are happy. You did not really believe in the stock market as a barometer of anything useful, did you?
Robert Kiyosaki: You and I had a similar experience. You put all this money into a mutual fund and some amount of money disappears. Where did the money go? I wrote another book called Who Took My Money. It is a system—there are the financial assets, which are stocks, bonds and mutual funds. There are real assets like real estate and oil wells. They produce stuff. I like the word you use, “claims.” The paper asset world is just a claim. It is so corrupt. It is so manipulated. There is no real value there. As you guys were telling my group of people, when you own a stock, you are the last guy in line. Everybody else gets paid before you when something bad happens. Stockholders are paid the least. They are the last guys standing in line, the stockholders. Why would you do that?
Chris Martenson: Yet that is what it is supposed to be when you are investing, you are supposed to be in stocks. It is an amazing feat of marketing. I think they have done an incredible job. I was just talking with another man today. His name is Michael Shuman. He talks about exactly what we are talking about, except he does it from the local investing side. He says that if you look at communities that are full of entrepreneurs, you have a lot of business start-ups and a lot of businesses that are thriving there, the per capita income is higher and the per capita job creation is higher. In every case, the defining factor is that these are real people who understand real value and how to provide it. They are providing it. That is where real prosperity comes from.
Robert Kiyosaki: Right. You look in communities where the entitlement mentality is alive and well. There is poverty. There is no production. It is a suck on production. It is all consumption or, "You owe me a living." It is horrifying, what has happened to the American dream. It has become the entitlement mentality, starting from the top. Ayn Rand warned us back in the 1950s that this was going to happen in her book Atlas Shrugged. It is happening. Today it is not Ayn Rand and Atlas Shrugged. It is The Hunger Games, where you have all these grotesque creatures in some major city that prey on the people who are producing. That is Washington, DC. None of the people are actually working out there. Atlas Shrugged has come true, and that is what is even more frightening.
Chris Martenson: I was horrified when George Orwell’s book 1984 started coming true in about 2003. It was almost like it was a blueprint. With Atlas Shrugged, you are right. It is literally following directly along the lines that she painted out at that point in time. Was it already obviously in motion when she was writing that? Did she make a killer prediction?
Robert Kiyosaki: You and I said this. It has been going on for thousands of years. Any time you have ambitious, greedy or ruthless people, the innocent people fall victim to it unless you fight back. If the people that control the money control everything, it is hard to fight back as a little person. That is why you and I concur, that we need to form our own little communities. I call them my "tribe." I have different tribes for different purposes. In the case of civil unrest, being a former Marine pilot, I have friends with guns. We are going to tribe up together. If it is a business, it is a different type of tribe and a different type of person. I have accountants and attorneys. I already have my house in the mountains ready to band together with my fellow Marines.
Chris Martenson: We are laughing about it, morbid humor. It is just sad that we can even have this conversation and it seems realistic. But, there is a wealth transfer coming up. That is what all my study of history shows me. It has been this way forever, for the same sets of reasons over time. Governments always end up following the same course of action. It seems easy to print. It fixes things. The budget seems to be fixed. John Law proved this. They had seven years of the most robust and incredible partying going on in Paris in the early 1700s because this guy John Law came along and convinced the French government to turn away from gold and silver and start printing bank notes.
The next seven years were amazing. There were parties. Paris was the number one destination for Persian carpets, rare spices and silks. Everybody was having a great time. Then it ended. You and I share the view that the same ending is going to happen. How is it that people can be on the right side of the wealth transfer when it happens, and not be on the wrong side?
Robert Kiyosaki: You said it best at the three-day in Phoenix. You have to pay attention. Most people are not paying attention. They are going out and working for money. Meanwhile, my rich dad in Rich Dad, Poor Dad—the rich do not work for money. I am not saying that is the answer. I am just saying to stop and think for a little while. Why are the rich not working for money? What are they doing? What am I doing wrong? Why am I paying so much more in taxes? Why am I getting upset with the government? Being an advocate of good financial education, we have no financial education in our schools. Do you ever wonder why that happened? We go to school to work for money, but there is no financial education in schools.
That is why I wrote Rich Dad, Poor Dad, I created my board games and my electronic games and all this. I believe there is a rich person in each and every one of us. But, we go to school to be told what to do. Education comes from the word "educe," to draw out of you. Inside of you is a rich person. Schools should draw out, educe, the rich person in you. What they do instead of educe is induce. They tell you to go to school and get a job. They train you to be an employee working for money. There is educe and induce. I believe personally that there is a rich person in every single one of us, whether you do well in school or not. The richest guys in the world today dropped out of school, Steve Jobs, Bill Gates, and Walt Disney.
What am I missing here? You went to school and you were programmed to get a job. Today, kids are coming out of school, like in Europe where 50% of the young people are unemployed or underemployed. They are still going to school to get a job. What is going wrong with that? It is because you have induced them with the idea that they should be an employee, not an entrepreneur.
Chris Martenson: It is fascinating to me. At your seminars, you like games. One of the games we played really drew out some of that behavior in people on both sides. There was a game where people had to raise capital. Some people did it just like that and knew what to do. They moved right into that space. Other people had more difficulty with that. A couple of people could not do it or did not want to. What was interesting to me in that was that it really clarified for me, something that I think is really vitally important. I talk a lot about how there could be a very disruptive future in front of us, economically and financially, who knows, maybe even more, with what we see in the Ukraine. There is war and social unrest looming over their heads.
In that moment, it is easy to see how some people moved easily into knowing what their value was and being able to offer it on the spot in order to participate in the game, the game of life as it were. Other people did not. I think that is valuable right there. If I could wave a magic wand and have people know something, it would be, what are those four things you uniquely do better than anybody else, that have value? I cannot imagine a more important thing for people to start figuring out right now.
Robert Kiyosaki: Yes. It is called What Do You Think of the Table. When little boys and girls are choosing their softball teams, if you do not bring anything to the team, you sit on the bench. That is what is going to happen. For me, as you know, I have lots of gold and silver. I have guns, lots of guns, lots of bullets and all this stuff. I do not want it to happen, but if it does happen, I am ready for it. At the same time, Mayor Bloomberg and all of them want to take our guns away. Why do they want to do that? Why are food stamps going up so high? Why is there no financial education in schools? I have to step back and say that there must be something else going on that I really do not know about. There is a bigger game going on. I think it is to impoverish us. That is really what I think it is. It is to make us little minion serfs who will do the beck and call of the uber rich. I would rather be rich and play by their rules, the same rules as the rich. I do not want to play by the rules of the middle class and poor, because those guys are paying the taxes.
Chris Martenson: The middle class have been the ones who have been footing the bill all these years, for everything that has been going on. We know the Federal government has just been borrowing its way toward the future. I guess if there was a plan, it was that somehow this miracle of economic growth would happen. But of course, economic growth happens when a lot of industrious people are productive. It requires resources that may or may not be there in the future. I think they will not be. We really have a mash-up in this story coming. You are absolutely right. From my perspective, when I look at both the education people get in school and the continuing education that happens across the airwaves, in the newspapers and the media, the American news has the least amount of context of any news that I go across and read.
What is happening in the Ukraine? I just read an interview that Putin gave. He started in the 1700s, so that people could understand the context of the Ukraine. It was valuable and important. There is a lot of context happening over there. Over here, it has been turned into a cartoon. We have to show Putin we are strong. There is no context. I really think that Americans are without really important context on a routine basis.
Robert Kiyosaki: I 100% agree with you. The problem with America is that we are too young. That might be the problem. We do not see far enough back in time and history. Our school systems and trading systems on Wall Street, they are trading minute to minute. They are missing the big picture. I'm a student of Dr. Buckminster Fuller, the guy who created the geodesic dome and all that. He says that if you want to be intelligent, you have to look at the biggest picture possible. Then you go to the small picture. What happens for most people is that they start small and go smaller. They become more highly specialized. I want to be a generalist and look at the big picture of the world, of what is going on with everything else, and then make my decisions.
I just started as a little kid at nine years old playing Monopoly with my rich dad. My poor dad was the head of the school system. My rich dad was my best friend’s father. At nine years old, I was playing Monopoly. I asked my rich dad why I was doing this. He said it was one of the formulas for great wealth. There are many formulas. You can marry somebody from money. That works too. You can win the lottery. That works too. You can get smart, and he said this was one of the games. We all know the formula for great wealth. It is four green houses and one red hotel, four green houses and one red hotel. I am nine years old and I ask him if that is all there is. He said that was it. Take your money and convert it to assets that print money and push money out. Today I have my big red hotel. I have my golf courses and all that. They all print money for me. Every month they send me money.
It is not that hard to do if you start with the right context of what you are doing. That is fundamentally it. The Monopoly game also has this interesting rule. It says in the rules of Monopoly that if the bank runs out of money, all the banker has to do is write money on a piece of paper. The Monopoly game taught me the context of how the game is played, at nine years old. I did not want to go back to school and get a job. That was my context. I knew I could print my own money like the bank did. I could just have a good time playing Monopoly. That was it.
Chris Martenson: I spent endless hours on that game. My favorite piece was the battleship. I think it does teach important lessons. Here we are. We are looking at—obviously the world economy is not behaving well. They are printing money like crazy. Is the advice here that people, if they are so inclined, should go out and start to learn those entrepreneurial skills? Could everybody be an entrepreneur? Or is this really a message for a subset of people?
Robert Kiyosaki: No, I believe there is a rich person in everybody. I also believe there is an entrepreneur in everybody. There is a young lady down the street and she is always selling lemonade. She is an entrepreneur. The woman who cleans my house is an entrepreneur. She is self-employed. Above that first level of entrepreneurship, of cleaning my house or selling lemonade, comes the next level of sophistication, education and experience. Most people say it is easier to get a paycheck so they go to work at McDonalds, rather than become an entrepreneur. That is what is happening. They do not have the education, experience or ambition to get out of what I call the "employee mindset" of working hard, getting a paycheck and paying taxes.
That does not make sense for my context. I would rather hire a lot of people to work hard and make a lot of money, and pay fewer taxes because the tax service, the Internal Revenue Service, rewards entrepreneurs and punishes employees. I am not the guy who did it. I am just reporting to you the way the system is rigged. Entrepreneurs get tax breaks and employees do not get tax breaks. That is the system.
Chris Martenson: It is the system. Your income gets taxed more heavily than your passive income, your active income. That is the system at present.
Your company has produced a game that is online now. This game, is this something that can help people begin to work with some of these concepts?
Robert Kiyosaki: Absolutely. I will say it again. I believe that inside of you is a rich person. My game "Cash Flow," or the board game Monopoly are to educe out of you the rich person. That is true education. The current system of education is an induction, they induce. They tell you what to do. You go to school and get a job. You work hard and you save money. You buy a house "because it is an asset" and you turn your money over to a financial planner so they can lose it. "Oh, I'm doing the right thing. I have a job. I'm working hard and paying taxes. I bought a house and I'm turning my money over to a financial planner and diversifying." You are going to get crushed. You and I are both saying the same thing. When the next crash comes, you are the guy who get crushed, unfortunately.
If you want to learn something new, play a game and then go do the real thing. It is really simple. It is called practice. In football, we practice and practice. In theater, it is called rehearsal. That is practice. But in the education system, you make a mistake and they punish you. That is why people do not get out of that box. What if I make a mistake? What if I lose my money? You should practice before you put your hard money in. You do not do that. You just turn your money over to a financial planner.
Chris Martenson: Here we are in early 2014. We see that the world is doing what it is doing. What would your advice be to anybody who's got—this is the most common thing I run into, people who come to my seminars and say, “Look, I am working this job. I am earning this paycheck. I am really not fulfilled by it. I know there is this other life I want to lead." But it is a really big gap between where they currently are and where they want to be. What are some practical ways to start closing that gap up?
Robert Kiyosaki: I guess it starts with discontent. You know in your gut that you are not on the right track for you. When I came back from Vietnam in 1973, my poor dad said to go back and get my Master’s, my Ph.D. and work for the government. In my gut, I knew that was not for me. It might be for you, but it is not for me. To thine own self be true. The second thing after what you want to be is what role model you want. My rich dad was my best friend’s dad in Hawaii. It is not easy, but I had to want that. The problem with education is it gives you the right answer and then you take the test. In real life, you take the test and you have to find your own answers out there. It is not easy. You have to be a very active learner. Every day I am making so many mistakes that it makes me sick. When am I going to stop doing this? It is painful. That is how we learn. A kid learns to walk by falling down. Most kids leave school saying that if they fall down, they are stupid. That is not real life. That is why most schoolteachers are not rich. They have big paychecks and 401Ks, but they are not rich people. There is a big difference.
Chris Martenson: That is absolutely invaluable insight there. I want to thank you for the warm reception that Adam and I had at the off-site there that you conducted in Phoenix. It was a wonderful experience. I was really gratified that a lot of people took the time to say that The Crash Course was a book that resonated with them and provided some framing that they found useful and helpful. Adam’s story and my story were stories of entrepreneurship. We both took big risks. We jumped off because we were dissatisfied with our current lives. We had to do something different. Now we have built some assets around that. Somehow, we managed to follow the path you recommend. I am just one person who is saying it works.
Robert Kiyosaki: What you saw in the workshop is my team, my advisors, the team of nine. We are tight. We have my accountants, my attorneys, my guys who raise capital for me and my sales guys, all that stuff. We are a team. That is what makes you rich. I talked about—you have to be a master of pieces. I put accountants, attorneys and bankers all together. That is how I get rich. In school, rather than being a master of the pieces you become one of the pieces. You come out of school as an accountant or attorney. The entrepreneur comes in and puts you together with the rest of their team. You are either the master of pieces as an entrepreneur or one of the pieces from the school system. What you guys are doing right now is becoming the master of the pieces, putting your own team together, or your community, or your tribe. That is what is going to cause us to survive.
Chris Martenson: There is a great lesson in there, whether it is in business or in people’s communities. This conforms so well with the future I see coming. We need to disconnect from the larger systems, forget what they are telling us, or even take whatever they are telling us and reverse it 180 degrees and take that as the truth. We have to start thinking for ourselves, planning for ourselves and controlling what we can, knowing we cannot control everything. And become that "master of the pieces" in our own communities.
Robert Kiyosaki: Right, especially when it comes to the world of money, as you and I will probably agree. That is probably the most corrupt of all. It is so corrupted. The moment they could print money, it became more corrupt. For people to go to school and work to make a high salary, you are probably going down the wrong trail. The more money they print, the harder you have to work. Mises says the more we print money, the poorer we get and the more impoverished people get. You had better start thinking differently. How do you convert your money into an asset? That is what you and Adam have done.
Chris Martenson: Absolutely. There is a lot of advice on that at our website, Peak Prosperity. We have been working on that. We really hope to be rounding all of that out. Robert, thank you so much for your time today. I am really looking forward to developing a relationship with you and your organization. What you are doing is really vitally important. It is about educating people and providing the right context so that people can make their own decisions. It is really just arming people with important information. I think that is great work. I want to commend you for that.
Robert Kiyosaki: Thank you. As I said at the seminar, the definition of intelligence is if you agree with me, then you are intelligent. You guys are really intelligent. Thank you. You guys have really blessed my organization. A lot of times they said, “That is what you are trying to tell me.” I said yes. They do not listen to daddy. They listen to somebody else. You get the message across.
Chris Martenson: Sometimes it takes a couple of teachers. That is fine. Thank you for that.
Robert Kiyosaki: Thank you guys. Keep up the great work.
Chris Martenson: Thank you. You too. Be well.
Robert Kiyosaki: Right. Bye.