What kind of land should I buy.

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gemel's picture
gemel
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What kind of land should I buy.

Hi,

What kind of farm land should I buy ?

I have been scanning the classifieds and I have seen all kinds of different types from praries to forests to leisure land with orchards . I am buying with the intention of investment + as a use when the hard time hit if ever.

Should I get land which is good for agriculture or good for keeping animals an orchard or a pine forest ?

How far away should the land be from major cities ? (here in western europe we are pretty crowded, example 1,5 hours from the capital and you have passed half the country!)

How would I know the soil was not abused in the past ?

Should I buy an orchard, should I opt for placing a caravan or having a "farm house" built ?

I know water is important, is it worth buying without a stream or a bore hole or a well ?

New to this and cannot afford to make mistakes ...

if you live in western europe do not hesitate to PM me if you have specific tips ..

Have you gone through this experience, any tips ?

Thanks

Mr G

 

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Tycer
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Re: What kind of land should I buy.

For me, a stream was #1 on the list. Water, power, animal habitat. Next was at least 1/2 acre(.2 Hectare) of farmable land. Next was a couple of nut and fruit trees established. Hardwoods on the North or East side of the property for firewood until I get my firewood hedgerows growing. A community full of young farmers thinking of natural farming techniques (Transition Town?) was also on my list. I moved in January. Harvested my first strawberry yesterday.

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joemanc
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Re: What kind of land should I buy.

Water is very important. Having a stream on the property is great, or even nearby. Might want to consider what the source of the stream is, and whether others may want to tap into it in the future. If you need to dig a well, you might want to ask people who live in that area what they know about the water tables.

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Full Moon
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Re: What kind of land should I buy.

 That is a challenging  one in your situation .    You get a lot of rain so you should be able to store water  but a well or creek would be a bonus. 

Far enough from the crowd of the city  but close enough you could go out on weekends and holidays to get it ready .  Could you keep your eye open for a place that the folks have established but going to retire ?  If you are only going to feed yourself and a couple others  you can improve the soil  but if you are going to grow abundance to feed many or to sell you will want one that is very fertile .   We are tooting the peak oil horn here but I would get in the car and drive around the country and pray .  Something will draw you .   Also  think further ahead   because if you have children it will need to be something worthy of passing down .  

  I  choose  a place  with river bottom land  for crops  and high ground for pasture .   10 miles from any population  with wells on it and spring near by .   I bought it with an old farm house that was set up  . But often wonder if I should not have  built new.  I bought it 15 years ago for  $15,000 .    My dad bought a similar place down the road a few miles at $100 an Acre .  We will be here to care for them and help each other out .

 You really can not go wrong if you improve upon a place .  Wheat grows , corn ripens , people eat  even if all the banks in the world may break , a time to plant and a time to harvest . This has happened even before banks were invented and will when the banks and oil have become obsolete .

 And my grandbabies picked 2 gallon of strawberries yesterday ... SO much tastier than store boughten ones that were shipped from who knows where .    We had a fun time .

 FM .

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that1guy
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Re: What kind of land should I buy.

15,000.....thats awesome....I cant find deals like that stateside anymore......hmmm, or maybe I was looking in the wrong place, LOL....

 

Its ok, looking overseas now =)

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Luc
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What kind of land should I buy.

 

We formed a group with a S.E.N.C. (société en nom collectifs) and plan on buying around 800 acres over time.

We have just bought 205 arpents or about 170 acres.

This land has no wood left on it just framland.

The next one will have to have wood. The earth is filled with water. The nape fréatique (underground water) is high and very healthy.

We have financed the share of a young farmer so he can be part of the group. This is a must.

A lawyer has set up the terms of agreement betwen us.

The young farmer's dad has dealt the deal with the other farmer (seller).

The farm has the name of the young farmer and nobody knows that he represents a group of invertors (new farmers)

This way the price of the farm and future farms reflects the true local value.

My experience in the past is that as soon as they see a city guy asking about the price of the land they add 30 % to the sale price.

I hope this helps.

 

I would have a question regarding the type of earth that is good for different fruit threes.

The farm land is very good for corn, soya , avoine (oat) I do not know what type of fruit trees would grow well on this land.

The land is a sandy loam. 

Would anyone know what type of fruit threes grows well in this type of earth.

Where could I access this type of information.

Thank you very much.

Luc

 

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deggleton
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Re: What kind of land should I buy.

A south-facing slope is very helpful.  Slope that enables capturing/storing water high on the property and employing gravity to put it to use here and there is good, too.  Make sure you have a building site that is not in a flood plain!

If you obtain land that is not very fertile already, you can build fertility surprisingly quickly with active management of grazing animals.  Look up Holistic Management and Joel Salatin (whom you saw/heard in Food, Inc. and/or Fresh, The Movie).

Luc wrote:

I would have a question regarding the type of earth that is good for different fruit threes.

The farm land is very good for corn, soya , avoine (oat) I do not know what type of fruit trees would grow well on this land.

The land is a sandy loam. 

Would anyone know what type of fruit threes grows well in this type of earth.

Where could I access this type of information.

Thank you very much.

In the USA, the federal government has mapped soil types from coast to coast, and public universities have agriculture departments that provide soil analysis services.  You can send samples and receive a report on each one.  Look for such in your contexts.

As for fruit trees that will grow in your area, ask those involved in agriculture and gardening in your area and/or at markets.  Look for a permaculture guild in the region, too.

David

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Luc
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Re: What kind of land should I buy.

deggleton

 

Thank you for your information

I will look into it

Have a good day

Luc

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deggleton
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Re: What kind of land should I buy.
deggleton wrote:

A south-facing slope is very helpful.

Ooops!  South- should be equator-.

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VeganDB12
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Re: What kind of land should I buy.

What a great thread. I hope it stays alive for a while.

I haven't bought land yet but I feel having a water source is a priority too. However,  tiny little streams that are barely a trickle can really get flooded in a sustained downpour. And fast.

So the only thing I feel I can add (or ask) is to consider flood risks when putting the property on the land with the stream. Uphill seems better but it depends on local drainage, weather conditions, etc... I live in a city right now and we get flooded regularly from our local streams but that is because they built over the dirt that is supposed to soak up and drain away the rain.   So it is an issue near and dear to my heart.

Best wishes

Denise

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Re: What kind of land should I buy.

  Good points , There is no way I would choose to live below a dam ... City or country .  Which might be hard because the towns were put in before the dams .  We are 50 miles above a dam  our low lying fields do get early floods  every ten years or so  but this is not a bad thing . They grow great crops .

  When our little town was established the pioneers were told by the Indians where  the best place to put the town was . So that it was protected from tornado's and such .    It is in a valley at the  Y  of two small rivers .   So  in 150  it holds true . ..Towns not 15 miles away have been hit  but we have been skipped .  Also these same natives lived in a dug out yurt kind of structure  to protect them from extreme weather .  Of course we now have basements  and root cellars .

   It seems that a place to call home is just going to become more important as the world crumbles around us .

 Luc ,do not plant your trees on the low land   as it is more prone to frost .  And  planting them  on the the North side of the house works best here because the sun does not hit them and start the sap to flow as early  to start the budding . Putting heavy cover of straw mulch  will give you a while longer .

  There is much to consider buying the best place for you .  And I would say that the people and  your circle of those that you depend on would be   High priority .   You can work around a not so perfect place if you have established friends with multiple skills .

Let us know how it goes for you .

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Luc
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Re: What kind of land should I buy.

Thank you very much for the good info Full Moon.

I will have to think hard in order to plant to the north brcause of the Dryer and the silos and just after is the field (there is no house).

I live close to montréal at 1 hour from the farm which is located between Montréal and Québec city.   

I will consult the young farmer and his dad to see how I could plant to the north.

Its funy how they kindly laugh at me when I bring those types of issues ( planting threes )

In their minds its more important to learn to drive the tractor and adjust the machinery to plant the seeds.

I just did my first lesson at backing up the tractor with the wagon. I did alright with a little bit of help.

I tell them that I have the rest of my life to learn the farming skills needed.

And there are a lot of them.

Its a goog thing that I built self managed cottages before because I can fit with them.

They have to know all the trades and do everything on their own in order to survive financially.

I just spent five hours in the field picking up rocks. I felt so good afterwards.

We had good laughs throughout and slept like a baby.

I certainly did not think about peak oil that night. 

good night

Luc

 

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Re: What kind of land should I buy.

I have 53 acres on the edge of a city of 350,000. It is currently servicing the equestrian community but could be quickly converted to a more survival oriented posture. I've been here for 24 years and can tell you what I value. First would be a good source of groung water. When I had my well drilled we hit water at several different depths but kept drilling until we hit a large layer of gravel at 100 feet. Besides an unlimited supply of excellent drinking water, I installed an open loop geothermal system that supplies all my heating and air conditioning needs plus most of my water heating requirments. Next I would say that I value the 7 acre woodlot. I have a wood burning fireplace in the house and if necessary would have a sustainable source of fuel for heating and cooking. A few acres to grow some fruits and vegetables are an asset. A barn of some sort to raise some animals would be a consideration. Some stortage area is a great bartering item. I had a pond dug out which besides being a great swimming venue, contains 250,000 gallons of drinkable fresh water.

I see that many people suggested a stream. While it sounds nice, a stream generally means flood plain, not good. Streams are vulnerable to everything upstream and therefore cannot be trusted for quality. I do have a small stream running through my property but found the only use to be a source of close water for some garden plots, otherwise I could do without it..

The best attribute of my property is the privacy. The closest neighbour is 3/4 kilometer away, on the other side of the forest.

 

 

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Wendy S. Delmater
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Re: What kind of land should I buy.

Luc,

It seems you have already bought your land, so I might take a stab at how to use it. And you say there is no house yet, but you know a little about building and ask about trees. Let me suggest something, then. In your climate decidious trees are used to shade a home in the summer. In  the winter, when the leaves fall, the sun can help warm the home.

Also, if you are farming, a row of trees in between each field acts as a "wind break" and keeps the valuable topsoil from blowing away. There is no reason not to plant these rows wider than needed for a wind break so that you can cut some of them for firewood, or sell wood, or use  the wood in other ways. Be aware that harsh winters can be very hard on young trees: use varieties that are native to the area and that should not be a problem.

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Full Moon
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Re: What kind of land should I buy.

  Our kids have oppertunity to buy the house they rent  for 10K .  I do not see how this can be a bad move .   The town has 1000 people and is tied to the farming community .     I lean towards telling them to go for it  . They can always get another person or two to move in and share expenses if things get tight for them .    Then they will have freedom to start preping more .

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Luc
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Re: What kind of land should I buy.

Thank you safewrite,

safewrite

I will certainly plant trees closeby the little house.  I like your idea.

When I will build the shack I will digg 4 feet and lay some 1.5 inches plastic tubing that I will fill with sand for air conditionning in the summer and 3 degrees air in the winter.   Then I will build the footing and lay 4 inches of concrete.  In the concrete I will insert tree quarter inch heating tubes hooked on to a water heater filled with glycol. This will be the only source of heat.  The walls will be insulated with old (foam) doors that I get for almost nothing at a compagny in the industrial area by my home. The walls will be R 32 ( r20 is the code in Quebec) and the roof will be R55 (R30 is the code).   

Have a good day

Luc

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