Value of gold

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Mean's picture
Mean
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Joined: Oct 24 2008
Posts: 6
Value of gold

Meddelande

Everything is valued in relation to something else.
There is a limited amount of recourses the
world so if you start with $1 = 1g gold = 1 stock = 1L oil  =phone = 1 gun

When something shift you always want to transform you
assets to the one that comes out on top.

Today we can see a massive shift when the stock
market an oil price is falling. Even when it seems like a lot of money is gone
it in only a shifting of relations. This really means this is happening $1 = 2
stock = 2L oil. So you cash is acually worth more now.

If we have a massive inflation this is happening  $2
= 1g gold = 1 phone

Is really something useless as gold the right stuff
to invest in? Gold is only valued what people believe its worth kind of like
paper money.

I don't think
governments will let the banks fall because they are to dependent on the system.
They will rebuild it some way or die trying. But lets first assume banks
crashes.

If banks
collapse then the government will collect all the debts people have to the banks and passing it out to
whomever borrowed the money to the bank. Trying to force the money creation
process backwards. In this case you don't want do have cash or loans in the
bank. Gold can then be a good option but so can anything and why not owned
something useful? Maybe something that produces
energy..

If you get a total social collapse then nobody will
collect anything. The police and government will stop working. In this case a
major loan is a good thing as you will not be forced to pay it back. Then on the
other hand someone can just come and take everything your hording. Your the only
one standing in the way. Then we ponds can be the smartest investment. Also
getting close to the production of recourse is another strategic choice. Become
a farmer and make sure you have some wind power plants to cover your needs. You
will also need to be heavily armed because massive starvation will take place
and the farms will be the place to rob if you don't farm and like to
eat.

 

The real problems will begin when food production
limits hit the consumption. If energy recourse decrees so will food production.
When we hit peek oil and don't have an alternative energy source countries like
India, china and most African countries will starve. When there is no more oil
in the Arabic world they will starve to. Because
countries will stop exporting food.

Next people will be fighting for there life. So the
guys with most guns will try to make sure they cover there needs first. Like
securing energy production with any means available. If you live in a country
that's already importing the majority off the consumed food or energy and don't
have much off an army your in for a bumpy ride. If you produce and export lots
off recourses like oil or food you will be a target and better get armed or get
an armed friend that don't turn around and rob you.

The only ways around this problem is to 

1 Find new ways to produce energy.

2 limit population.

China started with the population problem some time
ago but it might have been to late depending on what will happened to oil the
pike. India is in big trouble as I see it. If you fail to reduce
population in time nature will do it for you. The hard way

.'s picture
.
Status: Silver Member (Offline)
Joined: Oct 22 2008
Posts: 167
Re: Value of gold

Uggghhh!!!!

 you post read to hard.  it make me head hurt.  nEst time readproof!  

     Rape pillage and plunder, but not necessarily in that order.  Remember the three "F's" for the post apocalyptic world that is just around the corner...

Food

Fuel

Firearms

 

 

moneyone's picture
moneyone
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Posts: 2
Re: Value of gold

Maybe not.

Already smart people are forming communities of the future and many that 'could' have moved to rural locations where a sense of community can more easily exist because families within the community are smaller. We moved from a Central California sprawling metropolis four years ago to Oregon. We live at the 'end of the trail' in a neighborhood of large parcel landowners.

Our neighbors, not surprisingly, are scientists, law enforcement retirees, commercial fishermen, and Oregon natives who understand the land and it's potential bounty more than us 'greenhorns' could have grasped just five years ago. We are already working together to create a complete and totally self-sustaining enviroment where our family and friends can find refuge should the unthinkable become reality in the not too distant future. We also have the ability to defend our homes and families if the need should arise.

Such neighborhood communities are possible in almost any location, but first people must be educated in the realities of our economic situation such as the Crash Course provides so they don't fall victim to beliefs connected with specific politicians and promises they are unlikely to deliver. Once educated, people must reach out in their own communities to work together collectively using their physical and intellectual assets to devise a plan to best react to threat or shortages in necessary goods and services.

Going it totally 'alone' in a crisis many of us envision as potentially catastrophic is not an option compatible with the coming 'living on less' most of America's people are going to face...sooner or later. God Bless us All. 

 

 

Ray Hewitt's picture
Ray Hewitt
Status: Gold Member (Offline)
Joined: Apr 5 2008
Posts: 458
Re: Value of debt

This chart measures return on debt. What does it mean?

Karl Denninger explains:

... the economy only grows at a rate of about 20 cents for every dollar of debt taken on.  That is, it takes five dollars of debt to generate one new dollar of GDP.

The bad news is that once you reach the "$1 for $1" level you are no longer able to finance growth with debt, and it becomes inevitable that you will begin to finance debt with debt.

That, of course generates no GDP at all but precipitously tightens the spiral.

We crossed that Rubicon roughly around 1968, and you have had this fact concealed from you.

The full article is worth a read.  http://market-ticker.denninger.net/archives/618-Congress-What-Bernanke-and-Hank-Arent-Telling-You.html It gets worse.

The Truth is that we now require about $5 of debt to generate $1 of GDP.

The Truth is that the reason you [Congress] were not asked to approve $700 billion to capitalize 10 new banks, thereby creating seven trillion in lending capacity is that the economy cannot soak up that new lending capacity; each dollar of new debt generates almost no aggregate GDP.  If this were not true then that would be the logical and effective cure for the 'credit crunch" - if the borrowing capacity and impact on GDP necessary to help existed.  They do not. 

The Truth is that if we reach the point where a dollar of debt has a NEGATIVE impact on GDP The United States monetary system and government will implode.  The reason for this is mathematically obvious - each additional dollar of borrowing beyond that point actually contracts GDP instead of growing it; this is, for all intents and purposes, a "black hole".  It is that event that has led to the implosion of other monetary systems such as the hyperinflationary implosion of Argentina.

 

Liam's picture
Liam
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Posts: 16
Re: Value of gold

I have been hearing some talk around this website of the coming bad times, how to prepare for it, and what we can expect. It scares me when I hear people planning to buy weapons, hide food, and ignore the plight of our fellow man. It is obvious that the same thinking that created this change will not solve the problem. I would ask you to please remember that worrying is praying for bad things to happen. I am preparing myself for this coming change, not nessecarily to save myself, but to aid as many people as I can. Many, many people and religiouns have been predicting this change, some philosophies for centuries. they all seem to agree on two things. 1) This time is a blessing, one where we will experience dramatic shifts in consciousness, ways of living, and quality of life( in the emotional sense), all for the better, IF we approach this transformation in a positive, educated, compassionate way.     2) this period will encompass very scary, serious times.

My advice is to see these series of catastrophies as a blessing, and to ALWAYS strive to uphold one's faith and trust in humanity. People will not steal what is already theirs, nor will they attack their helpers. Focus less on saving oneself, more on saving others, and your survival will be assured. 

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joe2baba
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Posts: 807
Re: Value of gold
you are not from new orleans i take it liam
gyrogearloose's picture
gyrogearloose
Status: Platinum Member (Offline)
Joined: Sep 8 2008
Posts: 537
Re: Value of gold
[quote=Liam]

I have been hearing some talk around this website of the coming bad times, how to prepare for it, and what we can expect. It scares me when I hear people planning to buy weapons, hide food, and ignore the plight of our fellow man.

[/quote]

Chris is very clear that we should try and make others aware of the coming changes, form communities, help other people.

Buying guns is to protect our hard won assets from those who would use guns to take them. 

In hard time those who have not prepared despite warnings, have a choice. ASK for help and, help where they can and accept that their standard of living will not be the same as others. 

For those who make the choice to pick up a gun and demand, society has always condemned them.

danaroypatton's picture
danaroypatton
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Posts: 4
Re: Value of gold

>>>"you are not from new orleans i take it liam"

 laughing my arse off

Mean's picture
Mean
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Joined: Oct 24 2008
Posts: 6
Re: Value of gold

I love to help my fellow man if I can. Problem is that there is 6,7 billion people on the planet and ricing. This number is possible because there is a huge saved energy on the planet that dos the labor for us. 1 person can grow food for thousands because he lets the external energy do the physical labor for him.

The planet can only support a limited amount of people ( wishing will not change this fact ) By using external energy we can push this number higher then natural. By borrowing from an energy reserve we can push it even higher then what we can do by using the energy we produce. We are burning the saved resources in an escalating rate and the only thing that looks like its going to stop us is when we hit a brick wall. Do you want the job deciding, enforcing and reduction the world population with 90% ?

Then the first thing that will happened is that energy prices skyrocket. Then follows food price followed by most everything. Next comes economical problems off post kinds depending how the problems is countered. My guess it that this will happened in waves several times and worth every time.

When food skyrocket there will be people that have trouble paying for it. So people will starve. We are waaay beyond the point where everyone can just grow the food they need. This will be worth for every wave and starvation will limit the people on the planet.

As the oil gets more and more depleted the number off people the planet can support will drop. The limits will be put in place by nature and she will not be gentle. According to http://www.poodwaddle.com/worldclock.swf we run out of oil in 47 years.

The good news for most off us is that we are on top of the food chain sitting on most of the accumulated resources created through the years. If your country is not to heavily populated and have other energy production systems you will be hit the least. The price on transportation will skyrocket to so fighting world wars to secure food will get to expensive. Just transporting the food will be to expensive.

So if your country don't secure energy, food and defense in that order you need to do it yourself. First we will run out if energy. Then food will get scarce. Next the people without food will fight for there life to get some. If they do secure this gold might be a good Ide. Then on the other hand the currency will probably hold to. There is shitloads of gold stanched up and if governments let that out the value of gold will drop hard.

barrt's picture
barrt
Status: Silver Member (Offline)
Joined: Aug 25 2008
Posts: 171
Re: Value of gold

as for the price of glod, a few good pointer are;

1 http://www.thebulliondesk.com/ you can check the price of the lease rates for gold here, ie what bankers charge each other to lend gold, it has gone up 200% in the lst few weeks!!! (click on gold prices, then select Lease rates fromt the drop down list

3 Elliotwave.com are consistantly good predictors, they have been predicting gold $650 to $600 in the next few weeks, others say the same thing, im going to be loading up when it begins to approach 650

4 the comex problem, smater people than me expect problems mid way through november when contracts become due for the actaul delivery of the metal for december, these are due mid november too

so, watch the lease rate chart and the spot price over the nest few weeks for the best buying time

although personally i dont think thats as important as just having some to store your wealth in, entrey price is not too important really is it in the face of all this!

good luck amigos

gyrogearloose's picture
gyrogearloose
Status: Platinum Member (Offline)
Joined: Sep 8 2008
Posts: 537
Re: Value of gold

[quote=Mean]

Just transporting the food will be to expensive. So if your country don't secure energy, food and defense in that order you need to do it yourself. First we will run out if energy. Then food will get scarce. Next the people without food will fight for there life to get some. If they do secure this gold might be a good idea. Then on the other hand the currency will probably hold to. There is shitloads of gold stanched up and if governments let that out the value of gold will drop hard. [/quote]

 If by currency you mean those funny bits of paper the government is so fond of printing in ever larger denominations.....

By the time people are fighting for food, those bits of paper would most likely be getting used to cook the next meal. 

 As to the 8133 tons the US govt has, at $25.75 million per ton is only $209 billion ( wiki numbers ) Drop in the bucket.....

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