Questions to Kiwis

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Nime's picture
Nime
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Questions to Kiwis

Hi all Kiwis!

Some questions I have regarding NZ and its situation in the coming crisis:

- how strong famillies and traditional values are in NZ? (this is important for how the society will hold in a crisis - societies are built out of famillies, not unstable "open relationships" so common now)

- how safe is it outside of main cities?

- how much of what you eat is imported? How well would you be able to do without it?

- apart from oil is there anything important you could not function without?

- how Orwellian the government is?  Do you have ID cards? Personal numbers? 

- armed forces - any chance of them turning against the population and creating a NWO-like total control in the name of "security"?

- gun laws - are you armed?

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Re: Questions to Kiwis

New Zealand is extremely safe outside of the main cities, especially in the south island.  New Zealand raises a lot of its own table food, but naturally a lot of things are imported as well.  Guns are illegal to own in New Zealand, and the police do not even carry weapons.  The Government is not Orwellian at all, and I would say there would be a zero percent chance of the army turning against the population.  If the Maori could have lived there for hundreds of years with a lot less than the country has now, then New Zealand could be perfectly self sustaining if you don't mind mutton. 

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Re: Questions to Kiwis

I love mutton. And wool. :)

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Re: Questions to Kiwis

Guns are legal to own if you get a gun licence.

Crime rates are not realy any better than many western countries.

We export something like 90% of the food we produce

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Re: Questions to Kiwis
Nime wrote:

- how strong famillies and traditional values are in NZ? (this is important for how the society will hold in a crisis - societies are built out of famillies, not unstable "open relationships" so common now)

People of pacific heritage make up a significant portion of the population and have mostly maintained strong family. People of european heritage are more itinerant and mostly have weaker family link. Rural communities are quite strong and help each other. People are very self reliant. Many have food gardens. Through marriage the population is gradually becoming more pacific in heritage.

Nime wrote:

 

- how safe is it outside of main cities?

 

It is quite safe. I live in a South Island provincial town with about 35,000. We can walk around the town centre at night without problems. We leave our doors unlocked when we go out but keep the vehicle locked when out. Have been here more than 20 years never been victim of any 'crime'.

Nime wrote:

- how much of what you eat is imported? How well would you be able to do without it?

 

Industrial mono cropping has had the same effect here as elsewhere. It would take quite a while for us to be able to feed ourselves without oil. Our sea and foreshore although depleted are still productive in some remote places

Nime wrote:

- apart from oil is there anything important you could not function without?

Without transport life would be much harder

Nime wrote:

 

- how Orwellian the government is?  Do you have ID cards? Personal numbers? 

- armed forces - any chance of them turning against the population and creating a NW.control in the name of "security"?

Government is generally innocuous. No ID cards, no numbers. No chance of armed forces against pop 

Nime wrote:

- gun laws - are you armed?

 

Most guns are owned by people licensed by police and used for recreational hunting or pest control. Very few people have guns, at a guess maybe one in 100 households or less.

Don

___________________

Store fed, store owned

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Re: Questions to Kiwis

Hi Nime,

All of NZ has a good climate, though there is a range cool temperate, alpine to sub tropical. You shouldn't go hungry here, even on a small area of land.

I live in the Bay of Islands, Far North of NZ. We have a warm climate and can grow a huge range of food, Good rainfall and soil, I have pineapple, avocado and banana ripening well but also the usual northern european crops as well. Our electricity comes from our local geothermal plant - consumer owned with dividends paid to consumers annually. About 75% of NZ electricity is generated from renewables, we also have good gas reserves and significant oil. Most of our international trade is from agriculture, tourism, forest products (plantation) fisheries and some high tech. In common with a lot of western type economies, consumer type manufacturing has shifted to low labour cost countries (China).

Family and traditional values are strongest away from the main centres, in the cities I would say similar to the US. The Maori people (I am part Maori) have strong family ties unfortunately strained thanks to adjustments to European values.

We only import some luxury foods as answered above

We are a small country so most complex  manufactured products (motor vehicles etc) are imported for reasons of scale. We could cover most our existing transport needs with domestic oil, nat. gas, and electricity(renewable. We could function to a reasonable level with no external inputs.

No ID cards or Internet restrictions

I don't know about the chances of the military turning against the population, fairly low key sort of outfit, I can't even imagine the circumstances that would initiate such a response so can't really answer that one.

You can obtain a gun licence relatively easily, clean police record and no mental illness required. Low level of gun ownership.

There is a thread already started on this site for folk wanting to find out more about immigrating to NZ, you will find some excellent comments and links here.  

http://www.peakprosperity.com/forum/kiwi-overseas-looking-new-zealand-contacts/13004

Cheers,

David 

 

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Re: Questions to Kiwis

First of all, thank you for your responses. You have been most helpful and good ambasadors for your country.

Re. family - I ask, because family has been ruined through most of the West by many factors, including rejection of God and widespread replacement of religious belief with mindless consumption. I follow also this blog and a few times I have read most worrying things about the situation in NZ in that respect, including anti-family indoctrination in schools, pro-abortion legislation and other stuff that has made places like the UK what they are today. 

Re. the Internet - I heard Internet censorship is coming fast to Australia, something quite close to what China has already implemented with "wrong" views and texts filtered out. I heard too there is an effort in the NZ to force ISPs to disconnect Internauts "breaking copyright" and denounced by the recording industry. How does the situation on the ground look like to you living there? Were you aware of those actions?

 

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Re: Questions to Kiwis

I copied these notes from an article  on ecomigration in Washington Post (? I think) that said

In the recent Global Peace Index, New Zealand finished among the most peaceful countries at No. 4. The U.S. is ranked 97. -- According to the Seventh United Nations Survey of Crime Trends, New Zealand has a murder rate among the lowest in the world, ranking the 10th lowest out of 62 countries. The U.S. ranks 24th. -- New Zealand has low rates for MRSA, infectious disease, HIV, AIDS and Hepatitis B and C, and its blood supply is considered among the safest in the world. 

New Zealand would offer a comparable quality of life, has an excellent environmental record and is isolated from global conflicts by large tracts of the Pacific Ocean. Its tropical, subtropical, temperate and arctic zones also offer a variety of "bioenvironments" as a hedge against the vagaries of climate change.

New Zealand's environmental credentials are no secret: Nearly half of all skilled migrants to the country cite its "climate or the clean, green environment to be a main reason" for moving there, according to a survey conducted by the nation's Department of Labor.

Although the nation of 4.3 million produces only one-fifth of 1 percent of the world's greenhouse gases, it is ramping up production of energy from renewable sources, said Roy Ferguson, New Zealand's ambassador to the United States.

LARINA/David I think your idea of KIWI Connection forum is needed as there are hits and misses on the subject that people keep coming back too.

I was at a KEA London event and tried to make some links there too.

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Re: Questions to Kiwis

LARINA/David I think your idea of KIWI Connection forum is needed as there are hits and misses on the subject that people keep coming back too.

I was at a KEA London event and tried to make some links there too.

http://www.keanewzealand.com

Questions I still have are:

where to build a community ... I have extended family ties in South Is. but not sure I would like the cold.  Karamea is a place I plan to check out this year though

I grew up in Auckland but do not wish to be there.  Studied in Hamilton but do not like being so inland.

Challenges ...

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Re: Questions to Kiwis

A web site I'd recommend is Move2Nz. Interesting advice for would-be migrants.

BTW - in their last newsletter they sent this alarming update:

 

Rising crime in schools

Police in SchoolsIn 2008 Police were called 1,658 times to attend
schools throughout New Zealand to deal with violence, drugs or sex offences.

These figures were released under the Official Information Act and show
officers were called out an average of 1,531 times each year from 1998. Over
the past decade violent offences jumped 27 per cent from 869 to 1,064.

School enrolments rose only 4 per cent between 2001 and 2009 – so statistically
these results are alarming.

 

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Re: Questions to Kiwis

Crime in NZ cont.

New Zealand has an image of being a safe, clean country at the end of the world. Considering moving from where we are now we started to look at hard data about different countries, and we were quite surprised to see the statistics:

  • NZ persecutes 31.059 persons per 1,000 people, which is 3rd in the world, and more than places like Turkey or Belarus (source),
  • There are 7.47881 assaults per 1,000 people in the NZ, which is far less than South Africa (people from SA flee in thousands, many of them to NZ) but is a level not different than US at 7.56923 or UK at 7.45959, also much more than most of Europe (appropriate number for Poland is 0.850459, in Germany 1.4183) (source),
  • Burglaries - also NZ in the top ten at 16.2763 per 1,000 people - again, more than UK, more than US, (source),
  • Car theft - NZ at #4 at 5.45031 per 1,000 people, way more than most of EU (eg. Germany 1.00767) and quite amazing given that this is a remote island inhabited by 4 mln people - so what happens with all those stolen vehicles? It would seem an easy thing to crack given the small size of the population and the fact that stolen cars are not shipped out of the country so they must be "consumed" locally. (source),
  • Rapes -NZ didn't make top ten at 0.213383 per 1,000 people, but is still worse than UK (@ 0.142172) or most of continental EU (Germany 0.0909731) (source),
  • all that leads to NZ being second in the world with most crimes per capita after Dominica! (source)

Categories where NZ fares better are murders and manslaughter, so it seems NZ is full of assaults, theft and rape but not murder. Also, when it comes to robberies it is not that bad - on par with Ukraine and France (source). No wonder NZ is at the bottom of the list of countries when it comes to perceived safety (source).

So how come NZ has this positive image? Is it all just successful PR and people falling in love with the scenic beauty of the place not noticing this? Or maybe all crime is concentrated in select areas and there is little or none elsewhere? And - what is being done, if anything, to effectively crack down on crime?

Or maybe the stats are wrong? The image painted by hard data is very different than the general perception. This may be in part due to crime being seriously underreported in defunct or weak countries - that's why in my comparisons I referred mostly to Western countries liker Germany where reporting is most reliable. Also, as you may note all the links above lead to one site. This is because it gathers all the data in one place so is easy to use while writing something - like this post. However, when I first encountered this data I didn't believe it and checked some of the data - like assaults etc. - elsewhere. Unfortunatelly, the numbers are same or very simillar.

So, dear Kiwis: what gives?

 

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Re: Questions to Kiwis

I understand what you're trying to do with your analysis, but the numbers for most countries will tell only a partial story. The statistics are certainly not very comparable between countries because of large differences in law enforcement, statistical reporting and cultural issues about reporting crime. Look at the numbers, but visit the places you may resettle.

New Zealand has more crime than we would like, but is safe, beautiful, and eminently livable. Having moved down 14 years ago from the US, I have always felt far safer in NZ than I ever did in the States.

Here's a net outcome: really bad people go to prison. New Zealand has 5,881 people in prison (yes, that's the total--155 per 100,000). The US has over 2 million (701 per 100,000), which represents a per capita imprisonment rate nearly 5 times higher than NZ. When I tried to calculate murder rates per capita, I got approximately 1/7 the US rate. Those are enormous differences, and you feel the difference in everyday life.

And I'd bet that Turkey and Belarus actually persecute more people than NZ. We're just not like that.

 

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Re: Questions to Kiwis

Sorry to blow your bubble here, but we are all atheists here, and we have very strong family ties, thank you very much. You don't have to be Christian to be a good person.

In fact, if it weren't for the family ties, I'd move to NZ tomorrow....

The amount of food a country imports is not necessarily a good or bad sign of its ability to feed itself.  I discovered two weeks ago that Australia imported as much butter from NZ as......  NZ imported from us!  NZ is a great place, and Kiwis are really nice people.  Go for it! 

Mike

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Re: Questions to Kiwis

NZ persecutes 31.059 persons per 1,000 people, which is 3rd in the world

You actually persecute people in NZ?

Mike 

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Re: Questions to Kiwis

Mike, don't know what bubble you refer to. And I doubt you are all atheists "there" (whatever "here" was supposed to describe). Certainly you don't have to be a Christian to be a good person, but it certainly helps. In any case the decline of Christianity in Europe happened in parallel with the decline of family in same countries and there is strong evidence this is not an unrelated process.

Raetihi: I was not trying to prove anything. I'm just doing some research on various places in the world, one of which happens to be NZ. I was deeply surprised by those numbers and I'm trying to get some explanation as to, first, their validity and second possible underlying causes. I didn't find that those numbers are not accurate - and some of them are certainly comparable.

I think, btw, car theft is one of the best stats for comparison between countries, because in most countries with cars they have to be registered, insured and sometimes taxed so car theft rarely goes unreported and can be therefore a pretty reliable stat for comparing overal crime rate. Amount of car theft in NZ was, I think, the most surprising number in the stats I've found and it still perplexes me how it is possible. 

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Re: Questions to Kiwis

We might be in our own sinking ship but very very few of us are planning to emmigrate to the US.

Don

____________________________________

So few then with so many ways, so many now with so few ways.
 

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Re: Questions to Kiwis

Sorry to have to agree but Damn the Matrix is right.

Don't go to NZ - its a bad place full of atheistic shotgun toting xenophobes.

Australia on the other hand - a very lucky country has a lot more going for it, not to mention the acres of space.

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Re: Questions to Kiwis
gaspingpug wrote:

Sorry to have to agree but Damn the Matrix is right.

Don't go to NZ - its a bad place full of atheistic shotgun toting xenophobes.

Australia on the other hand - a very lucky country has a lot more going for it, not to mention the acres of space.

 

WTF....?? 

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Re: Questions to Kiwis

He seems pissed in more than one way..........Tongue out

 

(see his post in  http://www.peakprosperity.com/forum/new-zealand-crash-course/9733 )

 

 

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Re: Questions to Kiwis

Oh dear....  now I realise his avatar says it all:  the brain is only supposed to be split in halves down the middle, not in quarters!  Cool

Mike 

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Re: Questions to Kiwis

Nime,

Mike, don't know what bubble you refer to. And I doubt you are all
atheists "there" (whatever "here" was supposed to describe). Certainly
you don't have to be a Christian to be a good person, but it certainly
helps. In any case the decline of Christianity in Europe happened in
parallel with the decline of family in same countries and there is
strong evidence this is not an unrelated process.

Sorry - can't let this one go without a response. Check your history re Christians. Read about the crusades, read about the Vatican and the corrupt Popes of history, read about the violence in the United States promulgated by extremist Christians.

Read about Hawaii being "savaged" by christian ministers and forcible conversions, read about other pacific island nations who were forcibly converted to Christianity.

The list goes on and on. Don't tell me that it helps "...to be a Christian to be a good person...". HA!

BTW, in reading your posts, it seems that you are more intent in finding a reason NOT to move to NZ than otherwise.

Let me point out a problem with crime statistics. As I have pointed out to Damnthematrix in another thread, crime statistics do not reflect the reality on the ground here in the US. If you have a city with a good size population with a "bad area", most of your crime statistics are going to be derived from what is happening in that bad area.

Predominately, here in the US, we live pretty uneventful lives - just as do most Aussies and Kiwis. The media tends to hype the bad stuff because they are convinced that is the only thing that is newsworthy. Thus, people in other countries look at the US as a maelstrom of violence where everyone is afraid to walk down the street and everyone carries a gun.! Not true!

Guess what - I've lived over 53 years in this country and have never been attacked, shot, robbed, had my car stolen, etc. The only reason I recently purchased a gun is because I'm finally getting concerned about what the future may hold in store. With luck, my gun may collect dust for the rest of my days on this planet - at least that is my hope.

So, bottom line, NZ is probably a wonderful place to live - your crime statistics notwithstanding.

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Re: Questions to Kiwis

Hes not pissed, just pragmatic.

If to many people get the idea NZ is such a good place then it wont be such a good place.

Remeber it it is a numbers game. NZs sole advantage is low population density. Head for head I suspect your average kiwi is no better than your average westerner. We just have less effect due to lower density of population.

I can understand his point of view. You dont want to many poeple getting the idea of coming over otherwise you just export the problems to NZ that are already quite evident in places such as the UK.

NZ already has various ethnic divides and potential future flashpoints if centralised govt begins to fade. (am i being a doomer?? I dont know - but from what Ive seen in the world their is a fine line between civil conduct and the other variety). Their are tensions (well their where 7 yrs ago and I suspect thay have not just disappeared) that could be used in a less resource abundant future, even in NZ to justify what is fairly common in history.

Personly I think its a tough call. I hope the Govt shuts the door sooner rather than later but that wont happen any time soon and hell if it does what does that mean for my wife and three daughters, they are born in the UK. 

Reading various articles it sounds like more kiwis are coming back home. This will increase competition for employment, property and all the other good stuff. Additional environmental, financial whatever refugees will exacerbate the situation. I like this article form theNZ Herald;

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/property/news/article.cfm?c_id=8&objectid=10566203

I like the part where many kiwis dont trust the safety of their wealth in the UK and are starting to repatriate it back to NZ (well thats my interpretation). It was hard for me to convince my wife that this was agood thing, glad we got in before sterling sunk. 

However this will increase preassure in NZ if it continues and competition for jobs, property will be high. I left myself because competition in NZ was high 7 years ago and It was much easier to compete in the bigger world as many other Kiwis can probaly attest. It will get awefully crowded when we all come back.

I suspect that even NZs current pop would be hard to sustain without fossil fuel inputs particulary in transport and agriculture as well as our dependence on imports of complex machinary.

Im in two minds. I dont want excess people flooding the country but then again that would me make a hippocrit as Im trying to bring over a non NZ raised family - though getting the kids NZ passports ASAP.

Funny I never dreamed this would be the case when I left 7yrs ago.  

Somtimes ignorance really is bliss. A common trait that I miss from NZ is being honest about things.

Gary.

 

 

 

 

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Re: Questions to Kiwis

Sorry about the ramble - what I was trying to get across hes probaly trying to put people off. Is he from NZ????

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Re: Questions to Kiwis

American political ideology must be the 'New'  global Christian faith then?

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Re: Questions to Kiwis

Kiwixport

I know some Kiwi's are not keen on lots of immigration.  They think we will get overpopulated and culturally diluted I suppose.  I say if the immigratnts are good honest people coming in - lets welcome them.  Especially CM.com er's !!!

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Re: Questions to Kiwis

I was speak'n to a mate-a-mine  -  just the other day

A guy called Bruce Bayliss actually who ah - lives up our way

I said how was the climate and how was the year?

He said the climates too hot - you can't get a beer

The sheila's look like blokes and of course the blokes are all queer 

if you're gonna live anywhere - you may as well live here 

He said . . . .

 

As Gandalf said to Frodo - Is it secret is it safe? 

 

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Re: Questions to Kiwis

 

Whatever.

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