No Tax Discussion?

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SagerXX's picture
SagerXX
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No Tax Discussion?

It surprises me -- without leaving me feeling bereft -- that there's no thread about income taxes, what with Wednesday being April 15th.  Maybe that's a good thing, since such a thread might crash the servers...[wry grin]

I used to live in NYC, and I'd get my (very simple 1040) return done maybe a week before 4/15.  Then on the night of the 15th, I'd take the subway up to the main Manhattan P.O. (across the street from Madison Square Garden) to mail the thing.  It was always a trip to smell the rage and desperation in the air as literally 1000s of people thronged the post office, filling out their returns (yes, I actually saw people using the back of people in front of them in line as a desk to write on) standing up.  

People bellowing "Anybody got a Schedule C?!!!"  This sorta thing.  Awesome.

Then I'd post my return and scarper off.  I'm not much of a schadenfreude kinda guy, but this was always a worthwhile spectacle.  Very New York.

Viva -- Sager 

 

SamLinder's picture
SamLinder
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Re: No Tax Discussion?
SagerXX wrote:

It surprises me -- without leaving me feeling bereft -- that there's no thread about income taxes, what with Wednesday being April 15th.  Maybe that's a good thing, since such a thread might crash the servers...[wry grin]

I used to live in NYC, and I'd get my (very simple 1040) return done maybe a week before 4/15.  Then on the night of the 15th, I'd take the subway up to the main Manhattan P.O. (across the street from Madison Square Garden) to mail the thing.  It was always a trip to smell the rage and desperation in the air as literally 1000s of people thronged the post office, filling out their returns (yes, I actually saw people using the back of people in front of them in line as a desk to write on) standing up.  

People bellowing "Anybody got a Schedule C?!!!"  This sorta thing.  Awesome.

Then I'd post my return and scarper off.  I'm not much of a schadenfreude kinda guy, but this was always a worthwhile spectacle.  Very New York.

Viva -- Sager 

 

Maybe there's no income tax thread because we're all too busy doing our income taxes.  Wink

Lemonyellowschwin's picture
Lemonyellowschwin
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Re: No Tax Discussion?

Actually, I was considering enclosing a cover letter to Tim Geithner.  It would start something like this:

----------------------------------

Dear Secretary Geithner:

Enclosed is my 2008 tax return together with my check for xxxxxx.xx.  I trust you will find everything in order.  If you find any errors, please be assured that they are unintentional.  My understanding is that if I have made any significant mistakes I can simply make an apology to avoid any repurcusions and still attain my goal of being confirmed to a high-level cabinet position where I oversee, among other things, the Internal Revenue Service.  Can you confirm whether my understanding is correct?

[Then I would go off about how he sucks at his job and sucked his thumb as chief of the NY Fed and all sorts of other sarcastic nasty stuff that would, (1) assure me of an audit but, (2) provide an excellent First Amendment retaliation claim in the event I were actually audited.]

--------------------------------------

I fantasized about this quite a bit at the gym today.  Then I figured my time would be better spent changing out the water in my emergency water barrels.

- LYS

Woodman's picture
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Re: No Tax Discussion?

Death and taxes are for certain; not much use debating those in a forum!

I have noticed my return has become exponentially thicker and more complicated every year, just like everything else in life. 

PlicketyCat's picture
PlicketyCat
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Re: No Tax Discussion?

I agree Woodman... my return gets thicker and more complicated, but my refund keeps getting smaller. Geez, I had to scramble and pull some serious rabbits out of my as-uh-hat this year in order not to owe anything. There's all these "economic stimulus" incentives out there are are nigh impossible to qualify for if you're being reasonable and trying to avoid increasing your debt... but of course they want you to increase your debt because that's how they make new money out of thin air. grrrrrrrrrr Yell

Brainless's picture
Brainless
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Re: No Tax Discussion?

I stopped paying income tax a few years ago. Stopped my live insurance too.

I figured what the big boys can do i can do too. BVI, Hong Kong. It is easy, perfectly legal and 100% tax free. I still pay property tax though, and VAT and tax on energy, That already amounts to about 20-25%.

Having to pay 52% income tax was too high for me. Total tax was around 75%. For that i got bad infrastructure, every year worse healthcare and education, retirement uncertainties. I figured i can better manage most of that myself. Never received a dime in social security, so i don't have a guilty feeling. On the contrary, it feels very liberating. 

paranoid's picture
paranoid
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Re: No Tax Discussion?

I started a thread on taxes a few weeks ago - it got edited by CM for promoting unlawful activities!

All I can say is file an extension! and another...

PlicketyCat's picture
PlicketyCat
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Re: No Tax Discussion?

We're trying to remain "tax neutral" - i.e. make enough income to pay for things we can't produce ourselves, but not make enough income to be taxable.  It's going to be a fun balancing act... and we'll still have to file a lengthy return and likely be audited, but hopefully will become exempted from making those stupid "estimated" tax payments every quarter.  Automatic tax withholding from paychecks or estimated tax payments for self-employed is just a sneaky way the government gets to use your money and the interest for free the whole year... grrrrrrr... and they whine at us about illegal activities?!?

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jerrydon10
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Re: No Tax Discussion?
SamLinder wrote:

 

Maybe there's no income tax thread because we're all too busy doing our income taxes.  Wink

Just finished mine online about 10 minutes ago.......Now we can discuss....Hehe

SamLinder's picture
SamLinder
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Re: No Tax Discussion?
paranoid wrote:

I started a thread on taxes a few weeks ago - it got edited by CM for promoting unlawful activities!

All I can say is file an extension! and another...

Not sure how this would help. You are still required to pay what you owe (or think you owe) with the first extension request. So you can file additional extension requests until the cows come home but the IRS still wants your money up front.

SamLinder's picture
SamLinder
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Re: No Tax Discussion?
PlicketyCat wrote:

<snip>
Automatic tax withholding from paychecks or estimated tax payments for self-employed is just a sneaky way the government gets to use your money and the interest for free the whole year... grrrrrrr... and they whine at us about illegal activities?!?

I hear you loud and clear, PlicketyCat. Not only do they get your money interest free, they also expect you to correctly guess how much you owe them and send it in each quarter.

When I was younger, this situation didn't exist. At the end of each year, you toted up how much you made the previous year then you paid the appropriate taxes on that amount. Then, one year, the government decided they didn't want to wait a whole year to steal your money, so they instituted the estimated tax concept.

And then, if your estimated tax guess turns out to be wrong, they slap you with penalties and interest on top of what they've decided you owe them. It is aggravating beyond belief!  Yell

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PlicketyCat
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Re: No Tax Discussion?

Sam - it's an atrocity, I tell ya!  Like self-employed people don't have enough to do and worry about already without having to file and pay every quarter?!  It's even worse when you take into account seasonal businesses like agriculture.... gee, it's summer so I'm making almost all my yearly income, but who knows what I'll be making in the fall or winter or if I'll use most of summer's income for (deductible) winter feed or for vet bills, etc?  I just attempted to digest the 100+ page tax pub for Farmers... OMG it's about as clear as mud. Yell

SamLinder's picture
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Re: No Tax Discussion?
PlicketyCat wrote:

Sam - it's an atrocity, I tell ya!  Like self-employed people don't have enough to do and worry about already without having to file and pay every quarter?!  It's even worse when you take into account seasonal businesses like agriculture.... gee, it's summer so I'm making almost all my yearly income, but who knows what I'll be making in the fall or winter or if I'll use most of summer's income for (deductible) winter feed or for vet bills, etc?  I just attempted to digest the 100+ page tax pub for Farmers... OMG it's about as clear as mud. Yell

PlicketyCat,

I work on a simple cash basis as a consultant. But I have no idea from one quarter to the next what I'll be making - if anything (this year has been the worst ever). So, my guesses are always wrong. Frown

I can't even imagine trying to do what you're doing - you have my sympathies, indeed!

PlicketyCat's picture
PlicketyCat
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Re: No Tax Discussion?

Sam - I could almost stomach quarterly tax BS if you paid on what you made last quarter instead of estimating next quarter. The IRS would still get their money every 3 months, but probably not their penalty payments! Of course, we still have to figure out how and when to get refunds/repayments if your quarterly gains and losses didn't pan out with your AGI at the end of the year. Arg!! The government f***ers should just keep their grubby hands out of my pockets and stop making my life more difficult!!

SamLinder's picture
SamLinder
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Re: No Tax Discussion?
PlicketyCat wrote:

Sam - I could almost stomach quarterly tax BS if you paid on what you made last quarter instead of estimating next quarter. The IRS would still get their money every 3 months, but probably not their penalty payments! Of course, we still have to figure out how and when to get refunds/repayments if your quarterly gains and losses didn't pan out with your AGI at the end of the year. Arg!! The government f***ers should just keep their grubby hands out of my pockets and stop making my life more difficult!!

PlicketyCat - I am truly on your side with this one. Maybe this can be one of the things we won't miss after TSHTF!

SagerXX's picture
SagerXX
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Re: No Tax Discussion?

FWIW, have you guys [Plickety, Sam] thought of forming a corporation?  We're organized as an S-Corp and therefore, while we have to do the quarterly payment thing, we do it on what we've already paid ourselves, not estimated earnings for the coming Q.  And there's plenty of other nice things about being incorporated (health insurance et alia).

Just a thought...

Viva -- Sager 

PlicketyCat's picture
PlicketyCat
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Re: No Tax Discussion?

Sager, we've been thinking about it. There are definitely some benefits to being a corp, but the biggest drawback we see is that the corp biz tax in our state is a bit higher than for sole-proprietor. We need to talk to a local lawyer and accountant to determine whether we'd end up getting "taxed twice" on the same income; or get dinged on state taxes or whether it would get balanced out somehow by not having personal income tax on what we pay ourselves as "employees".  (I'm going to go pound my head into a wall somemore LOL!)

SagerXX's picture
SagerXX
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Re: No Tax Discussion?
PlicketyCat wrote:

Sager, we've been thinking about it. There are definitely some benefits to being a corp, but the biggest drawback we see is that the corp biz tax in our state is a bit higher than for sole-proprietor. We need to talk to a local lawyer and accountant to determine whether we'd end up getting "taxed twice" on the same income; or get dinged on state taxes or whether it would get balanced out somehow by not having personal income tax on what we pay ourselves as "employees".  (I'm going to go pound my head into a wall somemore LOL!)

 

With our corp setup, we basically pay ourselves every dime we can, leaving the corporation no profits to pay taxes on.  Of course, with a corp, we have to put ourselves on payroll (and therefore withhold SS, unemployment, medicare etc.).  But with the deductions we get (company car, health ins, biz dinners, professional development) it seems like we come out ahead.  

Yes -- talk to a knowledgeable professional and see what's what.  Happy hunting!

Viva -- Sager 

SamLinder's picture
SamLinder
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Re: No Tax Discussion?
SagerXX wrote:
PlicketyCat wrote:

Sager, we've been thinking about it. There are definitely some benefits to being a corp, but the biggest drawback we see is that the corp biz tax in our state is a bit higher than for sole-proprietor. We need to talk to a local lawyer and accountant to determine whether we'd end up getting "taxed twice" on the same income; or get dinged on state taxes or whether it would get balanced out somehow by not having personal income tax on what we pay ourselves as "employees".  (I'm going to go pound my head into a wall somemore LOL!)

With our corp setup, we basically pay ourselves every dime we can, leaving the corporation no profits to pay taxes on.  Of course, with a corp, we have to put ourselves on payroll (and therefore withhold SS, unemployment, medicare etc.).  But with the deductions we get (company car, health ins, biz dinners, professional development) it seems like we come out ahead. 

Yes -- talk to a knowledgeable professional and see what's what.  Happy hunting!

Viva -- Sager

Sager,

Already looked into incorporating. No benefit financially. Already get good health coverage via wife's retirement plan and don't drive anywhere as part of my business (I just "drive" my computer). I'm just too small potatoes to make it worthwhile.

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