gold ira insurance

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dave987's picture
dave987
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gold ira insurance

 

The FDIC protects your cash against a bank going under. If I buy gold with an ETF in my rollover IRA, is there anything that protects it from a bank failure? I s some insurance related to this necesarry or available?

 

 

dave987's picture
dave987
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Re: gold ira insurance

I forgot to mention that this retirement account is with Fidelity.

 

Ragnar_Danneskjold's picture
Ragnar_Danneskjold
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Re: gold ira insurance

See "How is my account proctected?" at: http://personal.fidelity.com/products/trading/Trading_Platforms_Tools/faq-account.shtml.cvsr 

Your investment would be protected by SIPC if the firm handling your investment funds goes bankrupt or conducts unauthorized trades in your account AND they are a member of SIPC, which is the case for Fidelity.  It doesn't protect the value of the investment.  You also need to read the prospectus for whatever investment you purchase. 

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strabes
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Re: gold ira insurance

Dave, I know on the surface you were just asking about SIPC and FDIC.  But to go a bit deeper in case you're actually relying on these agencies to save you, FDIC does not protect your cash against a bank failure.  It only says it does on some cheap paper written by govt bureaucrats.  It will not if a systemic banking collapse occurs (systemic collapse has already occurred, it's just that the govt is falsely keeping it afloat by stealing our future dollars).  Once the collapse that has happened but is being hidden by govt actually is allowed to happen for the public to see, FDIC will have nothing left to save you.  Nor will SIPC for brokerage accounts.  Holding actual gold, hard assets, putting cash in US T-bills, or small Swiss banks, or something like that will protect you.

 

 

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JL Lord
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Re: gold ira insurance


Strabes

You bring up a point that I've pondered occasionally but had not thought it all the way through.

If one has cash sitting at an SIPC-insured brokerage, what happens if/when a "collapse"  occurs.  My thinking has been that the acct holder would either
a) hope/pray that the brokerage could cut you a check...yet what good would it do if banks were closing/closed and/or dollar has little to no value
or
b) immediately buy shares (at whatever cost/share) in a multi-national defensive company of some sort (for ex - a food company, like a Kraft for ex)...the thinking being that people still gotta eat, and while it may take awhile to figure out what
the "new currency" is and how to value it, the defensive company would still be selling something, somewhere in the world, using some kinda medium of exchange and might be a store of value.

I recognize the thinking that if TSHTF, one could argue to have most if not all of their worth in hard assets and holding actual gold/PM - yet, if TSDNHTF (an acronym for "TS does not HTF"), one misses out on the growth available in other asset classes (I have a bias in that I am a stock/options trader)

JL Lord

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Ken C
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Re: gold ira insurance

JL Lord,

 

I too have been giving some thought to my IRA account and how to handle it.

Another alternative that is offered by some institutions is to hold physical gold in the IRA. One example is Sterling Trust down in Texas. There are a few others that I have looked at. I am not recommending them just noting there it can be done.

You open the IRA account (transfer funds in) order the gold from a dealrer and have the account custodian pay for it and the gold gets sent to a bank for safekeeping. If you decide to liquidate the account they will send you your physical gold.

 Sounds good for most normal circumstances. The question is - If things unravel can you still get your gold. If you can't then not much has been achieved.

I wish I was certain about when TSHTF because the tax  implications are significant liquidating the account too soon.

 

Ken

 

 

jerrydon10's picture
jerrydon10
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Re: gold ira insurance

We are rolling a lot of our customers with qualified money retirement accounts into either fixed or equity indexed annuities with solid insurance companies.

These companies are required to keep a dollar in reserve for every dollar invested in case TSHs TF. They are then further guaranteed by state insurance pools to protect the investors.

In the early 30s these institutions were about the only ones left with cash and if it all goes, I think they will be the last tier to fall.

JL Lord's picture
JL Lord
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Re: gold ira insurance

jerrydon

Don't take this the wrong way, but I am highly suspect of what would be referred to as a "solid" insurance company.  I used to think that a top rating issued by S&P or moody's would give ya a warm fuzzy - but now we see how much they understood the CDO's that they were rating as AAA.  

Not to cast stones at AMBest or Fitch or whoever the insurance rating companies are, but I have my doubts as to them knowing what's under the covers in the insurance company holdings. 

Also, with the money print going on at the fed, and the desperate grab going on at the state and local levels, I question if a state insurance pool would have the funds available to do some bailing, should SHTF.

I'll swallow my comments about the logic of putting an annuity into a tax-sheltered account.

I am far from an expert in the debt world.  I'd guess that if a $ is kept in reserve for every $ invested, then those reserve $ are probably being put into either short-term commercial paper, high-grade corporate bonds, or t-bills.
 Should rates rise (and we're pretty darn low at the moment), then those asset values decline. 

JL Lord

 

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SteveS
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Re: gold ira insurance
jerrydon10 wrote:

We are rolling a lot of our customers with qualified money retirement accounts into either fixed or equity indexed annuities with solid insurance companies.

Curious as to which companies are rated solid,. Is there a rating agancy that is truly believable and has accessible ratings? I currently have an annuity (with Allianz) and it's hard to know if I can trust for it to make good on it's promises. 

jerrydon10's picture
jerrydon10
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Re: gold ira insurance
JL Lord wrote:

jerrydon

Don't take this the wrong way, but I am highly suspect of what would be referred to as a "solid" insurance company.  I used to think that a top rating issued by S&P or moody's would give ya a warm fuzzy - but now we see how much they understood the CDO's that they were rating as AAA.  

Not to cast stones at AMBest or Fitch or whoever the insurance rating companies are, but I have my doubts as to them knowing what's under the covers in the insurance company holdings. 

No, I won't take that the wrong way, I will agree with you. Although they DO look under the covers to discover how the insurance companies holdings are allocated--and these companies usually (maybe they have to by law? Not sure) disclose where their holdings are allocated to the end investor--there is admittedly still risk in any investment.

So we vet these companies very closely ourselves. As example, concerning one company I was writing for a few weeks back, who shall remain nameless for reasons of liability, I noticed they were 14% invested in mortgage securities. I dropped them like a hot potato and sure enough, their AM Best rating went down a few days ago.

 

JL Lord wrote:

Also, with the money print going on at the fed, and the desperate grab going on at the state and local levels, I question if a state insurance pool would have the funds available to do some bailing, should SHTF.

That's true, could happen.

 

JL Lord wrote:

I'll swallow my comments about the logic of putting an annuity into a tax-sheltered account.

 

Certainly not for everyone. But it makes sense for many people as they usually wont want to touch that pre-tax retirement money for many years to come anyway and these types of annuities are tax deferred. You just roll the retirement over into the annuity, no taxes are owed. And they also can be turned into an income stream anytime the investor wishes if this is ever needed

Again, this investment is not for everyone but it seems to be the hot investment dejeur in my neck of the woods these days.

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jerrydon10
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Re: gold ira insurance
SteveS wrote:

Curious as to which companies are rated solid,. Is there a rating agancy that is truly believable and has accessible ratings? I currently have an annuity (with Allianz) and it's hard to know if I can trust for it to make good on it's promises. 

I would suggest AM Best:

http://www.ambest.com/

I don't write Allianz because I don't like some of their policies. However, they will do what they tell you they will because that is the law as enforced by state insurance commissioners. The key, however, is really understanding what they tell you they will do.....Wink

 

 

SteveS's picture
SteveS
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Re: gold ira insurance
jerrydon10 wrote:

I would suggest AM Best:

http://www.ambest.com/

I don't write Allianz because I don't like some of their policies. However, they will do what they tell you they will because that is the law as enforced by state insurance commissioners. The key, however, is really understanding what they tell you they will do.....Wink

Thanks, I do know what you mean. I got into that policy because I had no interest in learning about finacials and figured it was best to use an 'expert'. I have tried to figure out that policy since then and it is really really confusing. Like with doctors, I have realized it's good to listen to experts, but you need to do your own homework and really understand what it is you are getting into. In that quest I have came to this site, and others, and am on the road to being at least somewhat financially literate.

Back to one of my questions. is there a rating agency accessible to the public that has the kind of information you need to know about these companies?

jerrydon10's picture
jerrydon10
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Re: gold ira insurance
SteveS wrote:

Back to one of my questions. is there a rating agency accessible to the public that has the kind of information you need to know about these companies?

Yes, you can do this online through a company called AM Best:

http://www.ambest.com/

Just go to that page and search for the ratings of that company:

A Best's Financial Strength Rating can be assigned to an insurance
company on an interactive or non-interactive basis. In both cases, the
rating scale and descriptors are:

Secure Vulnerable

A++, A+ (Superior)

B, B- (Fair)

A, A- (Excellent)

C++, C+ (Marginal)

B++, B+ (Good)

C, C- (Weak)

 

D (Poor)

 

E (Under Regulatory Supervision)

 

F (In Liquidation)

 

S (Rating Suspended)

 http://www.ambest.com/ratings/guide.asp

SteveS's picture
SteveS
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Re: gold ira insurance

jerrydon -

I'm sorry, I thought that you meant ambest was an annuity company. Thanks for patiently prodding me until I got it! Excellent resource. My company looks like it's ok (for now!).

-Steve

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Mr. Fri
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Re: gold ira insurance

I'm in the same boat that many of you are in, trying to figure out what to do with my IRAs.  JL Lord put is well... 

JL Lord wrote:

I recognize the thinking that if TSHTF, one could argue to have most if not all of their worth in hard assets and holding actual gold/PM - yet, if TSDNHTF (an acronym for "TS does not HTF"), one misses out on the growth available in other asset classes (I have a bias in that I am a stock/options trader)

No one knows the answer on how bad the collapse will be.  But, everyone has some picture in their mind what they believe will happen when TSHTF.  Earlier today I started a thread to poll everyone's thinking on what we think will be the minimum problems that we need to protect against.  Once we start sharing our thinking it will be easier to make decisions (like what to do with IRAs) as we continue to plan for the future.

 Here's a link:

http://www.peakprosperity.com/forum/what-do-you-think-will-be-minimum-will-happen-when-tshtf/15492

 

 

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jerrydon10
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Re: gold ira insurance

No problem Steve,

That's a good investment and no one has yet lost a penny in that investment. It's certainly not a get rich quick investment vehicle but as people get older we are more into preservation of what they have accumulated for retirement than making a bundle.

And until this economy hit, our investors seem to have been averaging around a 7% return on those. Not so bad.

Jerry

SteveS's picture
SteveS
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Re: gold ira insurance

Thanks again Jerry,

When I took out the annuity I opted for the min 6% gain option. I remember at the time trying to figure out how they could do that if things really tanked. I guess I'll find out. Of course it has a bunch of restrictions and such that I'm still trying to figure out. If the company stays solvent it may turn out to be a wise (though inadvertent) move.

- Steve

 

mikese's picture
mikese
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Re: gold ira insurance

I don't know if i'd buy gold right now a few years ago i had some 1oz coins that i cashed in for $350 and recently another one for $850 even though it's almost 1k per oz i dont think i could invest in it. Even with aseguradoras or insurance i'd feel pretty anxious with the prices moving around.

dusty1995's picture
dusty1995
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Gold ira with Allianz

how can you start an gold ira?

 

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