Gold Vs Bitcoin... Why bitcoin wins.

81 posts / 0 new
Last post
mrees999's picture
mrees999
Status: Gold Member (Offline)
Joined: Aug 16 2013
Posts: 424
Gold Vs Bitcoin... Why bitcoin wins.
Gold Vs Bitcoin... Why bitcoin wins.

As gold has remained ~1300 for the year but bitcoin has increased from $13 to ~450 as of today, we can do the math.

Value:

At the beginning of the year - and once of gold could buy you 100 bitcoins. Today and ounce of gold will buy you only 2.9. Bitcoin wins. Much more interest in buying bitcoin than gold worldwide. Gold has history on its side.Bitcoin has ease of use, better accessibility, more acceptance for every day transactions from more people around the world.

More startup companies and excitement for new infrastructure for bitcoin - gold is "grandpa's money" and fallen out of favor for most of the population. Has the reputation for being archaic. Once the research has begun and the "aha" moment finally arrives you will join us and recognize the potential and value. Only those stodgy companies that have made their life-work will continue to fight the future and attitudes such as film fought digital, and record companies fought file-sharing. Once you go digital you don't go back. 

 

Transportability: 

Gold, heavy, need armed gaurds \ security to move large quantities. Paperwork, insurance, identification - very limited places you can trade for actual goods and services without converting to cash first. Each step requiring fees and money. You might loose 10 - 15% of value by transporting large quantities. Trying to transport across country borders creates its own set of hassles and paperwork.

Bitcoin, you can transport anywhere in the world with Internet access. It travels at the speed of light. It moves inside encrypted wallets so it needs no security. It needs no third parties, insurance, fees. It's "frictionless".You can transport it across borders without effort. There are no borders. Hundreds of thousands of places will accept bitcoin for payment with needing to convert it to cash. - It can be done with your smartphone.

Storage \ protection from theft.

Gold is most often stored in safes: either a bank's safe or your own. This is always an obvious target of thieves, Or government confiscation.

Bitcoin: You can store in oneline wallets, in a paper-wallet that you can keep anywhere as it's just a series of numbers, you can fit it on the paper that comes in a fortune cookie.  Then access that data from any pc in the world connected to the internet.  You can make backup copies of your encrypted wallet off-line on usb or other removable media. You can store copies of your password protected encrypted wallet on any number of one-line free storage locations such as drop box or "sky drive" etc. Retrieve it from any pc when you want.

There are now methods to store wallet information only in your mind. Sounds like science fiction - but you can set up your own wallet id from a code you make up provided it matches certain rules that define a wallet.  (My Pony Jumps Haystakes During Daytrips To Grandma's House) could be MPJHDDTGH - you get the idea.  How hard is that to get past border gaurds? (just don't forget!)

Divisible:

Gold can be subdivided but at great cost and labor. Not just anybody can subdivde it ounces, half onces etc without precise equipment and the right skills. Techincally gold is very divisable but practically it is not.

Anybody can subdivide bitcoins as far as 8 magnitudes of order. Without effort, the amount will happen automatically through the transactions. You can create any amount of free wallets to store your value and sub one penny worth of bitcoin to 100 free wallets if you like. There is practically no limit.

Recognizable.

Gold can be faked using tungsten as proven recently. The purity might also bug "Fudged" by mixing in other metals to make it less pure. Few people are expert enough or have the correct equipment to detect when they've been conned. - Services of experts might be needed which reduce the value of the gold itself to pay for it.

Bitcoins enter the world unque from each other. Each transaction that is made carries with it the world wide network of the most powerful united computing force known to mankind. Each unit and transaction is protected by 256 bits of military grade encryption that would take supercomputers millions or billions of years to crack. When you receive a bitcoin, there is NO question if it is real or not.

Intrinsic Value

Gold isn't used for very much. Mostly just a store of value by shared belief. Only a tiny bit is used for electronics or art. The value of gold can be "faked" by central banks pushing large quantities to market by flooding it and then slowly buying it back once the price is to their liking again. Anybody else holding gold suffers from the manipulation of the governments and people of power and wealth. The most common place to find it is buried in a protected vault and is almost never seen. It can be double spent or worse as several people may have the same claim on gold stored and not in their own possession as is the vast majority of gold "holders".

Bitcoin has many uses.  It is a unit of exchange. A "real" currency that is used every day for everyday kinds of transactions. It also is a store of value and represents many man-hours of computer time and energy costs used in its creation and continued transactions. One use is acting as a measure of account. As you can track each bitcoin through public ledger, it cannot be faked or double spent.  It is also bandwidth for transactions for remittances. Large quantities and it's value act as transport envelops for companies or people that want to send large quantities of value between countries without the expense and delays of international banking transfers which cause "friction" slowness and percentages paid for the transaction.  You can exchange bitcoin for cash in most currencies on both end of a transaction between countries - only limited by the amount of bitcoins owned and transferred,

Bitcoin can eliminate the need for credit cards as business can accept bitcoin payment for electronic payment which reduces the cost normally paid to credit card companies. Bitcoin can save small businesses that can't afford 3-5% of their small profit margin. No risk of charge-backs. You don't need ID, applications, fees, and prerequisites to own bitcoin or conduct business in bitcoin.

These are but a few. The list goes on and one.  Is it any wonder people continue to trade in their inflated and increasingly worthless paper money and their ancient concept of money in gold and silver as they tire of the manipulation by the privledged and governments - and are now embracing the future of money?

What do you think?

 

bowskill's picture
bowskill
Status: Bronze Member (Offline)
Joined: Mar 16 2012
Posts: 78
The "aha" moment

I recommend the Bitcoin 101 Blackboard series of youtube videos that Mrees previously shared a link to:

http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=bitcoin+101+blackboard&sm=3

One of them is on gold vs bitcoin and makes compelling viewing.

Another on whether bitcoin is a bubble is equally good.

Sometime while watching them I had that "aha" moment. It is hard not to come to the conclusion that bitcoin will take the space we all expected gold would be filling right now. The more I learn about it the more convinced I am that it cannot and will not be stopped. While the central banks have likely been preoccupied with keeping gold suppressed this thing called bitcoin has come way out of left field and by the time they even understand it, it will be too late.

TAMWO37101's picture
TAMWO37101
Status: Bronze Member (Offline)
Joined: Jun 17 2012
Posts: 44
bitcoin etf

  Thanks for posting mrees999.  Im a bitcoin believer and made first purchase yesterday.  But i do have question about possibility of bitcoin etf.  I saw the interview last week with the Winklevii twins trying to push for a bitcoin etf.  We all know that gold etf has been primary weapon of central banks to manipulate gold price by first removing one of its primary intrinsic qualities of being rare, then illegally shorting the heck out of it and dumping illegal amounts of paper contracts through thin overnight trading.  If a bitcoin etf is created do you think it removes bitcoin quality of being scarce and gives TPTB incredible opportunity to manipulate bitcoin as well?  Would bitcoin etf be a game changer?  Thanks again for post!

TAM

mrees999's picture
mrees999
Status: Gold Member (Offline)
Joined: Aug 16 2013
Posts: 424
Bitcoin ETF...Unsure future

Good questions about a Bitcoin ETF.  I'm not sure what to think about that one.  I can see possible good, but I share your concerns about the possibility of manipulation.

The bad:

Just as you say, it adds a level of opaque dealing with bitcoin. As you start masking movement off the bockchain ledger that is open for everybody. For individual ownership I would advise against it. One of the strongest points going for bitcoin is the transparency and is one of the founding tenets that Satoshi Nakamoto wanted available when creating the currency after the 2008 banking crisis.

 

The good:

Institutional investors, hedge funds, mutual funds might be granted exposure to the currency as it adds legitimacy to and allows non-technical people access to the price movement. It will finally be taken seriously by "big money" and possibly banks themselves.  With the new respect comes political power as these big companies fund the campaigns and the political friends will defend bitcoin with more urgency. You might see mainstream media start talking positive rather than mocking or disbelief. With this respect, it will grab the attention of more people and you'll watch the network effect pile in and growth may explode even further and faster. Good for us "early adopters".

It might make regulation in the future a bit more "bitcoin friendly" having political force backing us up. As you might have noticed there are a few big "discovery" meetings with legal experts, politicians, national security and bitcoin experts\backers this week. Do you think it was coincidence that there was a ruling just made that political donations can be accepted in bitcoin? You can bet there has been some back room dealing going on.

Our cause is now "Greasing the wheels" for having future powerful proponents, politically speaking, on our behalf as lobbying groups have been working to get attention of policy makers. The fasted way to a politician's hearts is to fund their campaigns.  But this opens the possibility of "secret donations" that might introduces the possibility of skirting campaign reform with untraceable donations.

My recommendation - keep acquiring the bitcoin itself. As much as you can reasonably afford with money you can live without if it crashes.  I honestly don't see that happening, but this is brand new technology with little history so we need to be careful about our risk.  Owning the actual currency and protecting it with off-line storage \ paper wallets etc is a safer bet not to have our wallet and currency stolen. There are a few on-line instructions for doing this - and here's a great video on how to make a paper bitcoin wallet using your smart phone and ink-jet printer.

 

Good luck!

 

 

bowskill's picture
bowskill
Status: Bronze Member (Offline)
Joined: Mar 16 2012
Posts: 78
Regular crypto-currency commentary

I vote mrees999 and/or JimH do a regular market commentary for PP smiley

This is a huge topic. So much is happening on two fronts:
A) the groundswell of adoption and continued development of services
B) the efforts of politicians and regulators to catch up and try and control it.

I suspect that some governments will support or ignore it. Especially those anti US$ reserve currency Others will attack the Achilles heel of bitcoin which is the public trust in it. A propaganda campaign lapped up by the MSM associating it with drugs, firearms, prostitution and terrorism would not surprise me.

The view of a balanced and steady commentator/guide through this period would be invaluable to PP. 

Jim ???

 

ao's picture
ao
Status: Diamond Member (Offline)
Joined: Feb 4 2009
Posts: 2220
mrees999 wrote:What do you
mrees999 wrote:

What do you think?

 

I think you have a promising future as an annuity salesman.

AndyG's picture
AndyG
Status: Bronze Member (Offline)
Joined: Feb 29 2012
Posts: 33
a good discussion

Thanks for discussing this topic. Like others I thought about bitcoin a while ago [when $20 a coin] and 'wish' I had purchased some. I see some of the advantages but do consider it 'speculation' myself. Especially now as others see the parabolic curve being formed. I do disagree with you Bowskill about how governments will view [ignore or support] it. Surely it cuts their power drastically as they can't Ctrl-P it at will - or could they? I think for me putting a little money in [for those that did early on, good on you] you are prepared to lose is a 'punt' now. But I do see governments attacking this for all they are worth. Not just in the MSM but digitally. Bankers will hate it I'm sure, and be pulling all the strings and leverage they can to get politicians to attack and destroy it, ideally without anyone knowing who is doing the attacking.

Gold? Don't write it off just yet. When you log on and see your 'wallet' emptied or all transactions of bitcoin 'denied' [made illegal or prevented], then perhaps reaching for a few physical gold coins will be reassuring.

Time2help's picture
Time2help
Status: Diamond Member (Offline)
Joined: Jun 9 2011
Posts: 2833
Whoops, power is out...

...ahh yes, there's my flashlight.  Now where did I leave those bitcoins???

jdye51's picture
jdye51
Status: Silver Member (Offline)
Joined: Feb 17 2011
Posts: 157
What do I think?

I think we are in a collapse that can only increase in momentum. I think we are past peak oil and are on the downward slope with no new non-polluting energy source ready to replace it. Industrial civilization is on borrowed time while we frack the hell out of our land and use huge amounts of increasingly scarce water for rapidly diminishing barrels. What will power the internet as the ROI of oil of any type becomes less and less? Coal? Nuclear? They have their own problems. Think climate change and Fukushima.

Why invest in a doomed technology? Bitcoins, even fiat currency, what do they matter when the world is collapsing around us? Is this normalcy bias in action? At least put your money into hard assets that will still be there when power becomes unreliable. There are no assurances that even gold and silver will be of any use past a certain point though they at least have a history of usage and are tangible. What is important to the Filipino people affected by the mega-typhoon? - food and clean water. The use of Bitcoins implies a belief that technology can be relied upon to be there for us in the future. I believe this is a false assumption. Events affecting the 3 E's are accelerating and our future is more and more uncertain.

Why all this focus on money and debate about what is the best form to have? What does it matter?!  Maybe some people only have an intellectual understanding of collapse and haven't really taken it's implications fully into their hearts. Focusing on money becomes a way to distract and to reinforce the illusion of control in the face of increasing chaos. For me, the desire to keep playing poker while the ship is sinking is just crazy. But I suppose we all have our ways of dealing with the unthinkable. It just seems like beating a dead horse.

So aren't you glad you asked! smiley

Time2help's picture
Time2help
Status: Diamond Member (Offline)
Joined: Jun 9 2011
Posts: 2833
jdye51 wrote: Why all this
jdye51 wrote:

Why all this focus on money and debate about what is the best form to have? What does it matter?!  Maybe some people only have an intellectual understanding of collapse and haven't really taken it's implications fully into their hearts. Focusing on money becomes a way to distract and to reinforce the illusion of control in the face of increasing chaos. For me, the desire to keep playing poker while the ship is sinking is just crazy. But I suppose we all have our ways of dealing with the unthinkable. It just seems like beating a dead horse.

Limited internet access (due to energy constraints, electrical grid degradation/disrepair, government intervention, etc.) is just one of reasons I'd be cautious with cryptocurrencies. I think in the short term these may play out quite well for those with $$ they can afford to play with, but in the long(er) term? 

bowskill's picture
bowskill
Status: Bronze Member (Offline)
Joined: Mar 16 2012
Posts: 78
Marc Faber once said that in

Marc Faber once said that in the future there will be those with gold and those without.

It looks like in the nearer future there will be those with bitcoin and those without. A bitcoin may soon be worth more than an ounce of gold.

Faber went on to say ... but in the end we are all doomed. If you have gold you will just be doomed a bit later.

Time2help - bitcoin can be printed on paper and put into a safe and is also the only currency ever that can exist only in someones memory. Truly mind blowing.

jdye51 - there will be a time to convert bitcoin to hard assets. In the meantime, bitcoin is every bit as deserving of time and energy in discussion here as the volumes that have gone into discussion of fiat currency.

bowskill's picture
bowskill
Status: Bronze Member (Offline)
Joined: Mar 16 2012
Posts: 78
Jim H's picture
Jim H
Status: Diamond Member (Offline)
Joined: Jun 8 2009
Posts: 2385
Great thread! Very insightful dialogue.

I love the points MRees made about how Bitcoin gives an advantage to a small business person by freeing them from the relatively huge vig that the credit card companies take out of their hides for transactions... just another of the thousands of ways banking is parasitic.  Bitcoin is monetary freedom, plain and simple.  Bitcoin is money without the bank.  Bitcoin is money that is not subject to the inflationary policies of our central bankers.  Bitcoin is not debt, hence it is not destroyed when debt is paid off... it is much less ephemeral than debt-based fiat in this sense.     

Joyce said,

Why all this focus on money and debate about what is the best form to have? What does it matter?!

I think it matters greatly.  I think that money is the main control mechanism... debt the pathway to serfdom.  We all know that Bitcoin is dependent on the internet and electricity (though it is not lost in the process.. just not so useful in the meantime)  ... so I don't think anyone here is plowing their whole net worth into it... but there is much to celebrate I think. 

BTW, BTC could hit $1000 soon... it's going nuts.  Supply and demand in a free market.. it's an amazing thing to see.  Speculative excess?  That's what some commentators said when it went to $100.      

   

davefairtex's picture
davefairtex
Status: Diamond Member (Offline)
Joined: Sep 3 2008
Posts: 5418
pathway to serfdom

Jim I agree, debt is the pathway to serfdom.  And debt-based money keeps the whole society in servitude.

I feel that non-debt-based money is good to see, understand, and experiment with.  I believe that some form of non debt-based-money will eventually be the monetary system we have in the future.  Is it bitcoin?  That I don't know.  But its a fascinating experiment to watch.

 

ferralhen's picture
ferralhen
Status: Silver Member (Offline)
Joined: Oct 14 2009
Posts: 151
dave i agee that this

dave i agee that this monetary system is failing and will replaced with something else.

 

what i find fasincating is how the human mind can construct/conjure value out of thin air. it's facinating to me to see people ascribe value to worthless things...items..concepts  that require only foolishness to buy in

i'm sorry i work too hard for my money to throw it away

i agree with joyce, there are way too many important things to be focusing our attention on.

jim says:   I think that money is the main control mechanism

control of what?

.a piece of wood is floating down a rapid river with 10,000 ants on it....one ant stands up and says i'm in charge here, i'm in control....,,,,,,i fail to see how that affects the piece of wood's direction ....in our case the wood chip is getting close to going over the falls.

davefairtex's picture
davefairtex
Status: Diamond Member (Offline)
Joined: Sep 3 2008
Posts: 5418
Armstrong on Bitcoin

For Martin Armstrong, the concern he has about bitcoin is that the government will (eventually) view bitcoin as a vehicle for money laundering and tax evasion - and that retroactively they will prosecute people who haven't paid their taxes on bitcoin gains.  He thinks they are allowing the bitcoin experiment in order to foster the concept of a completely cash-less society, which is all about collecting 100% of the taxes owed completely suppressing any underground economy.

Lump this under the general heading of "Law Enforcement Risk."

http://armstrongeconomics.com/2013/11/19/congressional-hearings-on-bitcoin/

Personally, it is hard to imagine a world where they will allow bitcoin to survive when they are doing everything in their power to hunt down money. Canada is already looking at taxing it and the concerns expressed by Congress clearly place this within the legal definition of what they call money laundering. What once was real washing of illegal money for legal use like the mob buying old 1930s roadside motels and pretending they were fully booked every night to get illegal cash into the system, is now applied to even storing gold or cash in a safe deposit box. Having an account outside the USA is money laundering hiding untaxed money from the government. So bitcoin can fit into that category and what federal judge would rule against the government? NONE!

Do not get all excited that bitcoin will replace the dollar. Sorry, they are exploring the idea and allowing it to get press for one single reason – they intend to go to an electronic “virtual” currency so they get 100% of all taxes. In 1934, they printed $10,000 notes when a Cadillac was $600. Today, $100 is the biggest bill. The next phase is no bills. The euro tried to displace the dollar issuing €500 denomination notes. In Britain, they have made them illegal – it is all about taxes. The virtual dollar is coming. I would say after 2015.75 when the Fed has zero power and they will go electronic. So for now, bitcoin serves a purpose to get people use to the idea of a cashless society.

 

 

Jim H's picture
Jim H
Status: Diamond Member (Offline)
Joined: Jun 8 2009
Posts: 2385
ferralhen

You said,

what i find fasincating is how the human mind can construct/conjure value out of thin air. it's facinating to me to see people ascribe value to worthless things...items..concepts  that require only foolishness to buy in

i'm sorry i work too hard for my money to throw it away

As you know, we assign value to our gov't sponsored, central bank controlled, unbacked fiat currencies today... and I assume that it is this "money" you are referring to above in your last sentence.. unless you are getting paid in barter agreements.. I have to assume that you are getting paid for things you produce in dollars.. then using those dollars to buy feed for your animals, etc.  What I don't understand about your comment is;  On the one hand you are living and transacting in a faith-based monetary system... on the other hand you are, if I interpret you correctly, attacking the willingness of some folks (those using Bitcoin for instance) to shift over to another faith-based system for its purported advantages.  If we are to have faith-based money.. I would argue that Bitcoin is much less foolish than unbacked, infinitely printable (and printed) fiat currencies that exist in the context of a banking system that is highly parasitic.         

I understand one aspect of what you and Joyce are saying... that in a worst case scenario no type of money will help and we will be very dependent on the real, non-money things we have available.  I get that and I prepare for that.. I don't have a farm for now.. but I have an immense collection of dehydrated food and seeds.  That being said, I don't know how disruptive the transition will be.. and I expect that Gold and Silver will continue to be money throughout.  I am thinking that Bitcoin will as well, since it is borderless.  

My counter to your argument is that Bitcoin is not a worthless thing.  True, it is not physical, and to a large extent it's actual dollar or yen or Gold conversion value is very much faith-based... it's value is what the market of all suppliers and demanders, sellers and buyers, say it is.          

Adam Taggart's picture
Adam Taggart
Status: Peak Prosperity Co-founder (Offline)
Joined: May 26 2009
Posts: 3082
Crazy recent price action

Bitcoin vaulted to from the mid-$500's yesterday to $900 last night, and then fell back to the mid-$500's this morning:

I'm not going to pretend to know the value of Bitcoin's true worth right now, and in general, remain a fan of Bitcoin's mission to serve as a new alternative currency. But the recent price action has certainly been bubblicious.

Daring to take the contrary position vs Bitcoin is Axel Merk, friend of PP.com. Here's him on CNBC yesterday:

Grover's picture
Grover
Status: Platinum Member (Offline)
Joined: Feb 16 2011
Posts: 843
Success Fosters Imitation

I just viewed this slide show on MarketWatch about 5 alternatives to Bitcoin. http://www.marketwatch.com/story/five-virtual-currencies-other-than-bitcoin-2013-11-18

I love this quote from L. Ron Hubbard (founder of Scientology):

You don't get rich writing science fiction. If you want to get rich, you start a religion

Apparently, that is sooooooo old school. Now, if you want to get rich, just create a virtual currency. Is there any limit to what can be accomplished in the virtual world?

Grover

Arthur Robey's picture
Arthur Robey
Status: Diamond Member (Offline)
Joined: Feb 4 2010
Posts: 3936
My 2 Bit worth.

Quick reminder that the Romans could find no use for their gold when their empire fell. Stashes of it are found in Roman Villa excavations.

I wonder what a Roman would think about Bitcoin's value?

I see over at Maxes that the Uber wealthy just paid a lot of whatever passes for money these days for a painting. Poor darlings- imagine the sleepless nights! What to do? What to do with all this worthless paper?

Just slip out the back Jack-and set yourself free.

jdye51's picture
jdye51
Status: Silver Member (Offline)
Joined: Feb 17 2011
Posts: 157
No Thanks

Take a look at what Wikipedia has to say about Bitcoins and make up your own mind.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bitcoins

My alert system goes off around Bitcoins. We're talking human beings here and our propensity to screw everything up. The idea might sound great, but in reality people are already finding ways to mess with it.

Jim, I hear you but do you really think the gov't is going to allow a currency that's not under it's control? And it sure looks like Bitcoins can be hacked/stolen - poof! - all gone. So far it seems like it's being used by speculators and those involved in illegal activities with some legitimate businesses getting in on it. If you have the extra funny money to play this game, then go for it. I'm not biting.

Good luck!

Time2help's picture
Time2help
Status: Diamond Member (Offline)
Joined: Jun 9 2011
Posts: 2833
Bitcoins - Pass

Congress is ok with Bitcoin?  That's all the red flag I'll ever need - and the Hydra extends it's tentacles.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/the-switch/wp/2013/11/18/this-senate-hearing-is-a-bitcoin-lovefest/

Pass.

Jim H's picture
Jim H
Status: Diamond Member (Offline)
Joined: Jun 8 2009
Posts: 2385
Disruption is not always pretty

Especially when humans are involved.  And that's the point;   Bitcoin trading today is actually humans, with all their greed and lust and fear, exposed via the price. 

http://finance.yahoo.com/blogs/daily-ticker/bitcoin-price-swings-threate...

In theory, Bitcoin is many admirable things: a frictionless virtual currency, independent of any state or central bank’s endorsement or printing, useful for storing purchasing power and moving it across borders.

In practice, at least lately, Bitcoin has become a wildly volatile speculative instrument - a collision of hot money, high futuristic hopes for digital money and an illiquid, fractured trading market.

Fractured market?  We are still very early in the game...  the players are feeling this out .. folks who bought earlier via speculation stampeded to sell on last night's run to almost $1000.. but isn't it great to see a market that is human?  A market that does not have or need artificial stabilizers... or a crash protection team..  let it crash I say.  These are growing pains.. the market will continue to become more liquid and will become naturally more stable.  The argument above is simply trying to put lipstick on the pig that is today's financial markets... 

No entity controls the price of Bitcoin outside of the actions of humans trading it.  There are no derivatives... no paper futures markets wagging the dog, no leased Bitcoins, no central banks adding Bitcoin liquidity, and no Gov't sponsored plunge protection teams to keep large drops from happening.  Disruption is sometimes messy... heck, Freedom is sometimes messy. 

Freedom is the lack of moral hazard.  Markets need the freedom to go up, and down, based on natural causes.  The "stable" markets we have today are really the result of much moral hazard and manipulation... which is setting us up for a much greater fall to come.  Give me a free market, like Bitcoin, any day.      

Nate's picture
Nate
Status: Platinum Member (Offline)
Joined: May 6 2009
Posts: 590
bad sign

Coworkers are talking about buying Bitcoin.  Time to sell?

gillbilly's picture
gillbilly
Status: Gold Member (Offline)
Joined: Oct 22 2012
Posts: 423
The devil you know

The regulators love it, Wall Street loves it, the Fed gives it its blessing, it's been hacked numerous times, used a lot for money laundering, and its chart is going vertical, and yet its still a wonderful free market of people. Hmm if this is a free market, I'll pass. Sometimes its better to go with the devil you know.

What goes up always comes down, unless we are living in space now.

Peace!

 

 

bowskill's picture
bowskill
Status: Bronze Member (Offline)
Joined: Mar 16 2012
Posts: 78
Axel contrary?

Adam I dont think Axel was taking a contrary position. Yes he questioned that it is really money. But he did say it is promising. He just can't figure out its real price.

But I was dismayed that he thinks the bitcoin market could be fixed with a derivatives exchange so "the price cannot be pushed around by a few actors".

The biggest take for me was that Axel said the "big money" is looking at it. The current $6 billion bitcoin market now is just a drop...

I agree with Jim. These are very early days. Volatility is totally expected.

troof's picture
troof
Status: Bronze Member (Offline)
Joined: Sep 14 2013
Posts: 39
a sucker is born every minute

If you don't hold it, you don't own it.

TAMWO37101's picture
TAMWO37101
Status: Bronze Member (Offline)
Joined: Jun 17 2012
Posts: 44
Phys gold not SAFE either

I HOLD my gold in a safe and yet the bankers still manage to steel from it through price manipulation.

davefairtex's picture
davefairtex
Status: Diamond Member (Offline)
Joined: Sep 3 2008
Posts: 5418
bitcoin intraday TA

So since the gold market is asleep...I can't resist...

600 looks like a good support level - its where BTC broke out on the 18th, but now on the way down, it looks like a descending triangle is forming.  They often don't end well.

Also note that the red volume sticks are significantly larger than the green volume sticks.  That's bearish.

A close below 525 would be bearish overall.  Imagine the guys who bought up at 800-900.  How do we imagine they are feeling with BTC at 600.  That's a 25-33% loss.

debu's picture
debu
Status: Silver Member (Offline)
Joined: Aug 17 2009
Posts: 228
Internet Medium Currency!!??

After Edward Snowden's revelations of how the NSA owns the internet I can place no faith in a digital currency.

Must say, I'm a little surprised by the credulousness of some Bitcoin supporters who seem very clued in about matters gold.

troof's picture
troof
Status: Bronze Member (Offline)
Joined: Sep 14 2013
Posts: 39
Where have all the electrons gone?
TAMWO37101 wrote:

I HOLD my gold in a safe and yet the bankers still manage to steel from it through price manipulation.

Well, if they're steeling it, they're doing alchemy which is pretty cool but unlikely.;-)

If they're stealing it, they know where your safe is and have cracked it.  Just another good reason for never putting most of your gold in a safe which is the most obvious place to look for it.

If you've lost money through price manipulation, you likely bought too late in the game, just like now is late in the game for bitcoin.

 

Gold is more stable than computer based electrical charges.  Gold in physical possession is not subject to loss of electrical power, loss of Internet, EMP attack, solar flare, hacking, government take-over via electronic means, quantum computing cracking of cryptography, etc.

Who do you think is the original source of bitcoin? 

Who do you think is developing quantum computing?

What is the final step if this shift to a cryptocurrency were to be widely embraced by society?

People, don't listen to shills, the techno-intrigued, the well meaning but misguided, and the gullible. 

Be patient and count on the Golden Key. 

Remember problem, reaction, solution.  Thesis, antithesis, synthesis.

 

When will they ever learn?

 

Comment viewing options

Select your preferred way to display the comments and click "Save settings" to activate your changes.
Login or Register to post comments