generals and admirals demand a plan?

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ao's picture
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generals and admirals demand a plan?

This video is a disgrace.

http://thegunwire.com/blog/youtube-video-maigcoalition-generals-and-admirals-demand-a-plan/

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If...

If they push hard enough, it will be on. You and I both know that.

Why do they want a fight?

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the reason
MarkM wrote:

If they push hard enough, it will be on. You and I both know that.

Why do they want a fight?

Fight = civil insurrection = martial law = even tighter control.

 

Naomi Wolf's 10 steps necessary for a fascist group (or government) to destroy the democratic character of a nation-state and subvert the social/political liberty previously exercised by its citizens:

  1. Invoke a terrifying internal and external enemy
  2. Create secret prisons where torture takes place
  3. Develop a thug caste or paramilitary force not answerable to citizens
  4. Set up an internal surveillance system
  5. Harass citizens' groups
  6. Engage in arbitrary detention and release
  7. Target key individuals
  8. Control the press
  9. Treat all political dissidents as traitors
  10. Suspend the rule of law[28]

 

  • But she forgot the most important one.  Disarm the citizens.
  •  
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To What End?

It seems as though that would be killing the goose that laid the golden egg.

"None are so hopelessly enslaved as those who falsely believe they are free."

Why not let us continue to falsely believe we are free?

http://21stcenturywire.com/2013/02/26/fears-of-coup-in-greece-blackwater-mercenaries-guarding-govt-overseeing-police/

Re: Naomi Wolfe's steps.

We are batting 1.000.

Every week in my city there are more intersections with surveillance cameras. We even have the new ones that are rotational, alowing one camera to cover all four directions. Who is watching these? My employees just roll there eyes when I ask them if they have noticed the ongoing camera installations.

Brandon Raub, anyone?

http://communities.washingtontimes.com/neighborhood/citizen-warrior/2012/aug/22/can-government-detain-you-over-facebook-posts/

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Very disturbing

This is a very slick piece of propaganda.  It implies that our top military leaders are united in advocating new gun control measures.  Which goes against a strong tradition of not politicizing the military.  You have to look closely at the subtitles showing rank to see they all end with (Ret).  That means “retired” but most people won’t see that, much less understand what it means.  When they verbally announce their ranks, none mentions he is retired.

As retired citizens they are free to say what they want.  But I agree it is disgraceful for them to participate in this ad.  It was produced by Mayors Against Illegal Guns; also know as Illegal Mayor Against All Guns because so many of them have been convicted of serious crimes.  New York City Mayor Bloomberg is their figure head, and they have a lot of funding from big foundations and people like George Soros.

I find it very disturbing.

Travlin

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The people will not allow the rights to bear arms to fade...

...away. Just not going to happen my Friends. No sense in getting ones blood pressure to the boiling point, and inspire some baffoon to do something he or she may not.

Respectfully

BOB

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power, sociopaths, and strongmen
MarkM wrote:

It seems as though that would be killing the goose that laid the golden egg.

"None are so hopelessly enslaved as those who falsely believe they are free."

Why not let us continue to falsely believe we are free?

Mark,

Because those who covet power are greedy and they want it all, every last bit of it.  Some power is not enough.  Absolute power is what they want.  Think of Kissinger saying that power is the ultimate aphrodisiac.  Would you and most people you know make a statement like that?  I know I wouldn't.  But the elite like Kissinger aren't like most people.  They are sociopathic in the extreme.

If you look around our world, you can see how right has become wrong and wrong has become right and how chaos and disorder are increasing, day by day.  Normal, rational, decent people find this situation increasingly disturbing and upsetting.  And they will look for someone, anyone, who can restore order and discipline.  And that is why good people will grab on to a charismatic strongman who promises to set everything right and restore what once was.  That is how a Hitler comes to power.

  .   

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the many ways
RJE wrote:
The people will not allow the rights to bear arms to fade...

...away. Just not going to happen my Friends. No sense in getting ones blood pressure to the boiling point, and inspire some baffoon to do something he or she may not.

Respectfully

BOB

Bob,

Some won't, many will.  Large numbers already have.  Try owning a gun in Chicago or NYC.  Observe what happened in New York State.  Observe what is happening in Colorado.  Various paths will be tried and those to which the least resistance is shown will be followed, to be followed up by others, bit by bit, step by step, jurisdiction by jurisdiction, year by year.  Shrinking magazine size.  Shrinking types of ammo available.  Shrinking access to ammo.  Stiffening requirements to purchase a firearm or ammo.  Having to register.  Being charged annual registration fees to pay for the cost of gun ownership administration.  Being assessed firearms taxes to pay for the effects of firearm violence.  Having those expenses gradually increase year by year.  Poor folks having to sell their firearms because of insufficient funds.  Richer folks having to trim their collections to trim their expenses.  Government buy-backs and other incentive programs to encourage handing in your guns.  Government entitlements tied to being a gun-free citizen.  Specified limited geographic zones of increased anti-firearm enforcement action to isolate resisters.  The possibilities are endless.  Soft forms of encouragement will be used followed by firmer forms of coercion and intimidation eventually followed by iron fists.  But the iron fists may not even be needed. 

Will you still keep your guns Bob when your wife or children or grandchildren are threatened.  Perhaps the threats will be soft, perhaps they will be hard.  When you are labelled "extreme" or "radical" because of your refusal to turn in your weapons, will your grandchildren be refused admission to the school of their choice?  Will they be denied credit of various forms?  Will they be denied a job because of their family ties to you?  Will they have to disavow you to move ahead and advance in life?  Or will your family members be threated with entirely legal criminal charges?  Or perhaps even illegal "brown shirt" violence?  Have you talked to your family members about such situations?  Have you discussed how you may be leveraged against one another?  Are you prepared to make the sacrifices that may be necessary?  Are you prepared to all go down together?  

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The Many Ways

Have faith, Dude.  This whole thing sucks, but there are an awful lot of really good people out there.  Plus you are bumming Bob and I out. 

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the spectrum from absolute faith to absolute knowledge
Time2Help wrote:

Have faith, Dude.  This whole thing sucks, but there are an awful lot of really good people out there.  Plus you are bumming Bob and I out. 

Time2Help,

As Chris Duane says, "When you are aware, you can prepare.:  I'm a Jungian personality type, INTJ, the "Strategist" like two of my heroes, Thomas Jefferson and Isaac Newton. As such, I like to know and foresee what I'm up against to best prepare.  

I have faith and I have knowledge.  To stand and act in truth and righteousness, the complete absence of knowledge requires absolute faith, like a child, while the complete the absence of faith requires absolute knowledge, like God.  Like everyone else, I'm somewhere in between the two but the more knowledge I can gather, the less faith I need, and in choosing between knowledge and faith, I'll pick knowledge ... and the wisdom and courage to use it.

Plus, I know the good guys win in the end. ;-)

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Moron labe

Ao,

You are right oppressive regimes will pull out all the stops to make someone cave to their demands.  Living in NJ, I am proud to say their is a stalwart community of 2cnd amendment supporters. NJ2AS.  They have been instrumental in fighting the latest round of criminalizing legal gun owners in the state.  I submit to you the latest in the NY Cuomo led gun grab.  I have never been so politically invested in anything else to date.

http://www.outdoorhub.com/news/injunction-may-be-issued-on-new-york-gun-...

There are lots of gun owners out there.  Many who you would not suspect are.  We are fighting the best we can on the East Coast to throw off the oppressors who would infringe our rights.  

United we stand. Divided we fall.

Lynne

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MOLON LABE

How embarrassing.  Sorry didn't see the misspel in the title.  Ugh.  Too late in the evening....my apologies

 

Lynne

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Moron Labe

I was trying to figure out the punchline...got a good laugh at this end. ;-)

Lnorris wrote:

How embarrassing.  Sorry didn't see the misspel in the title.  Ugh.  Too late in the evening....my apologies

Lynne

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Remind me ,,,
ao wrote:

Observe what happened in New York State.  Observe what is happening in Colorado.  Various paths will be tried and those to which the least resistance is shown will be followed, to be followed up by others, bit by bit, step by step, jurisdiction by jurisdiction, year by year.  Shrinking magazine size.  Shrinking types of ammo available.  Shrinking access to ammo.  Stiffening requirements to purchase a firearm or ammo.  Having to register.  Being charged annual registration fees to pay for the cost of gun ownership administration.  Being assessed firearms taxes to pay for the effects of firearm violence.  Having those expenses gradually increase year by year.  Poor folks having to sell their firearms because of insufficient funds.  Richer folks having to trim their collections to trim their expenses.  Government buy-backs and other incentive programs to encourage handing in your guns.  Government entitlements tied to being a gun-free citizen.  Specified limited geographic zones of increased anti-firearm enforcement action to isolate resisters.  The possibilities are endless.  Soft forms of encouragement will be used followed by firmer forms of coercion and intimidation eventually followed by iron fists.  But the iron fists may not even be needed. 

Will you still keep your guns Bob when your wife or children or grandchildren are threatened.  Perhaps the threats will be soft, perhaps they will be hard.  When you are labelled "extreme" or "radical" because of your refusal to turn in your weapons, will your grandchildren be refused admission to the school of their choice?  Will they be denied credit of various forms?  Will they be denied a job because of their family ties to you?  Will they have to disavow you to move ahead and advance in life?  Or will your family members be threated with entirely legal criminal charges?  Or perhaps even illegal "brown shirt" violence?  Have you talked to your family members about such situations?  Have you discussed how you may be leveraged against one another?  Are you prepared to make the sacrifices that may be necessary?  Are you prepared to all go down together?  

Ao

Remind me never to get on your bad side.  You have a truly devious mind.  frown

Actually, I think you have a deep knowledge of how devious people operate, which is a good thing, because we are up against some masters.  I’m just glad you have no desire to rule the world.  At least I hope you don’t.  cool

Travlin

 

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Lnorris wrote: Ao, You are
Lnorris wrote:

Ao,

You are right oppressive regimes will pull out all the stops to make someone cave to their demands.  Living in NJ, I am proud to say their is a stalwart community of 2cnd amendment supporters. NJ2AS.  They have been instrumental in fighting the latest round of criminalizing legal gun owners in the state.  I submit to you the latest in the NY Cuomo led gun grab.  I have never been so politically invested in anything else to date.

http://www.outdoorhub.com/news/injunction-may-be-issued-on-new-york-gun-...

There are lots of gun owners out there.  Many who you would not suspect are.  We are fighting the best we can on the East Coast to throw off the oppressors who would infringe our rights.  

United we stand. Divided we fall.

Lynne

Lynne,

Glad to hear NJ folks are rallying on this issue.  As a former citizen of (as the Boss says) "the great state of New Jersey" (love the Boss but question his politics and opinion of NJ, lol), I remember participating in a protest in Trenton where 50,000 of us threw rolls of toilet paper on the lawn of the governor's mansion.  Thankfully, NJ voters limited Jim Florio to one term.  But I left NJ before then and have never looked back.  Unfortunately, even owning a BB gun there is difficult.

P.S.  Are you having fun with functional reporting measures, G-codes, severity modifiers, PQRS measures, etc. yet?  More BS from TPTB that's only going to get worse.      

 

'

 

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Travlin wrote: Ao Remind me
Travlin wrote:

Ao

Remind me never to get on your bad side.  You have a truly devious mind.  frown

Actually, I think you have a deep knowledge of how devious people operate, which is a good thing, because we are up against some masters.  I’m just glad you have no desire to rule the world.  At least I hope you don’t.  cool

Travlin

No desire to rule others but definite desire to be free, lol.  I remember reading years ago when someone asked Mother Theresa why she did what she did, she replied something to the effect that she realized she could just as easily have become a Hitler.  Within each of us is the potential for both good and evil.  Obviously, it's up to us what we choose to do with it.  Last year, I learned that my maternal ancestry came from the Swabian area in Germany that produced such notables as Hans and Sophie Scholl, Claus von Stauffenberg, Erwin Rommel, Erich Hartmann, Ernst Heinkel, Rudolf Diesel, Gottlieb Daimler, Johannes Kepler, Albert Einstein, etc. and is home of everything from Porsche, Audi, BMW, and Mercedes Benz to Bosch electronics to Heckler & Koch firearms (my favorites).  Perhaps, it explains my anti-authoritarian personality, martial interests, passion for cars and airplanes, and fascination with space and science.  And my grandparents, who left Germany at the height of the Weimar Republic hyperinflation, taught me lessons of history including when to get out of Dodge and how any group of people (from Germans to Americans) can get caught up in mass madness and evil if they let their guard down.  Plus, my grandparents were excellent strategic game players and taught me everything they knew.;-)   

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Like ao, I have no desire to rule...

....anybody but myself.  And FWIW, having ancestry from 3 groups (Scots, Irish and Bohemian) that historically suffered at the hands of aggressors both from within and without (the Scottish & Irish stories are pretty well known, but the Bohemians spent a couple generations during the Thirty Years' War [1600s] getting run over by everybody in Central Europe -- either they themselves were the targets, or they just happened to be inbetween two warring groups [i.e. the Holy Roman Empire and the German {Protestant} princes/Palatines/Electors] and by the end of it all their homeland had been completely devastated and denuded by war and foraging armies) maybe carries down to me this very day having a strong attitude of [language softened since this is a family website] "Fer Pete's sake, ye bastards, canna ye happy with the power ye already have?!!!"...

The answer sadly is no, of course.  Strongest drug there is, power, and we have a whole class of empowered and addicted elites.  And as we continue to bump up against resource limits both hard and soft -- and as that bumping becomes more insistent -- the scrabbling for MORE will happen more often and with more brutal resolve.  And, IMO, it will increasingly take place right here at home (with resource & power grabs overseas running up against resistance from the Chinese, a resurgent Russia, and the many in the developing countries that want to keep their wealth & resources right there at home with them -- instead of watching the tribute of empire flow back to us profligate Americans [or Westerners in general]).  

One more reason among many to reconsider the definitions of wealth and freedom.  

Is freedom the chance to choose between 40 brands of toothpaste?  Between "Dancing WIth the Stars" and "So You Think You Can Dance"?  The Kardashians and Honey Boo-Boo?

Is wealth defined by a nice car -- or having fine places (such as to a gathering of community) for it to take you?  Or having fancy plates on which to serve food -- or to have that food grown in one's garden, free of chemicals and GMOs?  Having honey to sweeten one's tea -- or keeping a few hives in the backyard and knowing you can supply you and yours with honey in relative perpetuity?

I have suffered some serious personal, professional and financial setbacks in the last few years.  But I fill my 400 sqft apt with laughs and loving friends, my work (though there's less of it than I'd like) gives me the feeling of a job well done, helping people live better in the bodies they have, and hell -- I just paid off my little Toyota Yaris.  New garden goes in over the next month-ish.  I have said a few times in the last month I'm amongst the richest men I know.  There now, I just said it again.

The hardest burden to bear these days is the MASSIVE COGNITIVE DISSONANCE between what I know to be true and the nincompoopery spouted by the graceless Grackles in the MSM (and for the most part, duly repeated by the masses they mislead).  But things always revert to the mean (although in our larger case, we may be in for a wee bit o'overshoot when reality intrudes to lay its incisors into the collective hind end of the misled masses), and when that time comes no doubt -- for all that I was impatient for the day to arrive -- I will wish I'd had "just a few more months" to prepare.  

More to the point of this thread (sorry!), IMO those that are attempting to manage this whole situation to their benefit will make a hash of it one way or another.  They will miscalculate, overstep, or maybe just plain bungle.  And let's not forget the possibility that events will overtake them.  They're smart, sure, real smart.  Which is why they'll tend to think they've got it all under control and figured out.  

"Is that you, Hubris?"...  surprise

Viva -- Sager

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Ao's description of how

Ao's description of how gun-owners will be squeezed is dead on.

I just returned to this country after six years abroad. I became aware of what was wrong while I was abroad, so my perspective is skewed, but I do not feel I have returned to the same country I left.

To get my electricity turned on? Federal regulations require the power company to have my SSN to run a credit check on me. Having been a customer with the company before, I managed to somehow get away with not giving them my SSN, based on my past customer record.

I refused to give my SSN to acquire internet. So I gave them a deposit instead, but they still had to prove who I was. I gave them the last four of my SSN. They then began questioning me with multiple statements clearly drawn from my credit record. This was a goddamned cubicle sales twit reading from my credit record at me and requiring me to confirm or deny the information to prove who I was. Between my last name, last four of SSN, and physical address of internet service, they knew exactly who I was.

Registering my children at school has been even worse. What's their catch? Refuse to give the school my children's SSNs, and they won't maintain any grade records to provide as a transcript to universities. They will assign a student number if you decline to provide SSN, but they won't maintain a transcript against that student number. WTF? I had to declare a race for them (no "other" or "I decline" option available). I had to declare whether I was military, police, a federal employee, a judge, or someone who came here as temporary agricultural labor. Try to sort that one out.

The game is up. Complete economic collapse is the only thing that might possibly finish this totalitarian state. I am really no longer sure I want to stay in this country that long.

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ao, I hear you but look at what is happening, the trend...

....Obama's first term seen the doubling of fire arms in America. His second term is on target for the same. The People have responded in spite of the mass killings of our children. Women have been one the huge changes to gun ownership, and historically they have been indifferent. I sense a major change in how women view weapons, and that just add not lessons the strength of our rights to bear arms. 

We are talking about the most important rights all Americans share, the rights to bear arms. This is a powerful right that will be resisted of that I have no doubts.

BOB

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ao, I enjoyed very much that you could trace your lineage...

....back as far as you have. It is said that we are all Brothers and Sisters so I take great comfort in knowing this. If we have a predisposition then to react to some form of primordial printing then mankind has a pretty good chance of surviving well into the future. As my family member then, I wish you the very best, and as my Brother I like very much having these type conversations. Even if as most Brothers tend to do, we do hit certain primordial nerves that seem to suggest a deeper emotional response. We move along though, and get that second chance. What family do are my thoughts.

http://science.howstuffworks.com/life/evolution/female-ancestor.htm

Respectfully Given

BOB

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ao, I really think you are a beast...

You said, (what does threated mean):

"Will you still keep your guns Bob when your wife or children or grandchildren are threatened. Perhaps the threats will be soft, perhaps they will be hard. When you are labelled "extreme" or "radical" because of your refusal to turn in your weapons, will your grandchildren be refused admission to the school of their choice? Will they be denied credit of various forms? Will they be denied a job because of their family ties to you? Will they have to disavow you to move ahead and advance in life? Or will your family members be threated with entirely legal criminal charges? Or perhaps even illegal "brown shirt" violence? Have you talked to your family members about such situations? Have you discussed how you may be leveraged against one another? Are you prepared to make the sacrifices that may be necessary? Are you prepared to all go down together?".

AO, I really think you a sick puppy beyond your seemingly good intentions here. I really do. I think even that you are dangerous. Are you a Born again Christian and a Psycho-Babbler?

I stand alone I think. Oh well.

WOW!, do you ever have a fixation on Me. Your treatment of me, for disagreeing with your ways is exactly what you propose the government is doing, will do, and that makes you a hypocrite.

I do this research on you in preparations to Rowe, and I do not believe you or I belong in the same room.

Incidentally, you have a mis-spelling, something any grade schooler would have caught. Remember, see, we are sometimes at the mercy of the spell check. Even you, Oh Lord.

I need this like a hole in the head.  

BOB

To the Moderators: You have allowed this rather crazy thread by ao to stay up for so long, and I hope I have just as equal a time because this dude is a freak.

[Moderator note:  We have read your comment.  Nevertheless, your reaction here is confusing.]

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RJE wrote: You said, (what
RJE wrote:

You said, (what does threated mean):

"Will you still keep your guns Bob when your wife or children or grandchildren are threatened. Perhaps the threats will be soft, perhaps they will be hard. When you are labelled "extreme" or "radical" because of your refusal to turn in your weapons, will your grandchildren be refused admission to the school of their choice? Will they be denied credit of various forms? Will they be denied a job because of their family ties to you? Will they have to disavow you to move ahead and advance in life? Or will your family members be threated with entirely legal criminal charges? Or perhaps even illegal "brown shirt" violence? Have you talked to your family members about such situations? Have you discussed how you may be leveraged against one another? Are you prepared to make the sacrifices that may be necessary? Are you prepared to all go down together?".

AO, I really think you a sick puppy beyond your seemingly good intentions here. I really do. I think even that you are dangerous. Are you a Born again Christian and a Psycho-Babbler?

I stand alone I think. Oh well.

WOW!, do you ever have a fixation on Me. Your treatment of me, for disagreeing with your ways is exactly what you propose the government is doing, will do, and that makes you a hypocrite.

I do this research on you in preparations to Rowe, and I do not believe you or I belong in the same room.

Incidentally, you have a mis-spelling, something any grade schooler would have caught. Remember, see, we are sometimes at the mercy of the spell check. Even you, Oh Lord.

I need this like a hole in the head.  

BOB

To the Moderators: You have allowed this rather crazy thread by ao to stay up for so long, and I hope I have just as equal a time because this dude is a freak.

 

Bob,

You're reverting to a form of behavior you've been accused of elsewhere on the web.  Go take a deep breath and calm down.  You're overreacting.  I commented on what you said.  Nothing more or nothing less.  Frankly, I think your behavior on this post demonstrates, in you, the exact attributes that you're attributing to me.  I'm writing the moderators.

      

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ao, this is your standard answer to all who disagree...

...with you, and you internalize with such contempt and hatred. There are so many who agree with you. You ARE an easy tell, and you think you are invisable. You think you can discredit me? I am the only one who can do that you unfortunate soul. You need counceling, you really do. You remind me of the lost children of "Lord of the Flies". You do. only in grown up form. I don't fear you, I fear for those who buy into your extreme BS. Why? It would make 2, 3, 4...of you. Yikes!!!

I did have an incident on the web before, and these people, like you, attacked, downloaded my wifes picture and my newborn grandson and went on a perversion attack, and personal calls. I took care of that situations with the help of the authorities. If that is what you reference then I stand tall.

Two sides to every story you puke.

The moderators will do as they wish but all over the place are your threads and your attacks. I will NEVER coment to you directly again but will comment on your threads I do not agree with. I only read them now because I am bringing my Lady to meet the community, and I will NOT subject her to you that is for darn sure.

Concerned citizen here.

BOB

[Moderator's note:  Regardless of any past disagreement, each user is under a continuing obligation to be civil, and to react appropriately to new comments.  On that basis, these posts are a violation of our forum guidelines.]

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I flagged your posts

RJE I flagged your posts 21 and 23 for the moderators.  Both violate forum guidelines with personal attacks.

Travlin

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Travelin

What?

"Will you still keep your guns Bob when your wife or children or grandchildren are threatened. Perhaps the threats will be soft, perhaps they will be hard. When you are labelled "extreme" or "radical" because of your refusal to turn in your weapons, will your grandchildren be refused admission to the school of their choice? Will they be denied credit of various forms? Will they be denied a job because of their family ties to you? Will they have to disavow you to move ahead and advance in life? Or will your family members be threated with entirely legal criminal charges? Or perhaps even illegal "brown shirt" violence? Have you talked to your family members about such situations? Have you discussed how you may be leveraged against one another? Are you prepared to make the sacrifices that may be necessary? Are you prepared to all go down together?".

Travelin, ao said this, perhaps from a pulpit. I can imagine it now. Chilling. All over our community here at PP he has chased me, and you flagged these two Travelin? Dude, where is your sense of fair play? Or, are you Buds?

Travelin, I have to say that his obsession with me is a little unsettling. 

BOB

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Wow

A good thread ruined.  

Just because you don't agree with a subject, doesn't mean it's not something to discuss.  

The sheep are slowely being led to slaughter.  But the slaughter has now sped up, and will continue to do so.

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Logansrun, If I offer a slightly different outcome as is my

right it only becomes a ruined thread or confrontational if you, Travelin and AO want to so dominate opinions in such away that I, and my wife, son's and grandsons are mentioned as a fear tactic. My goodness, did you read that opinion of AO? It is spooky, it really is. 

What in fact has happened is that what you prophesy the government doing with such vigor is what you  have become. Two wrongs don't make a right, remember? This is dangerous, and are to be resisted. Make sense or are your Biases so strong that you can't see what you are doing yourself. Basically, it means, the enemy is you as your methods are eerily similar to the tact-ed of what you supposedly resist.

I am terribly disappointed in the three of you. I get home protection, and rights to bear arms but to assume what the future brings as a certainty is just not knowable.

I am blocking the three of you as unstable community members. I am here to learn from Dr.Martenson, and cannot allow my time with you people any longer other than to give a different point of view when what you propose is assuming too much. Please do the same for me, and all will be good.

BOB

goes211's picture
goes211
Status: Diamond Member (Offline)
Joined: Aug 18 2008
Posts: 1114
Add me to the list...
RJE wrote:

right it only becomes a ruined thread or confrontational if you, Travelin and AO want to so dominate opinions in such away that I, and my wife, son's and grandsons are mentioned as a fear tactic.

Add me to the list of people that think Bob is out of line.

Lnorris's picture
Lnorris
Status: Silver Member (Offline)
Joined: Mar 28 2011
Posts: 105
G codes etc

No we are not having fun with this regulatory environment.  We've gone from being reimbursed 14 days post  billing to 90 days.  It's all about delaying payment as we know Meidcare is flat broke.  So we try to diversify  our business and add consulting for those who are behind the curve of these changes.  

Isn't this how Greece went?  Delaying payments 60, 90, 120 days to the point where their medical practitioners haven't been paid in months.  

I don't have a good sense of how much longer this whole mess holds together.  It's not going to be pretty when it all falls apart.

Lynne

treebeard's picture
treebeard
Status: Platinum Member (Offline)
Joined: Apr 18 2010
Posts: 590
Nothing is ever ruined

There is nothing so difficult as discussing issues relating to ones sense personal power, ones ablility to control ones own destiny.  Nothing will drive a person more crazy than the feeling of being disempowered or disrespected.  Discussions of gun control, government bureaucracies and dictatorships trigger our deepest feelings around fear and power.  These are real issues and the discussions are not academic as we all know.

We are in trying times and emotions will fly.  If we can continue work our way through these difficulties together I believe we will build stronger and lasting bonds in the long run, even at time if the discussions are not pleasant or easy. Patience and perseverannce are our greatest allies in these difficult times.

A. M.'s picture
A. M.
Status: Diamond Member (Offline)
Joined: Oct 22 2008
Posts: 2367
And in this corner...

Wait, never mind - we're too busy fighting ourselves.

RJE,

I've discussed with ao for a few years on this site, and would like to extend a partial endorsement of his character, and examine the statement he made that you took offense to.

First off, ao is a pretty stand up dude. I can think of some characters who've come and gone over the years that I wouldn't want to meet, but no one sticks around PeakProsperity to badger and harass others. Those types fall by the wayside pretty quickly. 

By saying:
"Will you still keep your guns Bob when your wife or children or grandchildren are threatened. Perhaps the threats will be soft, perhaps they will be hard. When you are labelled "extreme" or "radical" because of your refusal to turn in your weapons, will your grandchildren be refused admission to the school of their choice? Will they be denied credit of various forms? Will they be denied a job because of their family ties to you? Will they have to disavow you to move ahead and advance in life? Or will your family members be threated with entirely legal criminal charges? Or perhaps even illegal "brown shirt" violence? Have you talked to your family members about such situations? Have you discussed how you may be leveraged against one another? Are you prepared to make the sacrifices that may be necessary? Are you prepared to all go down together?".

This doesn't read to me like an attack on your character (RJE), your family or your level of commitment/planning - it sounds like a very clinical analysis of your where you're at in terms of accepting the potential for serious problems. This video makes my blood boil, and while I'm not concerned with peoples' individual stance on this right now, ao has just followed their 'presentation' through to it's logical conclusion: They are demanding action. Public servants, who swore an oath to our constitution, it's democratic principles, and to our Republic, are making a partisan demand on a political issue using their uniform as leverage.

To those of us who are veterans, this says a lot. We, especially enlisted folks (see, the 'proletarians') are not only discouraged from tying any sort of politics to our uniform or service, but we are explicitly forbidden from doing so.

What these men just did would get me punished severely, had they done it while they were still serving in an active capacity.

So, ao has pointed out several things:
1. There is a social caste that is demanding that all below them are disarmed.
2. This is not historically unprecedented
3. Disarmament coupled with authoritarianism has consistently led to massive civil strife and;
4. Regimes who wish to impose will with impunity must not face an armed body of citizens.

This all sums up the reasons for a 2nd Amendment nicely, but that's not the point - the real point is that the quote above was not about any one of us specifically, but about the embrace of both possible outcomes.

Personally, I like RJE's upbeat optimism.
I also very much appreciate (especially as a fellow INTJ) ao's rational detached and methodical approach to measuring future events based on the present. 

There's no reason to feel attacked here, and I think that this topic is extremely important and bears both further scrutiny, a deferral of our differences to a later time, and some very serious dialog regarding what this means to our nation... Senior Military officials demanding political action on an issue such as this is absolutely transgression, in my opinion. While I wouldn't go so far as to say it's 'treasonous" as some did, I will echo the old Soviet adage:
"The Fish rots from the head down"

When the rules that constrain the body of the population do not constrain the upper echelon, it is very easy for good order to deteriorate. Ask yourself: "What would happen to our society if our military began ignoring the codes that keep it seperate from our political institutions?"

I believe if you do, RJE, you'll see exactly what AO was trying to convey.
Cheers,

Aaron

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