I am new at buying gold - need help

24 posts / 0 new
Last post
Lykkelig's picture
Lykkelig
Status: Member (Offline)
Joined: Apr 5 2011
Posts: 8
I am new at buying gold - need help

Hello

I am new to gold investing. I have decided to invest in physical gold, but I have yet to buy my first coin. I am in the process of finding out how concretely to do it. I have a question for anyone out there who has experience with this. Hope you can help me out.

I have seen vidoes on youtube in which investors of bullion coins show their collections of physical gold. It seems as if gold bullion coins are often in protective plastic covers.

I have read that 24 carat gold is very soft and has to be in a protective cover and is not supposed to be removed from the cover. 

I am curious: How do you know that the gold you have purchased is real ? If you cant remove the gold from the plastic and personally inspect it. (Measure its height and diameter and weigh it.)
I have seen videoes of people on youtube perform these standard tests to verify the authenticity of their gold. If the gold is in protective plastic covers and are not to be taken out of there, I guess it is entirely a matter of you trusting your dealer then?

Thanks for any answer or comment you may have.

lykkelig
 

Ken C's picture
Ken C
Status: Platinum Member (Offline)
Joined: Feb 13 2009
Posts: 753
What to buy

As far as whether to buy 24 kt or 22 kt. I think that it can be argued either way. Keep  in mind that you are not going to be carrying the coins like pocket change so if you take care of the 24 kt you should not have a problem with damage. Store them in the tubes or covers they come  in.

I personally like American Gold Eagles but any of the other major coins are good too. Sealed coins are usually numismatic coins and that is a different investment than buying bullion coins. I see little benefit in sealed numismatic coins. If you are buying bullion coins for their bullion value protection there is no reason to get sealed/graded coins.

Always buy from a trusted source. In addition to being able to measure coins you can always compare newly acquired coins with ones that you already  have. There should be NO difference. If there is you have a problem.

Lykkelig's picture
Lykkelig
Status: Member (Offline)
Joined: Apr 5 2011
Posts: 8
Ken C: Two things. First

Ken C:

Two things.

First thing.

So you like American Gold Eagles. They are 22 karats.

Do you own any 24 bullion coins like Austrian Philharmonics or Canadian Maple Leafs?

If you do. Did they come in a package (plastic capsule, vacuum pack) when you bought them?

If they did, and you did not remove them from their cover(you are not supposed to, I am told, since fine gold coins are extremely soft and can easily be damaged - and the value of the gold is decreased when the original package has been opened), how have you personally verified the authenticity of the product?

You cant weigh them, you cant really measure their diameter og height, when they are in a protective cover.

Second thing.

About the 22 karats coins that you own. Since they are a little harder than 24 karats maybe they are not in a package (plastic capsule, vacuum pack).

If you touch them and test their authenticity, how do you do it.

The testing procedure that I have heard of is this: You weigh them, measure their thickness and diameter, test them with a magnet and of course you check the design.

If for example your American gold Eagle is 2,87 mm in thickness, 32,70 mm in diameter, weigh 33,93 grams and does not respond when you run a magnet close to it, I guess that you can be 100 percent certain that your coin is the real thing. Please tell me if you agree with this testing procedure, or if there is something I am missing here.  

If anyone else wants to comment please do. I would appreciate all comments. Thanks.

 

Lykkelig

Ken C's picture
Ken C
Status: Platinum Member (Offline)
Joined: Feb 13 2009
Posts: 753
Too much angst.

You are WAY too concerned about touching bullion coins.

You are not going to damage bullion coins by touching and handling them. Obviously don't drop them or bang them around.

If you are dealing with numismatic coins then there is a concern about opening the package.

When you get a bullion coin carefully take it out of the package and weigh, measure and compare all you want and then put it  back in the package then put it away somewhere safe.

 

 

shanti's picture
shanti
Status: Member (Offline)
Joined: Jan 19 2012
Posts: 2
buying gold and silver coins from coin shop

Thanks for the comments, I just called all the coin dealers in my area and checked the current prices on line.  some dealers told me on the phone how much over the spot price they charged. So I went to the dealer that charged less.  The spot prices are online, so I checked a few websites to get a price range.

I checked the reviews of the dealers on line, but I didn't think about  the gold not being real.  That does complicate things. Huh, I don't know, Guess you hope the dealer is honest.

Lykkelig's picture
Lykkelig
Status: Member (Offline)
Joined: Apr 5 2011
Posts: 8
Ken C wrote: You are WAY too
Ken C wrote:

You are WAY too concerned about touching bullion coins.

You are not going to damage bullion coins by touching and handling them. Obviously don't drop them or bang them around.

If you are dealing with numismatic coins then there is a concern about opening the package.

When you get a bullion coin carefully take it out of the package and weigh, measure and compare all you want and then put it  back in the package then put it away somewhere safe.

 

 

I have never been near a gold coin in my life. The dealer I am considering buying from have guidelines for handling gold. Those guidelines correspond well to what people on youtube are demonstrating.

Do you have a comment to the second part of my post. Appreciate the feedback.

Travlin's picture
Travlin
Status: Diamond Member (Offline)
Joined: Apr 15 2010
Posts: 1322
Look here

Lykkelig

Since you are new to buying gold you should check out the following.

How to buy gold.
http://www.peakprosperity.com/buying_gold

Where to buy gold from trusted dealers.
http://www.peakprosperity.com/where-to-buy-gold-and-silver

A simple tester.
http://www.fisch.co.za/home.htm

Try the search box in the upper right corner of every page to find many discussions on this topic.

Travlin

Test, test, test
Test, test, test
Test, test, test
Test, test, test

redfir223's picture
redfir223
Status: Member (Offline)
Joined: Jan 10 2012
Posts: 19
Where to buy

Lykkelig,

Look up Provident Metals online. I have purchased from them and they are honest and I have yet to find a dealer who beats their prices. Some complain about slow delivery but they use the most secure method available in USPS, certified mail which has a verifiable chain of custody from Provident to you, (when I have picked up my packages at my post office they come out of the PO safe) but this takes a little extra time which security I prefer over speed. They also protect themselves by allowing time for your payment to clear which makes good business sense to me. To answer your concern about the authenticity of the coins you buy, if you deal with a reputable dealer and buy known coins such as American silver or gold Eagles, Maples, Kruggerands, etc., you have nothing to worry about. If you buy from Craig's list or out of the newspaper, I would be more concerned. 90% US silver coins are easy to recognize and are another option. Provident has those as well.

redfir

earthwise's picture
earthwise
Status: Platinum Member (Offline)
Joined: Aug 10 2009
Posts: 846
When I was a newbie........

Lykkelig

I bought gold for the first time in 2009 and was also a little nervous. I trusted Chris' endorsement (on his 'Buying Gold and Silver' page) of these guys at California Numismatics Investments (golddealer.com). Their spreads were among the lowest and I had to take a chance on somebody, so I sent them a lot (to me) of money via cashiers check, and lo and behold a couple of weeks later the Post Office notified me I had a package to be picked up. It was gold!!  Pretty stress free if you can control the initial nervousness. I bought Krugerrands by the way. Just 'cause they were a little cheaper. I made a later purchase with the same results and have referred three family members to them, who also all had the same results. I've since learned that most reputable dealers operate the same way. No big deal. If you're hesitant, make a small purchase to get your feet wet, then follow up with susbsequent buys.

 

P.S. Also, most reputable dealers will walk you through the process. 

 

 

Base821's picture
Base821
Status: Member (Offline)
Joined: Mar 11 2012
Posts: 4
Anyone have any experience with any of the bullion vaults?

I have used Colorado Gold and have enjoyed the transaction.  The only issue is that they use the USPS and that can be slow and the tracking is poor.  

I was wondering if anyone has had any experience working with any of the bullion vaults?  I am considering opening an account with Goldmoney.com but am a little nervous.  How secure is your gold *really*?  I do not mean from a security standpoint, but from a legal standpoint as well as a trust standpoint.  Most of them have regular audits, etc but I would really appreciate anyones experiences in this.

Thanks

Base

taxidriver's picture
taxidriver
Status: Member (Offline)
Joined: Aug 24 2012
Posts: 7
Too late. The gold bubble has

Too late. The gold bubble has burst. Just kidding. :)

You may start being into the Eagles, but eventually you'll expand your tastes to PAMP bars, Krugerrands (yech) and whatnot. 

Best bet for authentic buying is finding a reputable dealer. And to buy well-known brands like PAMP. You can't really test gold content when the things are sealed.

 

ao's picture
ao
Status: Diamond Member (Offline)
Joined: Feb 4 2009
Posts: 2220
taxidriver wrote: Too late.
taxidriver wrote:

Too late. The gold bubble has burst. Just kidding. :)

You may start being into the Eagles, but eventually you'll expand your tastes to PAMP bars, Krugerrands (yech) and whatnot. 

Best bet for authentic buying is finding a reputable dealer. And to buy well-known brands like PAMP. You can't really test gold content when the things are sealed.

 

I wouldn't buy PAMP bars or Krugerrands and I wouldn't buy anything that's sealed. 

jonarmst's picture
jonarmst
Status: Member (Offline)
Joined: Feb 13 2011
Posts: 16
I would advise getting the

I would advise getting the most bullion for your buck.  This generally means staying away from "collectibles" (as neat as some of them might be.)

I've generally used two dealers here -- a local (Denver) dealer USA Gold (http://usagold.com) and CMI Gold & Silver (http://www.cmi-gold-silver.com/).  Both are perfectly decent dealers.  CMI Gold & Silver has a lot of variety in their products, but I like the fact that when I deal with USA Gold, I deal with the same people during every transaction and it feels very personal (CMI strikes me as a much larger outfit.)  You'll probably get a slightly better deal at USA Gold, but both provide excellent customer service (note that I have no financial stake in either company>)

The only caveat is that "collectibles" might be a hedge against a potential gold confiscation.  I tend to agree with Peter Schiff's article that a gold confiscation is highly unlikely (as physical gold owners are still a small tiny fringe of the investing community).  Even given an eventual gold confiscation, I would imagine that it would only come during a time when Joe Six Pack is talking about how his new gold coins (purchased from Goldline, naturally) are going to fund his children's private liberal arts college educations.  Most people astute enough to subscribe to a site like this will probably see this coming with a decent amount of headway.  Still, educate yourself just so you know what you're doing.

http://www.europacmetals.com/Portals/0/newsletters/december2010.html

http://miningandmetallurgy.com/gold/html/protection_against_government_....

Last of all, getting a good rapport with a local dealer makes for an easier time in the event that you will eventually want to sell your gold and use it to purchase farmland, real estate, or some other commodity that can be had at a massive discount in the near-inevitable event of a high inflationary environment that leaves aforementioned asset classes (or other things that require credit to purchase) available at a large discount.  Some (James Turk) have argued that you don't get rid of your gold until you spend it like cash (presumably with a new gold-backed currency?) but I'm a little leery of this, and in any event am getting too far afield from the original question.  Feel free to IM me if you want any more input as well.

Jonathan

Daniel2814's picture
Daniel2814
Status: Member (Offline)
Joined: Sep 15 2012
Posts: 1
Learning to invest in coins is a very smart thing to do.

I have a website that will explain exactly what to look for when investing in coins and what to stay away from www.preciousgoldstore.com, go there and there are Tons of videos on how to start coin collecting and what to buy for a novice up to a professional investor, there is even a place to buy coins of any sort and when you purchase you are protected by buying from one of the largest and safest places on the Internet "amazon.com" so you can rest assured you are getting a coin that's real and avoid all the fakes that are out there...www.preciousgoldstore.com can answer all of your coin investing questions...Have a Nice Weekend

Lykkelig's picture
Lykkelig
Status: Member (Offline)
Joined: Apr 5 2011
Posts: 8
Appreciate the responses

Thanks for all the responses.

Lykkelig's picture
Lykkelig
Status: Member (Offline)
Joined: Apr 5 2011
Posts: 8
Travlin wrote:LykkeligSince
Travlin wrote:

Lykkelig

Since you are new to buying gold you should check out the following.

How to buy gold.
http://www.peakprosperity.com/buying_gold

Where to buy gold from trusted dealers.
http://www.peakprosperity.com/where-to-buy-gold-and-silver

A simple tester.
http://www.fisch.co.za/home.htm

Try the search box in the upper right corner of every page to find many discussions on this topic.

Travlin

Test, test, test
Test, test, test
Test, test, test
Test, test, test

Hi Travlin

Thanks for the reference

I have read Chris Martensons articles on how to buy gold.

And I have looked at the fisch tester. I cannot see how that instrument really helps test coins.

Basically what it does is that it measures the diameter and the thickness and weighs the coin. But one does not need the fisch to do that.

Regarding the fisch. I was watching an interesting clip on youtube. Its a short clip. Here is an example of a counterfeit coin that the fisch would not have detected. But if you test the way the guys do in this video you will catch the counterfeit.

Look here and notice what he says on 1,24, "this is what makes it bad"

This would go right through the fisch. Am I not correct? It is new to me that a fake coin can be smaller than the official measurements. I thought that fake coins were always bigger than the official measurements.

According to wikepedia an austrian philharmonic weighs 31,103 has a diameter of 370 mm and a thickness of 20 mm.

This one has a thickness of 16,5 mm. So it is smaller and would pass a fisch test since, from what I can understand, the fisch only catches counterfeits whose measurements are to thick or wide.

I would appreciate any comments on this.

 

 

Lykkelig's picture
Lykkelig
Status: Member (Offline)
Joined: Apr 5 2011
Posts: 8
redfir223
redfir223 wrote:

Lykkelig,

Look up Provident Metals online. I have purchased from them and they are honest and I have yet to find a dealer who beats their prices. Some complain about slow delivery but they use the most secure method available in USPS, certified mail which has a verifiable chain of custody from Provident to you, (when I have picked up my packages at my post office they come out of the PO safe) but this takes a little extra time which security I prefer over speed. They also protect themselves by allowing time for your payment to clear which makes good business sense to me. To answer your concern about the authenticity of the coins you buy, if you deal with a reputable dealer and buy known coins such as American silver or gold Eagles, Maples, Kruggerands, etc., you have nothing to worry about. If you buy from Craig's list or out of the newspaper, I would be more concerned. 90% US silver coins are easy to recognize and are another option. Provident has those as well.

redfir

Thanks for the response. I am not in the US - I am in Europe. I have found a reputable dealer. It is the largest one in northern europe. At leat all the induviduals I have talked to about them have nothing but positive things to say. And I have not been able to find any negative things about them. They only get good reviews. Trust is what it all comes down to. I guess there is a strong incentive on the part of the dealer to protect their reputation.

Lykkelig's picture
Lykkelig
Status: Member (Offline)
Joined: Apr 5 2011
Posts: 8
ao wrote: taxidriver
ao wrote:
taxidriver wrote:

Too late. The gold bubble has burst. Just kidding. :)

You may start being into the Eagles, but eventually you'll expand your tastes to PAMP bars, Krugerrands (yech) and whatnot. 

Best bet for authentic buying is finding a reputable dealer. And to buy well-known brands like PAMP. You can't really test gold content when the things are sealed.

 

I wouldn't buy PAMP bars or Krugerrands and I wouldn't buy anything that's sealed. 

 

Why would you not buy PAMP bar, Krugerrands or anything thats sealed.

Lykkelig's picture
Lykkelig
Status: Member (Offline)
Joined: Apr 5 2011
Posts: 8
Daniel2814 wrote: I have a
Daniel2814 wrote:

I have a website that will explain exactly what to look for when investing in coins and what to stay away from www.preciousgoldstore.com, go there and there are Tons of videos on how to start coin collecting and what to buy for a novice up to a professional investor, there is even a place to buy coins of any sort and when you purchase you are protected by buying from one of the largest and safest places on the Internet "amazon.com" so you can rest assured you are getting a coin that's real and avoid all the fakes that are out there...www.preciousgoldstore.com can answer all of your coin investing questions...Have a Nice Weekend

 

Interesting large video library. Thanks for that.

Travlin's picture
Travlin
Status: Diamond Member (Offline)
Joined: Apr 15 2010
Posts: 1322
Fisch does it all

 

Lykkelig wrote:

So it is smaller and would pass a fisch test since, from what I can understand, the fisch only catches counterfeits whose measurements are to thick or wide.

Lykkelig

If  the diameter is too small it will move around in the hole.  If it’s too thin it will wiggle in the slot.  It also tests the weight.

Now you can buy a digital caliper and scale, and carry them with you with a list of the dimensions for a variety of coins.  But the Fisch will fit in your pocket anywhere you go.  There are models for a wide variety coins.  It looks simple and accurate to me.  I am not a coin buyer and I’ve never used the Fisch.  It is pricy for a piece of plastic.  But precision costs money, and the concept and convenience are impressive.

Travlin

nameofthegame's picture
nameofthegame
Status: Member (Offline)
Joined: Sep 25 2012
Posts: 15
Great links

I love the links on this thread. Thanks to all for posting. Preciousgoldstore.com looks cool. May I also add the resources at bullionvault.com are great reading, highly informative.

locky man's picture
locky man
Status: Member (Offline)
Joined: Oct 6 2012
Posts: 5
Six method to tell if the Gold is Real or Fake

Hi friends....

I have found six method to tell if the Gold is Real or Fake...check the below link.

http://www.wikihow.com/Tell-if-Gold-Is-Real

oware's picture
oware
Status: Member (Offline)
Joined: May 15 2015
Posts: 2
Selling and supplying gold

We are group of gold diggers in Guinea and Ghana, kindly let us know how we can supply you gold. we can supply you any quantity that you want to buy. We would like you to visit us in Guinea or Ghana to start the business. We can also send you pictorial sample. Contact us on 00233207500725 or [email protected]

oware's picture
oware
Status: Member (Offline)
Joined: May 15 2015
Posts: 2
Buy from the ground at low price and sell at high price elswhere

we are gold diggers in Guinea and Ghana, we would like to sell the gold to you direct from the mining site. I think we need to meet or visit us at the site so that we do serious business. we can mine and supply you any quantity all the time. You can contact us direct, not through any middle man no. it is time you dealt with the right people in Gold site. Contact us on [email protected] or 00233207500725

Thank You.

Comment viewing options

Select your preferred way to display the comments and click "Save settings" to activate your changes.
Login or Register to post comments