Typical public reaction to this site

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  • Wed, Jan 07, 2009 - 12:08am

    #1
    GR8TFUL

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    Typical public reaction to this site

 Sorry for the long paste below, but I wanted you to see the reaction from Joe Q. Public to this site.
I read & post on several other unrelated sites, and have occassionally mentioned this site on them. Recently I asked for feedback from people on an investment / political site what they thought about the chrismartenson site, and below is some sample feedback.
It may or may not be representative with regards to how the average person responds, it’s just frustrating to me when obviously intelligent people don’t give the site a fair shake due to their 1st immediate impression. Below is my post and the first few responses:
——————————————————————————————————————————————–
The future of the U.S. dollar & economy

Would be extremely grateful if those of you who are wiser, more intelligent, & more experienced than myself (basically all of you!) would take a look at the following & give me your opinion:

https://www.peakprosperity.com/crashcourse

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Old Today, 12:04 PM   #2
Chip Spewer

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Re: The future of the U.S. dollar & economy

i chose one movie to watch and can extrapolate it will be quite pessimistic / negative. at a glance, i’d say take the projections of the movie and reduce them by maybe 35-50% and that is likely how bad it will get. now keep in mind i’ve done nothing more than watch 1.5 minutes of this (the fed part to see where he was coming from) lol

Barron

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Old Today, 12:23 PM   #3
veteran

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Re: The future of the U.S. dollar & economy

Barron,
How pessimistic are you?

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Old Today, 12:39 PM   #4
adept

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Re: The future of the U.S. dollar & economy

In the little intro video he says he says something about his 6 hour "End of Money" seminar, I turned it off right there.

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Old Today, 12:47 PM   #5
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Re: The future of the U.S. dollar & economy

I cant figure out where the USD is going. I know pretty good arguments either way made by people who saw the crisis coming. The economy will be in the tank for years of course. Matter of fact I think I will buy more fed funds futures to bet the fed will stay low for longer than the market thinks

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Old Today, 04:10 PM   #6
Chip Spewer

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Re: The future of the U.S. dollar & economy

Quote:
Originally Posted by maxtower View Post
Barron,
How pessimistic are you?

well i don’t think the market has bottomed nd the economy certainly hasn’t (obv). i think there is quite a few expectations still to be killed on the downside. today caught me by surprise as that was one indicator that i didn’t expect to be less negative than forecast so that castes some doubt on my pessimism.

so i guess i’m ‘medium’ pessimistic.

Barron

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Old Today, 04:11 PM   #7
Chip Spewer

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Re: The future of the U.S. dollar & economy

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stormwolf View Post
I cant figure out where the USD is going. I know pretty good arguments either way made by people who saw the crisis coming. The economy will be in the tank for years of course. Matter of fact I think I will buy more fed funds futures to bet the fed will stay low for longer than the market thinks

i’ve been trying REALLY hard to decide which way i think futures will go and when. what contract are you buying?

Barron

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Old Today, 05:06 PM   #8
adept

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Re: The future of the U.S. dollar & economy

Long 09 Oct and Nov. Thinking of adding, there is just no way in hell the fed raises rates this year, unemployment is a lagging indicator, in the scenario the economy(GDP) recovers during the 2nd half(which I dont think its all that likely), jobs will still be shred every quarter. risk reward is poor, but I think the odds are overwhealming

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Old Today, 05:29 PM   #9
Chip Spewer

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Re: The future of the U.S. dollar & economy

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stormwolf View Post
Long 09 Oct and Nov. Thinking of adding, there is just no way in hell the fed raises rates this year, unemployment is a lagging indicator, in the scenario the economy(GDP) recovers during the 2nd half(which I dont think its all that likely), jobs will still be shred every quarter. risk reward is poor, but I think the odds are overwhealming

so you ride this from 99.4 to 99.85? seems like you need a TON of risk here and this can move if the economy picks up (Which i highly doubt it does). what leverage are you getting…i think most i could get is 4:1 or so which puts a 100k margin up per contract so that ties up capital as well…just ‘tested’ this and it seems it only ties up 2k so IB allows a TON here 🙂

Barron


Last edited by DcifrThs; Today at 05:38 PM.

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Old Today, 05:47 PM   #10
adept

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Re: The future of the U.S. dollar & economy

Been riding this one for a while, it was the trade that made me in 2008. contract is worth $400K, so it can wipe me out in a black swanish scenario the fed hikes a ridiculous amount and says more is coming

I keep trying to milk more profits out of them because it just look like free money, I think the fed keeps the zero range through the entire 2010, but I just dont want to risk to go that far
In the last credit crunch(90-91), greenspan keep rates low till feb 1994. Kept at 1% 1 year after 2003. this suggests the first hike is coming at dec 09, but this time is much worse so late 2010 looks more right
When they started to hike, they did 300bps in the first 12 months of hiking of those cycles, so there is a risk out there

  • Wed, Jan 07, 2009 - 12:41am

    #2
    AnOregonian

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    Re: Typical public reaction to this site

GR8TFUL,

Don’t be discouraged by what you just showed us. It
is obvious to me that these people are basically interested in
speculation to satisfy their immediate greed. People like this are
self-centered and only care about "what’s in it for me?".

As you
read the various forums on this site, you will notice that there is
strong interest on solving our problems and working with others to help
make it happen (e.g. The Martenson Brigade).

Folks on this site
will work to make this world a better place. The greedy ones on the
site you showed us are like the grasshopper in Aesop’s fable "The Ant
and the Grasshopper" (http://www.umass.edu/aesop/fable.php?n=0).

When their self-centered world collapses, they will be tapping on our door looking for salvation. I, for one, will not answer.

  • Wed, Jan 07, 2009 - 01:38am

    #3
    joemanc

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    Re: Typical public reaction to this site

GR8TFUL,

As SamLinder said – don’t be discouraged by the reaction. I get the same skeptical reaction all the time myself. But where I did have success, all of a sudden those people want to learn more and they have awoken. Sometimes you need to think of yourself as a salesman – not everyone will buy your product, but those that do will enjoy it.

And remember what Chris and people like Ron Paul have said, you only need 8-10% of the population to force a change or a revolution.

  • Wed, Jan 07, 2009 - 02:30am

    #4
    MarkM

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    Re: Typical public reaction to this site

GR8TFUL,

My wife thinks I am too negative, I should think about positive things.  I asked her, "If a hurricane is coming and I am obsessing over the weather forecasting, is that negative or trying to be as prepared as possible"?  She has no good answer and I continue to prepare.  The only way I can continue to prepare is to motivate myself daily with this site and others that discuss what I think are probabilities for our future.  Otherwise I fall back into complacency like most others.

I suggested to one of my co-workers that she take a look at "The Long Emergency".  She said, "No thanks".

Sam is right about your friends.  It seems as though they are looking for an angle to make a profit on events.  I am thinking of ways to survive and to try and help others survive.  I think our future will be more focused on daily life than turning a buck.

SAM,

Thanks for mentioning "The Ant and The Grasshopper".  Aesop’s Fables were some of my favorite reading as a child and that is one that has really shown me a lot of guidance throughout my life.

  • Wed, Jan 07, 2009 - 07:28am

    #5
    ckessel

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    Re: Typical public reaction to this site

GR8TFUL,

I just had one of those moments of realization after reading all of the comments to your original post. That is that perhaps the nature of this site is somewhat self sorting in that it naturally attracts those with a sincere desire to make a difference.

I agree with the general opinion that the authors of the comments you noted are not the types of individuals I would want to be holed up with anyway. So we should be grateful or is it GR8FUL !!

Coop

  • Wed, Jan 07, 2009 - 09:31am

    #6

    sylvanarrow

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    Re: Typical public reaction to this site

I thought Chris presented a strong and unbiased argument in his videos.  Maybe it’s because I’d already read Peter Schiff, lol.  Now he’s doom and gloom.  Personally I learned a lot from the Crash Course and was truly enlightened when it came to the sections on oil and natural resource depletion.  It didn’t go counter to any of my beliefs though–a lot of this is stuff I suppose I’d subconsciously suspected for a long time. 

As for others… I wanted to spread the message and pretty much got brushed off too.

I think it’s sad that people would dismiss this so easily (it doesn’t sound like anyone in your forum even watched more than two minutes worth), but I guess there’s a lot of truth to the idea that you can only be taught what you’re ready to learn.  

There’s a part of me that hopes fecal matter really does hit the fan, if only for the "I told you so" factor, but I’d settle for big box stores being put out of business and a return to a less materialistic lifestyle. 🙂

 

  • Wed, Jan 07, 2009 - 02:04pm

    #7

    cat233

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    Re: Typical public reaction to this site

Public reaction??? What about family reaction??? I am in my mid 40s and known as, Miss Doom and Gloom by my parents and siblings.  At least my husband and children have listened and thankfully most of my friends.  It does take some work to get the message thru, but persistence usually prevails one step at a time… I am not giving up on anyone.  As the economy gets worse, more and more people certainly have an open ear.  Won’t be long before your family and friends are coming out of the woodwork for advice from you!

  • Wed, Jan 07, 2009 - 02:42pm

    #8
    switters

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    Re: Typical public reaction to this site

I’ve been accused of being a "doomer" many times.  I’ve also heard Heinberg, Kuntsler, Chris M., and others who are telling the truth as they see it labeled this way.  This is a recent response I wrote to that accusation.

———————–

I’ve often heard people who are raising the alarm about the Three Es (economy, environment and energy) accused of being “gloom & doomers”.  While I have actually encountered some folks who fit that description, my experience is that it’s usually a mischaracterization.  I think it’s crucial to recognize that not all problems can be solved through positive thinking or action.  On a personal level, death is the most obvious example.  We are all going to die no matter what action we take and what our attitude is about death.  On a planetary level, the possibility that the earth could become a ball of ice in a period of 30 years also illustrates this point.

Our society’s dependence on oil and the inevitable peak in its supply represents a problem that can’t be “solved” through individual, regional or even national action alone.  Instead of viewing these issues as problems to be solved, we might instead embrace John Michael Greer’s suggestion to see them as predicaments that invite a response.  The distinction may seem academic, but I think it’s really important.  A problem calls for a solution which, once employed, eliminates the problem. A predicament, however, has no solution.  Faced with predicaments, people come up with responses which may fail, succeed, or fall in between, but none of them eliminates the predicament.

For me, the reality that we do not have complete control over the circumstances of our lives highlights the benefit of a spiritual approach to the challenges we face.  In Kubler-Ross’s Five Stages of Grief, acceptance is the final stage and the precondition to healing.  In the context of patients with a terminal illness (which ultimately means all of us!), death isn’t a problem to be solved but a predicament to be responded to.  Acceptance means acknowledging the predicament and healing means, not survival, but coming to terms with impending death and responding appropriately.

My sense of “doomers” is that they are stuck in anger, fear or depression.  It is actually their inability to accept what is happening and to truly allow all of the feelings that come with that recognition that prevents them from responding and taking action.  I’ve noticed that the people who seem to have the deepest understanding of the problem are rarely, if ever, doomers.  In fact, it’s common that people who are first exposed to this information ask experts like Richard Heinberg how they can maintain such a positive attitude even as they warn us of civilization’s impending decline.  Their answer is that in the process of beginning to respond to these issues we make changes in our lives that bring us satisfaction and joy.  The transformation towards the life they envision has already begun, and they are reaping the benefits.  I’ve found this to be true in my own experience as well.

I think it’s entirely possible to stare the full reality of the Three Es in the face and work towards creating a more sustainable and rewarding life at the same time.  In fact, the latter may even be an inevitable result of the former.
 

  • Wed, Jan 07, 2009 - 02:54pm

    #9

    Tom Page

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    Re: Typical public reaction to this site

The crash course has been getting favorable review at sites like Peakoil.com, where of course folks already believe there are significant issue 

http://peakoil.com/fortopic44551-0-asc-0.html

Friends seem to agree with me on issues like the Fed trying to reinflate the credit bubble won’t work because it’s repeating the same mistake, but they’re not moved to take actions yet like watch the crash course DVD I gave them or write their congressmen to stop all these bailouts.  They probably won’t act until they directly feel the impact of current crises personally, and when they can percieve a gain from taking action. 

Right now, many friends seem to percieve a "cost" in taking action; e.g. lower standard of living because they  cut expenses etc.  I tyr to point out that reducing and simplifying is actually improving my quality of life.

 

  • Wed, Jan 07, 2009 - 03:26pm

    #10
    gregroberts

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    Re: Typical public reaction to this site

I’ve handed out around 20 CC’s  to people ranging from a Vice President of an insurance company to a clerk in a paint store,  and have not heard from them yet in response. Hopefully now that the holidays are over they might take the time to view the CC. What I hear most often is, "When things get back to normal", when I try to explain that they most likely will not get back to normal they want to change the subject. One person refused to take a disk from me saying that he didn’t want to know what might happen, weird! When they ask why I’m giving out the CC I tell them that if they had worked in the WTC and I knew what was going to happen on 9/11 I would warn them.

Next week I’m going to start handing out the CC to the City Manager, High School Principal, Police,  and Priests/ Ministers and see what response I get from them. Will keep you informed, Happy New Year,

Greg

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