The Definitive Conspiracy Theorist, New World Order, Mad Max, Alex Jones Fan Club Thread

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  • Fri, Mar 06, 2009 - 06:12pm

    #31
    Peak Prosperity Admin

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    Re: The Definitive Conspiracy Theorist, New World Order, …

Dogs,

I understand that your Scotch collection is under seige and this would cause most to get cranky so I will overlook the fact that you forgot this is a conspriracy theory thread and that pretty much anything goes.

I do not like DUI checkpoints whether the military is involved or not, in my perfect world you have to violate someones rights before you can be convicted of something and unless you harm someone while drinking and driving you should be left alone. BTW-driving is a right not a priviledge, what king do we have in this country granting priviledges?

Greg

  • Fri, Mar 06, 2009 - 06:45pm

    #32
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    Re: The Definitive Conspiracy Theorist, New World Order, …

[quote=c1oudfire]

And now, a propos of nothing, I’ve been wondering for some time what the inspiration for your user name was.  Or should I be afraid to ask?  Or should I mind my own business?

[/quote]

Cloud –

 

I am a ginormous fan of the Grateful Dead.  Hence the Uncle Sam skeleton.

 

"Dogs in a pile" comes from one of my favorite songs – "He’s Gone"  It was originally written following the disappearance of Lenny Hart (acting band manager and father of drummer Mickey Hart) and a large sum of the band’s money.

 

I will send you the entire song when I get home this evening.  Of the 2300+ shows the Grateful Dead performed, it’s one of my favorite versions of the tune.  "Dogs in a pile" comes in at the 3:52 mark.  I love sitting down with my mandolin or guitar and just noodling along with the boys.

 

And now you know…….

I miss the fat guy. Frown

 

"He’s Gone" – The Grateful Dead


Words by Robert Hunter; music by Jerry Garcia

 Rat in a drain ditch
Caught on a limb
You know better but
I know him
Like I told you
What I said
Steal your face
right off you head

Now he’s Gone
Lord he’s gone
Like a steam locomotive
rolling down the track
He’s gone
He’s gone
and nothing’s gonna bring him back
He’s gone

Nine mile skid
on a ten mile ride
Hot as a pistol
but cool inside
Cat on a tin roof
Dogs in a pile
Nothing left to do but
smile, smile, smile

Now he’s gone
Lord he’s gone
Like a steam locomotive
rolling down the track
He’s gone
He’s gone
and nothing’s gonna bring him back
He’s gone

Going where the wind don’t blow so strange
Maybe on some high cold mountain range
Lost one round but the price wasn’t anything
Knife in a back and more of the same
Same old rat in a drain ditch
Out on a limb
You know better but I know him

Now he’s gone
Lord he’s gone
Like a steam locomotive
rolling down the track
He’s gone
He’s gone
and nothin’s gonna bring him back
He’s gone….

 

  • Fri, Mar 06, 2009 - 06:53pm

    #33
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    Re: The Definitive Conspiracy Theorist, New World Order, …

 

Aha . . .I should have known; I recognized the Uncle Sam skeleton, and understood its significance, but hadn’t made the connection.

[quote=Dogs_In_A_Pile][quote=c1oudfire]

And now you know…….

[/quote][/quote]

 . . . the rest of the story.

  • Fri, Mar 06, 2009 - 06:55pm

    #34
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    Re: The Definitive Conspiracy Theorist, New World Order, …

Cloud –

Until then, here’s the link to the entire show. 

http://www.archive.org/details/gd77-06-07.sbd.sacks.1861.sbeok.shnf

Click on the VBR M3U link on the left side of the page in the "Listen to audio" box.  The link is underneath  "Stream (help)"  Let it run in Windows Media Player.  The whole show is superb (except for Donna Jean Godchaux’s occasional caterwauling).  He’s Gone is the fifteenth song.

  • Fri, Mar 06, 2009 - 07:19pm

    #35
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    Re: The Definitive Conspiracy Theorist, New World Order, …

Harold Pinter

On September 10, 2001, I recieved an honourary degree at the University of Florence. I made a speech in which I referred to the term ‘humanitarian intervention’ – the term used by NATO to justify its bombing of Serbia in 1999

I said the following : On May 7, 1999 NATO aircraft bombed the marketplace of the southern city of Nis, killing thirty-three civillians and injuring many more. It was, according to NATO, a ‘mistake’.

The bombing of Nis was no ‘mistake’. General Wesley K. Clark declared, as the NATO bombing began: ‘We are going to systematically and progressively attack, disrupt, degrade, devastate and ultimately – unless President Milosovic complies with the demands of the international community – destroy these forces and their facilities and support.’ Milosovic’s ‘forces’, as we know, included television stations, schools, hospitals, theatres, old peoples homes – and the marketplace in Nis. It was in fact a fundemental feature of NATO policy to terrorize the civilian population.

The bombing of Nis, far from being a ‘mistake’, was in fact an act of murder. It stemmed from a ‘war’ which was in itself illegal, a bandit act, waged outside all recognised parameters of International Law, in defence of the United Nations, even contravening NATO’s own charter. But the actions taken, we are told, were taken in the persuance of a policy of ‘humanitarian intervention’ and civilian deaths were described as ‘collateral damage’.

‘Humanitarian intervention’ is a comparatively new concept. But President George W.Bush is also following in the great American presidential tradition by referring to ‘freedom-loving-people’ (I must say I would be fascinated to meet ‘freedom-hating-people’). President Bush possesses quite a few ‘freedom loving’ people himself – not only in his own Texas Prisons but throughout the whole of the United States, in what can accurately be described as a vast gulag – two million prisoners in fact – a remarkable proportion of them black. Rape of young prisoners, both male and female, is commonplace. So is the use of weapons of torture as defined by Amnesty International – stun guns, stun belts, restraint chairs. Prison is a great industry in the United States – just behind pornography when it comes to profits.

There have been and remain considerable sections of mankind for whom the mere articulation of the word ‘freedom’ has resulted in torture and death. I’m referring to the hundreds upon hundreds of thousands of people throughout Guatamala, El Salvador, Turkey, Israel, Haiti, Brasil, Greece, Uraguay, East Timor, Nicaragua, South Korea, Argentina, Chile, the Philipines and Indonesia, for example, killed in all cases by forces inspired and subsidized by the United States. Why did they die? They died because to one degree or another they dared to question the status quo, the endless plateau of poverty, disease, degradation and oppression which is their birthright. On behalf of the dead, we must regard the breathtaking discrepancy between US government language and US government action with the absolute contempt it merits.

The United States has in fact – since the end of the Second World War – persued a brilliant, even witty, strategy. It has exercised a sustained, systematic, remorseless and quite clinical manipulation of power worldwide, while masquerading as a force for universal good. But at least now – it can be said – the US has come out of its closet. The smile is still there of course (all US presidents have always had wonderful smiles) but the posture is infinitely more naked and more blatant than it has ever been. The Bush administration, as we all know, has rejected the Kyoto agreement, has refused to sign an agreement which would regulate the trade of small arms, has distanced itself from the Anti-Ballistic Missile Treaty, the Comprehensive Nuclear-Test-Ban Treaty and the Biological Weapons Convention. In relation to the latter the US made it quite clear that it would agree to the banning of biological weapons as long as there was no inspection of any biological weapons factory on American soil. The US has also refused to ratify the proposed International Criminal Court of Justice. It is bringing into operation the American Service Members Protection Act which will permit the authorization of military force to free any American soldier taken into International Criminal Court custody. In other words they really will ‘send in the Marines’.

Arrogant, indifferent, contemptable of International Law, both dismissive and manipulative of the United Nations: this is now the most dangerous power the world has ever known – the authentic ‘rogue state’, but a ‘rogue state’ of collosal military and economic might. And Europe – especially the United Kingdom – is both compliant and complicit, or as Cassius in Julius Caesar put it: ‘peep about to find ourselves dishonourable graves’.

There is, however, as we have seen, a profound revulsion and disgust with the manifestations of US power and global capitalism which is growing throughout the world and becoming a formidable force in its own right. I believe a central inspiration for this force has been the actions and indeed the philosophical stance of the Zapatistas in Mexico. The Zapatistas say (as I understand): ‘Do not try to define us. We define ourselves. We will not be what you want us to be. We will not accept the destiny you have chosen for us. We will not accept your terms. We will not abide by your rules. The only way you can elliminate us is to destroy us and you can not destroy us. We are free’.

These remarks seem to me even more valid now than when I made them on September 10. The ‘rogue state’ – without thought, without pause for reflection, without a moment of doubt, let alone shame – confirmed that it is a fully-fledged, award-winning, gold-plated monster. It has effectively declared war on the world. It knows only one language – bombs and death. ‘And still they smiled and still the horror grew.’

 …………………

…to me this thread is really about accountability. The discussion is about the fear to stand up and do something about what is wrong in America and the laws you allow to be past. Government is a creation designed for the people with decisions made by those people. I truly hope the 50,000 that marched in New York today are going to get more people involved – up and out of their computer chairs and actually do something for the future of your children and country…

Paul

  • Fri, Mar 06, 2009 - 07:50pm

    #36
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    Re: The Definitive Conspiracy Theorist, New World Order, …

 

Vanityfox;

I take no exception to your perception of the behavior of the United States government.  But understand this, too, that many of us here are painfully aware of the crimes committed by our government.  More and more of us are speaking out.  The silver lining to our economic crisis is that the criminality of our government is more obvious than ever.  Please understand this, too: the forces that propagate this evil are not American, but rather global.  And I would suggest that the U.N. is very closely allied to the source of that power.  Yes, American politicians and military are the puppets of this power, but it is folly to oversimplify and assume that average Americans endorse these criminals.

You make reference to "the laws we allow to be passed", but I can tell you that with very few exceptions, our population overwhelmingly does not feel that we have any control over our government anymore, as our elections are a fraud.  We generally feel that our government is renegade.  Many of us are speaking out, at great personal risk.  Our elections are a sham, and an ineffective way to affect change.   Our hope is that the general poulation will wake up and refuse to participate in the crimes.  By this, I mean our soldiers simply refusing to cooperate with torture and other atrocities, and police and other security institutions refusing to participate in the surveillance, harrassment, and arrest of our own citizens who speak out. 

The internet has proven to be a great tool in spreading the truth about our government’s corruption.   Toward that end, sites like this one are very useful, in spreading the word and in sharing ideas about how we can affect change.

That having been said, thanks for posting your views of the incident in Serbia.  It is a completely different account from the garbage presented in our media, and that is refreshing and enlightening. 

  • Fri, Mar 06, 2009 - 08:10pm

    #37
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    Re: The Definitive Conspiracy Theorist, New World Order, …

C1oudfire,

I have an ache in my gut that there is still such a small minority that get the full measure of what is happening not just in the United States, but the UK where I originate, Hungary where I am now, and the rest of the globe. I’m glad you defined well the difference between the people of America and American policy. Yet there has to come a day when there is a united Full Stop to the continuous media garbage and diss-information and the equally poorly measured decisions made by your politicians; where out of all of this is ‘Accountability’?

In Hungary there is a group that is climbing up into power to take the reigns of government. It is going to be messy and violent but in all honesty, very neccessary, because of the gross neglegence that is played here with the tax-paying people.

Choices are made by the voters of the USA and another puppet front comes into power. $400 million was a figure I heard bandied about for the cost of getting Obama to power for a job that pays $400,000; payed for by corporations who need his policy making power to maintain the corruption. I, with no power to confront this am affected even here in Hungary by people I will never meet, controlling the population with poor judgement to our needs from a vantage point 6,000 miles away.

Would I even need to have bought this farm here if the politics were designed for the people instead of corporations?

Thankyou for your thoughtful reply,

Paul

 

  • Fri, Mar 06, 2009 - 08:27pm

    #38
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    Re: The Definitive Conspiracy Theorist, New World Order, …

Vanity, Cloud –

Two quotes by one of my favorites, H. L. Mencken.

"Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want and deserve to get it good and hard."

The problem is the "common people are for the most part entirely clueless.  I actually heard someone at work say, "I am voting for Obama because Oprah is."  Until the majority of our voters rise above the massed ignorance and comfort of huddled stupidity, we will continue to elect those who tell most of the people what they want to hear.  Which ultimately will lead to our collective downfall when nothing gets done.

      and

"Every decent man is ashamed of the government he lives under."

The problem in America is there aren’t enough "decent men" who are ashamed enough to be of much utility – yet.  Until then, we’ll continue to tilt at the windmill.

 

  • Fri, Mar 06, 2009 - 08:56pm

    #39
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    Re: The Definitive Conspiracy Theorist, New World Order, …

[quote=Vanityfox451]

I have an ache in my gut [/quote]

Well put.  I’ve had an ache in my gut ever since I saw the photos of Abu Graib, and I’ve been ashamed at the complacency with which many Americans accepted this horror.  Many Americans have grown fat and morally lazy with their abundance.  I’m hoping that the economic crisis, which has really just begun here, will remind average Americans what it’s like to be powerless, and will awaken their compassion for others.  I’m doing that by talking with everyone I meet: cashiers, mechanics, doctors, nurses, police officers . . . whoever will listen.  Our survival and well being, and indeed, our souls, will depend on how we manage this.  In my heart I know that we will be held accountable, here and now,  or later, in hell.  Accountability is not avoidable.  The only choice we have is whether we are voluntarily or involuntarily accountable.  I’d rather voluntarily take my dose of medicine in this life than take the cure in hell.

I don’t advocate violence, largely because it’s usually ineffective in bringing about stable, positive change.  I sincerely believe that if the public wakes up, and refuses to carry out crimes, the criminals will be essentially powerless.  I don’t want to sound cliche, but, I believe that the truth will set us free.

  • Fri, Mar 06, 2009 - 08:59pm

    #40
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    Re: The Definitive Conspiracy Theorist, New World Order, …

Rick,

I like you, you make me laugh with your easy ways and mock anger; you’re just plain fun!! But deep down within you, you know that that answer you’ve just bought and payed for is a total cop-out and an excuse for things to-just-stay-the-same…

As a collective known as America, all I see is balled-up-fear. Have a look and see how the French kick the shit out of their polliticians. They strike, they boycott, they march and they riot; they kick back and the polliticians fear them; that’s the way it’s supposed to be, not waving flags to another mock president with his eyes cast on your 401K.

Accountability…

I Want Somethings Flesh!!!Surprised

Paul

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