Investing in precious metals 101

seek partner-collaborator to buy and develop fabulous property

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  • Tue, Apr 24, 2012 - 07:56am

    #1
    bootstrap

    bootstrap

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    seek partner-collaborator to buy and develop fabulous property

I decided to get out of dodge (the USSA) about 5 years ago.  I researched quite a few places in depth, and traveled several places to explore first hand.  If I had to characterize myself, I guess I’d call myself a "high-tech hermit".  As such, my tendency was to "do my own thing" and not depend upon or involve other people.  However, I keep rediscovering one very unpleasant fact that keeps smacking me across my face, and telling me I need to partner and collaborate with one or two others.  What is this inconvenient fact?  Answer: after looking at tens of thousands of potential locations, it has become blatantly clear that it is possible to get 5x, 10x, 25x, even 100x more quality and quanity of real-estate per dollar when spending over [roughly] $800,000.  Most individuals or couples buy real-estate that costs $150,000 to $450,000.  And what they get is a fraction of an acre with a ho-hum dwelling, or a couple boring acres with no dwelling.

In contrast, what can we buy for 2 or 3 times as much — assuming we spend endless hours researching our butt off?  Here are four examples:

#1: 135 acres of some of the most geologically wild, crazy, spectacular oceanfront property with a large gorgeous private beach, caves, etc.
#2: semi-tropical ~50 acre island (~1.40km by ~0.40km) 15~20 degrees from equator with 4 private white-sand beaches & coral reefs.
#3: ~6800-foot altitude mountaintop in wild, crazy, gorgeous desert environment overlooking endless ocean only ~8000 feet away.
#4: gorgeous executive vacation quality home on 6 acres of absolute white-sand beachfront property on Hawaiian island.

Except for #4, these properties are in very carefully selected locations outside the USSA.  Specifically, these location are carefully selected to be in places with a high chance of being "left alone and not bothered by government" when the SHTF in the next few years.  I include #4 because it is a very special location and situation inside the USSA that will likely be "out of sight, out of mind" of the predators-that-be.  However, my inclination is to stay outside the USSA.  Still, just try to find 6 acres with about 300 feet of absolute beachfront on a huge, usually empty, gorgeous beach in Hawaii for less than tens of millions of dollars.  Good luck.  Still, let’s ignore #4 while I finish my point.

The weather in all the above locations is absolutely glorious.  None of these ever receive snow, but #1 can get fairly cold at night in winter.

Here is my problem.  I’ve lived a frugal life, never taken a loan, never owned a home or real-estate, and managed to save up something over $250K.  And there is the rub.  I can easily find some small, totally boring property in any number of places for $250K.  For somewhere around 3~5 times that, I could own any of these totally spectacular properties that are ~100x larger and/or more desirable, glorious and secure against what is coming to every western country very soon.

My problem has been this.  It seems just about everyone suckered for the real-estate bubble, and lost whatever savings/wealth they might have accumulated over the years.  But hey, I can’t be the ONLY liberty-oriented human being who didn’t lose his shirt… right?

So I’m looking for 1, 2, or 3 partner-collaborators to buy one of these properties.  I’ve invested some insane number of hours finding these extraordinary opportunities.  These are the four most amazing places I’ve found after ~6 years and endless hours of researching, searching, traveling and exploring.  In two of these cases, we can likely recover all our money within two years in the following way.  Let’s take the island as the best example.  It is located not too far from similar-size islands that host tiny "vacation resorts" that charge hundreds to thousands of dollars per night.  Others offer small ocean-view [and a few ocean-front] lots for sale for a small fortune (hunderds of thousands for 0.25 to 1.00 acre).  If we install infrastructure (solar/wind power, water collection/purification, plus underground pipes for power/water/internet), we could sell 15 to 20 absolute white-sand beachfront lots along the east side of this island for ~ $100K each (a bargain price in comparison to any alternatives).  This would completely pay for the island, plus provide several hundred thousand dollars to build three small but luxurious "executive vacation" dwellings on the 3 isolated/separate white-sand beaches on the west side of the island.  This would likely take 2~3 years to play out completely, at which point we own the entire island and resort dwellings, including 3 of the 4 white sand beaches on the most glorious side of the island.  Note:  The island has a ridge down its 1.40km length that reaches up to ~65 meters (250 feet) altitude.  This makes the two sides completely private, separated and independent.  Except for a small area on the north tip of the island where the water is deep (good for parking yachts/vessels), the entire island is surrounded by huge, gorgeous coral reefs.  The island is about 50 acres, but the coral reefs that surround it cover more than 100 acres.  The island is very isolated, but less than 80km from an island with an international airport.  The air-temperature and water temperature are both warm and crystal clear all year long, and the waters are inhabited by endless amazing colorful tropical creatures.

Previously I tried to find 5~8 partner-collaborators so we could buy the property outright and add small but luxurious dwellings – all with cash and no loans.  Having not found 5~8 people with roughly $250K to invest, I am not considering the following more conventional possibility:  take my $250K+ and buy the island (20% down payment, finance the other 80%)… then find ONE partner-collaborator to invest $150K ~ $300K.  That is sufficient to establish complete self-sufficiency infrastructure (solar-panels, wind-turbines, batteries for electric power, water collection and purification for water, microwave internet connection to an island less than 50km away, underground pipes to carry power/water/internet to all parts of our island, plus miscellaneous small improvements.  Once done we could sell 15 to 20 lots on the east side to recover 100% of our investments, completely pay off the mortgage loan, and build 3 dwellings on our [western] side of the island (as well as the peak of the ridge at 65-meter altitude).

I’m just "putting this idea out there" to see whether anyone here is inclined to take advantage of this kind of opportunity, and my ga-zillion hours of research and exploration.  I can’t pull this off myself without taking too much risk — I’m a factor of 2 short on resources.  But we get 100x more per dollar by investing in a more expensive property like this one, and I just can’t forget that, or waste my money on mundane boring crap (in comparison).  Anyone willing, able and interested?  If so, pipe up.  As examples, I will provide a link to a web-page that shows a couple dozen photos of property #1, along with the original proposal that "went nowhere" because only one other person who contacted me had any savings!  Personally I find it amazing how many people want to "get out of dodge", want to "get self-sufficient", and develop a more secure future for themselves… but simply cannot convince themselves to take any action!  Plus, of course, the problem that virtually "everyone is broke" after the real-estate bubble-and-crash.

Forget the obsolete proposal text on the following web-page, but look at the pix.  This is property #1 mentioned above: http://www.sovereignones.com.  I’m not willing to show a link to the semi-tropical island here, because someone with $500K could do the whole project himself and cut me out.  I didn’t spend 27-zillion hours of research and exploration — just to hand this opportunity over to someone else.

PS:  I lived alone for 7 years at a remote 100% self-sufficient mountaintop facility (except for food production), so I have practical, real-world experience implementing the kind of self-sufficiency systems this project requires, and keeping them operational.  I’m a scientist, engineer, product-developer, so I am a practical, down-to-earth individual who understands reasonably well what is practical and what is not.

Anyone ready, willing and able?

  • Tue, Apr 24, 2012 - 02:34pm

    #2

    Dogs_In_A_Pile

    Status Platinum Member (Offline)

    Joined: Jan 04 2009

    Posts: 810

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    I’ll Bite…..

bootstrap wrote:

I decided to get out of dodge (the USSA) about 5 years ago.  I researched quite a few places in depth, and traveled several places to explore first hand.  If I had to characterize myself, I guess I’d call myself a “high-tech hermit”.  As such, my tendency was to “do my own thing” and not depend upon or involve other people.  However, I keep rediscovering one very unpleasant fact that keeps smacking me across my face, and telling me I need to partner and collaborate with one or two others.  What is this inconvenient fact?  Answer: after looking at tens of thousands of potential locations, it has become blatantly clear that it is possible to get 5x, 10x, 25x, even 100x more quality and quanity of real-estate per dollar when spending over [roughly] $800,000.  Most individuals or couples buy real-estate that costs $150,000 to $450,000.  And what they get is a fraction of an acre with a ho-hum dwelling, or a couple boring acres with no dwelling.

In contrast, what can we buy for 2 or 3 times as much — assuming we spend endless hours researching our butt off?  Here are four examples:

#1: 135 acres of some of the most geologically wild, crazy, spectacular oceanfront property with a large gorgeous private beach, caves, etc.
#2: semi-tropical ~50 acre island (~1.40km by ~0.40km) 15~20 degrees from equator with 4 private white-sand beaches & coral reefs.
#3: ~6800-foot altitude mountaintop in wild, crazy, gorgeous desert environment overlooking endless ocean only ~8000 feet away.
#4: gorgeous executive vacation quality home on 6 acres of absolute white-sand beachfront property on Hawaiian island.

Except for #4, these properties are in very carefully selected locations outside the USSA.  Specifically, these location are carefully selected to be in places with a high chance of being “left alone and not bothered by government” when the SHTF in the next few years.  I include #4 because it is a very special location and situation inside the USSA that will likely be “out of sight, out of mind” of the predators-that-be.  However, my inclination is to stay outside the USSA.  Still, just try to find 6 acres with about 300 feet of absolute beachfront on a huge, usually empty, gorgeous beach in Hawaii for less than tens of millions of dollars.  Good luck.  Still, let’s ignore #4 while I finish my point.

The weather in all the above locations is absolutely glorious.  None of these ever receive snow, but #1 can get fairly cold at night in winter.

Here is my problem.  I’ve lived a frugal life, never taken a loan, never owned a home or real-estate, and managed to save up something over $250K.  And there is the rub.  I can easily find some small, totally boring property in any number of places for $250K.  For somewhere around 3~5 times that, I could own any of these totally spectacular properties that are ~100x larger and/or more desirable, glorious and secure against what is coming to every western country very soon.

My problem has been this.  It seems just about everyone suckered for the real-estate bubble, and lost whatever savings/wealth they might have accumulated over the years.  But hey, I can’t be the ONLY liberty-oriented human being who didn’t lose his shirt… right?

So I’m looking for 1, 2, or 3 partner-collaborators to buy one of these properties.  I’ve invested some insane number of hours finding these extraordinary opportunities.  These are the four most amazing places I’ve found after ~6 years and endless hours of researching, searching, traveling and exploring.  In two of these cases, we can likely recover all our money within two years in the following way.  Let’s take the island as the best example.  It is located not too far from similar-size islands that host tiny “vacation resorts” that charge hundreds to thousands of dollars per night.  Others offer small ocean-view [and a few ocean-front] lots for sale for a small fortune (hunderds of thousands for 0.25 to 1.00 acre).  If we install infrastructure (solar/wind power, water collection/purification, plus underground pipes for power/water/internet), we could sell 15 to 20 absolute white-sand beachfront lots along the east side of this island for ~ $100K each (a bargain price in comparison to any alternatives).  This would completely pay for the island, plus provide several hundred thousand dollars to build three small but luxurious “executive vacation” dwellings on the 3 isolated/separate white-sand beaches on the west side of the island.  This would likely take 2~3 years to play out completely, at which point we own the entire island and resort dwellings, including 3 of the 4 white sand beaches on the most glorious side of the island.  Note:  The island has a ridge down its 1.40km length that reaches up to ~65 meters (250 feet) altitude.  This makes the two sides completely private, separated and independent.  Except for a small area on the north tip of the island where the water is deep (good for parking yachts/vessels), the entire island is surrounded by huge, gorgeous coral reefs.  The island is about 50 acres, but the coral reefs that surround it cover more than 100 acres.  The island is very isolated, but less than 80km from an island with an international airport.  The air-temperature and water temperature are both warm and crystal clear all year long, and the waters are inhabited by endless amazing colorful tropical creatures.

Previously I tried to find 5~8 partner-collaborators so we could buy the property outright and add small but luxurious dwellings – all with cash and no loans.  Having not found 5~8 people with roughly $250K to invest, I am not considering the following more conventional possibility:  take my $250K+ and buy the island (20% down payment, finance the other 80%)… then find ONE partner-collaborator to invest $150K ~ $300K.  That is sufficient to establish complete self-sufficiency infrastructure (solar-panels, wind-turbines, batteries for electric power, water collection and purification for water, microwave internet connection to an island less than 50km away, underground pipes to carry power/water/internet to all parts of our island, plus miscellaneous small improvements.  Once done we could sell 15 to 20 lots on the east side to recover 100% of our investments, completely pay off the mortgage loan, and build 3 dwellings on our [western] side of the island (as well as the peak of the ridge at 65-meter altitude).

I’m just “putting this idea out there” to see whether anyone here is inclined to take advantage of this kind of opportunity, and my ga-zillion hours of research and exploration.  I can’t pull this off myself without taking too much risk — I’m a factor of 2 short on resources.  But we get 100x more per dollar by investing in a more expensive property like this one, and I just can’t forget that, or waste my money on mundane boring crap (in comparison).  Anyone willing, able and interested?  If so, pipe up.  As examples, I will provide a link to a web-page that shows a couple dozen photos of property #1, along with the original proposal that “went nowhere” because only one other person who contacted me had any savings!  Personally I find it amazing how many people want to “get out of dodge”, want to “get self-sufficient”, and develop a more secure future for themselves… but simply cannot convince themselves to take any action!  Plus, of course, the problem that virtually “everyone is broke” after the real-estate bubble-and-crash.

Forget the obsolete proposal text on the following web-page, but look at the pix.  This is property #1 mentioned above: http://www.sovereignones.com.  I’m not willing to show a link to the semi-tropical island here, because someone with $500K could do the whole project himself and cut me out.  I didn’t spend 27-zillion hours of research and exploration — just to hand this opportunity over to someone else.

PS:  I lived alone for 7 years at a remote 100% self-sufficient mountaintop facility (except for food production), so I have practical, real-world experience implementing the kind of self-sufficiency systems this project requires, and keeping them operational.  I’m a scientist, engineer, product-developer, so I am a practical, down-to-earth individual who understands reasonably well what is practical and what is not.

Anyone ready, willing and able?

All of that is great.  One question……

Have you watched Crash Course yet?

  • Wed, Apr 25, 2012 - 05:57am

    #3
    bootstrap

    bootstrap

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    Dogs_In_A_Pile wrote:All of

Dogs_In_A_Pile wrote:

All of that is great.  One question……
Have you watched Crash Course yet?

Yes.  Did you have to pollute my thread?

  • Wed, Apr 25, 2012 - 02:22pm

    #4

    goes211

    Status Gold Member (Offline)

    Joined: Aug 18 2008

    Posts: 287

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    Your thread?

bootstrap wrote:

Yes.  Did you have to pollute my thread?

Kind of cocky for a first time poster talking to a valued community member with over 2000 posts, don’t you think?  We talking about the internet here and you are an anonymous user looking for someone to partner with, requiring a large sum of money.  You got any Nigerian connections?

Please forgive my skepticism.

  • Wed, Apr 25, 2012 - 03:56pm

    #5

    Mary Aceves

    Status Silver Member (Offline)

    Joined: Aug 23 2010

    Posts: 132

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    miscalculated

 Bootstrap, I think you have seriously miscalculated your market here.  If you have the money to travel to do all that research, you have the money to buy your own place.  I doubt anybody  here wants to live with you and bring their chickens and goats to a luxury dive on pristine island.  Sounds very fishy to me.  Most folks  here would gladly give away their information in order to educate the public, which I doubt you intend to do.

  • Wed, Apr 25, 2012 - 04:36pm

    #6

    Dogs_In_A_Pile

    Status Platinum Member (Offline)

    Joined: Jan 04 2009

    Posts: 810

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    bootstrap

bootstrap wrote:
Dogs_In_A_Pile wrote:

All of that is great.  One question……
Have you watched Crash Course yet?

Yes.  Did you have to pollute my thread?

Hmmm, if you think that’s polluting, you ain’t seen nothing yet.

Not to pile on with goes, but when you’ve been around here longer than a day, you’ll understand that your first post on this vibrant site has all the markings of spam.  Most first time posters who aren’t trolls don’t roll up on us with a sales pitch and intimations of ridiculously great returns on investment – despite “gazillions of hours of research”

Most people tentatively wade into discussions about the Economy, the Environment or Energy – or better yet how all three are intertwined – commonly known around here as “The Three Es”

Your post looked like a duck, it walked like a duck, it smelled like a duck.  You responded to a post so at least we know you aren’t a spammer pushing some miracle snake oil – so for now your post doesn’t (yet) sound like a duck.

How about addressing some questions about energy requirements, the local government, dependency on oil for energy generation, length of growing season, type of soil, local industry, community supported agriculture organizations, dairy co-ops. community barter opportunity (my i.e., sawmill for your milk and produce) – I think you get the point.  Your pictures had power liner in them so there’s something else going on on your idyllic island investment opportunity.

Most of the long term contributors on this site are all about fostering community and less focused on the potential for investment returns on gazillions of hours of research and once in a lifetimem, too good to be true and it won’t last so you better act now  posts like yours.

goes is right – it’s our thread, not yours.

Your move – will you quack or not…………

  • Wed, Apr 25, 2012 - 11:52pm

    #7

    Damnthematrix

    Status Diamond Member (Offline)

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    Not impressed.

http://www.sovereignones.com.

Not impressed.  Looks like crap soil.  Is there ANY soil?  One lousy patch of grass with sheep on.

I hope you like coconuts and fishing.  And hurricanes.  Me, I intend to move almost 2000 miles to GET AWAY from the Equator.  Tropical life may look idyllic, but like most places, it comes with strings attached.

Mike

  • Thu, Apr 26, 2012 - 02:05am

    #8
    bootstrap

    bootstrap

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    Damnthematrix

Damnthematrix wrote:

http://www.sovereignones.com.

Not impressed.  Looks like crap soil.  Is there ANY soil?  One lousy patch of grass with sheep on.

I hope you like coconuts and fishing.  And hurricanes.  Me, I intend to move almost 2000 miles to GET AWAY from the Equator.  Tropical life may look idyllic, but like most places, it comes with strings attached.

Mike

Hey, to each his own.  I have NO problem with that.  I just wonder why so many people are so negative today.  That attitude is an EXACT analog of the predator DBA government attitude – they assert their way is the only way, and force everyone into it.  Clearly you match that attitude.  I am opposite.  I am happy to let everyone have their own plans, their own tastes, their own opinions, their own skill-set… and implement their own solutions.  It does not threaten me that others have different plans and tastes.  In fact, I much prefer it that way.

Why is it so important to you people to trash everyone and everything?  Have you ever asked yourself that?  I’m simply an individual trying to establish a solution for my own life and preferences.  Is that so terrible?  I guess so.  I explained exactly why I’m looking for collaboration – because $250K can buy any one of a billion totally boring but totally conventional properties… while 3x that can buy something spectacular and 10x ~ 100x more quality and quantity per buck.

Further, you make endless assumptions that happen to be WRONG, at least in this case and my case.  I lived in Hawaii the past 20 years, about 20 degrees north of the equator.  Whatever “price” you refer-to hasn’t bothered me here — AT ALL.  I am VERY aware that being too close to the equator is much too cloudy, and has other drawbacks too.  However, I am also aware that once we get more than about 12-degrees from the equator, conditions get much better.  And I carefully research the characteristics of EVERYWHERE I consider to relocate (imagine that).  In case you didn’t read my whole post, I also visit and explore places I consider.

That property at the web-page you mentioned is FAR from being tropical property — it is on the south island of New Zealand.  The soil is adequate – the adjacent two properties are farms (yes, most of those properties are flatter than this one, and vastly less spectacular).  But the main point of living there is NOT to operate a farm.  We do intend to grow enough food for a few people to live on, and the property is more than adequate for that purpose.  All the properties I consider are adequate in that regard.

EVERYWHERE has strings attached.  NOWHERE is best in every regard.  I suspect you already know that, but just want to make trouble and be critical because it gives you some kind of faux ego-boost… or something.  Sadly, you are a fairly typical human… which explains why humans got themselves into such a horrible situation.  Just watch the crash course for a small sample of ways humans and the predators they sanction, defend and finance have royally screwed themselves.

I have a suggestion.  Try to be helpful some day.  You’ll find that makes for much better forum content.  Imagine that.

  • Thu, Apr 26, 2012 - 02:43am

    #9
    ao

    ao

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    bootstrap

bootstrap wrote:
Damnthematrix wrote:

http://www.sovereignones.com.

Not impressed.  Looks like crap soil.  Is there ANY soil?  One lousy patch of grass with sheep on.

I hope you like coconuts and fishing.  And hurricanes.  Me, I intend to move almost 2000 miles to GET AWAY from the Equator.  Tropical life may look idyllic, but like most places, it comes with strings attached.

Mike

Hey, to each his own.  I have NO problem with that.  I just wonder why so many people are so negative today.  That attitude is an EXACT analog of the predator DBA government attitude – they assert their way is the only way, and force everyone into it.  Clearly you match that attitude.  I am opposite.  I am happy to let everyone have their own plans, their own tastes, their own opinions, their own skill-set… and implement their own solutions.  It does not threaten me that others have different plans and tastes.  In fact, I much prefer it that way.

Why is it so important to you people to trash everyone and everything?  Have you ever asked yourself that?  I’m simply an individual trying to establish a solution for my own life and preferences.  Is that so terrible?  I guess so.  I explained exactly why I’m looking for collaboration – because $250K can buy any one of a billion totally boring but totally conventional properties… while 3x that can buy something spectacular and 10x ~ 100x more quality and quantity per buck.

Further, you make endless assumptions that happen to be WRONG, at least in this case and my case.  I lived in Hawaii the past 20 years, about 20 degrees north of the equator.  Whatever “price” you refer-to hasn’t bothered me here — AT ALL.  I am VERY aware that being too close to the equator is much too cloudy, and has other drawbacks too.  However, I am also aware that once we get more than about 12-degrees from the equator, conditions get much better.  And I carefully research the characteristics of EVERYWHERE I consider to relocate (imagine that).  In case you didn’t read my whole post, I also visit and explore places I consider.

That property at the web-page you mentioned is FAR from being tropical property — it is on the south island of New Zealand.  The soil is adequate – the adjacent two properties are farms (yes, most of those properties are flatter than this one, and vastly less spectacular).  But the main point of living there is NOT to operate a farm.  We do intend to grow enough food for a few people to live on, and the property is more than adequate for that purpose.  All the properties I consider are adequate in that regard.

EVERYWHERE has strings attached.  NOWHERE is best in every regard.  I suspect you already know that, but just want to make trouble and be critical because it gives you some kind of faux ego-boost… or something.  Sadly, you are a fairly typical human… which explains why humans got themselves into such a horrible situation.  Just watch the crash course for a small sample of ways humans and the predators they sanction, defend and finance have royally screwed themselves.

I have a suggestion.  Try to be helpful some day.  You’ll find that makes for much better forum content.  Imagine that.

I’ll try to be helpful.  Look somewhere else.  I agree with DTM.  The land looks sub-optimal at best.  Rocky beach, rocky land, scrubby vegetation, muddy estuary, and where’s a good fresh water supply?  Plus, if you present yourself as a hermit, that means you’d probably not be easy to get along with.

Pass.

  • Thu, Apr 26, 2012 - 03:01am

    #10
    bootstrap

    bootstrap

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    Dogs_In_A_Pile

Dogs_In_A_Pile wrote:
bootstrap wrote:
Dogs_In_A_Pile wrote:

All of that is great.  One question……
Have you watched Crash Course yet?

Yes.  Did you have to pollute my thread?

Hmmm, if you think that’s polluting, you ain’t seen nothing yet.

Not to pile on with goes, but when you’ve been around here longer than a day, you’ll understand that your first post on this vibrant site has all the markings of spam.  Most first time posters who aren’t trolls don’t roll up on us with a sales pitch and intimations of ridiculously great returns on investment – despite “gazillions of hours of research”

Most people tentatively wade into discussions about the Economy, the Environment or Energy – or better yet how all three are intertwined – commonly known around here as “The Three Es”

Your post looked like a duck, it walked like a duck, it smelled like a duck.  You responded to a post so at least we know you aren’t a spammer pushing some miracle snake oil – so for now your post doesn’t (yet) sound like a duck.

How about addressing some questions about energy requirements, the local government, dependency on oil for energy generation, length of growing season, type of soil, local industry, community supported agriculture organizations, dairy co-ops. community barter opportunity (my i.e., sawmill for your milk and produce) – I think you get the point.  Your pictures had power liner in them so there’s something else going on on your idyllic island investment opportunity.

Most of the long term contributors on this site are all about fostering community and less focused on the potential for investment returns on gazillions of hours of research and once in a lifetime, too good to be true and it won’t last so you better act now  posts like yours.

goes is right – it’s our thread, not yours.

Your move – will you quack or not…………

Holy crap!  Either you can’t read, or somehow my writing must be incomprehensible.  Because your reply bears little resemblance to my post.  Frankly, I’m not sure how a forum site can be “vibrant” when everyone who answers is purely negative, ignores the content of my post, and offers nothing potentially helpful.

I would have hoped that people in this forum would be able to see how my post relates to the content of this website.  Do you honestly consider someone trying to establish a self-sufficient place to live… away from aggressive western governments… to be unrelated to the subject matter of this website?  Really?

I DID address some questions about energy requirements and such in my original message.  I did not go into detail, because my first message was already rather long, and typically the first complaint about my messages is “they are too long”.  I did mention that I lived for 7 years at a completely self-sufficient facility with solar-panels, wind-turbine, battery-banks, water-collection… everything except I was too lazy (as in busy with my scientific and engineering projects) to grow my own food.  Maybe it isn’t obvious to you, but the “growing season” in locations 15~20 degrees from the equator is “all year long”.  Honestly, I don’t know enough about barter opportunities yet to comment intelligently, except that tons of very inexpensive local-grown food is available on islands not far away (within 100km).  What WE might have to barter for that is unknown (except travel between islands in our tiny little super-efficient 30~50mpg aircraft).

You (and others apparently) weren’t reading carefully enough.  The location at http://www.sovereignones.com is NOT the tropical property, it is one of the four properties I listed as examples of getting “more per dollar” when we spend more than about $800K.  The property shown at that website is on the south island of NewZealand, which puts it WELL outside what I’d call “tropical” (though it never freezes there… barely).  As I said in my post, I’m not willing to post detailed information or photos of the tropical island because I suspect someone would buy it out from under me (thus I require a confidentiality agreement, and only from people who are seriously interested and able).  It is an extraordinary deal, which is why I want to buy it and develop it to live on.  I would MUCH prefer to find 5 partners with similar level of savings as me so we could flat-out buy the island and install everything we need for self-sufficiency.  The only reason I consider dividing the eastern quarter or third of the island into lots to sell is — I have not been able to find 5 partners.  It appears that just about everyone except me refused to live a frugal life the past 20 years and/or they suckered for the housing bubble and are now upside-down or close to broke.  Frankly, it is revolting to me that I was able to save $250K while living in Maui (a very expensive place to live), while everyone else couldn’t save anything while living in much lower-cost locales.  However, that is irrelevant, except to explain why it is so difficult to find anyone with savings today.

I am quite aware of the 3 Es and the other subject matter addressed by the course.  Frankly, I’ve been complaining about these and related topics for decades… while nobody listened.  So “it ain’t my fault” that nobody pays attention to these issues.  I HAVE.  And I lived my life accordingly.  How many others do you know who lived mostly self-sufficient lives?  How many others do you know who never purchased a TV or stereo or cell-phone or endless other non-essentials?  How many others did not generate offspring because population is a big problem?  So take your sanctimonious tone and live an intelligent life rather than bitch about mine.

I don’t know what you mean by “my move”.  I came to this forum because it APPARENTLY contained people who are interested in intelligent living, self-sufficient (or “sustainable”) living, and maybe even wanting to escape the western governments that are becoming the most aggressively predator-controlled of all.  And what I offered directly addresses these understandings and goals.  The point is NOT to create some kind of business to rip people off.  Like I said, I’d prefer to find partners who would like to develop it for self-sufficient living and live there themselves — PERIOD.  However, I have not been able to find 5 partners, so now I have a plan that is feasible with ONE partner (with similar resources as me).  Yes, that does involve selling several lots to pay off the mortgage on the island and the self-sufficiency infrastructure.  Sorry if that offends you, that we end up with 20 self-sufficient familes rather than two or three.  But at root, this is not a commercial venture.  This is a endeavor designed for some small number of people who value living a self-sufficient, sustainable life without the need for external input.  Will we have external input?  Hopefully so.  The idea is not necessarily to completely eliminate all connections to others, the idea is to BE ABLE TO if necessary, for as long as necessary, when the SHTF.  I assume that some of you do worry the S will be hitting the fan in the near future, correct?  Frankly, the S of tyranny is going to hit the fan several years sooner than those physical-resources exponential curves hit the fan… and that’s is the first problem this island venture is meant to address.

If you people have QUESTIONS or HELPFUL SUGGESTIONS… I welcome them.  I’m just trying to accomplish something good and relevant to the subject matter of the course.  It is remarkable how virtually all mankind [in the western world] has become so aggressively anti-benevolent.  It is as if everyone wants to assure that NOBODY can organize or execute anything intelligent and responsible.  Why?  Because they haven’t done so personally?  And they’re jealous?  What?  I don’t get it.

What I describe is NOT “too good to be true”.  However, if you believe such nonsense, you’ll never look for exceptional opportunties, will you?  Frankly, it makes perfect sense to me that extensive research often leads to results.  What?  You want everything good to be EASY ???  Is that how people think reality works?  I don’t, so I work my butt off, and sometimes get great results.  Sorry if that offends people.  Sheesh.

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