Investing in Precious Metals 101 Ad

Renewable energy can replace coal

Login or register to post comments Last Post 7983 reads   53 posts
Viewing 10 posts - 1 through 10 (of 53 total)
  • Wed, Feb 09, 2011 - 10:37pm

    #1
    sevenmmm

    sevenmmm

    Status Bronze Member (Offline)

    Joined: Jan 20 2011

    Posts: 42

    count placeholder

    Renewable energy can replace coal

 

I had to line up the various negatives of burning coal for energy before sharing this next link. I think each of these negatives highlighted deserve separate discussions, should anyone be willing. But there is an alternative to the current methods, methods causing disharmony amongst life on Earth. All we have to do is make the choice.

Really, it is all about capital and the return on investment. It is no secret the capital markets have financed the research and engineering of the modern fossil fuel and nuclear power generation plants. To the tune of billions. Now they want a return, a fat return. 

No doubt renewable energy is a roadblock to the desires of the super rich:

http://www.solarthermalmagazine.com/2011/01/25/battle-fo-dominance-between-renewables-coal-and-nuclear-likely-to-grow/

  • Wed, Feb 09, 2011 - 10:49pm

    #2
    Peak Prosperity Admin

    Peak Prosperity Admin

    Status Bronze Member (Offline)

    Joined: Oct 31 2017

    Posts: 1612

    count placeholder

    Re: Renewable energy can replace coal

Sorry, that story sounds like a lot of nonsense to me.

  • Thu, Feb 10, 2011 - 12:53am

    #3
    Peak Prosperity Admin

    Peak Prosperity Admin

    Status Bronze Member (Offline)

    Joined: Oct 31 2017

    Posts: 1612

    count placeholder

    Re: Renewable energy can replace coal

[quote=james_knight_chaucer]

Sorry, that story sounds like a lot of nonsense to me.

[/quote]

 

Why?

  • Thu, Feb 10, 2011 - 05:33pm

    #4
    Peak Prosperity Admin

    Peak Prosperity Admin

    Status Bronze Member (Offline)

    Joined: Oct 31 2017

    Posts: 1612

    count placeholder

    Re: Renewable energy can replace coal

Okay, well to start with Sevenmmm, you are obviously anti-coal, as you have just started three separate anti-coal threads.

Here in the UK, we have a maximum of 5 GW of renewable energy from wind and hydro-power. It is also not very sunny for most of the year. In December we had two weeks of below zero temperatures. Daily average consumption around 50GW, but not a breath of wind. Average renewable output during those two weeks was 0.5GW, about half of which came from hydro-power, around 1% of consumption. It also was not very sunny, so photovoltaic is out.

So for two weeks, coal. gas and nuclear power kept the lights on. To replace those would thus require 200 times as many windmills as we have at the moment, that have taken us 20 years to erect. So for the next 40 years, we would have to put up 100 times as many windmills per year as we have done previously.

I don’t think so.

  • Thu, Feb 10, 2011 - 05:44pm

    #5
    Peak Prosperity Admin

    Peak Prosperity Admin

    Status Bronze Member (Offline)

    Joined: Oct 31 2017

    Posts: 1612

    count placeholder

    Re: Renewable energy can replace coal

[quote=sevenmmm]

[quote=james_knight_chaucer]

Sorry, that story sounds like a lot of nonsense to me.

[/quote]

Why?

[/quote]

Maybe I’m missing something, but here’s one why. 

Extracted from the article:

Among other top line findings, the report demonstrates the need to phase out 90 percent of today’s coal and nuclear power plants by 2030 in order to have a stable and efficient electricity supply with 68% renewable sources by that date.

So I take nuclear and coal electrical generation out of the denominator and I am surprised that renewable sources now account for 68%?  What is the gap between electrical demand and electrical supply after 90% of coal and nuclear generation is gone.  Or are we supposed to be content with the fact that 68% of an inadequate electrical supply system is renewable?

Another why – adding a picture of a NUDET is a nice touch.  The drama of comparing uncontrolled nuclear energy release to controlled nuclear power generation while subliminally implying the risk of a NUDET from a power plant perhaps?  Greenpeace certainly has no agenda there right?  Cool

Other than that the article was interesting but a little short on details of how to accomplish the stated end state.  I’m still trying to figure out how the article apparently dismissed the demand side of things – unless it was tacitly stating that the supply level would establish the new demand level and everything would have to adjust down to the new level of consumption?

  • Thu, Feb 10, 2011 - 09:20pm

    #6
    Peak Prosperity Admin

    Peak Prosperity Admin

    Status Bronze Member (Offline)

    Joined: Oct 31 2017

    Posts: 1612

    count placeholder

    Re: Renewable energy can replace coal

[quote=james_knight_chaucer]

Okay, well to start with Sevenmmm, you are obviously anti-coal, as you have just started three separate anti-coal threads.

Here in the UK, we have a maximum of 5 GW of renewable energy from wind and hydro-power. It is also not very sunny for most of the year. In December we had two weeks of below zero temperatures. Daily average consumption around 50GW, but not a breath of wind. Average renewable output during those two weeks was 0.5GW, about half of which came from hydro-power, around 1% of consumption. It also was not very sunny, so photovoltaic is out.

So for two weeks, coal. gas and nuclear power kept the lights on. To replace those would thus require 200 times as many windmills as we have at the moment, that have taken us 20 years to erect. So for the next 40 years, we would have to put up 100 times as many windmills per year as we have done previously.

I don’t think so.

[/quote]

 

Then, might I so so bold to type, if you consider me anti-coal, can I consider you pro-pollution for dismissing the continuing growth of mercury, sulfur dioxide, nitrous oxide, and CO2 emissions?

If I am anti-coal, are you then anti wind energy? How about photovoltaic and thermal electric? What is your opinion about conservation measures? Should the people of the world have access to all the pollution energy they desire? 

If no one makes a stand, then we will doom our progeny to one hell-of-a-transition once the Earth energy fund reads zero. I am making a stand, so you might just as well run along than waste your time making such a ridiculous assertion about my opinion concerning coal. You will always lose this debate…

  • Fri, Feb 11, 2011 - 12:36am

    #7
    Peak Prosperity Admin

    Peak Prosperity Admin

    Status Bronze Member (Offline)

    Joined: Oct 31 2017

    Posts: 1612

    count placeholder

    Re: Renewable energy can replace coal

[quote=sevenmmm]

 

 How about photovoltaic and thermal electric? What is your opinion about conservation measures? Should the people of the world have access to all the pollution energy they desire? 

If no one makes a stand, then we will doom our progeny to one hell-of-a-transition once the Earth energy fund reads zero. I am making a stand, so you might just as well run along than waste your time making such a ridiculous assertion about my opinion concerning coal. You will always lose this debate…

[/quote]

 

I already told you. It is not sunny enough for photovoltaic in the UK winter. If by Thermal electric you mean geothermal heating, this still requires electricity and does not run lights or factories. If you mean generating steam by pumping water into the ground, our ground isn’t hot enough. Conservation measures? Sure if you can conserve 99.5%, we might just scrape by on windmills. I think I won the debate.

By the way over here in Europe, we drive cars twice as efficient as the average American one because our petrol is the equivalent of $7/ US gallon.

  • Fri, Feb 11, 2011 - 01:03am

    #8
    Peak Prosperity Admin

    Peak Prosperity Admin

    Status Bronze Member (Offline)

    Joined: Oct 31 2017

    Posts: 1612

    count placeholder

    Re: Renewable energy can replace coal

Didjall listen to Kimosavvy’s podcast on water? Solar is out.

  • Fri, Feb 11, 2011 - 01:17am

    #9
    Peak Prosperity Admin

    Peak Prosperity Admin

    Status Bronze Member (Offline)

    Joined: Oct 31 2017

    Posts: 1612

    count placeholder

    Re: Renewable energy can replace coal

[quote=james_knight_chaucer]

[quote=sevenmmm]

 

 How about photovoltaic and thermal electric? What is your opinion about conservation measures? Should the people of the world have access to all the pollution energy they desire? 

If no one makes a stand, then we will doom our progeny to one hell-of-a-transition once the Earth energy fund reads zero. I am making a stand, so you might just as well run along than waste your time making such a ridiculous assertion about my opinion concerning coal. You will always lose this debate…

[/quote]

 

I already told you. It is not sunny enough for photovoltaic in the UK winter. If by Thermal electric you mean geothermal heating, this still requires electricity and does not run lights or factories. If you mean generating steam by pumping water into the ground, our ground isn’t hot enough. Conservation measures? Sure if you can conserve 99.5%, we might just scrape by on windmills. I think I won the debate.

By the way over here in Europe, we drive cars twice as efficient as the average American one because our petrol is the equivalent of $7/ US gallon.

[/quote]

 

UK has plenty of sun and photovoltaic produces electricty during cloudy conditions. Solar thermal has the means to store heat for night time and, if one wants to, build a high mass system that could conceivably store enough heat from the summer for the whole of winter. Of course, there is wind in the UK. With all of these measures taken into account, the UK could drastically lower coal burning for producing electricty and heating fuel use as well. 

All one has to do is make the choice.

  • Fri, Feb 11, 2011 - 01:18am

    #10
    Peak Prosperity Admin

    Peak Prosperity Admin

    Status Bronze Member (Offline)

    Joined: Oct 31 2017

    Posts: 1612

    count placeholder

    Re: Renewable energy can replace coal

[quote=Tycer]

Didjall listen to Kimosavvy’s podcast on water? Solar is out.

[/quote]

 

I live on the shores of Lake Michigan. 

Viewing 10 posts - 1 through 10 (of 53 total)

Login or Register to post comments