Max Keiser: BTC and Trump vs. Biden
Max thinks BTC will go up quickly if Biden wins and slower if Trump wins. I know who I want to win. LOL
Ha. I was thinking, yesterday, that the answer to the question, “Will the government engage in more stimulus after the election?” is, of course, yes. If Trump is re-elected I’ll become a millionaire over the next couple years. If Biden is elected I’ll become a multi-millionaire. 😉
(Voicing this realization will drive some resident BTC critics crazy: “all you care about is getting rich on rent-seeking!” But I’d happily trade BTC’s upside for a solid currency.)
Ha. Yes the critics will always find something to complain about. Reminds me of a Rumi poem.
” The Lovers, Ah the Lovers, The Lovers should be crazy, absent minded, disgraceful.
There will always be someone sober to find the things that have gone wrong,”
Rendering by Coleman Barks.
So VT why do you think people are still critical? Is it jealousy? Maybe they think they missed out? Fear? Every criticism leveled has been answered numerous times yet the same people keep criticizing. Oh well.
As far as rent seeking goes lots of people here are counting on returns from their investments. The difference is BTC and crypto in general are the new, revolutionary, disruptive technologies. Bonds, Gold, Stocks are part of the old system which is dying before our eyes. Yes money can be made and should be, how else are you going to motivate the entire planet leave a failed oppressive monetary system. What is that quote? Oh yeah,” show me the incentive and I will show you the result” I have one of my own ” If the result you want is a democratic, fair monetary system w/o banksters the incentive is BTC”
The rent seeking is the current environment, What will come next is the move from SOV to MOE. This will happen on a huge scale. It will have to. What has not been discussed is the Fed coin, and other CB coins. Surprisingly (or maybe not ) there has been little in depth discussion here about CB digital currency. One would think that the owners and followers would be discussing the ramifications. Like what happens if you sell a used car? Or have a yard sale? Or any number of private exchanges that go unreported? Crypto to the rescue. A parallel, competitive monetary system. Now we are getting somewhere.
Do you think John and Mike will recommend owning stock in Coinbase or other crypto exchanges when they go public? lol
Ah, but what will the purchasing power of those millions be? Therein lies the rub. By the way, I am a Weimar Republic billionaire by virtue of a single postage stamp but it does me little good other than having a historical curiosity to show my children and grandchildren.
ao I really expected better of you. Too bad you missed the point completely. BTW what will the purchasing power of gold be? How do I get it to my bugout country ?
I don’t really understand BTC well despite having read a fair amount about it. I should say, I don’t understand it enough to be willing to invest in it at my late stage in life (just like Warren Buffet supposedly doesn’t understand tech and therefore eschews tech stocks). Do you really think Buffet isn’t capable of understanding them or is it he just prefers something else with more perceived solidity. As I think you know, one of the cardinal rules of investing is, don’t invest in something you don’t understand. I plan on abiding by that rule. To condemn me for that, is like condemning someone who favors investing in utility stocks for not investing in more high flying stocks. One appeals to the personality with a more slow-and-steady-wins-the-race investor philosophy while the other appeals to a personality with a more shoot-for-the-moon speculator philosophy. As the saying goes, to thine own self be true.
I do understand, from what I’ve read, why people would put their money into BTC (for a whole host of reasons besides just profit). Quite frankly, I think the odds are that the people who invest in it will do very well, at least in the short term. It’s the longer term and the potential downside risks involved with safely entering and exiting the market and safely holding BTC (avoiding all the potential sources of cyber theft) that concern me the most. Both my cognitive analysis and my intuitive gut feelings tell me to stay away from it and I’ve learned to listen to those sources of information. And so I need to keep my actions authentic and consistent with one of my cardinal rules of investing, minimize downside risk.
We have Peter Lynch who favored stocks, Bill Gross who favored bonds, Jim Rogers who favored commodities, etc. Was Rogers wrong because he favored commodities over equities? I wouldn’t say so. It’s like saying someone is wrong because they favor jazz over rock and roll. For most, it’s a matter of personal preference and familiarity with a medium with which they feel comfortable.
I feel more comfortable with cash, precious metals, and real estate and have done very well with those. If Biden winds up spending more profligately than Trump, can you deny that the increase in nominal dollar wealth described by VTGothic would be due, at least in part, to currency debasement and therefore accompanied by a decrease in purchasing power?
Gold was here 5,000 years ago, it was here 100 years ago like my stamp, it is here now, and it will be here in the future. Is BTC as durable and timeless? Can it be exposed to salt water for 400 years like coins from a Spanish galleon and still have the same value? Can it be buried in a backyard during WW2 and be dug up and still have value? Can it survive societal breakdown, technological breakdown, energy source collapse, an EMP event, a CME event, digital media decay, etc., etc?
Perhaps I did miss the point completely though. Could you give me a brief summary of “the point” which you think is important to make your case? I’d appreciate it being that you are certainly more knowledgeable about BTC than I. Thank you.
P.S. I don’t plan on bugging out from the U.S. I will make my last stand here and decided no one’s going to chase me out of my country. I’ve traveled to many prospective bug-out locations around the world and there is no place, to my knowledge, that is immune to what is happening.
If the internet continues as it has since inception, bitcoin will do just fine.
If not, then the longer the internet is down, the more bitcoin’s value will drop. That’s a guess – based on human nature. If you can’t get at your wealth, and neither can anyone else, it will cease to have value for you, because confidence in the currency will decline.
* Can it be exposed to salt water for 400 years like coins from a Spanish galleon and still have the same value? [The “coins” are stored in a database – said database is replicated on 12000 computers worldwide. So – yes. If one of those computers sink, heck if half of them do, nobody even notices.]
* Can it be buried in a backyard during WW2 and be dug up and still have value? [same answer. replicated database.]
* Can it survive societal breakdown, technological breakdown, energy source collapse, an EMP event, a CME event, digital media decay, etc., etc? [Theoretically yes – practically, no. The entire database will almost certainly survive in some form or another, to be later dug up by archeologists, but until that event, you won’t have access. And neither will anyone else.]
Gold provides intertwined value-and-access because it is “molecules.”
Bitcoin provides value, but the access is mediated by the internet. No internet = no access. No access for any “reasonably long” amount of time = value declines, because access is part of the “confidence in currency” equation.
If you can’t access your bank account, it effectively doesn’t exist during the time you have no access. Same thing is true for bitcoin.
And a prolonged non-access situation will decrease people’s confidence. People demand access. A few days of non-access is fine – weeks and months of non-access is fine, as long as it is voluntary. Six months of involuntary non-access is a disaster for confidence.
And as with all currencies, confidence is everything.
No internet hahahahahahaha
You can’t be serious.
Do you do stand up?
If the internet goes down the absolute least (read again) the absolute least of your worries will be what happens to your BTC (well not your BTC because you are too smart to fall for that scam)
“Gee the internet went down, what will happen to my BTC?”
You know Mondays are in need of more jokes like this.
ao I don’t care what you choose to invest in. I don’t lose sleep over what you or anybody chooses to do with your money.
Buffett is a dinosaur. I have a friend who lost $14 million in 08 because he held Berkshire. I told him to dump it and get gold. Did he listen? Clearly not.
By your own admission you do not understand BTC. At your age (?) I would not expect you to jump onto another horse. Nor am I asking or suggesting you do. I am not even asking you learn about BTC and other crypto.
What I think the reasonable intelligent thing to do is refrain from commenting about something you know nothing about. Every objection people have to BTC has been answered here ad infinitum. Your canard completely off base. I guess you have not heard people like Mike Saylor, Raoul Pal, Paul Tudor Jones are putting huge sums into BTC to counter the very reason you object to BTC.
Now you know a lot about gold and have been around here a long time , long enough to have some understanding of the three E’s. Of course this site is now primarily devoted to only one. Be that as it may, perhaps you would care to tell me about the effect of gold on the environment? Nobody here cares about the environmental destruction wrought by mining. You talk about the past, what about the future environment being left to your children and their children. Is that tradeoff worth your wealth?
Disclaimer; I am a masochist. I find myself against my better judgement getting involved in these types of discussions when I absolutely know better. In your case I generally appreciate your comments so I replied. But I am done here with this line of discussion of worst case scenarios.
I hope your health is okay.
So ao was talking about scenarios. If there is no reliable internet, there is no bitcoin.
He laid out a whole bunch of different scenarios. All of them involved no internet.
Clearly you can’t conceive of a world without internet. If AO wants to consider this possibility – perhaps he remembers a time back before the Internet. He’s a really old guy, apparently. I was writing code back then – but I’m definitely not an old guy.
Guess what? My code still compiled and ran, at a time before everyone had realtime connectivity to everything. Trains ran, planes flew, telephones rang – it was an amazing world back then. We had usenet. And netnews. And email, using a whole lot of exclamation points. High tech meant a telebit trailblazer 9600 baud modem. They were the very latest thing. It all (more or less) worked.
I remember such a time. I was a software engineer, at the dawn of the Internet age.
And my code really did still compile.
I guess what I’m saying is – you can still have global connectivity without the realtime connectivity. And preserve most of the benefits. Bitcoin won’t work, and neither will google search – at least not as well – but all the rest of the stuff will. Life really would continue – modulo some small changes – even if we didn’t have instant connectivity to every spot on the globe in real time.
And it really wouldn’t be all that different to end users. I know, because I used to manage it, way back when. It was part of my job to keep it running.
It would just take a lot more caching. 🙂