Less talk, more action: what to do now to prepare, THE COMPLETE MANUAL

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  • Mon, Dec 19, 2011 - 10:30am

    #51
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    vegetarian diet

 does anyone have a vegetarian survival plan.  i don’t really feel like butchering animals all the time.  i donmt mind  killing a fish.  could anyone recommend a protein substitute, or iron or whatever.  i might just buy supplements.

  • Mon, Dec 19, 2011 - 11:44am

    #52
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    bientumI am a pretty strict

bientum

I am a pretty strict vegetarian these days and have given this a lot of thought.   I know people who raise ducks for their eggs (apparently the eggs are bigger?) and of course lots of people keep chickens for the eggs.  Of course dairy cows and goats are available but would probably be a pretty tempting food source to others. (sorry to get so negative).  Road kill doesn’t require killing an animal so if you don’t mind butchering that is an alternative.  Fishing seems like a good alternative if you are near a source.

I have not made it to the point of growing my own food except for herbs as I do not own any land so take what I say with a grain of salt.  Not sure what your situation is.  Stockpiling is pretty important for me.  I have a stockpile of sprouting seeds. Pea sprouts have a shockingly high protein content.  If you want to grow your own maybe it would be worth finding out how to preserve and dry peas for sprouting.  Of course there are the usual beans, lentils, nuts, legumes. Wheat products are a good protein source and home made seitan is extremely high in protein. I make mine from gluten to save time but if you google seitan recipes you will find many variations using wheat gluten and or wheat flour. It can be made in advance and frozen for many months.

Of course what you can grow on your own land is regional, so you might want to survey the veggies you can grow to see what makes the most sense for your climate, soil, etc…..Potatoes have a decent protein content and store well and can grow in a variety of climates so that might be an important addition.

I cook in cast iron which actually transmits iron to the food. Molasses has a bit of iron in it as do some greens.

Do not want to derail the prior discussion but just a few thoughts to answer your question. I have a lot of experience with this issue in particular.

take care

Denise

 

 

 

 

  • Mon, Dec 19, 2011 - 12:15pm

    #53
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    B12 is ESSSENTIAL for people avoiding animal protein

bientum

just one more thought in case you did not know. There are no non animal sources for this vitamin, sorry to say.  According to Dr. Michael Greger (google veganmd to get his info if needed) who is a Tuft’s trained physician, there are studies showing the majority of vegetgarians and vegans are b12 deficient.   It is just a hard fact, you must take b12 if you avoid animal products. b12 deficiency causes lots of very bad health problems and is hard to detect.  Not worth risking brain damage, the supplements are cheap.

Of course you may know this already.

Good luck!

Denise

  • Mon, Dec 19, 2011 - 03:00pm

    #54
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    weston price to help understand diet

[quote]

 does anyone have a vegetarian survival plan.  i don’t really feel like butchering animals all the time.  i donmt mind  killing a fish.  could anyone recommend a protein substitute, or iron or whatever.  i might just buy supplements.

[/quote]

I think the work of Weston A Price is extremely helpful to understand how to craft a healthy diet.  www.westonaprice.com   He was a dentist that studied the diets of native peoples all over the world and their teeth.  He formulated the theory that the health of a person/society is greatly visible through the health of their teeth along with the jaw development.  The traditional societies he studied had very little tooth decay, if at all, and perfectly straight teeth and full jaws.  All this despite never seeing or using a toothbrush, much less an orthodontist.  And these people lived long, healthy, disease-free lives.  This changed within one generation after being exposed to western diets of refined sugar and flour and processed foods.  He documents all this well in his book Nutrition and Physical Degeneration.

Basically, eating meat specifically is not required as long as good fat and essential nutrients are found in the diet somewhere.  None of the cultures he studied ate anything remote to a vegan diet.  There were animal products of some sort in all of them.  And usually they were the most prized of all the food items.  

Good eggs and raw dairy from grass fed animals can go a very long way.  If you were going to buy some sort of nutritional supplement, the best one would be cod liver oil.  Next would be some sort of mineral suspension.

 

  • Tue, Dec 20, 2011 - 10:33am

    #55
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    Politically Incorrect Diets

Weston A Price had a lot to say about nutrition. He’s mentioned in "Nourishing Traditions" by Sally Fallon, which is ostensibly a cookbook but with a book length discussion of nutrition at the front. He’s also mentioned in "Deep Nutrition" by Catherine Shanahan, MD. Another book I’ve read recently is "Gut and Psychology Syndrome" by Natasha Campbell-McBride, which is about food, related to gut health (which affects the whole body). I’d recommend reading at least one of the last two but all three reach broadly similar conclusions about diet. I had been moving toward vegetarianism (supplemented by eggs), for efficiency reasons, but these books have completely changed my views about what is a healthy diet and meat products are a must, particularly organ meats. Most vegetable oils are a no-no, particularly for cooking, highly refined "foods" are not really foods at all and homogenised milk makes any nutrition in the milk impossible to assimilate properly.

Definitely worth a read, and each book has lots of references (though I’ve only checked some – too many to check even a small fraction).

Tony

  • Wed, Dec 21, 2011 - 06:47am

    #56
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    Politically Incorrect Diets

[quote=sofistek]

Weston A Price had a lot to say about nutrition. He’s mentioned in "Nourishing Traditions" by Sally Fallon, which is ostensibly a cookbook but with a book length discussion of nutrition at the front. He’s also mentioned in "Deep Nutrition" by Catherine Shanahan, MD. Another book I’ve read recently is "Gut and Psychology Syndrome" by Natasha Campbell-McBride, which is about food, related to gut health (which affects the whole body). I’d recommend reading at least one of the last two but all three reach broadly similar conclusions about diet. I had been moving toward vegetarianism (supplemented by eggs), for efficiency reasons, but these books have completely changed my views about what is a healthy diet and meat products are a must, particularly organ meats. Most vegetable oils are a no-no, particularly for cooking, highly refined "foods" are not really foods at all and homogenised milk makes any nutrition in the milk impossible to assimilate properly.

Definitely worth a read, and each book has lots of references (though I’ve only checked some – too many to check even a small fraction).

Tony

[/quote]

I’m totally with you here Tony……  It’s all very well to say B12 supplements are cheap, but will they even be available post TSHTF?  Believe me, if you get hungry enough, you will soon learn to kill chickens.  AFAIC, the hardest part of killing chickens (and particularly ducks) is not the head chopping, it’s the plucking….  gawd I look forward to making myself a plucking machine after I get all the other jobs around here done!

I have some vegetarian friends, and a pair of them have actually gone off the rails eating meat and fish at least once a week after some health problem that caused some concern in the household (can’t remember what it was now)

I agree that as a society we eat way too much meat, and meat IS heavy on the resources, but  a pork chop a week, and a roast chicken a week can be done very sustainably.  We raised two pigs at the start of this year, and fed them waste organic food from a meditation centre (who would have been appalled at the thought we were raising meat off it! )

The pigs were "tractored" http://permaculture.org.au/2011/01/28/pig-tractors/





 

  • Wed, Jan 04, 2012 - 06:34am

    #57

    Poet

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    Seaweed: Miracle Vegetable From the Sea

Denise

Actually, some seaweeds are a good plant-based source of vitamin B12. Here’s an article:

Seaweed: Miracle Vegetable From the Sea
Often found floating in miso soup, wakame looks like slippery spinach. It is a diuretic, which means it helps reduce the amount of water in the body. Because it prevents bloating and is packed with osteoporosis-preventing calcium and magnesium, wakame is sometimes referred to as the “women’s seaweed.” But the wakame benefits don’t end here – this seaweed is also high in important trace minerals and is one of the few non-animal sources of vitamin B12.
http://www.doctoroz.com/blog/mao-shing-ni-lac-dom-phd/seaweed-miracle-vegetable-sea

I love all sorts of seaweed. You can have it in soups or salads, or cut in strips and sautéed.

Poet

 

Denise2257114 wrote:

bientum

just one more thought in case you did not know. There are no non animal sources for this vitamin, sorry to say.  According to Dr. Michael Greger (google veganmd to get his info if needed) who is a Tuft’s trained physician, there are studies showing the majority of vegetgarians and vegans are b12 deficient.   It is just a hard fact, you must take b12 if you avoid animal products. b12 deficiency causes lots of very bad health problems and is hard to detect.  Not worth risking brain damage, the supplements are cheap.

Of course you may know this already.

Good luck!

Denise

  • Wed, Jan 04, 2012 - 11:58am

    #58
    ao

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    caution with overconsumption of sea vegetables

Poet wrote:

Denise

Actually, some seaweeds are a good plant-based source of vitamin B12. Here’s an article:

Seaweed: Miracle Vegetable From the Sea
Often found floating in miso soup, wakame looks like slippery spinach. It is a diuretic, which means it helps reduce the amount of water in the body. Because it prevents bloating and is packed with osteoporosis-preventing calcium and magnesium, wakame is sometimes referred to as the “women’s seaweed.” But the wakame benefits don’t end here – this seaweed is also high in important trace minerals and is one of the few non-animal sources of vitamin B12.
http://www.doctoroz.com/blog/mao-shing-ni-lac-dom-phd/seaweed-miracle-vegetable-sea

I love all sorts of seaweed. You can have it in soups or salads, or cut in strips and sautéed.

Poet

 

Denise2257114 wrote:

bientum

just one more thought in case you did not know. There are no non animal sources for this vitamin, sorry to say.  According to Dr. Michael Greger (google veganmd to get his info if needed) who is a Tuft’s trained physician, there are studies showing the majority of vegetgarians and vegans are b12 deficient.   It is just a hard fact, you must take b12 if you avoid animal products. b12 deficiency causes lots of very bad health problems and is hard to detect.  Not worth risking brain damage, the supplements are cheap.

Of course you may know this already.

Good luck!

Denise

Sea vegetables are indeed healthy (at moderate levels of consumption) but counting on them as a primary source of B12 has a couple of problems including B12 analogs and also the fact that consumption of those levels of sea vegetables could create an iodine induced (albeit reversible) hypothyroidism.

P.S. Take Dr. Oz sourced medical information with a grain of salt.  He is a Johnny-come-lately to the holistic health field and has most of his information supplied by ghost medical “authorities”/writers, the veracity of whom one may need to sometimes call into question.

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