China’s water and soil too far gone to support growing economy

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  • Sun, Dec 14, 2008 - 05:21pm

    #41
    switters

    switters

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    Joined: Jul 19 2008

    Posts: 433

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    Re: China’s water and soil too far gone to support growing …

Yes.  Governments screw things up.  Markets screw things up.  People screw things up.  That’s life.  Doesn’t mean we should get rid of governments, markets and people.

In Buddhism there is a concept called the "middle path".  It means to investigate and penetrate the core of life and all things with an upright, unbiased attitude. In order to solve a problem, we should position ourselves on neutral ground. We investigate the problem from various angles, analyze the findings, understand the truth thoroughly, and find a reasonable conclusion.

The middle path is more difficult to find and stay on than those representing the extremes.  Why?  Because it requires constant inquiry, analysis and action.  When one follows an ideology (i.e. government is evil) they can always depend upon that ideology to direct their thoughts and behavior.  This replaces the messy, moment-by-moment process of examining a situation, processing the information and responding appropriately.  Such an approach requires us to remain open to new ideas and to relinquish attachment to one particular way of thinking or being.  It demands a continuous engagement with the facts as they are, not as we believe or assume them to be.  It prevents us from ignoring those facts that don’t fit in with our views and emphasizing those facts that do.

The reality is that governments have done a lot to help people, and a lot to harm them.  The same is true for markets.  The idea that government is the root of all of our problems does not stand up to historical scrutiny.  And the idea that truly free markets would solve all of our problems (especially social, environmental and resource problems) doesn’t stand up to logical inquiry. 

Sure would be a lot easier if that were the case.  Then we wouldn’t have to keep thinking, analyzing, responding and evolving.  We’d always have the answer, and always know what to do. 

At least we’d think we do.

 

  • Sun, Dec 14, 2008 - 05:30pm

    #42

    Ray Hewitt

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    Joined: Apr 05 2008

    Posts: 277

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    Re: China’s water and soil too far gone to support growing …

Joe

my reply was not addresssed to you hewitt.

My error. I’m so used to being called an ideologue that I took it indirectly.

i assume you followed the whole thread. i also assume you manage a
hedge fund as you certainly hedge on free markets when you state a
"better" economic outcome will ensue if we have a rule of law in which
gov protects person , liberty and property. (is property mentioned in
the constitution or is it life liberty and the pursuit of
happiness……..no it was the declaration).one question i have is if
you have more property does that make you more equal? just asking cuz
the other two are not quantifiable

Not exactly. I’ve been hedging against the collapse of the dollar. Free market theory is a valuable analytical tool, but reality is still the imperative.  The phrase "more equal" is right out of Orwell’s Animal Farm. Having more property can make one wealthier or poorer depending on circumstances.

i am somewhat confused where you come in on this as i was speaking
about food and water yet i did not find those words in your post. so
please inform me if you have a preference for free market corporate
water and food ………..we can leave the air out since it will be
compromised whichever you choose anyway.

I’m an advocate of separation of commerce and State. That would imply a free market source of water. The southwest is notably an arrid area. I’m fairly sure that if I researched the topic, I would find that government subsidies were instrumental in supplying water to those states.

so therefore the financial shangri la we find ourselves in is not the
result of gov. regulation but boys being boys. ie "free markets" or am
i missing something here . or were all those derivatives vetted by
chris cox? a failure of regulation? 

 I would call it more broadly a failure of government. The fact is that the regulators protected the banksters, and are not only not prosecuting them, bailing them out. There is a common misperception out there that liberty is evil, and only the force of government can contain it.

hold the politicians liable for whatever infractions they commit. as
for now that means voting against them and exposing their dirty little
secrets as much as i can to as many as i can. if the opportunity
presents itself for ,more "effective means of redress" rest assured i
will avail myself. 

As every election proves over and over, the political class counts votes as a show of support. They can’t be beaten by their rules. They have no power without popular support. Better to leave the system as best one practically can. At least we preserve out integrity.

  • Sun, Dec 14, 2008 - 05:53pm

    #43

    Ray Hewitt

    Status Gold Member (Offline)

    Joined: Apr 05 2008

    Posts: 277

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    Re: China’s water and soil too far gone to support growing …

btw the people of new york city have the best water supply in the u.s.
and it is owned by the people of new york city aka known as a
government

I happen to live in the suburbs outside NYC. That may be true, so far as we can tell. If memory serves, they have two massive pipelines from upstate about a hundred years old. There is a massive project that began about ten years ago to build a third before one of the old ones falls apart. I don’t know what the status is.

They have a wretched subway system also in need of repairs. On some lines, the cars are packed like sardine cans during rush hour. The system can’t support itself, and now with city revenues tanking, they are frantically searching for a way to keep it going.

NYC has a network of steam pipes under the roads. Every once in a while one blows up the street scalding to death a few unfortunate motorists.

NYC reminds me of the mining towns during San Francisco gold rush days. When the gold ran out, the miners left. Devopers have many big projects in the works and the Trade Towers are being rebuilt. Who will come?

Yes Mussolini made the trains run on time. But the rest of Italy was falling apart.

  • Wed, Dec 17, 2008 - 07:57pm

    #44

    joe2baba

    Status Gold Member (Offline)

    Joined: Jun 17 2008

    Posts: 414

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    Re: China’s water and soil too far gone to support growing …

so i assume being the good austrian economist you are some company such as bechtel or kellogg brown and root

or halliburton should run the subways and everything else.       give me a scenario of what would happen to the nyc subways in the likely event of that happening

steam pipes? every once in awhile a plane falls out of the sky. 

shit happens ray

i get shit on just as much if not more by multinational corporations as i do by governments. with an informed educated  citizenry i will take my chances with a government. i will have to at any rate

btw ray i grew up in nyc and rode the subway everyday and you know what we were packed in like sardines then. i kinda liked it.  ya know  it was a great way to meet new people on a more intimate level.

infrastructure needs maintenance. i dare say the maintenance on the nyc subway is better than that on gsx……….a private enterprise.

merry christmas

joe

  • Wed, Dec 17, 2008 - 10:18pm

    #45

    Damnthematrix

    Status Diamond Member (Offline)

    Joined: Aug 09 2008

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    Re: China’s water and soil too far gone to support growing …

[quote=GR8TFUL]You write "there are three things absolutely necessary for life, food , air and WATER. corporations currently control food…..are you happy with that?" Uh, for the most part, yea, I am, Joe. [/quote]

Even though it’s killing you?

Supermarket food is CRAP!  Nutritional value is almost non-existent.  Additives make you and your kids hyperactive and fat.  Since eating mostly my own food, I have not been sick once (three years) and I have more energy than I can remember for a long time….  And my food tastes a lot better too!

I wouldn’t let government control my food supply anymore than I would corporations, that is not the point.  What you should be considering is being a lot more self reliant, because WTSHTF you will be on your own, you better believe it… 

  • Wed, Dec 17, 2008 - 11:26pm

    #46

    kcim67

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    Joined: Aug 19 2008

    Posts: 3

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    Re: China’s water and soil too far gone to support growing …

[quote=Ray Hewitt]

Switters

That’s fine. But as far as the Asians go, all you can do is howl from the sidelines.

What are you up to, hewittr (aside from "waiting on the sidelines")?

Visit my website usbible.com. I don’t come here to promote it, but since you asked.

[/quote]

I would quite like to be on the sidelines laughing as the ED209 gives you ten seconds to comply Hewitt cause thats where guys like you are headed! 😉

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