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Americanism

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  • Sat, Oct 09, 2010 - 12:02am

    #11
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    Re: Americanism

JK121:

You certainly are a pessimist…….and for very good reasons.  The world we live in sucks because of greed and corruption.  However, this is not the political system or world bequeathed to us by the Founders.  If anything, they were optimists who gave us a government which recognized the weaknesses of man while giving us our best shot at living in an ideal world.  When asked what kind of government they had given us, Ben Franklin responded, “A Republic if you can keep it”.  Well, we haven’t kept it, but this is not the fault of our debt based monetary system.  Instead, it is because of the fact that a group of sick and demented criminals manage and control our debt based monetary system.  If Congress coined our money and created it through issuing credit as required by our Constitution perhaps our Republic would still exist and perhaps we would still live in a Nation with equal justice under the law. 

If you wish to learn more about why the Federal Reserve is a criminal enterprise which has robbed us of our wealth, resources, and heritage then go to and read, “The Fed is a Ponzi Scheme” at: 

http://constitutionforum.us/fed_ponzi_scheme.htm

  • Sat, Oct 09, 2010 - 02:15am

    #12
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    Re: Americanism

 

Citizenal hahaha calling me a pessimist made me laugh a lot, I get that from people, thank youWink.  I always get it from people, “you should be in a better mood son”  I just look at them and sigh, coupled with a small lecture on how the financial oligarchs run things, aka REALITY.  I get what you are saying, but I will have to disagree on a level or 2.  A debt based system can happen but as we have seen through history it’s not possible.  The problem is money itself.  Remember scarcity has to be maintained on some level to earn profit, or a problem has to occur to fix to earn profit.  So the fundamental function of money itself is scarcity/problem to earn profit, not much of a short/long term ROI on that drunken concept.  The culture and value system is greatly perverted and highly maladjusted.  We need a paradigm shift, not another politician. 

Tesla wanted and could have given the world free energy, J.P. Morgan did not want that.  

Stan Meyers had a hydrogen based car up and running, funny how he was killed.  

I agree greed and corruption is a force in our system.  The human race is blind and is eating up this vanity, materialism, greed, corruption, behavior (not nature) that is constantly reinforced on a daily basis.  The family is broken up and little bobby and cindy have to be programed by the smut on the tv, which helps the cycle of social dysfunction.  

 

Remember debt is slavery and a debt based system is a cancer, money is too but you get what I’m getting at.  

Read: The Best that money Can’t Buy  

  • Sat, Oct 09, 2010 - 09:35am

    #13
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    Re: Americanism

Dear JK121:

Let me start out by saying that at 67 I am not your son.  I don’t know how old you are but unless you are 95 like my father, don’t call me son.  Also, I am in a very good mood.  However, the situation I find myself in is untenable in regard to what our government has done to us and this I do find to be frustrating and disturbing.

I really do think we are in agreement on many things and where we disagree boils down to a matter of semantics.  However, the world we live in is described by words and this makes their meanings and definitions important.  Having said this I would also like to clarify the following.

Money is not the problem.  Money is a medium of exchange, a tool, if you will, for exchanging goods and conducting commerce.  If money is the problem, then so is the exchange of goods and commerce because money only exists for these purposes.  The problem is how we do these things and how we use money.  You seem to think like most people in government.  Guns kill people, therefore guns are evil and should be banned.  They never stop to think that guns are only a tool used by evil people and a gun, like any other object or tool, is neither good nor evil in and of itself.  Similarly, money can be used for either good or evil and it is wrong to condemn a medium of exchange just because the potential for evil exists.

Understanding all of the above, I say again, a debt based system is only a problem when it is owned and run by private interests.  The reason for this is because the issuance of debt generates huge amounts of unearned windfall profits and this gives the people who own and run the system an unfair and fatal advantage over everyone else in society.  On the other hand, if government was the beneficiary of these windfall profits, they could use the money for the common good and regulate our economy through releasing the money or holding it reserve.  If this was done responsibly, it would be of benefit to all concerned and all taxes would be eliminated

And you would call the above describe possibility bad because, according to you debt is bad and money is bad.  It is not bad if used and managed properly by honest and responsible administrators.  Our problem is that our money supply is managed by self-serving demented criminals.  You want to get rid of them, but also wrongfully want to get rid of debt and money.  I say to you that this is impossible and that you should not throw out the baby with the bath water. 

  • Sat, Oct 09, 2010 - 04:00pm

    #14
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    Re: Americanism

 

Money is the problem.  The real question is not, Do we have the money?  The Real question is do we have the resources?  You have to understand the fundamentals of what money produces, it ensures SCARCITY.  If there is less of something it’s worth more, the more there is of something it has less monetary value.  We have the technology and know how to create abundance, and efficiency for the entire world, but the money powers will not allow that.  When we look at what really matters, society could greatly reduce its waste from what the market produces.  Just take a walk through stores such as Target, Walmart, Dollar Stores, tons and tons of junk created.  

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wDJ18m6KUW4&feature=related

I agree we should try to fix the money system, but even at that it will only take us so far till we have to emerge into a new paradigm.  Enjoy this video.  

  • Sun, Oct 10, 2010 - 10:50am

    #15
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    Re: Americanism

JK121:

I just watched the video you suggested.  In fact I watch several other associated videos to learn more about what you are advocating; that a resource based society replace the monetary base labor system we presently live under.  After doing this, my reaction to what I have learned can be summed up in one word; “hair brained”!  The question I have for you is why didn’t you just tell me you were a socialist and not make me go through all this effort to find this out?

The problem that I have with what I have leaned is that while at first glance it seems that replacing our monetary based labor system with a resourced based society is desirable, upon further examination, it falls apart when one considers what is involved in making a resourced based society function; the question being how will the resources be allocated?  The answer to this question is that is that this function will have to be performed by a designated group of people and this being the case, what we are talking about is Socialism.

The problem we have today is that the filthy rich bastards of the Federal Reserve have altered our society such that, like a corporation, decisions are made from the top down.  This being the case, your solution to having these self-serving idiots decide everything is to have, instead, a bunch of altruistic idiots decide everything.  The problem, as I see it, is that under your solution our society will still be run by a group of dictatorial idiots and my response to this is ‘no thanks’.  I will stick with a monetary based society where value is determined in the market place and not by a bunch of egotistical butt holes who think they know what is best for everyone else.

Money is not the problem.  The problem is greed and corruption.  Money does not produce scarcity.  It is medium of exchange that allocates resources.  The problem is that when greed comes into play, corruption is the inevitable and we all are victimized.  Upon passage of the Federal Reserve Act in 1913, we turned our monetary system over to a bunch of greedy criminals and they have used the ill gotten gains they have stolen from us to enslave us and now are using this wealth to enslave the rest of the world.  Again, this would not have happened had Congress retained control of our monetary system as required by our Constitution.

The mistake you continue to make is to attribute the dire situation we face to today to the medium exchange we use to allocate resources instead of placing the blame where it really belongs; upon the heads of the con artists and criminals who comprise the Federal Reserve.  These are the people who wrongfully used are own money against us.  Stop blaming the tool instead of the tool users.  In the final analysis, Socialism is just as bad as Federal Reservism.  They both are a dictatorship by fools.

  • Sun, Oct 10, 2010 - 02:41pm

    #16
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    Re: Americanism

 

I can tell you’re from another generation by your response.  Your preprogramed reaction by using labels such as socialist, is completely old school and out dated.  Socialist, Capitalist, Communist are divide and conquer techniques used to keep people divided.  Hey maybe you will learn one day to be above the political spectrum.  Let me guess you think Al queda is after you too?

I suggest you read more listen and watch more of what the entire resource based economy entails before you knock it.  I could give you a link, but hopefully you are capable of finding out the info yourself.  

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fT6VZ41aPRw  watch all parts to be more informed and go beyond the current paradigm that is paralyzing your mind.

  • Mon, Oct 11, 2010 - 10:03am

    #17
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    Re: Americanism

Dear JK121:

You have such a high opinion or yourself that I am the one who is now LOL.

In the early 70’s I resign my commission, gave up my career as a Navy Fighter Pilot, and re-entered civilian life to become a millionaire.  As fate would have it I began experimenting with drugs because it was the easiest way to get laid at the time and used LSD and similar drugs to expand my mind and open up new worlds to me.  And now you come along and because you are unable to reasonably answer or counter anything I have said, you derisively accuse me of being an old fuddy duddy with a paralyzed mind who has fallen victim old school out-dated thinking.  Now that is really funny and to add insult to injury, you ask me to watch a video by Peter Joseph who you think is in the vanguard of ground breaking thought about our economic system and the world we live in.  Now I am not just laughing out loud, I am in hysterics rolling on the floor.

Getting back to the 70’s, in my travels I came across a series of books by Carlos Castenada, who by happenstance full under the tutelage of a Indian Sorcerer who went by the name of Don Juan.  According to Don Juan, the world we live in is like a table top in restaurant.  The table top and everything on it is the extent of knowledge.  Everything beyond the table top is the knowable unknown and everything below the table top is the unknowable unknown.  Most men, upon growing up, stay within the bounds of the table top which those around him created for him.  On the other hand, a man of knowledge throughout his life, strives to go beyond the edges of his table and by so doing continually expands it.  This now brings us to the Sorcerer.  A Sorcerer uses mind altering drugs to dissolve his table top which then allows him to tap into the unknowable forces which lie below it.  If he survives, he will have achieved great power over other people and the world within which they live because he is no longer bound by anything.

Are your beginning to see my point.  For most of my young adult life, I have tried to be a Sorcerer.  However, in all honesty, I have to admit that I have had no success in this regard because I have never been able to do any “magic tricks”.  However, in trying to be a Sorcerer, I believe it is safe to say that I have become a man of knowledge and this being the case, you should be able to understand why what you have postured is so funny to me.  In your mind, you have me all signed, sealed, and delivered clearly demonstrating that you have no idea what the hell you are talking about.  And in case you missed it my point is this, if you can be so wrong about me, it sure makes a strong case that you probably are wrong about many other things.

Now let’s get on to specifics.

From my perspective, what you are trying to do is tear down the established order of things by attacking words and isms.  Granted, your intentions are honorable, but again you demonstrate that you do not know what you are doing or if you do, are operating from a sinister hidden agenda.

Words make up the world we live in and this is why they are so important.  However, you think they are artificial bullshit because words are used by our oppressors to brainwash and control.  In this you are absolutely correct, but where you go wrong is that, as stated before, you want to throw out the baby with the bathwater.  We need words to learn and exchange knowledge just like we need money to exchange goods.  And again I say, because words and money have been wrongfully used by our oppressors to enslave us, it does not logically follow that words and money are intrinsically bad.  Your failure to grasp this speaks volumes about you.

In your last post you asked me to go back and watch videos about resourced based economies.  If I do, there is no doubt in my mind that the people in the videos will use words and concepts to make their point.  The question I have for you why do you so readily accept and agree with those words and concepts as opposed to the ones I wish to use?  From my perspective, you have been injured by the system we live under and this is true for most of us.  Being injured, it is only natural to reject what we have now and latch onto anything that has the appearance of being a better replacement.  Fine, but in doing this be very careful that you do not jump from the frying pan into the fire. 

Hopefully, we now have a new understand of each other.  I you wish to continue this discussion then let’s drop the rhetoric and focus on points and issues one item at a time.  This way we may be able to accomplish something.  The ball is now in your court.

If you wish to learn more about how our oppressors use words to enslave us then go to and read my article entitled “Freedom and Democracy” at:

http://constitutionforum.us/main_freedom.htm

I have dutifly watched and considered everything you have asked me to.  I hope you are doing the same for me.  If not, then at least have the decency to stop wasting my time.   

  • Mon, Oct 11, 2010 - 03:24pm

    #18
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    Re: Americanism

Citizenal,

Namaste

There is a clear double bind. You are correct that Americans are taught, and history reflects, we are backed by the constitution and we have the power. But we are NOT told or taught the United States is a corporation. How many documents ask if you are an American citizen? How many documents ask if you are a legal U.S. citizen? All laws apply to corporations. An individual can opt out of the corporate game. Opting out would be necessary to honor American values, but there is no place to go…because the corporate system, by default and design, becomes total/global. 

 

I have also studied the teachings of Don Juan(link to lots of quotes from Carlos Castaneda’s Don Juan’s Teachings series)

 

Consider that, perhaps, we are bathing the baby in blood and oil…instead of water.

 

Please also see the discussion here:

Laying out the facts rather than debating theories about money

 

 

-littleone

  • Mon, Oct 11, 2010 - 11:05pm

    #19
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    Re: Americanism

 

Well citizenal, I’m not sure you are grasping the conversation.  We have this social scenario of cars that break down, planes that crash, trains that collide, Stock markets that crash, environments that are raped, humans that are exploited, Science that is crippled, Technology that is not advancing nearly as quickly as it should. Religions are to a degree worthless, certain political philosophy is nothing more than empty babble. Nothing in our system actually works.  It’s as if we have this contrived social acceptance of planned obsolescence on multiple levels and we see it as “well that’s the way it is”  As if the answer to solving any of these problems is going back to “The Constitution”  as if that is the answer to our problems.  People such as yourself treat that document as if it split the atom.  Many great things have come from that document, but I know you still fail to see the psychological social ramifications of money, and how it has a mass degeneration effect to civilization.  

 www.youtube.com/watch?v=oFe5shuCJuE&feature=related  here u go bud, enjoy all 10 parts.  Hope this sinks in.  

 

  • Mon, Oct 11, 2010 - 11:12pm

    #20
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    Re: Americanism

 

I would like to add, if society did go back to The Constitution and a monetary system that was in favor of the people and not the elite, that would be a positive step, but still would have flaws over time.  It would help buy us some time, until people realized we need a shift.  

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