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    Coronavirus Lockdown! Now It Gets Tough

    Facing the hard realities of mandatory sheltering-in-place
    by Adam Taggart

    Wednesday, March 18, 2020, 5:15 PM

With millions now living under home lockdown (or as it’s more gently referred to, “mandatory sheltering in place”) the serious reality of the coronavirus’ impact is sinking in.

Confined to remaining in your home, squeezed in with family members, can be frustrating and stressful. Especially if you’re watching your savings vaporize in the markets on a daily basis.

On top of that, many households aren’t receiving income while under lockdown. And many of those still employed are increasingly fearful that the longer this persists, the more likely their job will be lost in the coming mass layoffs.

The key to preserving your happiness and sanity during this undetermined period of house arrest will be maintaining your emotional resilience, as well as healthy relationships with those living under your roof.

With expert guidance on how to do that, Chris takes time in today’s video update to interview Dr. Peter Boghossian,  author of the best-selling book How To Have Impossible Conversations.

Dr Boghossian explains how to get your spouse, your kids, your elderly/at risk family members, onto or at least nearer to a mutual understanding of the ‘house rules’ that will preserve safety, respect and harmony during this open-ended period of sheltering through the covid-19 threat:

If you haven’t read them yet, the coronavirus preparation megathreads available for free on PeakProsperity.com are a great resource for those in lockdown.

If you’re one of the many new readers here on Peak Prosperity, be sure you’re up-to-date on developments with the coronavirus. All of our latest covid-19 video updates, podcasts and articles can be accessed here for free.

And here’s a brief list of the more recent material that Chris and I have published for our premium subscribers, to give you a sense of what’s behind the paywall (free executive summary, enrollment required for full access)

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197 Comments

  • Wed, Mar 18, 2020 - 5:35pm

    #1

    tourcarve

    Status: Member

    Joined: May 21 2009

    Posts: 45

    1+

    Now I know

    This is good. My friend has not heard anything that I have said (mea culpa re trying to 'spain things...). I need to be the one who reaches out, and now I know how to. Valued relationship. Thanks!

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  • Wed, Mar 18, 2020 - 5:49pm

    #2
    Jay Pine

    Jay Pine

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    Joined: Feb 15 2020

    Posts: 16

    3+

    Airline bailouts and share buy-backs

    Good to see mainstream media getting a hold of this after Chris mentioned it yesterday. Might prevent more money just going to the rich - a price worth not paying in my view. Sorry flying addicts.

    • https://www.theguardian.com/business/2020/mar/18/america-airlines-bailout-shareholders-coronavirus

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  • Wed, Mar 18, 2020 - 6:25pm

    #3
    Rooni

    Rooni

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    Joined: Oct 13 2019

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    I may be wrong...

    ...but I'm not confused. Best line I've heard in a long time.

    It is now on a Post-it note above my laptop. 🤷‍♀️

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  • Wed, Mar 18, 2020 - 6:29pm

    #4
    westcoastjan

    westcoastjan

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    Joined: Jun 04 2012

    Posts: 429

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    Dear Dr. Bonnie - gratitude in BC for integrity!

    ‘Dear Dr. Bonnie’: Women pen song on B.C.’s top doctor amid coronavirus pandemic

    Gotta love this! And I concur - Dr. Henry has been a beacon of calm and professionalism in the past few weeks.

    Other world leaders take note please.... being human and displaying  vulnerability builds trust. Dr. Henry gets major brownie points as a leader.

    Small things to be grateful for....

    Jan

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  • Wed, Mar 18, 2020 - 6:34pm

    #5
    Dave 0131

    Dave 0131

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    Joined: Feb 01 2020

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    6+

    Peer reviewed treatment 100% successful? Chris please review!

    On Tucker Carlson show tonight, Greg Rigano from Stanford School of Medicine said their was a peer reviewed paper on a trial out of France using a low cost anti Malaria drug that was 100% successful.  Link to the paper is at https://www.covidtrial.io/    40 patients in trial with 100% success.  I hope and pray this is true.  Chris can you review this?

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  • Wed, Mar 18, 2020 - 6:48pm

    #6
    westcoastjan

    westcoastjan

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    Joined: Jun 04 2012

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    BC update March 18th evening

    https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/b-c-announces-45-new-coronavirus-cases-bringing-total-to-231-1.5502135

    Dix acknowledged the measures taken over the last few days have been "breathtaking," leaving many people struggling to wrap their heads around the ways that daily life has changed.

    "We wouldn't have imagined taking them two months ago or one month ago," he said.

    Dix also spoke directly to those who have been slow to self-isolate and social distance, saying "it's not too late to join the fight."

    "To those who have been reluctant … I want to say that your friends and your neighbours and your family are counting on you," he said.

    Hello social contract.... Earth to slow adjusters, come in please..........................

    Jan

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  • Wed, Mar 18, 2020 - 7:06pm

    #7
    cathpro

    cathpro

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    Joined: Sep 08 2017

    Posts: 3

    cathpro said:

    Chris, Thought occurred to me that maybe we should have COVID-19 parties just like some folks do with their kids and chicken pox. Maybe just a small innoculum is enough to initiate an immune response but not overwhelm the system. Treat with hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin (as needed). Monitor viral load. Measure IgG and IgM responses. See if the illness is blunted or arrested.

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  • Wed, Mar 18, 2020 - 7:41pm

    #8
    MQ

    MQ

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    great tools

    Chris, thanks to you and Dr Boghossian for the valuable tools. I think it is important not to even think 'I told you so'. It can leak through in your voice or body language. Chris, have you thought about doing an update three times a week, after several weeks twice a week, then once a week? We can look up the numbers ourselves and even do some research on our own. And, you can start to have a life again. WooHoo! What a concept.

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  • Wed, Mar 18, 2020 - 7:42pm

    #9
    Sparky1

    Sparky1

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    China reports zero local infections

    (Zero infections? Riiiiiiiiight…!)

    China reports zero local infections, a major turning point.

    "For the first time since the coronavirus crisis began, China on Thursday reported no new local infections for the previous day, a milestone in its costly battle with the outbreak that has since become a pandemic, upending daily life and economic activity around the world.

    Officials said 34 new coronavirus cases had been confirmed, all involving people who had come to China from elsewhere."

    (Source)

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  • Wed, Mar 18, 2020 - 7:42pm

    #10

    Barbara

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    Joined: Dec 15 2009

    Posts: 154

    3+

    GOOD NEWS ABOUT THE COVID-19 PANDEMIC??

    Will silicon valley save us?  Perhaps if they think they can make enough money.

    https://www.diamandis.com/blog/good-news-covid-19?utm_campaign=Tech%20Blog&utm_source=hs_email&utm_medium=email&utm_content=84918252&_hsenc=p2ANqtz--pi6P2fEUmKE0LZsoTw0PV5iVmR71jDJaJk-udnR7d_Y7Mp87k6RNUQ5-GdAlO-emYSahSTtpkz3aqw5XHd8Txp0XHTA_jv-jJ5U22XMQ4UN40xIE&_hsmi=84918252

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  • Wed, Mar 18, 2020 - 7:48pm

    #11

    LesPhelps

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Apr 30 2009

    Posts: 620

    3+

    Picture... Thousand Words

    We are leaving our winter domicile early this year for obvious reasons, traveling 2,000 miles to our home, to weather out this sad drama.  Now, we can reuse our limited supply of masks during the trip, plus keep other essentials more bug free.

    I beat the rush for most things, thanks again Chris and Adam, but didn't think about these until the ready made ones were gone.

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  • Wed, Mar 18, 2020 - 7:58pm

    #12

    LesPhelps

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    Joined: Apr 30 2009

    Posts: 620

    1+

    When the Musics Over

    https://youtu.be/nOJSmXSFCWk

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  • Wed, Mar 18, 2020 - 8:01pm

    #13
    alanrgreenland

    alanrgreenland

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    Joined: Nov 07 2010

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    COVID-like Response to Global Climate Change?

    I am pondering the ways this pandemic challenge is similar to the dilemma of global climate change. The time scale is different, but the essential trade-off is the same: Do we give up Business as Usual (BAU) to save lives?

    I have been struck by the response of governments, both local and national, to the science behind this pandemic. Yes, they are late to react -- but they *are* reacting. And many people are getting it, and changing their lives radically in response. It remains to be seen how effective our response is, in the long run, but surely some lives are being spared by the collective sacrifice, which may turn out to be substantial (in economic terms).

    The exact same thing is true for climate change. At this late date, the only option to avert absolute catastrophe is to radically change our economy. (Bailout the airlines? Why? So we can return to burning fossil fuels at our previous pace?!) Sacrifices are needed, all around, and economic consequences are unavoidable at this point -- or serious environmental consequences will be the result.

    The stakes are actually higher with climate change. I don't want to diminish the value of any single life, but the worst-case scenario for the pandemic is ~10 million deaths in the United States. The worst-case scenario for global climate change is 330 million deaths in the US, along with every other human on the planet -- it is truly an existential threat.

    So in a strange way I am encouraged, slightly, by what I've seen in the last week related to the pandemic. I'm seeing our society accepting the judgement of experts and the direction of our governments and making collective sacrifices for the common good. (So far, at least.)

    Might this represent a turning point in addressing the climate crisis? I certainly hope so. What do others here think?

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  • Wed, Mar 18, 2020 - 8:02pm

    LabCat

    LabCat

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    China Lies

    I wish someone would challenge China's assertion that they have stopped CV.

    They have also kicked out foreign journalists.

    Why would they do that?

    Also there is Japan cooking the books to save face with the Olympics.

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  • Wed, Mar 18, 2020 - 8:22pm

    #15
    Steve

    Steve

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    Coronavirus Update: Dr Paul Cottrell: "Prepare NOW for 18 Months!"

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  • Wed, Mar 18, 2020 - 8:25pm

    #16

    dtrammel

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: May 03 2011

    Posts: 792

    A Question From Someone New To The Forum

    I got a PM from someone who is new to the forum. They were a bit shy that they hadn't seen this coming and were now worried they were behind the curve and screwed. They asked for my suggestions on their situation.

    I thought it might be better to let the PP community help, and I know many of you are way smarter and more experienced than I am, so with their permission here is their questions:

    I am very new to forum and, embarrassed now to say, not prepared for coming trials with CV.  Reading some of your comments I see you are quite knowledgeable on this topic.  If you don’t mind I wondered if you could provide any advice on what I, single man living on own in small town (not rural, west PA, US), might do to at least be SOMEWHAT better protected from not just CV but all societal/environmental threats caused by pandemic.

    In addition I had a more specific question: my elderly parents live 3 minutes down the road from me.  My father in particular is very at risk from CV.  Out of fear and concern for them I considered moving in with them for a few months to help them out.  But I have reservations on the grounds that my presence may put them more at risk (i.e. I’d be the one tracking in CV).  Do you have any opinion on what would be the safer option (even if only marginally so)?

    I asked them two questions to clarify:

    Are you employed and will you be able to stay employed. That is will your company close or might you still be needed to work?

    "Yes I am employed by a large university (currently working remotely due to CV).  I believe my employment is “safe” and I should be able to work remotely indefinitely (although nothing’s an absolute certainty given the situation)."

    Do you have any savings? or credit cards?

    "Yes I have quite a bit saved up (in checking, savings, money market).  I’ve only ever had 1 credit card (credit line of approx. $25000)"

    --

    Ok any suggestions for them?

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  • Wed, Mar 18, 2020 - 8:31pm

    #17

    Agent700

    Status: Member

    Joined: Aug 02 2014

    Posts: 41

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    Boghossian Talk

    Fantastic Guest, Fantastic Talk!

    Chris you led us to be prepared but we are the minority of the population. I always figured that once the system broke down, the REALLY difficult social issues would begin and those of us who prepared would have to be very, very humble. Let's remember this part, Peak Prosperity Community,  because this event that we all knew was coming and maybe even secretly hoped for - is now upon us, for better and for worse..

    I hope that Peak Prosperity begins to show it's heart and compassion now that our facts have come true. Let's help our kids become the next "Greatest Generation"..

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  • Wed, Mar 18, 2020 - 8:55pm

    #18

    dtrammel

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: May 03 2011

    Posts: 792

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    Heat Test On Masks #1

    After seeing this article:

    https://www.thebeijinger.com/blog/2020/02/18/how-reuse-and-dispose-your-masks-safely

    and how heat appears to be the method of sterilizing a mask that causes the least amount of damage, I thought I run a couple of experiments to see how a mask handles heat. The quickest method seems to be 170F for 30 minutes.

    Now my oven's minimum temperature on the dial was 200F, so I put it just a little under that and then put a cooking thermometer on a piece of cardboard to see what the temp was. It came in at about 180F.

    Some suggestions are to store contaminated masks in ziplock bags, so the first experiment was to see how said plastic bags hold up at this temp.

    Not good, lol. Don't put anything in plastic bags and heat it.

    Next I put a new mask into the oven and let it sit for 30 minutes.

    The mask did very well. No apparent damage of the mask material, straps or the plastic of the vent.

    Next I wanted to see what kind of temperatures my crock pot would generate without anything in it.

    Not good. Low setting showed a below the dial temp, probably 110-120F. High setting was above the top dial temp of 190F by a lot, probably 210-220.

    I think my idea of using a crock pot as a dedicated sterilizer won't work.

    I'll keep experimenting.

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  • Wed, Mar 18, 2020 - 8:57pm

    #19
    wotthecurtains

    wotthecurtains

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    Joined: Feb 27 2020

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    +1 for talking more about the markets

    I'm so thankful to Chris for all of his work on explaining the implications of the exponential spread of a novel virus so clearly, in such depth, and enough in advance to help myself and other curious people to prepare.

    I know the public health issue is still huge going forward, but now that CV is here I'm really hoping to see Chris' brainpower turned somewhat more toward diagnosing which directions the current financial avalanche is likely to take.

    I for one think that the next three months will set the stage for greatest wealth transfer of all time.  The decisions and policies being dreamed up in back rooms right now will set the financial system up either for its future or for its final collapse.

    It makes a big difference where the money fire hose gets pointed this time around, and Chris is the kind of guy who can pick out salient details.

     

    Anyway, thanks again.

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  • Wed, Mar 18, 2020 - 9:06pm

    Jim H

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    Posts: 1162

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    Dave 0131

    I believe that the same French trial you mention (link didn't work for me) is also profiled in today's MedCram video by Dr. Seheult, a pulmonologist.  We/I have been following this news on chloroquine and it is indeed promising.  As you will see in the video I will link to below, Dr. Seheult is speculating that the efficacy of chloroquine is related to it's ability to act as an ionophore for Zine, ferrying it through the cellular lipid layer and increasing intracellular Zn concentration.  Inside your cells, Zinc can interfere with viral RNA replication.. but don't take it from me;

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AToF8O5T86s

    I am taking Zinc picolinate, 30 mg, along with 500 mg quercetin, daily.  Quercetin, a safe bioflavinoid extract from plants, is also an effective ionophore for Zinc.

     

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  • Wed, Mar 18, 2020 - 9:09pm

    #21

    sand_puppy

    Status: Platinum Member

    Joined: Apr 13 2011

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    13+

    Systemically Important Bank Stock prices cratered today. Something big is up!

    With all of the chaos in the market today, this item may have slipped past some of us.

    In past crises, Chris reports that he has looked to the floundering of the big bank sector stock prices as an indicator of financial system distress.  (If anyone needed any additional indicators of distress.)

    From ZH:

    And,

     

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  • Wed, Mar 18, 2020 - 9:11pm

    Rooni

    Rooni

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    Thank you...

    I read all your posts and find them so helpful. Thanks for being such an integral part of this community.

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  • Wed, Mar 18, 2020 - 9:12pm

    herewego

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Aug 11 2010

    Posts: 143

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    Caring for elderly parents...

    This one caught my attention because I've had a similar dilemma to sort out with my Mom, who lives 1.5 hours away by bus (and I can't drive).  To my delight, my prepper-allergic family got on board with keeping Mom virus free and have jumped in from a day's drive away to help.

    My top priority from the very first warnings from Chris back in January was to keep Mom separate from the virus.  Second priority, get both households quarantine-ready.  Since there were other people living with her and coming home from work daily, that was a challenge.  So was me being able to visit, with public transport a complete roadblock.  That all resolved as the person moved away, and an already week-plus quarantined sister drove over to be with Mom.  Soon I can go into quarantine as my work winds up for the duration and safely take a turn with Mom in three weeks.  Sounds easy now, but it took soooo much careful thought and relational work with family.  Plus days of shopping.  I hate shopping of all kinds now, and we did it way back in Feb. before things got nuts.

    Things to do right now:

    Secure a LOT of food (pet food too) for both households, water unless you have gravity fed, secure access, medicine and accessories.  It seems at least three months is the going guess.  More is better.

    Get cashy money.  A ton.

    Make sure you have good first aid, including thermometer, pulse oximeter, symptom-relief for flues.  (check dtrammel's health thread for lots of info).

    Buy non-prescription immune boosters - DYODD but I got tons of buffered vitamin C, vitamin D3, multivitamins and an assortment of herbal antivirals.

    Then get toilet paper, toiletries, disinfectants (plain bleach and a spray bottle), soap including laundry soap.

    Next is entertainment: books, DVDs, meaningful projects for each (consider what supplies you need), communication devices if needed.  Include some special treat foods to haul out while you beat the socks off them at Monopoly.

    Things to consider:

    Can you really count on staying in seclusion yourself?  Will your job or other relationships force you out?  If maybe, then don't plan on visiting after a quarantine breach.

    Can you get to them without using public transit?   If you can go in your own car, you have some time to decide where to land,  as long as you are already quarantined yourself and are meticulous in disinfecting yourself from the journey before opening their door. (Wear full-cover outerwear you can slip off at the door, disinfect your hands, face, hair, anything you bring with).  If no, better move in with Mom & Dad pronto.

    Any part of this you get done will help you later.  Don't waste time.  Start buying! Don't get stuck if some things are unavailable.  Just go on to the things you can find and secure them.  Then go back and problem solve the others.  I don't think you have much time now.  Like, shop tonight.

    The sense of readiness is making such a difference in my experience of this crisis.  I have done almost every single thing I thought I should.  My whole family is better prepared than I could have imagined.  They decided to listen, and in time. PP, tip of the hat.

    Best luck finding YOUR solutions and making them real.

    Susan

     

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  • Wed, Mar 18, 2020 - 10:10pm

    #24
    Green Acres

    Green Acres

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    2+

    Grounded

    I've been "grounded" since late Saturday since I have a chronic condition.

    Been hanging out at the house, and only ventured out once on Tuesday to get the mail.

    Watching the worldometers link a little too much, Zerohedge a lot too much, it's like watching an extremely slow motion train-wreck in progress.

    Really hard to believe but it's real.   It's going to be a long 18 months or so.

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  • Wed, Mar 18, 2020 - 10:15pm

    Mark_BC

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Apr 30 2010

    Posts: 377

    Mark_BC said:

    BC waited waaaaayyyyy too long to declare an emergency. They haven't done anything special as far as I can see. I live a couple km from the senior center where all of Canada's deaths were from. You wouldn't know it even today driving around. Fact is, ANY of our medical leaders could have been squawking loudly a month ago. The evidence was obvious. Instead they waited to move with the herd and be reactive not proactive.

    My friend / family I share a house with says lots of kids just a couple weeks ago in Victoria had coronavirus symptoms and the doctor she was talking to was so frustrated because they couldn't test.

    Canada hasn't done anything except drag its heels and follow other countries' lead, weeks later.

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  • Wed, Mar 18, 2020 - 10:23pm

    tourcarve

    Status: Member

    Joined: May 21 2009

    Posts: 45

    2+

    dtrammel - Thoughts for the man wondering what to do for his parents.

    First of all, keep your parents' home virus free while providing food and assuring water. Only disinfected things or things that you know cannot have been contaminated/infected with the virus should be allowed into their house.

    I would not go into their home at all unless you KNOW that you are not infected (i.e., have been in isolation for several weeks). (If you had adequate protective gear AND understood the perversely exacting procedures for how to use it, it could be different.)

    Locate disinfectants - bleach, 70% isopropyl alcohol (or 99% to water down to 70%) wherever you can find them. Maybe you or they have some bleach in the laundry. Bleach gets watered down (1/3 cup bleach per 1 gallon of  water OR 2 tablespoons  bleach per 1 quart water) , so even a cup will get you started. You will also need spray bottles. If you are using bleach, take care of your spray bottle as bleach will destroy the sprayer. Flush the sprayer with water after each use.

    Also find soap. Powerful stuff in this context.

    Food. Food going into the house needs to be disinfected or washed first. We put groceries on a table outside, spray containers with the isopropyl alcohol (will switch to bleach when we run out), let the items air dry, wash our hands, then bring the items inside. Things like apples we wash for 20 seconds with soap. I would bring food, disinfect and wash it, step away, and let your parents carry it in, then disinfect the table.

    Mail. Can you handle this for them? Unnecessary mail doesn't get into our house. Bills don't get into the house if I can pay them online. Today, I wiped down a book with a disinfectant wipe before putting to down. Last, I wash my hands. Will your parents be careful? I handle all of my brother's mail.

    Newspaper. I still get my local paper, but I treat the outside page as contaminated, reading it, then shaking out the inner pages, disposing of the outer page, and washing my hands.

     

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  • Wed, Mar 18, 2020 - 10:30pm

    #27

    gyrogearloose

    Status: Gold Member

    Joined: Sep 08 2008

    Posts: 415

    Mask reuse

    As this keeps cropping up and so many posts going past one can miss things

    Peer reviewed paper testing effectiveness of standard surgical masks found that they were 0% effective against aerosol H1N1.

    Another paper found no statistically significant difference between surgical masks and N95 masks in hospital settings against influenza.

    This thread   covers how to make them effective and reusable, based on a peer reviewed paper.

     

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  • Wed, Mar 18, 2020 - 10:58pm

    Mpup

    Mpup

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    Joined: Mar 01 2020

    Posts: 48

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    Coming back from town

    On my way back from town last week I considered placing our masks on the dash of the car.  What are the thoughts about leaving the masks on the dash of the car in the sun w/windows rolled up?  They stay dry, in the sun, and the temps get to 120.  We have a second car so they could set for days if needed.   Simple, would this be effective?

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  • Wed, Mar 18, 2020 - 11:07pm

    dtrammel

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: May 03 2011

    Posts: 792

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    Doesn't Match Most of the Studies I've Read

    Peer reviewed paper testing effectiveness of standard surgical masks found that they were 0% effective against aerosol H1N1.

    You claim doesn't match most of the links I've studied. In fact this one

    https://www.thebeijinger.com/blog/2020/02/14/can-masks-protect-you-coronavirus

    Shows that even surgical masks perform quite well against small aerosol particles like this virus, more than is commonly thought.

    Researchers from the University of Edinburgh tested different common masks by running a diesel generator (to mimic car exhaust) and piping the exhaust through different masks. They used a particle counter to see how many particles made it through the mask.

    One important detail: The particle counter they used measured particles as small as 0.007 microns. That’s over 10 times smaller than the coronavirus particle diameter. We’re talking about truly tiny particles here!

    3M masks were able to capture over 95 percent of particles down to 0.007 microns. What might be surprising to some is that the surgical mask was able to capture 80 percent of the tiny particles.

    Soaking in salt does increase the electrostatic factor in particle capture but that is only one of several ways masks prevent infection.

    Also, even something like a surgical mask cuts the viral load you receive, so even if it doesn't catch 95% it does provide some protection.

    Quite scaring the newbies with that claim please.

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  • Wed, Mar 18, 2020 - 11:09pm

    dtrammel

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: May 03 2011

    Posts: 792

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    Good on heat, doesn't help for UV

    On my way back from town last week I considered placing our masks on the dash of the car.  What are the thoughts about leaving the masks on the dash of the car in the sun w/windows rolled up?  They stay dry, in the sun, and the temps get to 120.  We have a second car so they could set for days if needed.   Simple, would this be effective?

    A long afternoon with the windows rolled up and high temperatures would probably kill the virus. The UV light from the sun though, won't get through the glass. Good thinking out of the box though.

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  • Wed, Mar 18, 2020 - 11:30pm

    #31

    gyrogearloose

    Status: Gold Member

    Joined: Sep 08 2008

    Posts: 415

    NZ just said no to non citizens

    Late today, on the heals of multiple examples of tourists refusing to self isolate for 14 days, our boarder is at last closed to non residents.

    Tourism operators had on their own initiative had taken to verifying of peoples passport to confirm arrival dates and reporting non complying people.

    28 cases total and only 2(?) local infections from returned family members.

    With some  good luck and tracking etc it is barely possible to contain, but i'm not putting any money on it......

    Cheers Hamish

     

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  • Wed, Mar 18, 2020 - 11:38pm

    kathryn askew

    kathryn askew

    Status: Member

    Joined: Sep 13 2019

    Posts: 2

    1+

    kathryn askew said:

    Steve. Thanks for sharing that video. Amazing. We need to get that information out!!

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 12:34am

    #33
    Krollchem

    Krollchem

    Status: Member

    Joined: Jul 10 2012

    Posts: 22

    UV sterilization of masks

    Masks can be sterilized using a Lumin CPAP Mask and Accessory Cleaner - UV Light CPAP Cleaner - Ozone-Free Amazon $248.99 & FREE Shipping .

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 12:38am

    #34
    Krollchem

    Krollchem

    Status: Member

    Joined: Jul 10 2012

    Posts: 22

    6+

    Likely difference between the flu and the SARS-CoV-2 virus from a hospital doctor previously posted at Moon of Alabama.

    There are lots of confused folks out there, overall it seems to be a poor understanding of the viral danger. Granted, we do not have an abundance of reliable data available, but based on the the articles published so far, the epidemic is very different and much more dangerous than flu.

    The skeptics are pointing out that flu kills tens of thousand folks in America each season, most of them old and with '' medical problems" ...and Cov so far just took out several thousand of the same, so what is the hype about??

    The main problem with this line of thought: the flu dead are not the same as corona dead. I have been working in American hospitals for 25 years and I can say, in fair confidence, that most of the flu victims are at the end of the road already, suffering for terminal issues: advanced heart failure, copd, cancer, etc. That is the reason we, as the society, we are not making much fuss about it: those folks are expected to die and the flu just helps them to knock at the heaves doors...There are very few exceptions, with a handful of very young victims per year.

    The reports coming from China and Italy are pointing to a different profile for the victims: the number one risk factor seems to be simple hypertension. One in two American adults has hypertension...They also mention diabetes, more than 10% of Americans have it and some other "popular" issues like coronary disease and chronic kidney problems. It is true that above 80 the mortality is quite high, but there is a serious number of dead folks in their 50S, 60s and 70s and this is very unlike flu. Look at the reports coming from Iran: significant number of officials dead...those were not frail and severely debilitated persons, but folks in their prime political career. Hypertension, being a very low risk overall, is not supposed to be counted as a '' medical problem" as terminal heart failure, liver cirrhosis or copd counts for flu.

    Also, dying is not the only data that should be followed comparing the two viruses: being critically sick on the ventilator, for several weeks, is not fun. The average age for admission to hospital , in a Chinese article , with severe respiratory condition was mid 50s. Italian docs also reported large numbers of patients with ARDS/ severe respiratory condition that are younger that are younger than 50, many without any medical problem , and that is unheard for flu...

    Last, the skeptics are comparing the number of victims at the end of the flu season with the numbers just at the beginning of Cov. '20k vs 6k... it's a hoax!' So far , every epidemiologic model showed that in the absence of radical measures, the numbers may be from 10 times to much more worse than flu, when all will be done with.

    Posted by: hospital doc | Mar 18 2020 16:30 utc | 35

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 12:44am

    dtrammel

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: May 03 2011

    Posts: 792

    2+

    Or You Can Save $200

    Masks can be sterilized using a Lumin CPAP Mask and Accessory Cleaner – UV Light CPAP Cleaner – Ozone-Free Amazon $248.99 & FREE Shipping

    Or you can wait a few more days. Both Les Phelps and I are working on DIY demos that will let you build a UVc Light sterilizer for around $50. Les posted a few pictures recently and I've been busy but will get to mine in a day or two.

    Bottom line everyone, you are going to get ads and ads and ads from people trying to take advantage of this crisis to sell you stuff. Don't fall for it.

    (at least you didn't put a link to your spam)

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 1:09am

    #36

    thatchmo

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Dec 13 2008

    Posts: 219

    CURFEW!

    Well, lil ol' Kauai gets a curfew.  Of course, enough exemptions to make it's effectivness questionable and no challenge for your average Honey Badger.  All persons must remain in their residences between 9pm and 5am, starting Friday.  Haven't heard the penalty for non-compliance....Also from the mayor: visitors please stay away- "Kauai is on vacation"....Only 2 confirmed cases, in visitors....Aloha, Steve

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 1:12am

    Krollchem

    Krollchem

    Status: Member

    Joined: Jul 10 2012

    Posts: 22

    not spam

    Do not assume as my intent was just to help. I have to use a CPAP machine for sleep apnea and this product was the only reasonable method for disinfecting the mask and hose. When you build your UV light box be sure to use reflective metal on the inside.

    As an aside, I have five university science degrees and was a senior clinical specialist in the military with associated CBR training. I don't need N95 masks as I have full CBR outfits and also was a Senior Research Scientist at a plutonium research lab. Perhaps you read my earlier post on the impacts of nuclear winter?

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 1:13am

    #38
    David Allan

    David Allan

    Status: Member

    Joined: Nov 15 2009

    Posts: 47

    3+

    Life is now changed. Forever. What was is not coming back.

    From Chris's video conclusion – Life is now changed. Forever. What was is not coming back.

    As someone who has been prepping for over a decade and established on a rural homestead property for 9 years I can understand and accept this. But to what extent will things change? I've just read the Neil Ferguson study and the implications are bleak - but I'm still looking for ways to be positive.

    No more international air travel for a start – no more mass tourism. That's not too daunting but what does it all mean for a fragile global financial system? Some experts talk of a reset but is this even possible? I don't pretend to understand the complexities but a controlled 'reset' would surely leave the same players in power and probably more entrenched than ever. This just doesn't seem reasonable given the situation is so complex and unpredictable.

    Alternatively a full scale economic collapse would likely mean that essential infrastructure would quickly crumble away as transport, telecoms, healthcare, electricity, banking organizations fail.

    Beyond a certain point it would become impossible to reboot the system. 

    Humpty Dumpty sat on the wall

    Humpty Dumpty had a great fall

    All the kings horses

    And all the kings men

    Couldn't put Humpty together again

    And so it may be with our civilization too. It has evolved holistically over millennia and can no more be reconstructed from smashed pieces than an egg.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 2:28am

    Yoxa

    Yoxa

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Dec 20 2011

    Posts: 308

    Rude and uncalled for

    [quote] (at least you didn’t put a link to your spam) [/quote]

    Get some sleep, Dtrammel! That was rude and uncalled for. This person is not a newbie dropping dubious links, s/he is a long-time member sharing a useful nugget of information.

    That said, some posters do deserve to be growled at. What happened to the "report this post" button?

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 2:39am

    #40
    NicolaHNZ

    NicolaHNZ

    Status: Member

    Joined: Jan 28 2020

    Posts: 18

    1+

    Some lighthearted relief?

    Great video Chris, thank you. I’ll need to get the book given I will now have a lot of time to read indoors.

    Saw a post in the comments a while ago about someone not being able to think of Covid-19 in the same way since he realized it rhymed with ‘Come on Eileen’. In case you haven’t already seen it (I’m 2 days behind on reading the comments) someone has taken up the mantle and written lyrics. With all that’s going on, I needed some light relief. Enjoy 🙂

    IMG_8443

     

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 3:15am

    markonb

    markonb

    Status: Member

    Joined: Mar 19 2020

    Posts: 3

    3+

    UV-C could be a good solution

    Using UV-C light to desinfect used masks could be a solution but the right lamps, distance, level of UV-C  and duration will have to be applied.

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4699414/

    Friendly regards

    Mark

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 5:44am

    #42
    RATIO_AGERE

    RATIO_AGERE

    Status: Member

    Joined: Mar 19 2020

    Posts: 2

    Herd Immunity vs. Possible Reinfection?

    Hi PP Tribe - Newby on the chat frequency - silent longtime follower of PP since CrashCourse Days. Compliments to all for valuable contributions especially towards Chris&Adam. I am around Chris' neck of the woods in Western Mass hunkering down with family.

    As a programmer and tech guy my thinking is wired to grasp the foreign and strange situation we all the sudden face. What I need to process of course is factual data the more the better and you are an exceptional source.

    So here a missing link I try to fill in - Herd immunity how does it work with different strains? Does reinfection occur - if so is herd immunity not a circuit breaker we can bank on?

    Wondering what your thoughts or knowledge are/is

    nice one everybody and be safe!

     

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 5:53am

    #43
    isjrb029

    isjrb029

    Status: Member

    Joined: Jan 16 2009

    Posts: 11

    2+

    What to expect by next week

    We have seen the number from many on this in the past weeks. Tom has some interesting thoughts here.

    https://tomalrichblog.blogspot.com/2020/03/the-awful-arithmetic-ta-notice-since-it.html

     

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 6:05am

    Ision

    Ision

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    Joined: Feb 07 2020

    Posts: 120

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    You are absolutely wrong about a Climate Crisis.

    It seems you have no understanding regarding the climate, nor reason to address any crisis, nor the power to do so.

    Just so you know...  The ENTIRE Co2 contribution of the ENTIRE Human Race, could be removed from Earth's atmosphere...100% removed...and there would be absolutely NO CHANGE observed in the Earth's Climate...at all.

    We could KILL EVERY SINGLE HUMAN BEING ON THIS PLANET...trying to "SAVE" the World from a Man Made Climate Crisis...and STILL ACHIEVE NOTHING AT ALL.

    If you imagine a total atmospheric CO2 level of 412ppm, you may remove 18ppm, from this number, for a new sum of 394ppm.    What was Earth's climate like..when the average CO2 content was 394ppm?   Was it not exactly the SAME as it is now?  Would lowering the CO2 levels by 18ppm "save" the Earth?   No.  It would not.

    But, you see...you poor propagandized person...THAT IS THE AMOUNT OF CLIMATE CHANGE, WHICH WOULD TAKE PLACE IF YOU REMOVED ALL OF HUMAN CREATED CARBON DIOXIDE.

    CO2..and climate change...have NOTHING TO DO WITH EACH OTHER.

    CO2 levels FOLLOW climate change...and does NOT cause it.

    Learn..and prevent yourself from being a Socialist Stooge.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 6:10am

    #45

    dtrammel

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: May 03 2011

    Posts: 792

    4+

    dtrammel said:

    Get some sleep, Dtrammel! That was rude and uncalled for. This person is not a newbie dropping dubious links, s/he is a long-time member sharing a useful nugget of information. That said, some posters do deserve to be growled at. What happened to the “report this post” button?

    You are correct, my apologies.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 6:12am

    #46
    jupura

    jupura

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 01 2009

    Posts: 9

    8+

    Chloroquine- Some recent statements from various articles

    Following are some statements take from various articles.

    We need to get this information about the effectiveness of Chloroquine against Covid-19 in front of the eyes making a difference. Call your government representatives and/or medical personnel. Push this knowledge into the mainstream news.

    1. China and South Korea have allegedly issued guidelines for the proper use of chloroquine as an “effective treatment” according to a study report.
    2. China, South Korea and Belgium are already using it as a treatment. UK has added it to a list of none export drugs so they will have enough for their people. Australia is using it with Kaletra a drug for HIV and it is giving complete recovery.
    3. Andrea Savarino is an Italian scientist and has studied chloroquine since 1994. In the SARS outbreak he found chloroquine was a weapon against SARS. But by the time he published his paper the outbreak was over.
    4. Doctors in US are already prescribing it. In the US the doctors have broad authority to prescribe approved medications of what is known as off-label uses.
    5. US researchers published on Friday 3/13 a study. They are finding it has shown favorable outcomes in humans infected with Coronavirus including faster time to recover and shorter hospital stay. And it works as a preventative against Coronavirus.
    6. French researcher , Didier Raoult, confirms success in drug trial and shows there is a possibility to contain the virus in 6 days. The patients were given 600mcg for 10 days. Those not given it were contagious after 6 days. Those given the drug recovered with only 25% contagious. Chloroquine speeds up the healing process.
    7. Bayer is making large donations to US government of the Chloroquine.
    8. The drug company GPC in the Caribbean is ramping up production of Chloroquine stating it is a 70 year old drug which is safe and cheap. It has already received its first order.
    9. It can be given to nursing moms and pregnant women.

     

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 6:18am

    #47
    ao

    ao

    Status: Platinum Member

    Joined: Feb 04 2009

    Posts: 1242

    the 3 month Treasury yield just turned negative

    We are in for a sh*t storm.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 6:19am

    #48

    AKGrannyWGrit

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Feb 06 2011

    Posts: 1019

    But Ision

    It makes such a good story.  Who do we blame?  Why “the people” of course.  You spent too much time driving little Willie to soccer practice and going to Disneyland and caused Climate Change.  It’s your fault!   People should, pay, suffer and shoulder that burden cause they caused the problem.  What, don’t believe that, well we will repeat that message over, and over, and over, and over, until you do. See, you missed the point, it’s not about science it's about who to blame.

    Now don’t you feel better knowing who you should blame?

    AKGranny

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 6:42am

    #49
    ao

    ao

    Status: Platinum Member

    Joined: Feb 04 2009

    Posts: 1242

    4+

    there's a bright side to everything

    Remembering the opacity of the water in the canals of Venice and thinking that it would be very nasty to fall in, this is an unexpected benefit of the corona virus.  Mother Nature ain't no fool.  She's cleansing herself.

    https://abcnews.go.com/International/venice-canals-clear-fish-coronavirus-halts-tourism-city/story?id

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 7:04am

    Rooni

    Rooni

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    Joined: Oct 13 2019

    Posts: 16

    1+

    Blame

    Hi Granny,

    I wonder if it's wise to place blame at this point? Do you think it would be better to try to move forward and do what we can to make things better?

    Thanks for your posts.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 7:11am

    #51

    thc0655

    Status: Platinum Member

    Joined: Apr 27 2010

    Posts: 2001

    1+

    We’re not beat. Adapt and overcome. And enjoy it!

    https://twitter.com/leonardocarella/status/1238511612270690305

    Italians on lockdown are singing with each other from balconies and windows.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 7:11am

    #52
    Rooni

    Rooni

    Status: Member

    Joined: Oct 13 2019

    Posts: 16

    1+

    Online classes

    Hi Members,

    Chris and the Dr. B mentioned online learning in the most recent video, Coronavirus Lockdown! Now It Gets Tough.  I heard something that sounded like Kahn University, but when I go on their site it seems to be for K - 12. Hmm. Does anyone know the name and website for what they were referring to?

    I'm going on little nuts as I close in on my third week of isolation. Need some stimulation.

    Thanks, fellow members!

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 7:13am

    Nimby

    Nimby

    Status: Member

    Joined: Mar 18 2020

    Posts: 13

    Elderly Relatives

    Thanks TC.  Do you know of any recommendations for efficiently disinfecting cash?

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 7:20am

    karen is a farmer

    karen is a farmer

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 24 2020

    Posts: 23

    6+

    Re: Life is now changed

    Hi everyone,

    In regards to “Life is now changed” post, I’ve been pondering this too.  Like you, I saw this coming a long time ago after I read the “Party is Over” in 2003.  I had a very radical friend tell me to buy land, seeds and gold.  I have been homesteading now for 15 years and I’m nearly self sufficient.  I live a beautiful healthy albeit simple life.   I am a 58 year old divorced female.  It can be done! Like Chris said in one of his videos, we need to develop our communities and local resources. I see my neighbors already doing this. There will be new niches to fill and food will be the new currency or other useful and barter friendly items. Just my humble opinion on things.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 7:20am

    LRacine

    LRacine

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 13 2016

    Posts: 12

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    LRacine said:

    "CO2 levels FOLLOW climate change…and does NOT cause it.

    Learn..and prevent yourself from being a Socialist Stooge."

    This post is an excellent example of the "impossible conversations" Chris was discussing in his last video.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 7:24am

    LRacine

    LRacine

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 13 2016

    Posts: 12

    3+

    LRacine said:

    dtrammel, good form!  Respect is slowly earned and that apology got you a few more pts. Thank you for all that you do.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 7:28am

    #57

    AKGrannyWGrit

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Feb 06 2011

    Posts: 1019

    1+

    Rooni

    I wonder if it’s wise to place blame at this point? Do you think it would be better to try to move forward and do what we can to make things better?

    I was not placing blame I was interpreting the national meme of climate change and the cause.  By making light of the subject, just maybe someone will see that, by intentional design, people are being blamed.  I don’t think climate change is the peoples fault but it is the common narrative and I am trying to challenge that narrative.

    To make things better is to help people to believe it’s not their fault.

    Thank you too, for your posts.

    AKGranny

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 7:42am

    Ision

    Ision

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 07 2020

    Posts: 120

    3+

    Making Things Better...

    Better for whom?

    I can see the reduction of actual pollution to be a good thing.  But, I see only harm in using climate propaganda to regulate, remove, and tax, people and industry...and, as a result, allowing the government to take complete control of all of us..and all human industry.

    People are dying the world over, not just from pollution...but from the absence of affordable energy...of having enough power available to even run a few light bulbs at night...or to power a small lap top in a small medical clinic.

    "Oh, you cannot have a coal powered energy plant...you would be causing Global Warming!"  They are told.  "Best you just learn to live in the dark, hand carry the water to the fields...and decide if you want to light up the ward...or run your lap top...as you cannot run both at the same time."

    "Learn to save the planet by reducing your "carbon footprint" while accepting the mortality of your patients."

    "After all, if enough of you die...it will reduce the amount of CO2 in the air...allowing us to SAVE the planet."

    If your head is jam-packed with lies from those who would own you, they will have effectively controlled you, and will have taked over your emotional responses, too.

    When you read that Man-Made CO2 is not a problem..your conditioned emotional reaction is predicable, and it protects your ignorance about the Climate.

    People talk about the COAL INDUSTRY...as if it is the ENEMY, who supplies the funds to Climate Deniers...But, what of the NUCLEAR INDUSTRY, and the scam artists for other "alternative" energies?  Think THEY do not fund the Climate Alarmists?

    Who funds what is basically meaningless...it is what is the actual data..the actual Science...what is the truth...that matters.

    Ever wonder why the Climate Alarmists never use Part Per Million of Volume, but only use incomprehensible measures of weight?

    "Oh, my GOD!  That coal burning power plant generates 150.000.000 tons of CO2!  This has to STOP!!"

    Because doing this hides the fact Man's production of CO2 is meaningless...and it makes more of an emotional impact on the uninformed.

    Ever wonder why the temperature graphs, Climate Alarmists use in their publications, always like to start around 1850?

    Because if they provided a temperature graph starting, say...6,000 years ago, it would show the Climate has cooled down since this time...and ALL the increased temperature claims, since the 1850s, is STILL BELOW what they were during the last Altathermal, which peaked 6,000 years ago...before Man could EVER have impacted global climate.

    The fact is...most of what you think you know about the Climate..is malicious fantasy.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 7:50am

    Clem

    Clem

    Status: Member

    Joined: Jun 04 2019

    Posts: 2

    10+

    Disinfecting Cash

    Nimby,

    just received this from my college son:

    ALERT!!!

    The Corona virus can be spread through money.

    If you have any money at home, put some gloves, put all the money in to a plastic bag and put it outside your front door tonight.

    I'm collecting all the plastic bags tonight for safety.

    Think of your health.

     

     

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 7:54am

    #60

    dtrammel

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: May 03 2011

    Posts: 792

    1+

    Cook It In An Oven

    Thanks TC.  Do you know of any recommendations for efficiently disinfecting cash?

    30 minutes at 170F disinfects most anything except plastic ziplock bags, lol.

    Though I'd start with some $1 bills first just in case.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 8:02am

    nordicjack

    nordicjack

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Feb 03 2020

    Posts: 522

    2+

    regarding PM by new subscriber

    First, let me say , I am familiar with western PA , as I have lived there.  There are really no small towns that i would not consider rural.  So that I am not sure about.. Of course, things may have grown in the last 25 years since I lived there.

    The OP lives in a good location.  People in Western Pa are good natured and are cohesive.   Meaning,  they are more similarly ethnic and religiously oriented.  Which provides a buffer of societal discord.  I do not think he or his parents should worry about safety at this time.  PA has a high-hunting population , so most are armed.   But not of criminal nature.  western Pa is resource rich in game animals , that provide food , even when none is available commerically.   I do not see food vulnerability in this location in this population - until way latter in the game -- Meaning they will out-last the bulk of population.   Though, pittsburgh had become more progressive to outside industry over the last couple decades,  the basic cohesive values of a unified population exist.  This will be an extremely safe metro compared to other metros and states.  The healthcare there is reasonably competent compared to the US as well.

    Additionally, the OP mentioned that he is able to work from home , and works for a university.  He is also resource rich in contacts and collaborative folks.

    He lives near enough to support elderly parents, without need to move in and jeopardize their health

    My personal opinion is , this is the third place I would rank as safest during this situation.. Ranking Utah ( due to the church ) number 1 place to be . and very rural secluded locations with acreage as second.

    I would only recommend he acquire what ever food stuffs possible ,  along with some basic sanitizers and some minimal PPE if possible.   He should also practice self isolation with exception of acquiring absolute essentials and supporting parents.   He should also practice proper disease hygiene.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 8:22am

    alanrgreenland

    alanrgreenland

    Status: Member

    Joined: Nov 07 2010

    Posts: 57

    6+

    Climate Change is Real

    Thanks for replying on the topic, Ision, but it seems to me that you are the one who has fallen victim to propaganda. Climate change is real, it's happening now, and it is caused by humans releasing sequestered carbon at an alarming rate. You are dead wrong that CO2 and climate change "have nothing to do with each other".

    I don't expect to change your mind. Since you have immediately resorted to an ad hominem attack, I don't suppose I will engage with you on any other topics, either.

    Anyone else out there who sees the parallels between this pandemic and the dilemma of global climate change?

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 8:44am

    MQ

    MQ

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Oct 13 2011

    Posts: 115

    Cook It In An Oven...Nah, washing is easier

    The new and improved way to launder money. With soap and water.  Line dry or just lay it flat. I don't think I would put it in the dryer.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 8:58am

    MQ

    MQ

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Oct 13 2011

    Posts: 115

    chloroquine and hydrochloroquine

    These do have some side effects. Some experience migraines, nightmares, changes in vision--sometimes permanent. I think I'll stick with zinc and quercetin for prevention. If I become ill, I can revisit this decision.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 9:06am

    #65
    Matties

    Matties

    Status: Member

    Joined: Jan 30 2020

    Posts: 160

    chloroquine

    Effects of chloroquine on viral infections

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 9:06am

    #66
    yogmonster

    yogmonster

    Status: Member

    Joined: Apr 01 2013

    Posts: 47

    2+

    Articles being removed on FB

    Facebook Hits C****vir*s Articles with a Sledgehammer

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 9:07am

    Jim H

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jun 08 2009

    Posts: 1162

    3+

    I'm with you MQ...

    Based on my research the quercetin is safe enough for prophylactic use along with other supplements.  I don't want to be on choroquine or hydroxyC unless I am in the hospital and the risk vs reward balance has shifted.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 9:16am

    MQ

    MQ

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Oct 13 2011

    Posts: 115

    1+

    UV sterilization of masks

    There may be many here at PP who use CPAP.  Good to know there is another use for it, too.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 9:20am

    Jim H

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jun 08 2009

    Posts: 1162

    1+

    Excellent chloroquine paper Matties.

    The paper, which is now 17 years old, is very comprehensive regarding antiviral observed effects of Chloroquine, and much less decisive regarding underlying mechanism, for instance;

    As chloroquine/hydroxychloroquine probably inhibits viral
    replication by a mechanism different from those of currently
    used antiretroviral drugs, its application has been studied in
    combination with other antiretroviral drugs. The use of
    chloroquine in combination with other antiretrovirals is
    theoretically supported by the observation that chloroquine
    also shows anti-HIV activity in vitro towards isolates from
    patients in therapeutic failure with a multidrug-resistant
    profile.36

    It may well be that the mechanism has always been synergistic with Zinc and we just didn't know it, since Zn is relatively ubiquitous from diet.  Elsewhere in the paper it mentions how beneficial it is that, rather than being specific to the viral proteins,  chloroquine is anti-viral through direct action on the human cellular RNA replication mechanism... hence it is broadly antiviral.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 9:23am

    Mary Catherine Tartara

    Mary Catherine Tartara

    Status: Member

    Joined: Mar 13 2020

    Posts: 5

    Plaquenil Link gone

    The link to this study is gone.  Is information being taken down?

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 9:31am

    #71

    scotthw

    Status: Member

    Joined: Oct 16 2008

    Posts: 19

    From Axel Merk: Let's spend $1 trillion to get people back to work

    https://www.merkinvestments.com/insights/2020/2020-03-19.php?utm_source=merk&utm_medium=link&utm_campaign=merk-campaign&registered=yes

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 9:47am

    Eannao

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Feb 28 2015

    Posts: 192

    1+

    UV Sterilization Study

    Guys, this study might provide some useful information in designing your steriliser e.g. on power output and exposure times etc.

    UVGI Study 2

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 9:57am

    #73

    sand_puppy

    Status: Platinum Member

    Joined: Apr 13 2011

    Posts: 2339

    4+

    hydroxychloroquine link found

    https://www.mediterranee-infection.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/03/Hydroxychloroquine_final_DOI_IJAA.pdf

     

    Hydroxychloroquine link found

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 10:08am

    wotthecurtains

    wotthecurtains

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 27 2020

    Posts: 25

    4+

    Grounded

    "Zerohedge a lot too much, it’s like watching an extremely slow motion train-wreck in progress."

     

    I've been a connoisseur of "doomer porn" for a long time and I have a lot of memories of staying up late to read blogs during the 2008/2009 meltdown.

     

    The headlines on ZH almost gave me a heart attack on Monday morning.  I had to step away from it a bit.

     

    Its hard because you need to stay informed, but you need to know your limits.   One reason I like Chris and Adam so much is they tend to deliver the *relevant* scary news in a way that is coherent and organized rather than just making you feel like the curtains are on fire and also the rug is on fire and also the cabinets are on fire and... and ... and... which is what happens when you read the blogs too much.

     

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 10:13am

    #75
    robie robinson

    robie robinson

    Status: Gold Member

    Joined: Aug 25 2009

    Posts: 986

    1+

    Plaquenil

    A 6 day dose of plaquenil with Azithromycin, being an effective treatment for covid19 approaches zero chance of causing a toxic bulls eye maculopathy as the maculopathy I’d dose/time/weight dependent.

    rhrobinson od a poor and reluctant typist

    oughta see our spring garden, wow

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 10:34am

    Ision

    Ision

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 07 2020

    Posts: 120

    1+

    The conditioning goes deep...I see.

    Absolute nonsense.

    "Sequestered carbon"  OH, my God.

    Blank out..and shut down..is expected.  It is the emotional conditioning kicking in.

    Human made CO2 is treated by Nature exactly as it treats Natural CO2.  There is no difference between Human and Natural CO2, whatsoever.  And, ALL CO2 from ANY volcanic source is also releasing "sequestered carbon" and the natural flow of CO2 in our Atmosphere does not care, which is which.

    All Human created CO2 can be removed from the atmosphere...ALL OF IT..even the "sequestered carbon" and the 18 PPM of CO2 in the atmosphere, for which Man is responsible, already includes this.

    If Nature makes 393 PPM of CO2, and MAN makes only 18 PPM of CO2, which is more responsible for the very small amount of CO2 we find  in our atmosphere?   What do you think has more effect on Global Climate...a trace gas, which is 412 PPM, of 1,000,000 PPM total volume, or changes in the SUN..whose mass is greater than all the other mass in the solar system combined?

    The United States, all by itself...is responsible for only 4-5 PPM of the 18 PPM, Humanity creates.  We could totally eliminate ALL sources in the U.S....completely...and even THIS would alter the Climate..not at all...NO CHANGE...nothing.

    If eliminating 100% of United States generated CO2 does nothing...IMAGINE only reducing United States production by only 2%, or even 20%...at tremendous cost..suffering and..yes...death.   LESS THAN NOTHING!

    You are just a victim of the propaganda...meant to cause you harm...as you struggle to achieve nothing but your own enslavement..and that of everyone else.

    What you think you know...is not what happens to be.  But, this is now a unquestionable religion to so many..they are emotionally unable to see Reality.

     

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 10:40am

    loj-ikul

    loj-ikul

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Mar 03 2020

    Posts: 55

    8+

    Trump said to the press that the FDA has approved use of Chloroquine for treatment of Covid 19.

    Then the FDA says nope, we have not done that. It seems government bureaucracy is as dangerous to peoples lives as Covid 19. The FDA is also warning people about trying herbal supplements that are not approved. Who does the FDA really serve?

    Big Pharma would not want something dirt cheap and easily available to treat people, might lose billions on a new vaccine.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 10:43am

    dtrammel

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: May 03 2011

    Posts: 792

    Filter Material Degredation Is An Important Risk

    The new and improved way to launder money. With soap and water.  Line dry or just lay it flat. I don’t think I would put it in the dryer.

    I have to disagree MQ. Unless you have some actual studies which indicate that is an efficient way to disinfect mask you risk seriously degrading or destroying your mask's efficiency. The mask's material is actually pretty susceptible to damage. Damage means more of the virus particles get thru and into your lungs.

    The studies we have found here indicate that heat treatment shows little or no damage. Chemical soaks or alcohol or hydrogen peroxide followed by a water rinse and air dry is good but does some minor damage over time. That UV light should be effective and damage free but no tests yet on it.

    Washing in soap and water would be ok for the outer covers of DIY masks or pollution masks but the filter elements should still be treated with care.

    The one thing you are going to find here MQ if you stick around is we are not prone to making claims that are just backed up with your gut feeling or antidotal experiences. Since Peak Prosperity is one of the go to place for fact based information thanks to Chris' videos and Adam's work, we all take our responsibility to put out true information seriously.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 10:47am

    dtrammel

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: May 03 2011

    Posts: 792

    Great Find Eannao, Thank You

    Guys, this study might provide some useful information in designing your steriliser e.g. on power output and exposure times etc.

    Thank you, thank you, thank you!

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 10:52am

    dtrammel

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: May 03 2011

    Posts: 792

    3+

    Bug In FB Software

    "Articles being removed on FB"

    FB put out an announcement that when they sent their human moderators home and when to AI a bug showed up and flagged too many posts. They know about it, is working to correct it, and will repost all the removed posts soon.

    https://www.theverge.com/2020/3/17/21184445/facebook-marking-coronavirus-posts-spam-misinformation-covid-19

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 11:19am

    #81
    LRacine

    LRacine

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 13 2016

    Posts: 12

    8+

    The bottom line numbers...

    There are 327 million people in the USA
    60% are going to get infected
    3.2 percent of all people that get infected (this based on data from China and found to be creditable by the WHO) will die.
    So, 327 million people in the USA times 60% of the population that will get infected is (  327 *0.6) = 196 Million people infected with Covid 19.
    Of the 196,320,000 people (best case) 3.2% will die...
    That means best case 6,282,240 people will die in the next few months in the USA......(196,320,000*.032)
    20% of those infected will need critical care in a hospital (196.32 Million*.2)=   39.3 million people who will need critical care. If the critical care system/hospitals can not deal with the influx of patients the death rate will be drastically higher.
    FYI "Total Staffed Beds in All U.S. Hospitals 924,107"
    These are the numbers the media and government are not talking about because they are truly frightening..
    I have posted this on you tube and my comments have been deleted..
    I find it surreal...

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 11:28am

    joanna840

    joanna840

    Status: Member

    Joined: Mar 04 2020

    Posts: 3

    3+

    Socialism leading to totalitarianism?!!

    I'm from the UK and am a socialist. I think this video ends with complete misunderstanding and confusion about socialism, 'civil liberties' and totalitarianism. This virus is completely beyond the capabilities of neo-liberalism, with its 'civil liberties', espoused by the US and UK government and will only be dealt with humanely by socialism, meaning a more equal society and governments which care for their citizens. Socialism doesn't lead to being forced to be vaccinated, and this is not the 'Chinese virus', and socialism has nothing to do with the mixture of capitalism and communism exercised by that country. Watch as the UK and US are forced to adopt humane policies, such as the universal basic income in the UK, as the only way to help people.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 11:30am

    Sparky1

    Sparky1

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jul 21 2016

    Posts: 734

    2+

    dtrannek, MQ ref "money" not "masks"?

    Hi dtrammel,

    I read MQ's post as referencing laundering "money" (actually, paper fiat currency--not physical gold or silver which is real money) rather than "masks" (i.e., surgical masks and/or respirators). Otherwise, I agree with and appreciate your post regarding the potential to degrade mask material.  Thanks for keeping on top of that rather dense but extremely relevant subject of mask/respirator materials, reuse and sterilization. 🙂

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 11:40am

    Heather Johnson

    Heather Johnson

    Status: Member

    Joined: Jan 05 2012

    Posts: 4

    2+

    Khan Academy

    Rooni - I believe they were referring to the Khan Academy ... https://www.khanacademy.org/.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 11:50am

    #85

    dtrammel

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: May 03 2011

    Posts: 792

    1+

    LOL Sparky

    I see that now.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 1:34pm

    Sparky1

    Sparky1

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jul 21 2016

    Posts: 734

    1+

    If 6.2 projected Covid deaths; what to do with the bodies?

    Well this is pleasant (not really; and I'm sorry to bring this up). I've seen these figures, which are sadly credible IMO. The Furguson/Imperial College study estimates were about 1.2 million deaths under the "optimal" scenario using an R0 of 2.2 over a period of 5 months using multiple combined suppression/mitigation strategies. (This 1.2 figure did not account for anticipated surge in Covid cases and deaths once these public health strategies were lifted in fall 2020.)

    If these high mortality rates are anticipated, beginning in earnest mid-April, then what behind-the-scenes plans are being made now to manage the projected upwards of 6.2 million US Covid-related deaths (either from the disease itself, related comorbidities, and/or lack of life-saving medical supplies, equipment, facilities or personnel)?

    A few weeks ago there was some discussion on the PP threads of trains/trucks transporting large quantities of bins that looked like coffins or coffin liners. The government's Covid-2019 pandemic plan identifies possible shortages of body bags and medical examiners in case of unmanageable mass fatality cases. Funeral homes and crematoriums (and their professional associations) must have already been notified of this possible increase in "business". I wonder now whether the recall of the military might be also to manage and assist in removal and disposal of the dead.

    This is really difficult to comprehend and I don't want to incite fear or rumors. But we have seen how other countries deal with this problem (e.g., China and now Italy) with delayed internment, limits/ban on funeral ceremonies and traditional burial practices, mandatory cremations, additional crematoria units deployed, and military assistance to deal with mass casualties).

    If these projected numbers hold true, then preparations must be underway in the US. When might this peak (June 2020 for the first wave?)?

    What are others' thoughts on this? Please share any information you have in this regard, and identify sources and documentation if possible while ensuring privacy.

    Thanks all!

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 1:54pm

    karenchantal

    karenchantal

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Feb 06 2020

    Posts: 93

    1+

    Death topic

    I know Sparky.  Death is something people don't like to talk about.  (When not in pandemic mode, Ask A Mortician is a fabulous youtube channel btw)

    I would think FEMA would have a plan, but if they did, they can't talk about it.  You know, conspiracy stuff.  I say that is what FEMA is for.  When masses of people die unexpectedly.

    I know if I died or a loved 1 died, I would want a certain cremation place.  But would that be possible in a mass death event?

    I would love to know Sparky.  It is an uncomfortable topic......  But we all go there.

     

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 2:03pm

    karenchantal

    karenchantal

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Feb 06 2020

    Posts: 93

    1+

    that death chick I was talking about..........

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0WOyFErcTHU

    She has great videos.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 2:23pm

    ao

    ao

    Status: Platinum Member

    Joined: Feb 04 2009

    Posts: 1242

    yep, both will be used for more control

    Problem> reaction > solution

    Thesis > antithesis > synthesis

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 2:28pm

    nordicjack

    nordicjack

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Feb 03 2020

    Posts: 522

    1+

    re bottom line numbers

    Its a good start too bad its not more.   But the problem is it probably wont kill the right people.. If it were to kill those who deserve to die .. it would be really great.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 2:57pm

    TLWA1879

    TLWA1879

    Status: Member

    Joined: Oct 11 2017

    Posts: 19

    3+

    Ision solved the debate

    This is a little off topic of the intended thread, but if you have a legitimate source for those fancy numbers you threw out you may have solved the debate on human caused global warming.  source please. I'd like to quit worrying about it too.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 3:10pm

    Sparky1

    Sparky1

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jul 21 2016

    Posts: 734

    2+

    MQ, dtrammel re: Money "laundering"

    Ha!  I wonder if we'll get flagged for providing how-to advice on money laundering!  😉 Ya' never know: maybe we hit an algo trigger word or phrase that just blew our "grey man" digital footprints. I'd rather not be that "popular".

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 3:37pm

    #93
    drbrucedale

    drbrucedale

    Status: Member

    Joined: Sep 06 2009

    Posts: 103

    1+

    Chloroquine treatment: what dosages?

    Do we have any data about the chloroquine dosages that ought to be used to fight a COVID-19 infection?  Can anyone provide any useful studies? Chloroquine can be purchased without prescription and it might be good to have some on hand.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 3:58pm

    #94
    Sparky1

    Sparky1

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jul 21 2016

    Posts: 734

    Chris' newest video: "Day 56 - Racing Against Time" (3/19/20)

    Chloroquine: A Promising Coronavirus Treatment?  (3/19/20)

    https://youtu.be/rRgnQs6D1u8

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 4:15pm

    Rajkumarijay

    Rajkumarijay

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 08 2020

    Posts: 50

    To Rooni

    I see you are going nuts. Do you have any books? We have our little library that covers fiction and non-fiction. We have maybe 200 books that are sitting there calling my name.  I sort of hope we have to stay home and the power goes out so that we are disconnected from work. Then both my husband and I will read loads of books by the sunlight and cook on our little propane camping grill and listen to the birds sing. Do you have any books to read?

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 4:22pm

    #96
    Sparky1

    Sparky1

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jul 21 2016

    Posts: 734

    Central Valley, CA public health limits hospital visitors

    With 15 confirmed Covid cases and 2 deaths, San Joaquin County public health announced restrictions on visitors and non-essential personnel to hospitals, effective 3/15/20 through 4/30/20. Violations to this order constitute a misdemeanor punishable by fine, imprisonment or both. (Source)

    Adjacent Stanislaus County public health has confirmed 5 cases and 0 deaths (so far), with no restrictions on hospital visitors or non-essential personnel (yet). (Source)

     

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 4:23pm

    reflector

    reflector

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Aug 20 2011

    Posts: 262

    chloroquine OTC? info, please!

    drbrucedale wrote:

    Chloroquine can be purchased without prescription and it might be good to have some on hand.

    is this correct? where can it be bought without prescription in the usa?

    i was just about to hop across the border to tijuana and see if i can buy it there.

    farmacias del ahorro, a popular mexican pharmacy chain, appears to be selling it without prescription required, there's a lot of things you can buy in mexico that don't require prescriptions:

    http://www.fahorro.com/aralen-150-mg-oral-30-tabletas.html

    but if you know of a place in the usa selling chloroquine, please let me know, i'd prefer not to travel right now.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 4:33pm

    #98
    Sparky1

    Sparky1

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jul 21 2016

    Posts: 734

    PA Governor close all non-essential businesses 8 p.m. today; 180 Covid cases, 1 death

    Coronavirus: Gov. Wolf orders all non-life-sustaining businesses in Pa. to close

    "Allegheny Co. sheriff’s deputy tested for coronavirus; 15 other deputies in self-isolation"

    Summary: 180 Covid-2019 cases confirmed in PA, with one death. Physical locations for non-essential businesses services to close by 8 p.m. today. Enforcement activities begin 12:01 a.m. Saturday.

    https://www.wpxi.com/news/top-stories/live-updates-coronavirus-pennsylvania-what-you-need-know-thursday/NSJ3WMDCVRD65F3O4OMBSK5SH4/

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 4:55pm

    drbrucedale

    drbrucedale

    Status: Member

    Joined: Sep 06 2009

    Posts: 103

    1+

    Answer to Reflector-Chloroquine by Mail

    Well, I hope you and other PP members don't buy it all before I get some, but this tribe takes care of each other. 🙂 So, I have been purchasing medicines by mail from a place called River Pharmacy in Canada for years. Their prices are good, the service is fast and no US prescription is required. Here is the contact information.

    Chloroquine Phosphate

    Hydroxychloroquine

    Azithromycin

     

     

    Order while supplies last.

     

    Our medication is from trusted sources. The only difference- is the price!

     

      http://www.riverpharmacy.ca/ 

      1-888-848-1945.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 5:59pm

    Bigfoot

    Bigfoot

    Status: Member

    Joined: Mar 07 2020

    Posts: 8

    Bigfoot said:

    Riverside seems suspicious to me.  They won't take a credit card and want to take it out of our checking.  I think not.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 6:01pm

    spikauf

    spikauf

    Status: Member

    Joined: Mar 13 2020

    Posts: 1

    Hydroxychloroquine dosage

    Has anyone found info on Hydroxychloroquine dosage and length of time for treatment?

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 6:10pm

    AKGrannyWGrit

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Feb 06 2011

    Posts: 1019

    I Nixed The Sale Too

    Access to my checking account, I think not.

    Cautious Granny

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 6:18pm

    Rajkumarijay

    Rajkumarijay

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 08 2020

    Posts: 50

    Food in stores

    I spoke to a friend I have in the wholesale food supply business and asked about the empty shelves in stores. She told me their warehouses are equally empty. I asked about food supply. She said we have plenty of food in the US. What’s happening is that there are so many people out sick that food packaging is a problem. They can’t get additional food packaged fast enough to restock. Apparently that goes for produce especially but also meat and canned goods.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 6:23pm

    rockintheapocalypse

    rockintheapocalypse

    Status: Member

    Joined: Mar 15 2020

    Posts: 2

    Hydroxychloroquine dosage

    I take hydroxychloroquine daily for prevention of autoimmune flare-ups. I take a 200 mg tablet twice a day. There is a potential side effect related to the eyes, which I've never experienced after about 10 years of continuous use.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 6:43pm

    robie robinson

    robie robinson

    Status: Gold Member

    Joined: Aug 25 2009

    Posts: 986

    1+

    Does/weight/time maculopathy

    it’s out there. Take too much for too long and.......bulls eye.

    I have been an optometrist for 30 years and seen only a few cases.I am sufficiently girded to deal with disparagement. 400 mg/day is ..... for how many years?

    Dose/weight/time rhrobinson od a poor and reluctant typist, however an Enthusiastic Gardener/Farmer!

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 6:55pm

    kunga

    kunga

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Feb 26 2017

    Posts: 325

    Idled cruise ships

    Carnival cruise lines has offered its idled ships to be used for floating hospitals. (APnews).

    I. have. no. words.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 6:57pm

    Sparky1

    Sparky1

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jul 21 2016

    Posts: 734

    Critique of Furguson study

    This refutation of Dr. Furguson/Imperial College study was sent to me by a (more optimistic) colleague.  I haven't had time to read this through, but thought others here might be interested and willing to share their perspectives.

    https://necsi.edu/review-of-ferguson-et-al-impact-of-non-pharmaceutical-interventions

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 7:16pm

    Sparky1

    Sparky1

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jul 21 2016

    Posts: 734

    CA Gov. issues statewide shelter at home order, effective midnight today

    https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/california-governor-issues-statewide-stay-at-home-order-over-coronavirus/ar-BB11r1kg?ocid=spartanntp

    (I can't get the insert link to work....)

     

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 7:23pm

    mark2

    mark2

    Status: Member

    Joined: Mar 06 2020

    Posts: 29

    diy face shields

    https://www.cbc.ca/radio/asithappens/canadian-doctor-who-works-in-gaza-3d-prints-face-shields-for-covid-19-pandemic-1.5502964

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 8:17pm

    sl0j0n

    sl0j0n

    Status: Member

    Joined: Mar 20 2020

    Posts: 1

    RE: Not enough masks . . .

    OK, I don't remember where I saw this but it could really help so I wanted to share it. We all know about the mask situation, "It's not good", but almost any mask will work if its treated w/ salt according to this 2017 study. Here's the link;
    < https://www.nature.com/articles/srep39956 >
    If I understand the paper it's just a matter of soaking the masks (even just dust masks) in a ~30% salt water solution. The study says 100% of the mice protected by the salt-treated filter survived.
    I know a N95 would be better or just a surgical mask but the study indicates that salt saturation provides an effective means to nuetralize viruses.
    Of course it wasn't tested w/ coronavirus but I'm inclined to think the H1N1 test is somewhat comparable.
    Hopefully helpful,
    j

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 8:43pm

    reflector

    reflector

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Aug 20 2011

    Posts: 262

    thank you bruce!

    drbrucedale wrote:

    Well, I hope you and other PP members don’t buy it all before I get some,

    thank you so much, i never bought from canada pharmacies before, don't know why i didn't think of it.

    that saves me from having to travel right now.

    i just ordered a couple hundred pills, to have for myself and to share with older family members.

    if i do get them and the pharmacy runs out by some chance, i'll be happy to send some your way.

    despite mr. greer's objection to the forced checking account method of payment, which i noted, i went ahead and ordered anyways - the risk of losing a few bucks is a small concern, and as you say you've been using them for years, i expect it'll work out fine.

    thank you again.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 8:51pm

    dtrammel

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: May 03 2011

    Posts: 792

    1+

    The Pond Scum Just Keeps Floating To The Top

    https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/sen-kelly-loeffler-dumped-millions-in-stock-after-coronavirus-briefing/ar-BB11qVrS

    The Senate’s newest member sold off seven figures worth of stock holdings in the days and weeks after a private, all-senators meeting on the novel coronavirus that subsequently hammered U.S. equities.

    That first transaction was a sale of stock in the company Resideo Technologies worth between $50,001 and $100,000. The company’s stock price has fallen by more than half since then, and the Dow Jones Industrial Average overall has shed approximately 10,000 points, dropping about a third of its value.

    It was the first of 29 stock transactions that Loeffler and her husband made through mid-February, all but two of which were sales. One of Loeffler’s two purchases was stock worth between $100,000 and $250,000 in Citrix, a technology company that offers teleworking software and which has seen a small bump in its stock price since Loeffler bought in as a result of coronavirus-induced market turmoil.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 8:57pm

    dtrammel

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: May 03 2011

    Posts: 792

    1+

    No One Asks, "What Happens If A Vaccine Isn't Made?"

    I keep seeing people discuss the measures we must do, ala the Ferguson report, to fight this crisis, yet over and over I keep seeing the phrase "until a vaccine can be made".

    No one seems to be asking "What if a vaccine isn't made?"

    https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/coronavirus-will-radically-alter-the-us/ar-BB11pF6k

    People seem to assume that if we can just hunker down, squat in place, self quarantine until a vaccine gets produced then we can all go back to living out lives. What happens in 18 months if there is no vaccine. What happens if we end up having all 100% of us having to experience the virus and its affects?

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 9:11pm

    AKGrannyWGrit

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Feb 06 2011

    Posts: 1019

    1+

    dtrammel et al.

    What happens in 18 months if there is no vaccine.

    There can be a vaccine in 18 months,  no problem.  It sounds like you are assuming that the vaccine that will be offered or given will

    • Work
    • Be tested
    • Be safe
    • Be widely available.

    If the goat rope we have been watching is the same system that creates a vaccine I would not be in line to take it.  Remember the tests that didn’t work? No problem having one ready but how good it is, thats debatable.

    But back to your point. Distract and send people back to work.

    Time will tell.

     

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 9:58pm

    nordicjack

    nordicjack

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Feb 03 2020

    Posts: 522

    1+

    I know about blood type A susceptibility, But what about the Italian connection

    Look at how this large american italian family was wiped out of existence.  I wonder after looking at the numbers coming from italy and this - if there is some huge problem on the horizon for people of italian decent such as my self.   None of them had underlying health issues ( some weight issues- if this is reason to die from this - we have huge problem - - pun!! ) and some where young.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/18/nyregion/new-jersey-family-coronavirus.html

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 10:10pm

    gyrogearloose

    Status: Gold Member

    Joined: Sep 08 2008

    Posts: 415

    comparing apple and elephants

    dtrammel, The mask efficiency of capture link you posted was testing engine exhaust particles.

    However, the study I linked to tested against aerosol particles containing H1N1.

    An issue noted in the study was that the mask fibers were hydrophobic. a little bit of a problem if you are trying to catch water droplets.... they tend to just bounce off.

    The performance gain was put down to the salt coated fibers becoming hydrophilic.

    Many 'protected' workers are getting infected, believing they had good protection, so it is possible that the assumption M95 masks give effective protection is false.  It could also be that they were getting infected during the removal of the gear due to poor procedure, but there is a lack of information.

    I one acts as if the mask is gives poor protection against aerosols, you still get the benefit of restricting unconscious face touching, as well as attempting to keep greater separation.

     

    False confidence is dangerous

     

    Regards Hamish

     

     

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 10:11pm

    sand_puppy

    Status: Platinum Member

    Joined: Apr 13 2011

    Posts: 2339

    1+

    Show us the numbers, California

    I understand borderpatrol's need to actually see the numbers with her own eyes.  I'm pretty mistrustful of official information sources and even private information sources from people I don't know personally.

    We have a number of thinkers pointing out that the oligarchy could use Kung Flu in the same way that it was intending to using climate change--to consolidate centralized social control in their own hands. (Whitney Webb, Ron Paul, David Icke, Brandon Smith, Michael Snyder, quite a few others).

    So CA just announce a shelter in place order.  The governor predicts 56% of the population will be infected in the next 8 weeks.  We have a prediction that we can follow.  Lets see where we are 8 weeks from now, on May 21.

    CA Population  = 39.5 million

    56% of population infected = 22 million

    80% mild cases = 17 million

    5% Serous Cases = 1.1 million

    1% deaths = 221,000.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 10:25pm

    nordicjack

    nordicjack

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Feb 03 2020

    Posts: 522

    mask sanitization

    I know we have tried several ways to clean masks,  everything from bleach to h202 and UVC , heat etc.      I would think since its a filterable material that UVC can penetrate it completely , but it woudnt happen in 15 minutes like a solid surface.  So throw it the sun for several hours.     I think in a pinch throwing it in boiling water for a few seconds would do it too.   I know we wonder if the material filter would be affected by the washing.   I do believe there is some electrostatic properties to the filter that account for some of its ability to filter.   This would likely be diminished whether washing or just use over and over again.     So, when reusing masks , I do not think there is a perfect solution.. Sanitizing it more important than some of the filtering loss.. Again , i would not recommend being in high concentrated settings like a clinical setting or for extended periods of time - but running out for essentials -- Id think it would still offer good protection.   Its a game of risk.. there is no way to eliminate risk. The answer is to reduce it.  I would rate UVC as being least destructive on the mask and then ozone.   Washing and heating I would try to avoid as methods of sterilizing on the mask.

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 10:35pm

    nordicjack

    nordicjack

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Feb 03 2020

    Posts: 522

    answer to reflector chloroquine by mail

    - river pharmacy - CA.    However note that fulfillment is in India.. Isnt that india has restricted medicines and raw materials for medication being shipped from there?

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  • Thu, Mar 19, 2020 - 11:29pm

    MQ

    MQ

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Oct 13 2011

    Posts: 115

    clean money

    The new and improved way to launder money. With soap and water.  Line dry or just lay it flat. I don’t think I would put it in the dryer.

    Sheesh, people--someone asked about cleaning money--from an ATM, gotten in change, etc. and this was my fairly lame attempt at a punny bit of humor. Why would anyone assume that I meant masks when I clearly typed money? And dtrammel--I have been a member for a number of years. I understand you are tired and stressed and you have done awesome work that all of us will use and enjoy, But--chill, kiddo.

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  • Fri, Mar 20, 2020 - 12:18am

    Sandy Beach

    Sandy Beach

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 06 2020

    Posts: 12

    Order

    I placed an order om-line but received a call since I had a number wrong on my routing. debbie seemed very legit. Said the order will have to go through customs. Call came from Manitoba. Of course, it may never come if we are on lock down.

    Does anyone know specifics about a lock down? My son is a construction PM who can't believe they are still working though he gets to work from home. He will bug out to small hometown with wife & child if he has a clue about when it might happen.

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  • Fri, Mar 20, 2020 - 1:03am

    Linda T

    Linda T

    Status: Member

    Joined: Jun 09 2014

    Posts: 132

    3+

    Today's video on Chloroquine, Chloroquine and “natural zinc ionophore searches” anti-malaria alternatives for Coronavirus

    Hello,

    After watching today's video which was very informative. I want to be able to feel hopeful yet remain cautious and curious. Just in case a prescription is required, and who knows doctors maybe too overwhelmed by cases, people wanting to be tested, to see a new person wanting a prescription. Since I am not on any, and wish to avoid them as much as possible for many reasons, costs, side effects, etc. And, for the last 20-30 years, whenever possible I look for holistic methods or natural herbs to use. After all "Eastern" and alternative medicine has been around for centuries and Western for 100-200 years.

    So, I looked, and apparently I'm not the only one who searched. From one website, http://drdahlman.com/chloroquine-and-natural-solutions-for-coronavirus/, I found:
    "...A google search of “natural zinc ionophore” yields these results:
    https://duckduckgo.com/?q=natural+zinc+ionophore&t=ffnt&ia=web
    From this page, the most interesting result is:

    Zinc Ionophore Activity of Quercetin and Epigallocatechin-gallate

    https://pubs.acs.org/doi/10.1021/jf5014633

    Quercetin is a flavonoid antioxidant that’s found in plant foods such as leafy greens, tomatoes, berries and broccoli. It has been studied and proven to have anti-carcinogenic, anti-inflammatory and antiviral activity. It has been at the forefront for treatment of sinus problems.

    Epigallocatechin-gallate (EGCG) is found in green tea. It is also an anti-oxidant.

    This was a study to determine if quercetin and epigallocatechin-gallate can increase levels of intracellular zinc in mice with liver cancer.

    The takeaways from the above paper:

    1. Through fluorescence, quercetin and epigallocatechin-gallate were found to be ionophores and raised intracellular zinc levels.
    2. This is an animal study, not human.

    In summary, we have some interesting information here. It has been asked about at President Trump’s COVID-19 press conference (March18, 2020). Today, March 19th, there are more search results about than ever:

    https://duckduckgo.com/?q=chloroquine+and+coronavirus&t=ffnt&ia=news

    Chloroquine needs a prescription and quercetin and epigallocatechin-gallate can be found in health food stores. Dosage is unknown...."

    I also found:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chloroquine

    https://www.tcd.ie/tsmj/2003/antimal.htm
    (which talks about quinine which was introduced to western medicine in the 1600's for malaria and further down "...qinghaosu plant, known in western countries as "artemisinin." (also known as sweet wormwood).

    And, I found this one interesting too (but it's getting late so I'll look at it more later today after I get some sleep... "Kratom, which the government has been desperately trying to ban, contains powerful anti-coronavirus compounds".

    Kratom, which the government has been desperately trying to ban, contains powerful anti-coronavirus compounds

    Last one...

    https://www.thefitindian.com/blog/8-best-natural-remedies-to-treat-malaria

    Any thoughts or feedback? I remember reading before about using quercetin in addition to zinc and Vitamin C,  as well as the other medicinals in Stephen Buhner's protocol and update.

    Linda T
    (Portland, OR)

     

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  • Fri, Mar 20, 2020 - 4:33am

    drbrucedale

    drbrucedale

    Status: Member

    Joined: Sep 06 2009

    Posts: 103

    3+

    Ordering from River Pharmacy in Canada-Hydroxychloroquine and Azithromycin

    PP Friends:

    I have been ordering from River Pharmacy in Canada for many years, including Azithromycin. Never a problem. Delivery is from India for many medicines and the medicine comes in the mail about 4 weeks after the order. My wife has some health issues, so I have built up a stock of her medicines that I keep refrigerated in sealed Mylar bags with an oxygen adsorber.

    River Pharmacy took my order this morning for hydroxychloroquine and Azithromycin. I got an email from them yesterday saying they had Azithromycin and hydroxychloroquine in stock. Obviously, I don't know how long those stocks will last, but my experience with River Pharmacy is that if they say they have something in stock, they do have it.

    You set up an account with them with user name and password and they use a confirmation by text to make sure a given order is from you.  I found it convenient to have them draft my bank as I do with some other payments. I don't know (have never checked to see) if they accept credit card payment.

    The Azithromycin dose given to me by my dentist son-in-law years ago (not for the coronavirus). A standard dose is 500 mg the first day, followed by 250 mg per day for four days. I don't know a recommended dose for hydroxychloroquine but hopefully we will be able to find and post that information pretty soon.

    I am not pushing anyone to use River Pharmacy. Your choice. But my experience with them has all been good. Hope this helps.

    Here is their contact information again:

    https://www.riverpharmacy.ca/

    888-848-1945

    By the way, I am not a "real" doctor. My Ph.D. is in chemical engineering. I used the drbrucedale as a convenient and short handle to distinguish myself from the National Geographic photographer of the same name. Please call me Bruce.  🙂

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  • Fri, Mar 20, 2020 - 5:45am

    Mohammed Mast

    Mohammed Mast

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: May 17 2017

    Posts: 499

    2+

    River Pharmacy

    I ordered from them the first time last night. Yes it is weird not using a credit card and giving out your bank info but realize anytime you write a check you are giving out the info they ask for. I did check on the pay service they use. It is Genie pay services. It aint BOA (thank god lol). It is an LLC. in business for 8 years. It has a 5 star rating with BBB.

    Keep in mind folks you are ordering prescription drugs online which will arrive in 3-4 weeks. This aint Amazon and my guess is this loophole will be closing ricky ticky tacky. Yes you could just wait until you or someone you love gets sick, gets tested after the hospitals are swamped and hope that they not only will treat you with this but that it is actually in stock. (330,000,000) million Amerikans.

    I just got done with a run with Azithromycin for bronchitis(didn't touch it, as it is viral) the dose for that was 500mg. first day then 250mg for 4 days. This is pretty standard from my research. In the video Chris did it said the dose they were using was 600mg of the Plaquenil.

    It would be great if someone could post the actual dosage and protocol.

    Ironically I just returned from India and could have bought all I wanted for dirt cheap and brought in home in my suitcase. Oh well.

     

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  • Fri, Mar 20, 2020 - 5:47am

    Belka8

    Belka8

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 15 2020

    Posts: 15

    Canadians ordering Chloroquine

    Does anyone have any experience ordering from Mexico? Canadians cannot order from the River Pharmacy. Thank you.

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  • Fri, Mar 20, 2020 - 6:23am

    Belka8

    Belka8

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 15 2020

    Posts: 15

    Form of Zinc

    Which form of zinc is best to take?

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  • Fri, Mar 20, 2020 - 7:53am

    drbrucedale

    drbrucedale

    Status: Member

    Joined: Sep 06 2009

    Posts: 103

    Another possible mail order pharmacy

    Belka8,

    You might try https://www.unitedpharmacies.md/

    They also have a good name in the mail order medicines world. They are not based in Mexico...I am pretty sure they are U.S. based and get most of their medicines directly from India.

     

    T

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  • Fri, Mar 20, 2020 - 9:00am

    Belka8

    Belka8

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 15 2020

    Posts: 15

    Belka8 said:

    Is chloroquine or hydrochloroquine preferred?

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  • Fri, Mar 20, 2020 - 9:18am

    ezlxq1949

    ezlxq1949

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Apr 29 2009

    Posts: 358

    Covid-19 and damaging weather

    Just occurred to me to ask...

    For some time now in my part of the world, the weather has been mild and benign. No storms, no damage, no emergency crews rushing hither and thither to help secure damaged homes and other properties.

    Might this sort of thing provide many more escape routes for the virus? Or might it perish? Has anyone done any testing of how well the virus survives in adverse weather conditions? I've not heard of any.

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  • Fri, Mar 20, 2020 - 9:23am

    Belka8

    Belka8

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 15 2020

    Posts: 15

    United Pharmacies

    United Pharmacies is only allowed to send to the U.S., not to Canada.

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  • Fri, Mar 20, 2020 - 9:26am

    drbrucedale

    drbrucedale

    Status: Member

    Joined: Sep 06 2009

    Posts: 103

    1+

    Hydroxychloroquine versus chloroquine: Chris, please correct me if I am wrong

    I think Chris mentioned in his video on Thursday night March 19 that hydroxychloroquine is less cytotoxic (less damaging to human cells) than chloroquine.  Obviously, if it is a choice between chloroquine and nothing, get the chloroquine. All medicines, aspirin included, have some toxicity.

    Chris, please correct me if I am wrong or misunderstood you.

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  • Fri, Mar 20, 2020 - 9:31am

    drbrucedale

    drbrucedale

    Status: Member

    Joined: Sep 06 2009

    Posts: 103

    United Pharmacies can't send to Canada

    Belka8, I am sorry then. Those are the two mail order pharmacies that I have good experience with or knowledge of.

    Perhaps you can contact your doctor and get a prescription filled in advance?  If you live near the US border and have a friend on the US side, you could perhaps get the prescription sent to them, and then they send it to you??  Just thinking out loud here. Hope it helps.

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  • Fri, Mar 20, 2020 - 9:45am

    drbrucedale

    drbrucedale

    Status: Member

    Joined: Sep 06 2009

    Posts: 103

    form of zinc- PubMed study

    Belka8,

    I am not a medical doctor. But my chemistry background is pretty good. I think the form of zinc may not matter too much, but zinc gluconate seems to be useful and it is an the active ingredient along with zinc acetate in over the counter cold remedies such as Zicam.

    Here is a relevant peer-reviewed study. Trying to meet Chris's standards for high-quality information on this site.  🙂

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8678384

    "Dr." Bruce

     

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  • Fri, Mar 20, 2020 - 9:51am

    Jim H

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jun 08 2009

    Posts: 1162

    4+

    Zinc picolinate

    I use the picolinate based on this study;

    The results of this study suggest that zinc absorption in humans can be improved by complexing zinc with picolinic acid.
    Comparative absorption of zinc picolinate, zinc citrate and zinc gluconate in humans.
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3630857

    As well, if you can find picolinate with added trace Copper, all the better as too much Zinc can lead to Copper deficiency by some kind of displacement effect.  I found a 30mg Zinc with 2mg Copper from Nature's Life brand.

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  • Fri, Mar 20, 2020 - 9:52am

    Ision

    Ision

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 07 2020

    Posts: 120

    3+

    No Vaccine?

    If 100% of the population will eventually become infected with SARS-CoV-2, what will happen will depend upon many variables.  But, it may be assumed there shall be fewer of us.  And, more of us, who remain, shall have their health permanently damaged.

    But, think of this:  What if there is no such thing as "Herd Immunity" possible for this pathogen?  What if the ADE effect always applies to this pathogen?  What if this pathogen can hide in our fatty tissues, slumbering, until the targeted antibodies reduce in number...and grow old, before it wakes up again?   What if the pathogen mutates away from the vaccine's target?  What if it is difficult to manufacture the vaccine...or to scale up production of doses into the Billions?

    So many variables.  Let alone, deliberate manipulations.

    I am quite certain, should I become infected...I shall quickly need to make a catalog of all my antiques...so my family will have a clue...and not toss priceless stuff in the trash...after I am cremated.

     

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  • Fri, Mar 20, 2020 - 9:52am

    Belka8

    Belka8

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 15 2020

    Posts: 15

    US/Canada Border Closing for Non-Essential

    Hi Bruce, I live in a border city and our U.S./Canada border is closing tonight for non-essential. Things are changing quickly!

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  • Fri, Mar 20, 2020 - 9:58am

    Belka8

    Belka8

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 15 2020

    Posts: 15

    Zinc/Copper Balancing

    Does anyone know about zinc/copper balancing or point to information? I seem to recall that a balance should be maintained between the two. Is it safe to take zinc on its own? I recognize this is not a medical/nutraceutical forum but thought I would ask.

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  • Fri, Mar 20, 2020 - 10:12am

    sand_puppy

    Status: Platinum Member

    Joined: Apr 13 2011

    Posts: 2339

    5+

    Hydroxychloroquine dosing in pilot study

    Hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin as a treatment of COVID-19: results of an openlabel non-randomized clinical trial.  Philippe Gautreta

    International Journal of  Antimicrobial Agents – In Press 17 March 2020 – DOI : 10.1016/j.ijantimicag.2020.105949

    A few Quotes:

    Hydroxychloroquine sulfate [aka Plaquenil] (an analogue of chloroquine) has been demonstrated to have an antiSARS-CoV activity in vitro.  Hydroxychloroquine clinical safety profile is better than that of chloroquine (during long-term use) and allows higher daily dose and has fewer concerns about drug-drug interactions.

    Patients were excluded if they had a known allergy to hydroxychloroquine or chloroquine or had another known contraindication... including retinopathy, G6PD deficiency and QT prolongation.

    Dosing:  hydroxychloroquine sulfate 200 mg, three times per day during ten days .  [600 mg / day, which is a little lower than doses used in Lupus and Rheumatoid arthritis]

    take dose with a meal or a glass of milk

    6 patients in the hydroxychloroquine group were lost to follow-up due to:

    • 3 patients worsened and were transferred to an ICU
    • 1 patient decided to just leave the hospital
    • 1 patient died
    • 1 patient had nausea and stopped the medicine due to adverse effect
    • None of the untreated patient had these complications.  Hmmmm.

    They added azithromycin in the standard "Z-Pak" dose used for respiratory infections in the USA:  500 mg on day 1, then 250 mg daily for 4 more days.

    The clearance of viral shedding from the nasopharynx, the only end point measured in this study, was much improved in the hydroxychloroquine group.

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  • Fri, Mar 20, 2020 - 10:19am

    Jim H

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jun 08 2009

    Posts: 1162

    2+

    Management vs. Vaccine

    If we look at HIV today, there is still no approved vaccine, but there are various drugs that allow for HIV to be very well managed, and active viral load to be driven to zero.  There is room between having a cure/vaccine, and having nothing, for medications and supplements to emerge that may do a very good job.  Life can and will get back to some semblance of normal, even if a vaccine or herd immunity is not possible.... again, look at HIV.

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  • Fri, Mar 20, 2020 - 10:36am

    shimz

    shimz

    Status: Member

    Joined: Mar 07 2020

    Posts: 38

    1+

    Remember to cover your cough

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  • Fri, Mar 20, 2020 - 11:34am

    drbrucedale

    drbrucedale

    Status: Member

    Joined: Sep 06 2009

    Posts: 103

    Border Closing Won't Last too Long??

    If I were in your position, I think I would still send it to a US friend on the border. (I assume you probably have some friends on this side of the border.) It will take 3-4 weeks to be delivered anyway, and by that time I expect the border will open up.

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  • Fri, Mar 20, 2020 - 11:56am

    Matties

    Matties

    Status: Member

    Joined: Jan 30 2020

    Posts: 160

    3+

    An American and an Italian

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  • Fri, Mar 20, 2020 - 12:28pm

    Sparky1

    Sparky1

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jul 21 2016

    Posts: 734

    California Covid-19 estimates 8 wks. hence

    Thanks SP. These are good baseline figures, but I wonder what the underlying assumptions (e.g., what R0 figure was used) are that yielded the estimate of 56% of Californians infected with coronavirus in 8 weeks.  Also, what would be the effect of the suppression/mitigation efforts now implemented?

    I recall reading in a footnote Dr. Furguson's/Imperial College study that the US projections were broken down by state (but not published). I wonder if those state-based estimates were provided to the Governors, and that might be the basis of Governor Newsom's 25.5M (56%) infected Californians.

    Regardless, it'll be interesting to revisit your figures in 8 weeks to gauge the change up or down. And I also don't have a lot of confidence in the figures being put out by any of these governmental or health authorities for all the reasons cited and discussed many times at PP.  Even so, behind the statistics are lives and livelihoods that hang in the balance.

    I hope you are well and remain so throughout these crazy times.

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  • Fri, Mar 20, 2020 - 12:38pm

    Sparky1

    Sparky1

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jul 21 2016

    Posts: 734

    1+

    Italy: Military enforcement of CV lockdown as 627 die in 24 hrs.

    [Hopefully, this is not the future state of the US and other countries.]

    Italy calls in military to enforce coronavirus lockdown as 627 people die in 24 hours

    https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/20/europe/italy-military-coronavirus-intl/index.html

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  • Fri, Mar 20, 2020 - 1:04pm

    westcoastjan

    westcoastjan

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Jun 04 2012

    Posts: 429

    Karma in action?

    Coronavirus: B.C. couple donates $1K following meat-hoarding backlash, death threats

    It would seem that hoarding and panic buying can backfire and produce undesired 15 minutes of fame...

     

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  • Fri, Mar 20, 2020 - 9:38pm

    mdh330@gmail.com

    [email protected]

    Status: Member

    Joined: Oct 11 2008

    Posts: 2

    Come on Chris !

    It's very difficult to believe this isn't hyped to the max for Gov'ts eventual benefit.

    How many deaths to COVID 19 in the USA so far?? 190 -220 ??

    https://abcnews.go.com/Health/coronavirus-live-updates-us-hospital-association-warns-ventilator/story?id=69658566

    How many deaths to he Flu in the USA so far?? 23000 -59000??

    https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/burden/preliminary-in-season-estimates.htm

     

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  • Fri, Mar 20, 2020 - 9:50pm

    mdh330@gmail.com

    [email protected]

    Status: Member

    Joined: Oct 11 2008

    Posts: 2

    A " professor of philosophy " ?? YGBSM!!

    Damn Chris,  now I'm really going to cancel my membership!

    What a bag of downers you are !   You have no faith in the American people or apparently, yourself.

    And to bring on an academic egghead to tell us how to cope with life is insulting.

    Chris, YOU need to get a life !

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  • Sat, Mar 21, 2020 - 12:06am

    nordicjack

    nordicjack

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Feb 03 2020

    Posts: 522

    4+

    regarding YGBSM

    I actually have little faith in most of the american people.. But a lot of faith in a few american , most of those here and especially chris.   What I have no faith in is the american govt.  Wall street, big pharma, the FDA and federal reserve.

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  • Sat, Mar 21, 2020 - 12:20am

    nordicjack

    nordicjack

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Feb 03 2020

    Posts: 522

    1+

    re zinc/copper

    yes they need to be in balance and dominance of one can cause issues with the other.  In general women are copper dominant and men zinc.  But that is really something different than having adequate amounts.  If you are not supplementing more than 25mg per day , you should not need to worry about copper.  But if you want to take more zinc,  or for long periods of time it would be advisable to take some copper.    Copper in plentiful in water from copper plumbing..   chocolate is rich in copper.

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  • Sat, Mar 21, 2020 - 3:22am

    chef

    chef

    Status: Member

    Joined: Mar 21 2020

    Posts: 1

    "A Question From Someone New To The Forum"

    My suggestion for 'Someone New To The Forum" is: feel absolutely free to respond to your inner attraction with your parents. The reports plus doctor assessments indicate that that the individuals with compromised immune systems are the ones who are experiencing symptoms more severe than that typically associated with the flu. If you are still concerned about transmitting a contagion then I'd further suggest doing what you can to support enhancing your parents' immunity with the protocol published online by Dr. Mark Sircus.

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  • Sat, Mar 21, 2020 - 8:28am

    nordicjack

    nordicjack

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Feb 03 2020

    Posts: 522

    just got off phone with congressman

    I know most states have spoken about shortages of tests and only those acutely ill will be tested.    - I have confirmed this is the case - additionally I have confirmed that the situations is multiple fold worse than what is actually reported in the numbers.   It is consistent with reports from some healthcare workers - that are reporting dozens in not hundreds of cases per hospital - with all vents - and beds at capacity.   We are already at overwhelmed capacity.   this does not reflect the reported US numbers - why should we trust anyone else's numbers

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  • Sat, Mar 21, 2020 - 10:09am

    shimz

    shimz

    Status: Member

    Joined: Mar 07 2020

    Posts: 38

    Voluntary social distancing

    This is central Stockholm without an enforced lockdown. Not doing too bad imho:

    https://www.svt.se/nyheter/lokalt/stockholm/se-det-folktomma-platserna-i-stockholm

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  • Sat, Mar 21, 2020 - 8:58pm

    Leon Lee

    Leon Lee

    Status: Member

    Joined: Mar 19 2020

    Posts: 8

    National Lockdown

    I keep hearing things about a national lockown. Does anyone have more information on weather this is true and when it might happen? Chris thinks this will happen in the next 2 days, if I listened to his video right

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  • Sat, Mar 21, 2020 - 9:04pm

    Jim H

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jun 08 2009

    Posts: 1162

    National Lockdown

    Sean from SGT report said the same thing yesterday - he heard it from a friend of a friend regarding Nat Guard deployment.  Sounds like a Go to me.

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  • Sat, Mar 21, 2020 - 9:07pm

    Soar07

    Soar07

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Aug 05 2010

    Posts: 32

    Read this article

    https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/thank-you/2832337

    https://medium.com/@tomaspueyo/coronavirus-the-hammer-and-the-dance-be9337092b56

     

     

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  • Sat, Mar 21, 2020 - 9:08pm

    Soar07

    Soar07

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Aug 05 2010

    Posts: 32

    2+

    Read this article medium article Hammer and the Dance

    https://medium.com/@tomaspueyo/coronavirus-the-hammer-and-the-dance-be9337092b56

     

     

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  • Sat, Mar 21, 2020 - 9:20pm

    Jim H

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jun 08 2009

    Posts: 1162

    2+

    I no longer trust Fauci

    I didn't like the way he contradicted Trump the other day regarding chloroquine.   As well, I was aware that he put his face in his hands when Trump called the State Department the, "Deep State Department".  He's got deep state leanings himself.

      https://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2020/03/anthony_fauci_the_nihs_face_of_the_coronavirus_is_a_deepstate_hillary_clintonloving_stooge.html

    One of the first things I found about Dr. Fauci, at the WikiLeaks Clinton email trove, was a gushing 2013 email that Fauci had sent to Cheryl Mills, one of Hillary Clinton;s top aides, praising the then–secretary of state for her congressional testimony on Benghazi.

    Yeah, nice job Hillary defending the military stand down order that allowed Americans to be killed at Benghazi.  Maybe the coming lockdown will be used to finally take out the deep state once and for all... I sure hope so.

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  • Sat, Mar 21, 2020 - 10:00pm

    Sparky1

    Sparky1

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    Joined: Jul 21 2016

    Posts: 734

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    [email protected], I disagree but glad to see you posting after 12 years

    [email protected], I disagree with your criticisms of Chris and of his guest. IMO, people without or with degrees, and/or degrees of different types may have something of value to share. I personally found Chris' information and that of his guest very credible, informative and useful.

    Additionally, I think Chris has convincingly laid out compelling arguments and data to assert with some authority that Covid-19 is not the flu; is much more infectious than the flu; and is more deadly than the flu. This pandemic is still in its early stages for much of the world and for the US. The lack of tests/testing and reliable data on the actual number and severity of cases has impeded ability to assess the true scope and impact of this virus for which--unlike the seasonal flu--we have no herd immunity and no vaccine.

    I'm sorry to hear that you so strongly disagree with Chris' approach to this pandemic that you'd consider cancelling your membership.  Of course, you should to do what you feel is best for you and your situation.

    Regardless, I'm happy to see that you've contributed your first two posts today after twelve years of PP membership.

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  • Sat, Mar 21, 2020 - 10:12pm

    Tom Sammy

    Tom Sammy

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    Joined: Jan 30 2020

    Posts: 134

    2+

    NYC

    NYC lots of activity.  4 sites being setup for temp hospitals (javits center) and lots of army vehicle.

    Reports coming out now that hospitals starting to struggle.

     

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  • Sat, Mar 21, 2020 - 10:14pm

    dtrammel

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: May 03 2011

    Posts: 792

    3+

    Slick Article, Why Does It Make Me Uneasy?

    Soar07, a very polished and professional piece of work, followed by a string of comments all praising your petition. Why does such a paper make the hairs on the back of my head raise?

    No I didn't read it all, nor do I think anyone else did. Can you distill your proposal down to one hundred words? If you can't then it shouldn't be done.

    Many people are using this crisis to further their own agenda, I wonder what is yours? You're not engaging with the Peak Prosperity community, just blanketing the popular forum of the moment. Why is that?

    Perhaps my paranoia is showing.

    ---

    ADDED: Chris has covered this proposal and it appears I was wrong in may assumptions.

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  • Sat, Mar 21, 2020 - 10:17pm

    dtrammel

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: May 03 2011

    Posts: 792

    2+

    Why The Guns?

    On a health support mission, to a city in distress, why the obvious show of guns?

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  • Sat, Mar 21, 2020 - 10:24pm

    Sparky1

    Sparky1

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jul 21 2016

    Posts: 734

    Chilling scene.

    Holy sh*t! That made my heart skip a few beats. And guns???

    This is getting crazier by the hour. 🙁

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  • Sat, Mar 21, 2020 - 10:25pm

    AKGrannyWGrit

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Feb 06 2011

    Posts: 1019

    1+

    dtrammel

    Good observations!

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  • Sat, Mar 21, 2020 - 10:46pm

    Sparky1

    Sparky1

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jul 21 2016

    Posts: 734

    Corrected: Military in NYC today

    Update:  Sorry, I had the wrong tweet/video. Here is the corrected version.

    Another Twitter video of military rolling-in to NYC today.

    [Warning, raw video, strong (NYC) language that some my find offensive]: https://twitter.com/i/status/1241354386250571776

     

     

     

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  • Sat, Mar 21, 2020 - 10:56pm

    dtrammel

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: May 03 2011

    Posts: 792

    2+

    If You Are There To Help?

    Perhaps I'm old school but I remember tv ads that showed the National Guard responding to disasters which showed them arriving like helpful angels of mercy, with the local population glad they were there.

    What dumb f$%k thought rolling into a major US city with your M60 machine gun on the top of the lead vehicles said "I'm here to help"?

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  • Sat, Mar 21, 2020 - 11:08pm

    Sparky1

    Sparky1

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    Joined: Jul 21 2016

    Posts: 734

    2+

    Behind the paywall to discuss the "squirrelly" topics

    dtremmel just posted behind the Premium paywall given his concerns about more heightened Covind-19 related events. It was a good reminder to me that as things get more "squirrelly" and the PP site attracts many more visitors, that we might keep our discussions regarding sensitive, controversial or very speculative topics behind the added privacy of the Premium paywall. This might add an increased level of privacy and protection for the PP site and PP tribe to discuss these topics more freely.

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  • Sat, Mar 21, 2020 - 11:24pm

    Dutch Boomer

    Dutch Boomer

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    Joined: Feb 06 2020

    Posts: 101

    1+

    No need for Lock Down

    In my opinion a lock down is overdone

    In the outside fresh air the chance getting a virus is remote if distancing is kept. On top you can use a mask. ( I use a P3 double bio-filter mask) Anyway, you can keep it as safe as you want and if you're really afraid getting the virus you can self-isolate at home. Anyway, I do not need a government to tell me what to do. In Holland we are adviced to stay at home but not forced (until now) and I really think this is the best way to go. Let the most strong and confident people catch the virus (if they choose to) to enlarge herd immunity as fast and big as possible. This way the next cycle in fall will be less tragic

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  • Sat, Mar 21, 2020 - 11:31pm

    F L

    F L

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    Joined: Mar 03 2020

    Posts: 8

    1+

    Paywall

    How can you distinguish what is behind the wall or not? All looks the same to me... 🤔

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  • Sat, Mar 21, 2020 - 11:31pm

    ao

    ao

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    Joined: Feb 04 2009

    Posts: 1242

    4+

    Jan, this video is disturbing in several ways

    It brings out my libertarian tendencies.  If this couple buying all of this meat completed depleted inventory and other people were asking for meat but there was none and this couple would not allow them to have it, then I'd have a problem with their actions.  But if they just bought this meat and there was more meat and they deprived no one at the time, well, that's their right.  There were no apparent government or store limits on purchases, the inventory was there, and they paid for it.  They didn't apparently push anyone out of the way, cut in line, or do anything else that was anti-social.  And what's hoarding?  Two shopping carts, one cart, half of one, a quarter of one, or what?  The man was trying to provide for his family and animals and wasn't hurting anyone else at the time.  He seems like a decent guy and his subsequent donation tends to substantiate that impression.  But it's almost like he had to pay a bribe to regain social acceptance and safety and was bullied into this action.

    So who's at fault here?  Him or the ones bullying him or especially the ones threatening his life.  Would they be bullying and threatening him if he shot an elk in season, brought it home, and butchered it?  A big elk would easily fill two carts.  It's telling that the video did not decry those who made the death threats.  Allowing fear to be created rather than castigating those who are creating it suggests acceptance, if not outright promotion, of an agenda.  Just another example of social engineering by the media at work.  My preferred version of karma would have been an invitation by the threatened ones to the threateners to come and take their best shot and perhaps risk experiencing themselves what they planned to do to others.  Backing down from those types of people just empowers them to repeat their actions ... or worse.  But that seems to be the trend in our society and the result is growing lawlessness.

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  • Sat, Mar 21, 2020 - 11:49pm

    Dutch Boomer

    Dutch Boomer

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    Joined: Feb 06 2020

    Posts: 101

    1+

    Paywall Items

    hi FL

    Look at the top if you can see a diagonal orange "PREMIUM" notification

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  • Sat, Mar 21, 2020 - 11:51pm

    thatchmo

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Dec 13 2008

    Posts: 219

    Military/guns

    Just had this discussion with the sweetheart.  Well, they are the military after all (didn't see any markings on the vehicles...), and the military "does" guns.  Perhaps standard deployment protocol to "protect the troops".  Bad visual, though.  I'd think the M4s in the cab would be adequate protection.  Me, I'd feel better entering NYC armed ;^)    FD- never been in the military, or NYC....Aloha, Steve.

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  • Sun, Mar 22, 2020 - 12:29am

    Matties

    Matties

    Status: Member

    Joined: Jan 30 2020

    Posts: 160

    More research on chloroquine

    Chloroquine is a potent inhibitor of SARS coronavirus infection and spread.

    Chloroquine is a potent inhibitor of SARS coronavirus infection and

     

    It is not all hunky dunky. matfax in chloroquine hoax :

    "Quinine derivates such as Chloroquine are risky in their use. There are about 400 million people worldwide who have a hereditary enzyme deficiency called G6PD deficiency. They are lucky in that way that they don’t need this Quinine as an anti-malaria drug because the G6PD deficiency basically makes them immune to Malaria. So if a clinician submits a Malaria patient, they don’t have to worry about it. But if they were treated with it, the Quinine derivate would cause acute hemolysis. The last thing you want to see happen in a patient with pneumonia is hemolysis. Quinines are also troublesome in diseases of the nerves such as MG because they reduce the “activation” of nerve impulses at the nerve endings by blocking ACh receptors. Short breathiness due to reduced impulse activation of the respiratory system (i.e., breathing) might be another complication in older patients because their nerves aren’t in best shape regardless of disease. I think it’s safe in young and mid-aged patients with identified genetic G6PD status who have no side conditions or weak muscles."

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  • Sun, Mar 22, 2020 - 12:30am

    Dutch Boomer

    Dutch Boomer

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    Joined: Feb 06 2020

    Posts: 101

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    Visitors

    One thing I do not understand is, how can you see the difference between an enrolled member and a visitor? I was "freeloader" of the weekly newsletter for 10 years and about 2 months ago I decided to enroll because of the very helpful information so "freeloading" felt wrong. Anyway, my status is "member since Feb 6, 2020" and not some day 10 years ago. So, How to see who is an enrolled member and who is not?

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  • Sun, Mar 22, 2020 - 1:05am

    Sparky1

    Sparky1

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jul 21 2016

    Posts: 734

    2+

    Visitors and paywall

    Hi DutchBoomer, I don't think there's a way to identify who is a visitor or who isn't, nor I'm sure there's value in doing so. We do want visitors to feel welcome, gain value from the site and community, and join PP.

    We can see "new" members by their enrollment dates but, as in your case, that doesn't mean they haven't already been accessing the PP site for much longer than their "official" enrollment date. I think one cannot post unless they are a registered member.

    Besides having access to special, exclusive content and discounts afforded to Premium members, the value in going behind the paywall is to limit the access and conversations to only Premium members--ideally away from the prying eyes of "bots", trolls or others that have designs on disrupting or disabling the site.

    Chris and Adam have mentioned that [paraphrasing here] they feel more comfortable in keeping the more speculative conversations behind the paywall to minimize (censorship) risk and allow for more freedom of discussion. That's not to say that someone with an ax to grind or malintent couldn't access the Premium areas for the price of the Premium membership, it just seems less likely or easy. If Chris and Adam feel this behind-the-paywall is a more secure approach, then I'm comfortable with that.

    Of course, each PP Premium member should exercise some common sense and discretion in posting regardless of whether on the open-access areas of the site, or on the restrictive-access Premium areas.

    That's my take on the subject. Others here may have a different perspective or information.

     

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  • Sun, Mar 22, 2020 - 1:07am

    DaveDD

    DaveDD

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    Joined: Sep 08 2019

    Posts: 150

    3+

    Re: No lockdown needed

    Hi Dutch Boomer,

    as we now have seas of time I would suggest that you read your message again and focus on underlying assumptions you make. There are several. Per assumption ask yourself two questions: 1) is this a valid assumption, if not why not, if so, why?, and 2) if not, what could the impact of this invalid assumption be on you, people you love, people you hate, young children, old people, medical personal, poor people, people with disabilities and society.

    Then assess your own beliefs, fears and ethics: would you in the light of the new knowledge, if any, advice against or in favor of a lockdown?

    Based on you post alone I would because I see people misbehave (I use your behavior and thoughts as a golden standard): verbally caring about others, but acting totally indifferent to the risk they impose on others (I think that this is not on purpose for the fast majority). Many people do not have PPE and are currently stampeding through warehouses. Additionally, some people do not have the resources to understand and/or prepare accordingly (a large group, the younger generation,  do not have fully developed brains yet, so they should be protected against themselves, and they are still living in the realm of the “gods”: immortal, full with bravado, hope and dreams — as it should be). And lastly because many people are badly informed (sunshine in the winter is too weak to induce our bodies to produce vitamine D: on the northern hemisphere there is this old and forgotten rule that we need to take vitamine D supplements when the “r” is in the month).

    I believe we need a lockdown to ensure that a sanitary cordon can be invoked, protecting the weak, the poor, the old, caretakers (cleaning, nurses, doctors, etc).

    Take care!

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  • Sun, Mar 22, 2020 - 2:51am

    Matties

    Matties

    Status: Member

    Joined: Jan 30 2020

    Posts: 160

    Zinc

    Maybe unexpected, but infowars came with an extended article about Zinc. A bit over my head but perhaps Jim H or others can summarize it.

     

    Oxford University Report On Documented Antiviral Effects Of Zinc In Human Body

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  • Sun, Mar 22, 2020 - 3:11am

    Hohhot

    Hohhot

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    Joined: Mar 12 2020

    Posts: 25

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    Sir- the dosage of Chloroquine per Chinese study

    Expert consensus on chloroquine phosphate for the treatment of novel coronavirus pneumonia - PubMed - NCBI
    At the end of December 2019, a novel coronavirus (COVID-19) caused an outbreak in Wuhan, and has quickly spread to all provinces in China and 26 other countries around the world, leading to a serious situation for epidemic prevention. So far, there is still no specific medicine. Previous studies have shown that chloroquine phosphate (chloroquine) had a wide range of antiviral effects, including anti-coronavirus. Here we found that treating the patients diagnosed as novel coronavirus pneumonia with chloroquine might improve the success rate of treatment, shorten hospital stay and improve patient outcome. In order to guide and regulate the use of chloroquine in patients with novel coronavirus pneumonia, the multicenter collaboration group of Department of Science and Technology of Guangdong Province and Health Commission of Guangdong Province for chloroquine in the treatment of novel coronavirus pneumonia developed this expert consensus after extensive discussion. It recommended chloroquine phosphate tablet, 500mg twice per day for 10 days for patients diagnosed as mild, moderate and severe cases of novel coronavirus pneumonia and without contraindications to chloroquine.
    This is what they used. I do not know about other treatment regimens. Please consult handout for any contraindications.

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  • Sun, Mar 22, 2020 - 3:12am

    drbrucedale

    drbrucedale

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    Joined: Sep 06 2009

    Posts: 103

    2+

    Paranoia

    To paraphrase Robert Heinlein: "Even paranoids have real enemies."  🙂

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  • Sun, Mar 22, 2020 - 3:49am

    jmone

    jmone

    Status: Silver Member

    Joined: Feb 28 2020

    Posts: 154

    jmone said:

    “Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they aren't after you.”

    ― Joseph Heller, Catch-22

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  • Sun, Mar 22, 2020 - 4:50am

    drbrucedale

    drbrucedale

    Status: Member

    Joined: Sep 06 2009

    Posts: 103

    Thank you

    Thanks very much, Hohhot.  This is quite literally an answer to prayer.  I will be sending this chloroquine protocol along with the standard Azithromycin dosage protocol (500 mg first day, then 250 mg once a day for four days) to our children here in the US as well as to several friends in northern Italy.

    The doctors who are treating patients may be so overwhelmed with just caring for the sick that they have a very difficult time keeping up with the latest on possible therapies.

    Our daughter's brother in law and his wife (mid 40s, excellent physical condition) living in Detroit, Michigan, have been sick for the past week. They have been told that they have "presumed Covid-19".  I will see that they get this information also.

    Thanks again!

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  • Sun, Mar 22, 2020 - 5:08am

    drbrucedale

    drbrucedale

    Status: Member

    Joined: Sep 06 2009

    Posts: 103

    Correction noted :)

    jmone. Thanks for the correction.  This sounds like Heller.  🙂  I am pretty sure Heinlein said it too...but I can't find the quote right now. (I read everything Heinlein wrote--a long time ago.)

    Heinlein wrote from the 50s through the 70s so he very well could have been quoting Heller (or gently plagiarizing him), but I would like to give Heinlein (and myself :)) the benefit of the doubt.

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  • Sun, Mar 22, 2020 - 5:14am

    DaveDD

    DaveDD

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Sep 08 2019

    Posts: 150

    Heinlein

    Thanks for reminding me! In my youth I was a big Heinlein (and Kurt Vonnegut) fan. I will add these to my read-list for this spring and summer!

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  • Sun, Mar 22, 2020 - 5:50am

    thc0655

    Status: Platinum Member

    Joined: Apr 27 2010

    Posts: 2001

    2+

    I wouldn’t worry about the National Guard’s guns (yet)

    I would be more concerned for the Guard’s own safety from the “citizens” at this point. Until we have a “phase change” from peacetime to large scale civil disorder, I think we can count on the Guard’s own peacetime policies to neuter their kinetic fighting abilities. Unless they are in firearms training at a dedicated facility where it’s safe, the Guard either has no firearms or they have firearms with no ammunition readily available. Did anybody spot a belt of live ammunition in the mounted machine gun? I didn’t and I didn’t expect to see any. At best the ammunition will be in a dedicated vehicle(s) as will most of the firearms, and those vehicles may very well be too far away to be of any use if the Guard was attacked on the streets. This is true to a lesser extent of even active duty military. Do you realize that in spite of the terrorist incidents on US military bases in recent years active duty military who are not Military Police are prohibited from carrying firearms on their bases?! That’s why Maj. Hassan was able to shoot so many and why civilian police had to respond to the incident and put him down. Do you remember the terrorist attack on the US Marine barracks in Lebanon? “To avoid an international incident” the Marines guarding the road and entrance to the barracks building were not allowed to have ammunition in their M-16’s. They had loaded magazines in the guard shack or nearby. When the explosive-laden truck came barreling toward them and it became obvious they had to shoot,  they had to waste precious seconds grabbing magazines and loading their guns before they could fire. That delay was partially responsible for the truck getting through and detonating on target. When the Pope visited Philadelphia in Sept 2015 the National Guard was deployed to help the police with traffic and crowd control. All the ones I saw were unarmed, and many of them were in small groups (4-10) in violent neighborhoods blocking traffic. They we’re sitting ducks for any kind of violence someone wanted to inflict on them. Fortunately, nothing happened.

    Things would change rapidly when/if  the Guard’s troops came under violent attack one or two times, or some politician gave them an unjustified order like happened in New Orleans after Hurricane Katrina in 2005.

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  • Sun, Mar 22, 2020 - 7:01am

    VeganDB12

    VeganDB12

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    Joined: Jul 18 2008

    Posts: 206

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    National Guard

    When they came to New Rochelle New York this month they just handed out food and maybe helped out with disinfecting etc...it was a non event in the containment zone.

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  • Sun, Mar 22, 2020 - 7:36am

    yogmonster

    yogmonster

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    Joined: Apr 01 2013

    Posts: 47

    Good follow up article

    Good follow up article. I shared the first one with quite a few people. Unfortunately I don't think many will take the time to read it though.

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  • Sun, Mar 22, 2020 - 8:44am

    sand_puppy

    Status: Platinum Member

    Joined: Apr 13 2011

    Posts: 2339

    10+

    Emergency Physicians Report seeing COVID Respiratory Failure in USA

    A closed group for Emergency Physicians on facebook (EM Docs) is reporting respiratory failure cases from COVID now in the USA.  Maybe 10 cases discussed from just one day, yesterday, Saturday March 21.  The ED doctors are pretty frightened.

    Several young healthy adults (a marathon runner) and one child put on ventilators yesterday.  And more elderly people.  Healthcare workers seem to get very sick, presumably due to high viral load with initial multiple exposures (plural).

    Often the visit that lead to intubation was NOT the first visit for illness.  First visits were mild enough to be sent home, and often, the first COVID PCR test (nasal swab) was negative.  They are reporting that the PCR is only 70% sensitive if sample is obtained correctly (which is difficult) from the nasopharynx.  Samples from the throat (pharynx) are only 30% sensitive.  (Some drive by diagnostic clinics are doing pharyngeal samples--not terribly sensitive and will miss lots!)

    One case report of a sprained ankle injury who added, "can I get some cough medicine?"   COVID test returned positive 2 days later.  HCWs need full PPE for every patient.  Not just HCWs, but all close contacts with others in any setting is high risk.  [STFH].

    So if the picture is of dry cough with borderline low oxygen levels, do a CT of the chest and don't hesitate to diagnose COVID pneumonia without waiting for, nor relying on, the PCR to confirm the diagnosis.

    Horrible looking chest x-rays and CT scans can have clear lungs on stethoscope exam!  The pulse oximeter is a better tool than the stethoscope for this.

    The viral pneumonia causes decreased ability to extract oxygen from air.  A healthy young person can increase depth and rate of breathing a bit and compensate maintaining adequate, but "lowish" (91%-92%) oxygen levels.   At some point some  may tire, and oxygen level drops suddenly.  Early intubation is recommended for these borderline hypoxic patients as the crash happens quickly with little warning.

    However, if you have a positive COVID PCR and your oxygen level is good, you will be sent home.  The ER will not be able to help manage fear and anxiety from the infection.  There is no medical value in hospital admission unless you need intubation at that time.   And most people don't and won't.   The ED and hospital cannot manage slightly sick despite real, and realistic, fear.

    ACE2 receptors (that the SARS2-CoV virus attaches to) are in lung, gut and heart.  Some presentations are mostly diarrhea and abdominal cramping and an abdominal CT scan (which includes the lower lobes of the lungs)  incidentally notices "multifocal ground-glass infiltrates" in the lungs pointing to COVID infection.

    Some cases of NSTEMIs (heart attacks without classic EKG changes) presenting with heart failure (fluid in the lungs giving shortness of breath when lying flat and sometimes with low blood pressure) are probably COVID myocarditis.  Possibly mixed with COVID pneumonia.  Caution to not give the usual big fluid bolus to the patient with pneumonia who also may have COVID heart failure.

    Shock and hypotension can accompany viral pneumonia and require blood pressure medicines like a norepinephrine drip.

    In Italy, they are not intubating people with diabetes, obesity and over age 60!!  (I am on a diet and daily walking as we speak.)

    As Daisy Luther pointed out, the USA is on the same growth curve as Italy, just 11 days behind.

    An ER doctor from the little town of Westerly, RI was just diagnosed positive 2 days ago.  Well damn.

    The wait is over.  It is here.

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  • Sun, Mar 22, 2020 - 8:55am

    MQ

    MQ

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    Joined: Oct 13 2011

    Posts: 115

    4+

    and the people stayed home by Kitty O'Meara

    And the people stayed home. And read books, and listened, and rested, and exercised, and made art, and played games, and learned new ways of being, and were still. And listened more deeply. Some meditated, some prayed, some danced. Some met their shadows. And the people began to think differently.

    And the people healed. And, in the absence of people living in ignorant, dangerous, mindless, and heartless ways, the earth began to heal.

    And when the danger passed, and the people joined together again, they grieved their losses, and made new choices, and dreamed new images, and created new ways to live and heal the earth fully, as they had been healed.

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  • Sun, Mar 22, 2020 - 8:59am

    VeganDB12

    VeganDB12

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jul 18 2008

    Posts: 206

    1+

    NYC 1974 in hospital as of this morning

    I had to pause, PPE for patients meaning a masks.  I am told by an ER worker that they give one mask per week per staff for general care which they disinfect daily.  Full PPE reserved for diagnosed cases.

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  • Sun, Mar 22, 2020 - 9:51am

    vshelford

    vshelford

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jul 13 2014

    Posts: 142

    3+

    Again thanks to sand puppy

    Thank you so much for taking the time and thought to give these periodic reports, I appreciate them so much, as does everyone here.  Your voice from the front lines is beyond price.  PLEASE STAY SAFE - as much as you can, I know, this is stepping into the unknown at this point.

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  • Sun, Mar 22, 2020 - 10:04am

    redinr08

    redinr08

    Status: Member

    Joined: Mar 21 2008

    Posts: 15

    Question for sandpuppy

    "First visits were mild enough to be sent home, and often, the first COVID PCR test (nasal swab) was negative. They are reporting that the PCR is only 70% sensitive if sample is obtained correctly (which is difficult) from the nasopharynx. Samples from the throat (pharynx) are only 30% sensitive. "  Does this mean the test results are 70% or 30% effective, or what?

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  • Sun, Mar 22, 2020 - 10:36am

    sand_puppy

    Status: Platinum Member

    Joined: Apr 13 2011

    Posts: 2339

    2+

    Sensitivity of Nasal Swab for COVID is about 70%

    The sensitivity of a test refers to percentage of positive test results in people who really do have the disease.

    An example:  You have a room full of 100 people who all really do have a disease.  Then a tester comes into the room and collects a nasal swab from all 100 people.  The next day results return showing 70 of the 100 people tested "positive."   In other words, the test is not very sensitive--it is missing the disease in 30 of the 100 people.

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  • Sun, Mar 22, 2020 - 11:22am

    vshelford

    vshelford

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Jul 13 2014

    Posts: 142

    Another question for anyone with medical background

    I'm reading a fair amount about what appears to be an outlier symptom of loss of smell (and therefore taste) for CoV19.  As an occasional sufferer from RADS I get extreme coughing fits that leave me without a sense of smell for up to 6 months.  It's not a current problem, but about 6 weeks ago I had to clean out a severely blocked toilet in our B&B, and discovered that I couldn't smell anything, even though everyone else was gagging.  My sense of smell seems otherwise normal for my age and situation, and this was not just after a coughing spell.  Given that this is unlikely to be CoV19 in my case, I'm wondering how much stock to put in the reports of this as a symptom.  Have you any experience or educated guesses on this?

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  • Sun, Mar 22, 2020 - 2:46pm

    kunga

    kunga

    Status: Bronze Member

    Joined: Feb 26 2017

    Posts: 325

    Ride 'em out on a rail. Oregon

    Taring and feathering, optional.  Go, Beavs!!   Small beach towns all down the Oregon coast were inundated with Spring Breakers.  They have shut down parks, campsites, motels b&b, etc.  Furrinurs have been given 24 hours to git outta town.  Its a matter of life and death for these small communities with no resources.

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  • Sun, Mar 22, 2020 - 6:03pm

    TurquoiseRose

    TurquoiseRose

    Status: Member

    Joined: Feb 26 2020

    Posts: 81

    From Facebook post: Ozone offered for COVID positive patients in NYC + SF North Bay area

    https://www.facebook.com/DrRobertJRowen/posts/1236367359894596

    Information on Dr. Rowan from his website is below.  He is an internationally know physician using ozone therapy.

    https://drrowendrsu.com/about/
    About Dr. Robins see:

    https://www.ozonedoctor.net/

    Dr. Robins is a Podiatrist-Foot Specialist specializing in the use of Bio-oxidative therapy for the treatment of diseases and conditions affecting the foot an ankle. He has pioneered the use of the Robins Method of Direct Intravenous Ozone Therapy making it the safest and most effective way of performing this treatment.

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    Major Coronavirus Announcement from Both Dr. Robins and Rowen for Test Positive COVID Patients

    Dr. Robins has his office in hard hit NYC. I am in the SF North Bay area.
    We make the following offer to the people of our area.
    Anyone who is test positive may come in for treatment after regular office hours. Dr. Robins and I will be personally administering treatment of DIV ozone. We will not accept anyone who needs a respirator, or is so sick that they should be in a hospital.
    This is our public service to humanity. Our charges will be GREATLY reduced for this for those who have financial difficulties. However, in return you will have to give us permission to use your name, image, likeness and video. Our goal is to mitigate COVID damage to patients BEFORE serious symptoms are manifest, and have a track record of real patients who will share their stories.
    Again, you MUST have a positive test for this offer. This is our outreach to the world. I am also willing to go to any hospital in the north Bay to assist in saving the life of a seriously ill patient – and, at NO charge.
    For those wanting in-office treatment, we must be called first.
    Dr. Robins Manhattan number: ‭(212) 581-0101‬
    Dr. Rowen/Su phone number: (707) 578-7787
    We humbly ask you to share this outreach.

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  • Sun, Apr 12, 2020 - 7:42pm

    Cia

    Cia

    Status: Member

    Joined: Mar 08 2020

    Posts: 16

    NHS dosage

    500 mg chloroquine or 400 mg hydroxychloroquine a day for ten days. Plus 500 mg azithromycin. And zinc.

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  • Sun, Apr 12, 2020 - 7:47pm

    Cia

    Cia

    Status: Member

    Joined: Mar 08 2020

    Posts: 16

    Dosage

    Yes, I looked up the NHS dosaging recommendations and ordered it. 500 mg chloroquine or 400 mg hydroxychloroquine (less toxic than chloroquine), one a day for ten days. 500 mg azithromycin, one a day for ten days. Plus zinc.

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  • Sun, Apr 12, 2020 - 7:58pm

    Cia

    Cia

    Status: Member

    Joined: Mar 08 2020

    Posts: 16

    Hydroxychloroquine

    Hydroxychloroquine is preferred as it is said yo be less toxic.

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