Anyone taking the 10% penalty and cashing out 401k or IRA?

131 posts / 0 new
Last post
stevvot's picture
stevvot
Status: Member (Offline)
Joined: Feb 27 2009
Posts: 4
Anyone taking the 10% penalty and cashing out 401k or IRA?

I don't have a whole lot in it, and had already moved the balance into cash from mutual funds anyway, but now I'm wondering if I should go ahead and make the full withdrawal and buy the preparation gear/guns/ammo and physical gold with what's leftover.

 Anyone else already done similar or thinking about it?

caroline_culbert's picture
caroline_culbert
Status: Platinum Member (Offline)
Joined: Oct 2 2008
Posts: 624
Re: Anyone taking the 10% penalty and cashing out 401k or ...

I did- $20,000 just before the markets tanked (to pay off our debts).  I doubt we'll ever consider investing in 401k again.  Why would I want to gamble with my hard-earned money?

kylefenwick7's picture
kylefenwick7
Status: Member (Offline)
Joined: Mar 4 2009
Posts: 9
Re: Anyone taking the 10% penalty and cashing out 401k or ...

Yes, I took everything out in 07 and am glad I listed to Jim Sinclair. The markets are going much lower. However, you might want to consider investing your 401K in to a Gold mutual fund (like TGDLX, etc). It is a great way to get back some of what you may have lost. Other then that, get out, stay liquid, buy gold, to heck with your FICO score, and prepare for what is coming.

Dogs_In_A_Pile's picture
Dogs_In_A_Pile
Status: Martenson Brigade Member (Offline)
Joined: Jan 4 2009
Posts: 2485
Re: Anyone taking the 10% penalty and cashing out 401k or ...

stevvot wrote:

Anyone else already done similar or thinking about it?

We closed out every single one of our Roth IRA funds in 2003.  When I retired from the Navy in 2003 I didn't bother to start a 401k with my new employer.  My wife and I have been privately trading and investing in the market, and after a year of practice trading we have been averaging between 40 and 60% returns since late 2006.

Ask yourself this question:

What do you think is the worst scenario that could result?  If you think you are going to have to prepare for the "end of the world", then you probably have answered your question. 

1440 minutes's picture
1440 minutes
Status: Bronze Member (Offline)
Joined: Dec 29 2008
Posts: 51
Is the Fail-Safe portfolio too dangerous now?

I use Harry Browne's "Fail-Safe" portfolio form my small IRAs, but now I wonder whether even that model is too dangerous.

Rather than trying to predict the market, Harry recommended rebalancing investments once a year into four categories:

1.  25% aggressive stocks in case the market takes off.

2.  25% Treasury long bonds in case the market takes off and in case of depression.

3.  25% T-bills in case of depression.

4.  25% physical gold in case of inflation.  (I don't have money outside of IRA, so I use gold ETF instead.)

Since the early 70s through 2007, this ultradiversified strategy never lost money.  When one or more categories were down, other categories more than compensated for losses.  Last year was the one exception when gold was down along with stocks and bonds. 

Is it too dangerous to maintain IRAs now, even if they are ultradiversified like this?  What happens to my money if Scottrade fails?

Davos's picture
Davos
Status: Diamond Member (Offline)
Joined: Sep 17 2008
Posts: 3620
Re: Anyone taking the 10% penalty and cashing out 401k or ...

We did. Taxes were cheaper than what we would have lost. Sad testament. We also took capitol gains on land we sold - again cheaper than letting it tank in the real estate market.

Hindsight: Even all this at once was better than the loss we would have incurred.

Somehting is better than nothing. 

Mike Pilat's picture
Mike Pilat
Status: Platinum Member (Offline)
Joined: Sep 8 2008
Posts: 929
Re: Anyone taking the 10% penalty and cashing out 401k or ...

I did. I can't invest in an Uncle Sam sponsored program when I don't trust Uncle Sam. As Chris has hinted, retirement accounts could very well be a target when the government gets desperate. Our government will get desperate because it is insolvent. I want to have as much control over my savings as possible.

Cloudfire's picture
Cloudfire
Status: Diamond Member (Offline)
Joined: Sep 29 2008
Posts: 1813
Re: Anyone taking the 10% penalty and cashing out 401k or ...

 

Me, too . . .I'm currently on the verge of cashing in an annuity in to pay for the removal of mercury amalgams and some other extensive proactive dental work.  I feel the return on investment will be higher on getting the mercury out of our systems and preventing future dental/health problems than the return on the limited choices in the annuity.  Yes, the tax hit will hurt, but not as much as the devastation to our annuity if we stay invested in stocks/bonds/dollars.

 

 

Davos's picture
Davos
Status: Diamond Member (Offline)
Joined: Sep 17 2008
Posts: 3620
Re: Anyone taking the 10% penalty and cashing out 401k or ...

Now they just stick it in vacines and flu shots

caroline_culbert's picture
caroline_culbert
Status: Platinum Member (Offline)
Joined: Oct 2 2008
Posts: 624
Re: Is the Fail-Safe portfolio too dangerous now?

1440 minutes wrote:

1.  25% aggressive stocks in case the market takes off.

2.  25% Treasury long bonds in case the market takes off and in case of depression.

3.  25% T-bills in case of depression.

4.  25% physical gold in case of inflation.  (I don't have money outside of IRA, so I use gold ETF instead.)

At this point, though, wouldn't you just break even in the end?  I mean, to me, it kind of seems senseless.  Am I just confused on this?

I mean;

If #1 then loss on #2-4

If #2/3 then loss on #1&4

If #4 then loss on #1 (maybe #1-3)

caroline_culbert's picture
caroline_culbert
Status: Platinum Member (Offline)
Joined: Oct 2 2008
Posts: 624
Re: Anyone taking the 10% penalty and cashing out 401k or ...

c1oudfire wrote:

 

Me, too . . .I'm currently on the verge of cashing in an annuity in to pay for the removal of mercury amalgams and some other extensive proactive dental work.  I feel the return on investment will be higher on getting the mercury out of our systems and preventing future dental/health problems than the return on the limited choices in the annuity.  Yes, the tax hit will hurt, but not as much as the devastation to our annuity if we stay invested in stocks/bonds/dollars.

 

 

But I think, at the rate we're going, that taking th 25% hit is better than the overall 50-60% hit.

Cloudfire's picture
Cloudfire
Status: Diamond Member (Offline)
Joined: Sep 29 2008
Posts: 1813
Re: Anyone taking the 10% penalty and cashing out 401k or ...

.

Dogs_In_A_Pile's picture
Dogs_In_A_Pile
Status: Martenson Brigade Member (Offline)
Joined: Jan 4 2009
Posts: 2485
Re: Anyone taking the 10% penalty and cashing out 401k or ...

Cloud -

That's exactly why you should educate yourself on how to trade a down market.  We have been trading the market, buying and selling put options since November.  Being market neutral allows you to trade in an up or down market.  You take what the market gives you and you don't worry about the circumstances moving it. 

You also don't have to worry about bonds or T Bills or any type of equities v. bonds v. cash portfolio make-up.  We are 100% cash except for any open option positions and we are just looking for a reason to close the trade. 

It took two years of intense study, a year of practice trading with paper money, and daily studying to get there, but we are trading exceptionally well now, generating revenue for debt elimination and focused equity investing and the choice of being retired at age 47.

SteveR's picture
SteveR
Status: Bronze Member (Offline)
Joined: Dec 4 2008
Posts: 71
Re: Anyone taking the 10% penalty and cashing out 401k or ...

I did, in September.  I've been investing so successfully since that time that I actually came out ahead for 2008!  Thank you Peter Schiff, Marc Faber, Howard Ruff, etc.

Set's picture
Set
Status: Silver Member (Offline)
Joined: Sep 26 2008
Posts: 112
Re: Anyone taking the 10% penalty and cashing out 401k or ...

I was told that I can't cash out unless I quit.  Is there a way to cash out without quitting your job.   

caroline_culbert's picture
caroline_culbert
Status: Platinum Member (Offline)
Joined: Oct 2 2008
Posts: 624
Re: Anyone taking the 10% penalty and cashing out 401k or ...

Set wrote:

I was told that I can't cash out unless I quit.  Is there a way to cash out without quitting your job.   

They have to give you a form which shows you all the requirements you must meet before you can cash out.  I claimed "financial hardship" or something like that.  After looking at the account for so long day after day and seeing the losses, I knew I had to pull the money out.  I know in Fall of '07 that something was wrong.  I'm glad I pulled the money out but I'm sorry that I put them towards my debts.

RNcarl's picture
RNcarl
Status: Gold Member (Offline)
Joined: May 13 2008
Posts: 351
Re: Anyone taking the 10% penalty and cashing out 401k or ...

So,

Here is my problem. 

The Dow is below 7000. My 401K is worth 1/2 If I take what's left.... minus 20% tax + 10% penalty leaves what 1/4th!!!!!!!!!!!

I'm kicking myself for not moving the money at 13000. I knew better. I have stopped all contributions.

I have a mere 12K in a state retirement. They withhold 20% tax. I'm not sure of the penalty on state retirement funds.

Please help me.

I am one who has over 20K in CC debt... Closer to 30K if I'm honest.

My income before taxes is more than 100K

I want to get rid of the CC debt if TSHTF

Mortgage is 78K on a home in the 200K range and there is about 8 years left on a 15 yr note.

Of course a HELOC for 30K (past cc debt)

NOTHING IS LATE!!

Aaauuuggghhhh!!!!!!

If I lose my job, ..................

These thoughts keep me awake at night.

Can anyone recommend a course of action?

C.

SamLinder's picture
SamLinder
Status: Diamond Member (Offline)
Joined: Jul 10 2008
Posts: 1499
Re: Anyone taking the 10% penalty and cashing out 401k or ...

rncarl wrote:

So,

Here is my problem. 

The Dow is below 7000. My 401K is worth 1/2 If I take what's left.... minus 20% tax + 10% penalty leaves what 1/4th!!!!!!!!!! 

I'm kicking myself for not moving the money at 13000. I knew better. I have stopped all contributions.

I have a mere 12K in a state retirement. They withhold 20% tax. I'm not sure of the penalty on state retirement funds. 

Please help me.

I am one who has over 20K in CC debt... Closer to 30K if I'm honest.

My income before taxes is more than 100K

I want to get rid of the CC debt if TSHTF

Mortgage is 78K on a home in the 200K range and there is about 8 years left on a 15 yr note.

Of course a HELOC for 30K (past cc debt)

NOTHING IS LATE!!

Aaauuuggghhhh!!!!!!

If I lose my job, .................. 

These thoughts keep me awake at night.

Can anyone recommend a course of action? 

C.

rncarl,

Please excuse me if I'm too nosy but I am curious.

You say you have a HELOC for 30K (past cc debt)

You say you have close to 30k in CC debt - is this new since the past CC debt?

If so, perhaps the first thing you should do is create a budget and stick with it.

Next quit spending money except for the absolute necessities - put away those CC's.

Then you should pay down the most expensive debt first - presumably the CC debt. Don't wait for TSHTF scenario to solve your problem - you may be waiting a long time and the interest will keep building.

Then knock down the HELOC.

Repeat as necessary - with your income, you shouldn't be carrying such a debt load.

Personally, if you are relatively young, I would leave my 401k alone. The cost to cash it in is too great and you will definitely lock in your loss. However, bear in mind, this is one man's opinion. As Chris M. would say, "Trust yourself".

Dogs_In_A_Pile's picture
Dogs_In_A_Pile
Status: Martenson Brigade Member (Offline)
Joined: Jan 4 2009
Posts: 2485
Re: Anyone taking the 10% penalty and cashing out 401k or ...

cloud -

Send me an offline email and I will pass info on to you this evening.  Until then - here is the link to the seminars we took.  Be forewarned - the website is a very cumbersome - I would have set it up differently, but then again, it's not my site.  You will need to register first to be able to access the course sign-ups.  The course you want to take is the Wall Street Basics 1-5 course - I would order the CDs vs. the On line instruction - that way you can stop the CD if something comes up and you aren't hostage to your computer.

http://www.achieverschoicequest.com/home/tabid/36/Default.aspx

We took the 1-5 seminar (live lecture sessions) starting in 2002 and have been through the course close to 30 times - always hear something "new" each time even though it has always been in the material.  We also have the CD version of the course.  As you get a little experience, you hear things differently and pieces fall in place faster and in larger chunks.  Three years ago we took the Advanced and RTP course and have taken the RTP course each year since.  You have to take the 1-5 course first to be eligible to take the Advanced Class or RTP course.

And in the interest of full disclosure - I get absolutely nothing by referring you to the course.  The instructor does no advertising other than word of mouth - that way the classes are self policing - students refer people that have similar interests and are like them.

If you decide to take the course I can tell you it will be one of the hardest things you have ever done.  Not that the course material or techniques are difficult to understand.  What's hard is developing the discipline to do things exactly as taught and to overcome your fear and greed once you enter the market.

If I left anything out, or didn't convey something quite right, Mrs. Dogs will likely come along and correct me via post.  Then she will call me and yell at me for being stupid.

RNcarl's picture
RNcarl
Status: Gold Member (Offline)
Joined: May 13 2008
Posts: 351
Re: Anyone taking the 10% penalty and cashing out 401k or ...

Sam,
Thanks for the reply. Yes the new cc debt.... is new. I have only been paying cash (real) for things since last spring. I am within 15 of retirement (I'd prefer 10) Most of that HELOC was student loans. I am throwing most of my disposable income at the cc debt.
interesting note, each time the principle goes down, they adjust my limit within 1-2K of the balance.
For anyone who thinks that CC debt can be managed, they are only fooling themselves.

Besides paying down debt, my only investments right now are securing SHTF supplies.

Set's picture
Set
Status: Silver Member (Offline)
Joined: Sep 26 2008
Posts: 112
Re: Anyone taking the 10% penalty and cashing out 401k or ...

Thanks for the reply Caroline, but I don't think I'd qualify for a financial hardship... yet.

caroline_culbert's picture
caroline_culbert
Status: Platinum Member (Offline)
Joined: Oct 2 2008
Posts: 624
Re: Anyone taking the 10% penalty and cashing out 401k or ...

rncarl wrote:

So,

 

Here is my problem. 

 

The Dow is below 7000. My 401K is worth 1/2 If I take what's left.... minus 20% tax + 10% penalty leaves what 1/4th!!!!!!!!!!!

 

That sucks!!!  The dow will, IMHO, tank to 5 or less.

rncarl wrote:
 I'm kicking myself for not moving the money at 13000. I knew better. I have stopped all contributions.

There's nothing you can do to change the past.

rncarl wrote:
I have a mere 12K in a state retirement. They withhold 20% tax. I'm not sure of the penalty on state retirement funds.

Take it out!!!

rncarl wrote:

  Please help me.

I am one who has over 20K in CC debt... Closer to 30K if I'm honest.

Your debt to income ratio is okay... not great, but okay.  Only think about your credit cards given the CURRENT situation.  After that, think about the FUTURE situation.  DO NOT think of these two things the other way around.  There are only three things you NEED to live.

PROPER FOOD

PROPER WATER

AND MAYBE SHELTER (WARMTH/HEAT IF YOU LIVE IN COLDER CLIMATES)

rncarl wrote:

My income before taxes is more than 100K

I want to get rid of the CC debt if TSHTF

Why would you WANT to do this????

rncarl wrote:
 Mortgage is 78K on a home in the 200K range and there is about 8 years left on a 15 yr note.

DO NOT, DO NOT GIVE UP YOUR HOME IF AT ALL POSSIBLE!!!  Screw your credit cards, save the cash/gold.  IF the market turns for the better (and is looking favorable for 'x' length of years) ONLY THEN put your lump cash to pay down your house note.  DO NOT GIVE UP YOUR CASH.

rncarl wrote:

Of course a HELOC for 30K (past cc debt)

NOTHING IS LATE!!

Aaauuuggghhhh!!!!!!

 

If I lose my job, ..................

 

These thoughts keep me awake at night.

 

Can anyone recommend a course of action?

 

C.

Do what you would advise your children to do.  That is where you can find the wisest advice; because if you worry about your children then you will try to "help" them get out of whatever situation they may find themselves in because "you're older and hopefully wiser.  But remeber; losing sleep over this, or worrying about this will NEVER make you "live" (for the moment) or make your family happy.  You, your future, and your family depends upon your HEALTH above all.  If you lose sleep and anguish over this, then you are downgrading your PHYSICAL health (according to studies).

Good luck!  Maybe I'll see you on a bandwagon somewhere down the road.  But hopefully not!!!

 

Dogs_In_A_Pile's picture
Dogs_In_A_Pile
Status: Martenson Brigade Member (Offline)
Joined: Jan 4 2009
Posts: 2485
Re: Anyone taking the 10% penalty and cashing out 401k or ...

Set wrote:

I was told that I can't cash out unless I quit.  Is there a way to cash out without quitting your job.   

Set -

That's a common approach for many companies.  I work for an employee owned, private DoD contracting company.  They have the same rules.  There is also a twist regarding payout of accumulated company stock - my company can elect to pay out the stock over five years instead of lump sum.  That makes sense to me - minimizes the impact on the company's cash reserves so the other partners are not hit as hard.  And they are decent about it - they pay you based on what the stock valuation was when you left - not what it is 1, 2, 3 and 4 years later - so you don't have to worry about it if the price drops.  And you can't worry about it if the price goes up in those 4 years, because you left the company.

Just check with your Retirement Account people for the real rules and make them show them to you in writing.  I would not be surprised if in fact you do have to terminate to cash out.

1440 minutes's picture
1440 minutes
Status: Bronze Member (Offline)
Joined: Dec 29 2008
Posts: 51
Re: Is the Fail-Safe portfolio too dangerous now?

caroline_culbert wrote:
1440 minutes wrote:

1.  25% aggressive stocks in case the market takes off.

2.  25% Treasury long bonds in case the market takes off and in case of depression.

3.  25% T-bills in case of depression.

4.  25% physical gold in case of inflation.  (I don't have money outside of IRA, so I use gold ETF instead.)

At this point, though, wouldn't you just break even in the end?  I mean, to me, it kind of seems senseless.  Am I just confused on this?

I mean;

If #1 then loss on #2-4

If #2/3 then loss on #1&4

If #4 then loss on #1 (maybe #1-3)

Caroline,

Good point, but that's not the way it has worked out until last year.  See this graph:

http://www.harrybrowne.org/PermanentPortfolioResults.htm

SamLinder's picture
SamLinder
Status: Diamond Member (Offline)
Joined: Jul 10 2008
Posts: 1499
Re: Anyone taking the 10% penalty and cashing out 401k or ...

rncarl wrote:
Sam,
Thanks for the reply. Yes the new cc debt.... is new. I have only been paying cash (real) for things since last spring. I am within 15 of retirement (I'd prefer 10) Most of that HELOC was student loans. I am throwing most of my disposable income at the cc debt.
interesting note, each time the principle goes down, they adjust my limit within 1-2K of the balance.
For anyone who thinks that CC debt can be managed, they are only fooling themselves.
Besides paying down debt, my only investments right now are securing SHTF supplies.

mcarl,

Re your cc debt. These days, I'm not surprised the credit card company is adjusting your limit down as you pay down. They're making sure they limit their exposure.

I think you are smart to secure SHTF supplies - as the old saying goes, "Better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it."

I wish you success in your planning.

DrKrbyLuv's picture
DrKrbyLuv
Status: Diamond Member (Offline)
Joined: Aug 10 2008
Posts: 1995
Re: Anyone taking the 10% penalty and cashing out 401k or ...

Karl Denninger (Market Ticker) said:

Just so you have a short list of what's at stake if Washington DC doesn't change policy here and now (which means before
the collapse in equities comes, which could start as soon as today, if
the indicators I watch have any validity at all.  For what its worth,
those indicators are painting a picture of the Apocalypse that I simply
can't believe, and they're showing it as an imminent event - like perhaps today imminent.)

Tax-deferred accounts will be seized to fund rollovers of Treasury debt
at essentially zero coupon (interest).  If you have a 401k, or what's
left of it, or an IRA, consider it locked up in Treasuries; it's not
yours any more.  Count on this happening - it is essentially a
certainty.

I sure hope he's wrong.

Larry

SamLinder's picture
SamLinder
Status: Diamond Member (Offline)
Joined: Jul 10 2008
Posts: 1499
Re: Anyone taking the 10% penalty and cashing out 401k or ...

DrKrbyLuv wrote:

Karl Denninger (Market Ticker) said:

Just so you have a short list of what's at stake if Washington DC doesn't change policy here and now (which means before
the collapse in equities comes, which could start as soon as today, if
the indicators I watch have any validity at all.  For what its worth,
those indicators are painting a picture of the Apocalypse that I simply
can't believe, and they're showing it as an imminent event - like perhaps today imminent.)

Tax-deferred accounts will be seized to fund rollovers of Treasury debt
at essentially zero coupon (interest).  If you have a 401k, or what's
left of it, or an IRA, consider it locked up in Treasuries; it's not
yours any more.  Count on this happening - it is essentially a
certainty.

I sure hope he's wrong.

Larry

Either he's dead wrong or we're dead. I guess it doesn't matter at that point!

caroline_culbert's picture
caroline_culbert
Status: Platinum Member (Offline)
Joined: Oct 2 2008
Posts: 624
Re: Is the Fail-Safe portfolio too dangerous now?

1440 minutes wrote:
caroline_culbert wrote:
1440 minutes wrote:

1.  25% aggressive stocks in case the market takes off.

2.  25% Treasury long bonds in case the market takes off and in case of depression.

3.  25% T-bills in case of depression.

4.  25% physical gold in case of inflation.  (I don't have money outside of IRA, so I use gold ETF instead.)

At this point, though, wouldn't you just break even in the end?  I mean, to me, it kind of seems senseless.  Am I just confused on this?

I mean;

If #1 then loss on #2-4

If #2/3 then loss on #1&4

If #4 then loss on #1 (maybe #1-3)

Caroline,

Good point, but that's not the way it has worked out until last year.  See this graph:

http://www.harrybrowne.org/PermanentPortfolioResults.htm

ok... thanks

Set's picture
Set
Status: Silver Member (Offline)
Joined: Sep 26 2008
Posts: 112
Re: Anyone taking the 10% penalty and cashing out 401k or ...

Thanks for the response Dogs_In_A_Pile.  The construction company I work for has their 401K through “The Hartford Group” and they are who seem to call the shots.  Fortunately I’ve been in the money market fund for the past couple of years so I’m still up a whopping 3.8 percent for the past five years, but I would sure like to get it out and into some physical gold before the currency crash I think is in the near future.

Mr. Fri's picture
Mr. Fri
Status: Silver Member (Offline)
Joined: Feb 21 2009
Posts: 208
Re: Anyone taking the 10% penalty and cashing out 401k or ...

Yes, I'm considering the cash out as well.  I came late to the CC party but now that I see that TSHTF is on the way, I'm very concerned that my life savings (in IRAs) will be lost. 

I see the cash out in two steps; move IRA allocation from stocks to cash then cash out and buy gold and supplies. I'm now trying to decide on timing.  I don't know if stocks will have a small bounce up in a few weeks or a small rally in the fall as some predict.  I think most here believe gold will go down to below $900 so I plan to wait for that.

It doesn't do me any good to read folks saying "I saw it happening in 200x and took my money out..."  I would like to see some advice/discussion on what us late-comers should do over the next few months.

caroline_culbert's picture
caroline_culbert
Status: Platinum Member (Offline)
Joined: Oct 2 2008
Posts: 624
Re: Anyone taking the 10% penalty and cashing out 401k or ...

Mr. Fri wrote:

Yes, I'm considering the cash out as well.  I came late to the CC party but now that I see that TSHTF is on the way, I'm very concerned that my life savings (in IRAs) will be lost. 

I see the cash out in two steps; move IRA allocation from stocks to cash then cash out and buy gold and supplies. I'm now trying to decide on timing.  I don't know if stocks will have a small bounce up in a few weeks or a small rally in the fall as some predict.  I think most here believe gold will go down to below $900 so I plan to wait for that.

It doesn't do me any good to read folks saying "I saw it happening in 200x and took my money out..."  I would like to see some advice/discussion on what us late-comers should do over the next few months.

Well I told my mom, if my memory serves me right, in Nov. of '07 to move her money.  She blew me off because she didn't see what I saw.  I am by no means anywhere close to being economically or financially savvy but I did see signs that indicated something sinister.  I looked at my money daily after I saw huge drops in my mutual funds and listening to bits and pieces from here and there about nearly everything.  If you're doing that then I think you know the answer to your above concern.  Begin reading EVERYTHING you can get your hands on.  LISTEN to whatever you can listen to but try to stay away from the T.V.  Also, a lot of people here speculate A LOT, including me.  Make sure you can determine the REAL INDICATORS vs. the SPECULATIONS.

Another good advice is to read about gambling (I mean gambling problems -- aka myths that people have about gambling and "chasing their money").  It's really helpful in these times.  Money, chasing it or obtaining it, can be very addictive and sometimes we don't think rationally about it until one has lost everything.

Indicators--

1. declining jobs (still!)

2. rapidly declining DOW (yikes!)

3. retail markets (still closing doors)

etc.

When you see more than a 10% increase in any of these areas is the best time to get in.  Basically... when you see the beginning "signs" of an upwards growth IN NEARLY EVERY SECTOR of our economy, THEN get back in.

You want someone to TELL YOU when, EXACTLY, to pull out.  My advice is bad and good.  It's bad for the economy and good for you (in the short run).  If you suffer the losses, for everyone's sake, then that's your choice; but I would pull out if I were you unless you can wait another year or two with losses nearing 75%.

Remember that this is only a guesstimate.  I have a crystal ball but for some reason it has never worked for me.  Damn thing just sits there reflecting some other useless object on my nightstand.

Comment viewing options

Select your preferred way to display the comments and click "Save settings" to activate your changes.
Login or Register to post comments