Permaculture Egg Production

Hi there. I would like to point out, for anyone working on the mechanics of this site, that it is still very hard to participate in discussions. I got an email about recent activity, went to the site, then had to log in, then had to find where the discussion was and then I don't really see that it is threaded. Unless I am really really interested I am not going to take the time to do this. Could the webmaster please make this simpler?

On to chickens: the price of organic broiler/layer grain has increased faster than anything but the national debt! I have been trying to figure out a way around this for ten years but this year I really need to get serious. Years ago I knew a woman who had grown up on a farm in Ireland. She was horrified that our chickens were getting bags of processed feed. I told her that I was supplementing with table scraps and potatoe peelings and she was still not happy. I asked her what the chickens on her farm ate and she said "They ate what we ate."

If you think about it, that is probably what their dogs and cats ate too. Of course, vets will tell you that our animals today live longer and healthier than they did years ago. I don't have any idea whether that is true and I won't argue with anyone about it. But I do know that here in the Northeast our soils are seriously depleted and that our chickens, eating organic grain from the farmer's coop and greens/bugs from our yards are probably getting diets that are better balanced than those of the average human. If you give up the balanced commercial rations you may be getting yourself into trouble.

So the first thing you must do if you want to feed your chickens from your land is to get serious about soils science. I recommend Steve Solomon's new book "The Intelligent Gardener." Then you need to figure out what the nutritional needs of chickens are and see how you can meet those needs year round by what you can produce locally. If you are practicing permaculture or sustainable integrated farming you should be able to use a combination of worms, roots, insects and veggies to sustain your chickens. For example, our chickens love raw goat's milk, whey from cheese making, squash that are going soft in the basement (it's that time of year) and left over cooked potatoes. They still expect their grain though and I am not going to be able to grow what they can in the midwest.

I am going to be working towards feeding goats and chickens from my very small farm this year. Since I can't legally sell my delicious raw goat's milk I am working on how to make it into a substance that I can feed to dogs and chickens. I know that I can feed eggs (and raw chicken) to the dogs.

This entails really studying the nutritional qualities of these foods. I am looking at growing a lot more forage for the goats and chickens in the form of mangels and beets. I don't envision giving up the use of kelp and comfort myself that it can be sourced from Maine - not too far away - but I worry about the pollution in the Gulf of Maine.

If anyone wants to do a serious discussion of this I would be happy to join in. There is probably a Yahoo User Group on this subject. (I get a lot out of Yahoo User Groups and they are easy to use. Steve Solomon's Soil and Health User group is so helpful and he is right there. He is a true hero but he is older and he has made his fortune.) This discussion format needs to get easier - maybe we could reply via email instead of going through this lengthy sign in process?

There is a really good thread over on the blog about growing fodder for goats and chickens. I am going to read it. It suggests that you can at least increase the impact of every pound of grain that you do buy.

Robie,

Please tell us what breed of chicken you started out with and what part of the world you live in. Thank you!

My wife and I moved out of town -- arid central Colorado -- to 40 acres.  In town and out, we have had chickens, and I am now trying to raise all of our needed feed so that I don't have to drive to Nebraska for organic grains.

Since we eat millet and amaranth I want to try to raise both, some for people and some for hens.  Does anyone have experience with millet?  What type?  How do you hull it?

Thanks.

a1911guy

Interesting you should have that perspective.  I also do a lot of programming and use the web extensively.  My reaction to the new site was very much like yours.  I found the old site much easier to efficiently navigate.

I have one suggestion that you might find helpful.  If you join a group, then you can find recent action in those groups you have joined at http://www.peakprosperity.com/groups/myunread

The downside of joining groups is that you get email notifications unless you opt out, which is a PITA.  I avoid joining groups unless I am really interested.

I have bookmarked myunread on my browser so that I can quickly check them out.  This is my best hint for efficiently navigating the site.

- Jim

At a recent NOFA presentation I learned that some people had problems raising turkeys without soy in their feed. Apparently the turkeys actually died. I had never thought about soy and what it contributes to feed. In fact, so long as my bags of grain are labeled organic I have not worried about which grains they contained. I'll bet that some of the specially bred meat birds do require these industrially produced feeds in order to fatten quickly and be commercially viable.

I note that there are plenty of wild turkey wandering around here getting fat without soy so it occurs to me that we should be talking about breeding birds that will do OK on whatever food we can produce locally. This should be a no-brainer but it has just entered my brain.

I raise light brahma chickens and throw in a few other heritage breeds such as rhode island red and barred rock. I imagine that heritage breeds do not require soy. But I wonder whether the vitamin/mineral balances that are stated on the sides of the feed bags are universal for all kinds of chickens.

Can anyone point me to a reliable discussion of the nutritional requirements of chickens?

for not reporting on our flocks genetic heritage. they were,15yrs ago, rhode islands and astralorps. the death of an elderly neighbor and the gift of her flock by her children(they lived intown ans the flock was feral"fightin' chickens") led to 6 hens of hers being trapped and acclimated to our "free run" farm. they inmingled and hatched their own and other eggs (turkey,duck,emu) i believe one has for years been trying to hatch a golf ball. we use no lights and supplement little to nothing live in zone 7a (mid-atlantic)

robie